[CaramaC]

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/entertainment-arts-17656633

Ricky Gervais has defended his new Channel 4 programme, Derek, following suggestions he was mocking people with learning difficulties. The one-off comedy is billed as the story of "a simple, vulnerable man working in an old people's home". Some, including fellow comedian Stewart Lee, have said the character makes light of the "mentally handicapped". But Gervais, who plays the title role, said Derek was not intended to have a "specific and defined disablity". "Derek is a fictional character and is defined by his creator, me," he told disability rights campaigner Nicky Clark. "If I say I don't mean him to be disabled then that's it. A fictional doctor can't come along and prove me wrong." "He's different. But then so are a lot of people. He's not the smartest tool in the box but he's cleverer than Father Dougal [from Father Ted], and not as different as Mr Bean. "He's based on those people you meet who are on the margins of society. Nerds, loners, under achievers." 'Compassion' Gervais was interviewed for Clark's website ahead of the first screening of Derek on 12 April. The campaigner has previously been a vocal critic of the comedian. Last October, she took him to task for repeatedly used the word "mong" on his Twitter feed. She called on the 50-year-old to stop using the term, which can be used offensively in reference to people with Down's Syndrome. "If you find abuse of disabled people sickening, then please don't use the terminology of bullies and thugs," she wrote in The Guardian. The pair eventually made contact, and Gervais asked Clark to watch a pilot episode of Derek. She agreed with his assertions about the story, saying: "I've laughed and cried. I haven't seen cruelty." "Instead of it being a mocking disintegration of a learning-disabled man -paraded for the amusement of comfortable unaffected people, it's the story that really needs to be told at the moment," she wrote on her website. The character of Derek Noakes first appeared in 2001 as part of the Edinburgh show Rubberneckers, several years before the comedian achieved mainstream success with The Office. Stewart Lee made his comments about the character last year, when Gervais announced the Channel 4 programme, and linked to old YouTube footage of Derek. After watching the sketches, Lee said he "imagined feral children trailing real Dereks around supermarkets, chanting 'Derek Derek', as they doubtless would were the series to be made, and wondered if, sometimes, discretion is not the better part of valour". But speaking to Clark, Gervais defended the character, saying it was meant to be sympathetic. "It's important to have compassion for the characters you are portraying because at some level comedy and drama relies on empathy".

[Salvadora]

I've seen the ads for this and it looks terrible. That should be the crime here.

[33-Hit-Combo]

Mong can't be used to refer to people with Down's Syn?! I'm from UK and I've never heard of that reference...

EDIT: As in, I didn't know of the meaning

[Lord British]

Far be it from me to defend the loathsome Gervais, who I despise, but in this particular instance I don't think he's mocking the disabled. Apparently the show is quite thought-provoking and compassionate.

Mong can't be used to refer to people with Down's Syn?! I'm from UK and I've never heard of that reference...

Yes, it comes from "mongoloid". The whole "mong" thing on Twitter was absolutely sickening, and the pivotal moment in my reassessment of Gervais from "cunt" to "irredeemable cunt".

[Angry Fork]

Anybody who has listened to the XFM shows/podcasts would know Ricky is a really nice down to earth guy. Whenever he has something against someone he just flat out says it why would he create some thinly veiled 'attack' on mentally disabled people for no reason. People get offended by fucking everything now, hopefully he doesn't back down. The mong "controversy" was just as dumb.

edit - Just saw this:

The pair eventually made contact, and Gervais asked Clark to watch a pilot episode of Derek. She agreed with his assertions about the story, saying: "I've laughed and cried. I haven't seen cruelty." "Instead of it being a mocking disintegration of a learning-disabled man -paraded for the amusement of comfortable unaffected people, it's the story that really needs to be told at the moment," she wrote on her website.

More judging and raging before they even see the content. Reminds me of the Fox news Mass Effect shit.

[Carnby]

Looks like Ricky Gervais is pulling a Soul Man. And we all know how well that turned out for C. Thomas Howell.

[Dennis]

Still mocking Hollywood I see.

[StuBurns]

Mong can't be used to refer to people with Down's Syn?! I'm from UK and I've never heard of that reference...

You've never heard someone say mong? What about mongol? Mongoloid?

As for the show, never heard of it, but I'll check it out. Strange to see Gervais without Merchant too.

[Foliorum Viridum]

If it's not utter shit like his last few projects then I won't care.

It will probably be unfunny and recyling all of the shit he's done before, just like Life's Too Short. That'll be the offensive thing to me.

[Nevasleep]

Mong can't be used to refer to people with Down's Syn?! I'm from UK and I've never heard of that reference...

Haven't heard of what? The term Mong, or that you're not supposed to use it.

[BocoDragon]

He's a comedian. Your sensitivities can take a hike.

[33-Hit-Combo]

You've never heard someone say mong? What about mongol? Mongoloid? As for the show, never heard of it, but I'll check it out. Strange to see Gervais without Merchant too.

I've heard of it many times when I was growing up, it was tossed around so frequently, but only as a generic insult.

[Carnby]

He's a comedian. Your sensitivities can take a hike.

And so was Al Jolson.

[Angry Fork]

Yes, it comes from "mongoloid". The whole "mong" thing on Twitter was absolutely sickening, and the pivotal moment in my reassessment of Gervais from "cunt" to "irredeemable cunt".

Listen to the XFM shows, or watch some interviews with him. You haven't seen enough of him if you think he's a cunt. Have you even watched the office or extras? They're filled with so much heart and it's obvious he's not a malicious person.

[CrocMother]

[StuBurns]

I've heard of it many times when I was growing up, it was tossed around so frequently, but only as a generic insult.

That is what it is. But like saying queer to heterosexuals, saying mong or spak to normally able minded folk is considered offensive.

[IceCold]

lol at Karl in that image.

[danwarb]

Stewart Lee is an idiot.

[Eyeh4wk]

Never go full retard.

[Kano On The Phone]

Listen to the XFM shows, or watch some interviews with him. You haven't seen enough of him if you think he's a cunt. Have you even watched the office or extras? They're filled with so much heart and it's obvious he's not a malicious person.

This. Gervais is better than just about anyone at writing genuinely funny stories that are also very human, he just doesn't give a fuck if people are offended and he isn't going to do the normal celebrity fake apology if people are. More people should have that attitude.

[BocoDragon]

And so was Al Jolson.

Maybe blackface was a good thing to eliminate due to the sheer magnitude of racism... But I'll say this, if we followed that precedent in all subjects of comedic potential, we'd pretty quickly run out of things we were allowed to say...

[Mashing]

Is this a proper thread to state how much I love Life's Too Short?. So good.

[Lord British]

Listen to the XFM shows, or watch some interviews with him. You haven't seen enough of him if you think he's a cunt. Have you even watched the office or extras? They're filled with so much heart and it's obvious he's not a malicious person.

I find him to be extremely self-aggrandising, and his complete ignorance of the bullying he enabled during the whole "mong" thing soured me on him immensely. I don't mean to detract from anyone else's enjoyment of him, of course, and it doesn't reflect on him as a performer.

Stewart Lee is an idiot.

This is pretty much the opposite of the truth.

[krameriffic]

[butter_stick]

He's so edgy!

[Kano On The Phone]

I find him to be extremely self-aggrandising, and his complete ignorance of the bullying he enabled during the whole "mong" thing soured me on him immensely. I don't mean to detract from anyone else's enjoyment of him, of course, and it doesn't reflect on him as a performer. This is pretty much the opposite of the truth.

Being self aggrandizating is his persona. Don't confuse a person and a persona. What bullying did he enable exactly?

[Baconsaurus Rex]

Derek could've been the protagonist in Der Untergang.

The resemblance is uncanny

[Blackface]

The planet is way to sensitive.

[NullPointer]

I wouldn't care if he was. Mockery is what a comedian does, and all the world deserves a taste.

[Sage00]

I find him to be extremely self-aggrandising, and his complete ignorance of the bullying he enabled during the whole "mong" thing soured me on him immensely. I don't mean to detract from anyone else's enjoyment of him, of course, and it doesn't reflect on him as a performer.

Err.. funny that your opinion of him is completely different from that of the disability rights campaigner who was the one that pulled him up on it.

After speaking to him in October he sent me the pilot episode of Derek and asked me to tell him what I thought. I was worried that this would be the watershed of my opinion of Ricky Gervais, because I actively campaign against people “playing disabled”. Since he sent it to me I’ve watched it several times and each time I’ve laughed and cried. I haven’t seen cruelty, I haven’t seen Gervais “playing disabled” but I have seen reality in the subject matter, having spent a lot of the last 7 years in and out of my mum’s nursing home until she died in December from Alzheimer’s. There are already some mutterings, from people who haven’t seen the pilot, along the lines of “here we go again I suppose he’s laughing at vulnerable people”. I didn’t find that to be the case. Instead of it being a mocking disintegration of a learning-disabled man -paraded for the amusement of comfortable unaffected people, it’s the story that really needs to be told at the moment. It’s the story of a socially isolated, gentle vulnerable man surrounded by other people who society wants to forget, but told with humour, heart and real warmth. It’s a comedy in my opinion, which shows the reality of a life of otherness. With Derek Noakes the hero of the story, Ricky Gervais replaces the attributes of a person which society seemingly most values, with the attributes that ostensibly we don’t. Derek is not bright, he’s good. He’s not sophisticated, he’s kind. He’s not beautiful, he’s compassionate. Gervais as David Brent saw a documentary film crew as a ticket to becoming an entertainer, Gervais as Derek hopes the film crew, are from “Secret Millionaire” because he’s looking for a champion and protector for himself and his friends. The show deals with themes of loneliness, love, vulnerability and hope, told with humour and told from the perspective of people who as a society, we seem keener to laugh at than with. I think that whatever criticisms are levelled at Ricky Gervais , despite how far he’s travelled from Reading, or how far up the entertainment ladder he’s climbed, “Derek” shows us that his view from the top is of the stories that matter told with warmth, humour and truth.

[ClovingWestbrook]

I'm more offended that people find Ricky Gervais funny to begin with.

[EnderWiggles]

Fake outrage to boost rating, wow how original

[NoRéN]

I'm more offended that people find Ricky Gervais funny to begin with.

lol

[Dan]

Without knowing anything about this,

"Derek is a fictional character and is defined by his creator, me," he told disability rights campaigner Nicky Clark. "If I say I don't mean him to be disabled then that's it. A fictional doctor can't come along and prove me wrong."

That's a pretty dumb statement.

[Lord British]

Being self aggrandizating is his persona. Don't confuse a person and a persona. What bullying did he enable exactly?

With respect, I've had this whole discussion/debate a while back during the whole incident and it's too tiring to go into again now. The crux of it is that I don't believe his "words change" defence is sufficient - though it is true to an extent, I feel that given the oppression the disabled face (and even more in the current political climate), the time for his comedy punching down couldn't have been worse.

I am, however, absolutely against censorship of ideas, so he's well within his rights to express himself. I just don't have to like it.

I haven't seen evidence of the "person" being any less of a cunt than the public image he chooses to push. Still love The Office, laughed a lot at the podcasts/Ricky Gervais Show, and will watch Derek.

Err.. funny that your opinion of him is completely different from that of the disability rights campaigner who was the one that pulled him up on it.

Cool. I'll watch it and judge for myself.

I thought this was an interesting article regarding the controversy.

[B_Rik_Schitthaus]

I'm more offended that people find Ricky Gervais funny to begin with.

The guys great, since he turned up on the 11 o'clock show he's being rocking shit up.
This whole mess puts him against Lee and Herring, who I've loved since This Morning With Richard not Judy... can't they just get along and make a movie where they have a holiday in Spain and have high-jinks.

[Treefingers]

The real offensive thing is that he's actually turning this POS character into a series.

[Downhome]

I wonder if this will end up like Lizzie and Sarah.

I hope not. Heck, I still wish I could see more Lizzie and Sarah.

[Kano On The Phone]

With respect, I've had this whole discussion/debate a while back during the whole incident and it's too tiring to go into again now. The crux of it is that I don't believe his "words change" defence is sufficient - though it is true to an extent, I feel that given the oppression the disabled face (and even more in the current political climate), the time for his comedy punching down couldn't have been worse. I am, however, absolutely against censorship of ideas, so he's well within his rights to express himself. I just don't have to like it. I haven't seen evidence of the "person" being any less of a cunt than the public image he chooses to push. Still love The Office, laughed a lot at the podcasts/Ricky Gervais Show, and will watch Derek. Cool. I'll watch it and judge for myself. I thought this was an interesting article regarding the controversy.

Good argument, thank you.

[NinjaFridge]

That is what it is. But like saying queer to heterosexuals, saying mong or spak to normally able minded folk is considered offensive.

Spak? Never even heard of that. I'm learning a lot in this thread.

Stewart Lee is an idiot.

I can get behind this.

[Gadfly]

Ricky Gervais accused of mocking people with learning difficulties.

For a moment I thought this is in the context of his views on religion (i.e. he has suggested religious people have learning disabilities).

[leadbelly]

Look at that smile.

[Lord British]

So do people actually think Stewart Lee is an idiot, or do they just not find him funny? Because while the latter is fine, the former is extremely debatable.

[dalin80]

So do people actually think Stewart Lee is an idiot, or do they just not find him funny? Because while the latter is fine, the former is extremely debatable.

On the least funny things on this planet scale he sits somewhere neatly between hitler and having your spine ripped out through your anus.

[Lord British]

Heh. I've come away from gigs of his and heard the most spectacular vitriol from audience members who didn't enjoy it. Each to their own.

[NinjaFridge]

On the least funny things on this planet scale he sits somewhere neatly between hitler and having your spine ripped out through your anus.

This. I don't like Charlie Brooker either.

Come at me GAF!

[Redux]

Remember guys, we can mock Kevin from the Office just don't act like you have downs out in public because that's wrong.

[SketchTheArtist]

He's so edgy!

http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showpost...56&postcount=8

I knew I had seen you before. You really love Ricky, do you?

[rezuth]

If it's not utter shit like his last few projects then I won't care. It will probably be unfunny and recyling all of the shit he's done before, just like Life's Too Short. That'll be the offensive thing to me.

I hated that show but its alright just for giving us this

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sqA577_IoBk

[blind51de]

Mr. Bean was disabled in some unspecified way and nobody's ever ragged on Rowan Atkinson.
You could argue it of any "buffoon" character actor.