[HylianTom]

I think I missed that one. I still think it's just 3DS except with allowing more than one account tied to the system, and friend codes remain. Not changing my mind until I see concrete proof otherwise.

That's my stance on a lot of Nintendo things, and on video game companies in general. It's just wiser to be wary.

"The sadder but wiser girl for me.."

[Azure J]

MT Framework getting an upgrade better also mean some goddamned English documentation. That engine is one of the best of this generation. I go back to Devil May Cry 4 every now and again and still can't believe that's a game from the early days of this gen. (Dat water and lighting)

Tangent: What does the MT in the title stand for?

On topic: I think of all the engines to be worried about, Capcom's isn't the one. They're going to come back to it when it's time to make that MonHun money.

[darthdago]

An interesting interview of Hayashida about Mario 3D Land gamedesign It could nurture the speculation about the future iteration of the franchise on Wii U

very good article there, I would not be really surprised to see one on Wii U...

BTW speaking about 3D games for Wii U I would love to see a Contra/Super Probotector HD remake on Wii U...dreaming...

[GameplayWhore]

That would be awesome...please give me a real civilization for my Wii U or...or XCOM would be great also...

Civilization Revolution was a massive shocker for me. The series has an interface that is almost entirely pointer based, it appeals massively to old school gamers from the era where Nintendo was strongest, and it doesn't specifically appeal to the strongest audiences on the current HD systems. And it uses the Wii's code name in its title. I would grant that the system is slow and very memory bound for a modern Civ game and that it's made by a team that is used to fancy graphics APIs like DirectX, but then I realize that the Nintendo DS got an version of the game, and that has 1/22nd as much memory as the Wii and an even more primitive graphics API.

So I try not to make assumptions about third party games. Except for TimeSplitters 4, that will certainly be released in the Wii U launch window with amazing splitscreen action and impossibly intricate MapMaker and no borrowing of the stupider tropes of this gen's first person shooter genre, for reals.It'll be made for 360, PS3, 3DS, PSP, PSV, XB3, PS4, Steambox, Windows, OS X, Linux, FreeBSD, cellphones, tablets and toasters before it reaches the U. :(

[HylianTom]

Seriously I had this dream of collaborations between Nintendo and more PC-Centric developers since, phew. Imagine an Alpha Centauri, but Nintendoed. and a Sim City in the mario universe, with green pipes, brick streets, karts, pink ladies castles, lakes, mushrooms houses, etc.

IdeaMan.. that sounds like another 1000-hour game for me. I get easily obsessed with certain western titles on the PC. Civ, Sim City, Elder Scrolls.. all of them exist and compete very well with work and loved ones for my attention.

If an excellent Civilization game ever comes to a Nintendo home console.. oh my.. And if mods are ever allowed, I might lose my job from calling-in with "Civ sickness."

[lwilliams3]

Capcom Hiring for Next-Gen MT Framework Refresh In 2013 http://exophase.com/34972/capcom-hir...fresh-in-2013/ Capcom basically bet their business on the success of the HD twins and were spurred to develop their MT-Framework engine when the 360 came out. Most if all their AAA titles were built from it. It took a while for the Wii to get a version of engine. This is why Wii, the leading console, basically got crap support from Capcom. There is a mobile version made for the 3DS. So when I read this announcement, Im not expecting any serious WiiU support from Capcom till one or both of the HD twins releases a successor. And Im wondering if Capcom again is using Microsoft's new offering as a lead platform instead of the WiiU. Or, when Microsoft back in November or December showed their console, Capcom was able to determine what next gen actually looked like based on the WiiU and Durango. This is how they are going to expand their engine: Shader CG program Physical Simulation AI system At any rate, Capcom probably did not port their current MT-Framework engine to the WiiU. And thats why there is a good chance that Res6, etc. might not make an appearance on the WiiU. That said, Nintendo might of convinced Capcom to at least make one exclusive title for the WiiU that will be presented at E3 or TGS. And Im thinking its Monster Hunter. I think Nintendo really wants to capitalize on online gaming. A reason why they are also making inroads in Korea. .

I believe one thing that Capcom enforces with their MT-Framework is its flexibility (MT stands for "Multi-Thread", "Meta Tools" and "Multi-Target") I believe Capcom most likely already have a version of MT-framework ported to the Wii U, considering that they were probably one of the first to get a kit. Porting RE6 is most likely just a matter of priorities.

Edit: AzureJericho, I think I answered your question without realizing that you asked :D

[daCuk]

A Smash Bros. reveal too :p

I'll change you that for a Capcom X Nintendo reveal, by Sakurai.

[GameplayWhore]

Tangent: What does the MT in the title stand for?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/MT_Framework

MT stands for "Multi-Thread", "Meta Tools" and "Multi-Target".

[HylianTom]

I think that was the Wii. Faced with a market and publishers that had rejected GameCube, they rejected the standard upgrade path and made decisions based on what would be easiest for their own development without risking losses if it was another low performer. The Wii store is web-based.

One day, they might make a console with the assumption that it'll be 90% Nintendo - and then, with circumstances, the degree of third-party support would jump. Investors would be swimming in profits, Scrooge McDuck-style! Wii profits would look tiny in comparison. Heck, I think they might have feared a "too powerful" Nintendo this last time around.

[IdeaMan]

IdeaMan.. that sounds like another 1000-hour game for me. I get easily obsessed with certain western titles on the PC. Civ, Sim City, Elder Scrolls.. all of them exist and compete very well with work and loved ones for my attention. If an excellent Civilization game ever comes to a Nintendo home console.. oh my.. And if mods are ever allowed, I might lose my job from calling-in with "Civ sickness."

The accessibility, easy-to-learn/somewhat-hard-to-master approach of Big N, their graphical touch + the depth, the addiction, of old school PC games, in a harmonious blending of background/universe from the both.

[HylianTom]

The accessibility, easy-to-learn/somewhat-hard-to-master approach of Big N, their graphical touch + the depth, the addiction, of old school PC games, in a harmonious blending of background/universe from the both.

You're making me sad. I know that the chances of it happening are slim..

[GameplayWhore]

If an excellent Civilization game ever comes to a Nintendo home console.. oh my.. And if mods are ever allowed, I might lose my job from calling-in with "Civ sickness."

The next level of modding/homebrew could involve, somehow, bridges that encapsulate the DRC's protocol to TCP/IP packets, so you can turn on your Wii U when you leave for work but bring along your controller and play on it. It'd be massively laggy, but a Civ game wouldn't be so bad, eh?

Civ. Anywhere.


edit: I played Civilization 2 on a 140x140 PalmOS cellular device connected across miles of painful distance to my home computer in the 1990s. Surely, technology must have improved slightly since then.

[HylianTom]

The next level of modding/homebrew could involve, somehow, bridges that encapsulate the DRC's protocol to TCP/IP packets, so you can turn on your Wii U when you leave for work but bring along your controller and play on it. It'd be massively laggy, but a Civ game wouldn't be so bad, eh? Civ. Anywhere.

Massively laggy? Not too much different from the Civ games I play already. I'm used to that, so that's good, I suppose.

I have a beast of a PC, and yet it chugs on larger maps in the late portion of my games. :/

[darthdago]

Civilization Revolution was a massive shocker for me. The series has an interface that is almost entirely pointer based, it appeals massively to old school gamers from the era where Nintendo was strongest, and it doesn't specifically appeal to the strongest audiences on the current HD systems. And it uses the Wii's code name in its title. I would grant that the system is slow and very memory bound for a modern Civ game and that it's made by a team that is used to fancy graphics APIs like DirectX, but then I realize that the Nintendo DS got an version of the game, and that has 1/22nd as much memory as the Wii and an even more primitive graphics API. So I try not to make assumptions about third party games. Except for TimeSplitters 4, that will certainly be released in the Wii U launch window with amazing splitscreen action and impossibly intricate MapMaker and no borrowing of the stupider tropes of this gen's first person shooter genre, for reals.It'll be made for 360, PS3, 3DS, PSP, PSV, XB3, PS4, Steambox, Windows, OS X, Linux, FreeBSD, cellphones, tablets and toasters before it reaches the U. :(

U know I love all the CIV games, really all!!
Each one brings a new experience (eventhough you know the game for decades).
CIV Revolution I still play from time to time on my 360 and really enjoy it.
I would have changed some things if I were the dev but its still a lot of fun to play it.

The only thing that I was dissappointed about is, that they didnt bring it to Wii.
It would have been possible for sure (no one can tell me something different).
If you see Anno:Create a new world for Wii (which I still play sometimes for hours) it looks the same graphic wise.

[GameplayWhore]

Massively laggy? Not too much different from the Civ games I play already. I'm used to that, so that's good, I suppose. I have a beast of a PC, and yet it chugs on larger maps in the late portion of my games. :/

Yeah, it's amazing. I always play with an "Epic" or "Marathon" map until there are hundreds of cities. The game is very, very exponential in its resource-usage curve.

Also, it'd be massively visually laggy, not laggy in the usual civ "Hey, I can go get some Starbucks while the computer is thinking about its next turn" kind of laggy. So scrolling around would be incredibly not smooth. Figure, it'd be like maybe 3-5fps (just a WAG) with artifacts all over the place while things are in motion.

[Bagu]

Enough of the Civ talk. It was hard enough to stop playing 4. I don't need a relapse.

[HylianTom]

Yeah, it's amazing. I always play with an "Epic" or "Marathon" map until there are hundreds of cities. The game is very, very exponential in its resource-usage curve. Also, it'd be massively visually laggy, not laggy in the usual civ "Hey, I can go get some Starbucks while the computer is thinking about its next turn" kind of laggy. So scrolling around would be incredibly not smooth. Figure, it'd be like maybe 3-5fps (just a WAG) with artifacts all over the place while things are in motion.

There is one Civ-related online thing that I would love: mods. Being able to add mods to a game adds so much replayability, and community involvement.

If mods were available for Wii U games - Western ones in particular - then my PC gaming habit would suffer substantially.

[Azure J]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/MT_Framework

Lol, damn. Guess I should have looked on wiki first. :P

[HylianTom]

Enough of the Civ talk. It was hard enough to stop playing 4. I don't need a relapse.

Sorry. But 5 was soooo goooood. Hexagons ROCK! I'd start a game at 6PM one night and finally finish and go to bed around 10AM the following day. It was glorious, I tell you!

[Bagu]

Sorry. But 5 was soooo goooood. Hexagons ROCK! I'd start a game at 6PM one night and finally finish and go to bed around 10AM the following day. It was glorious, I tell you!

This is something I can believe in.
Also firaxis's X-Com on Wii U and the original on 3DS. I WANT IT!

[GameplayWhore]

Enough of the Civ talk. It was hard enough to stop playing 4. I don't need a relapse.

I'm still playing it. Or at least it was on last night. Why do you think I'm lagging so hard in posting to this thread?

[GameplayWhore]

There is one Civ-related online thing that I would love: mods. Being able to add mods to a game adds so much replayability, and community involvement. If mods were available for Wii U games - Western ones in particular - then my PC gaming habit would suffer substantially.

True. I'm happy that we got some mods for Nintendo games, at least. It was cool playing with the user-created levels for NSMBW and the modded characters in Brawl.

But, yeah, one of the reasons why I haven't yet gotten Civ5 (save for waiting for the "Final Edition, we REALLY REALLY Mean It This Time And You Don't Have To Buy It Again After This") is that Civ 4 and its mods have eaten my life.

[MDX]

If the Wii-U is closer to current gen performance, as apposed to being closer to Durango and PS4, I don't see why they wouldn't port the current MT Framework engine. Also depending on how large the gap is, it may not be worth porting the next gen MT engine, instead just using the current version.

Well then thats a good sign.
There is no mention of expanding the current engine to the WiiU.

[wsippel]

The next level of modding/homebrew could involve, somehow, bridges that encapsulate the DRC's protocol to TCP/IP packets, so you can turn on your Wii U when you leave for work but bring along your controller and play on it. It'd be massively laggy, but a Civ game wouldn't be so bad, eh?

The Xlink team tried with NiFi (DS/ 3DS) and failed. Nintendo loves to use the WLAN physical layer without TCP/IP (and I guess the DRC will use NiFi as well), but normal WLAN adapters won't allow that. It's not possible to solve this problem in software, it would require WLAN adapters running custom firmware on both ends of the tunnel, plus one regular network adapter each.

[Krev]

First post in the thread. Guess I may as well give it a shot:

Price?
Release date?
1st party launch titles?
Bullshit xbox360 multiplier equivalent?
E3 Surprise?
$299
November 4, 2011
Wii Play U (Chase Mii, Battle Mii, and other multiplayer tablet vs Wiimote games), 1080 Revengeance, Pikmin 3
1.5x (what does this even mean?)
Wiimote+ included in the box. Necessary for asynchronous play in Wii Play U, which I suspect will be included. If that game is sold separately, it will be bundled with a Wiimote+.
Other surprise: previously denied titles hitting Wii U. Bioshock Infinite, Resident Evil 6, and possibly Tomb Raider will see late ports.

EDIT: Nintendo's focus shouldn't be so much targeting big 3rd party titles, but rather working with smaller, talented Japanese developers that - without Nintendo's help - may not be able to really do something ambitious with the system and its features. Nintendo should promote the growth of developers in order to garner exclusive content and foster relationships with those that have the potential to shift into major players later on. Many of the Japanese big 3rd parties are sort of spotty at the moment, so looking for the next-generation is a wiser and likely less expensive option in my eyes.

Nintendo should really be reaching out to small developers who don't have the budget to create major titles for PS4 and Xbox 3. They should also try to replace Microsoft as the home of indie games on consoles. There's enough shared vision that many partnerships should have been made long ago. But I feel Nintendo focuses on creating the best platform for itself, not on making things easier for third parties of any type.
I see it as a possibility that NCL might turn things around in this area, but with the way NoA is run, I can't see it happening with western developers. If the eStore on Wii U takes off, it will be in spite of their (lack of) efforts. NoA really need restructuring.

[GameplayWhore]

Nintendo should really be reaching out to small developers who don't have the budget to create major titles for PS4 and Xbox 3. They should also try to replace Microsoft as the home of indie games on consoles. There's enough shared vision that many partnerships should have been made long ago. But I feel Nintendo focuses on creating the best platform for itself, not on making things easier for third parties of any type.

Depending on the specific policies of the offerings, it really looks like Nintendo is making a pretty big effort to grab onto smaller developers, what with their decision to offer significant third party middleware for free to developers who make games for their system. Granted, they could always turn around and place rigid restrictions that lock out the really small developers from getting their hands on these tools.

[Krev]

Depending on the specific policies of the offerings, it really looks like Nintendo is making a pretty big effort to grab onto smaller developers, what with their decision to offer significant third party middleware for free to developers who make games for their system. Granted, they could always turn around and place rigid restrictions that lock out the really small developers from getting their hands on these tools.

I'd forgotten about their supplying middleware, but it is a very encouraging sign of efforts to bring smaller third parties to the platform. Your last point is still a big concern though. It's hard not to be skeptical given Nintendo's history.

[HylianTom]

First post in the thread. Guess I may as well give it a shot: Price? Release date? 1st party launch titles? Bullshit xbox360 multiplier equivalent? E3 Surprise? $299 November 4, 2011 Wii Play U (Chase Mii, Battle Mii, and other multiplayer tablet vs Wiimote games), 1080 Revengeance, Pikmin 3 1.5x (what does this even mean?) Wiimote+ included in the box. Necessary for asynchronous play in Wii Play U, which I suspect will be included. If that game is sold separately, it will be bundled with a Wiimote+. Other surprise: previously denied titles hitting Wii U. Bioshock Infinite, Resident Evil 6, and possibly Tomb Raider will see late ports. Nintendo should really be reaching out to small developers who don't have the budget to create major titles for PS4 and Xbox 3. They should also try to replace Microsoft as the home of indie games on consoles. There's enough shared vision that many partnerships should have been made long ago. But I feel Nintendo focuses on creating the best platform for itself, not on making things easier for third parties of any type. I see it as a possibility that NCL might turn things around in this area, but with the way NoA is run, I can't see it happening with western developers. If the eStore on Wii U takes off, it will be in spite of their (lack of) efforts. NoA really need restructuring.

I wonder if it's because many western indies think that they, too, will be the next small or middle-sized development studio.. so they fall into the same thought pattern that the larger houses have.

[GameplayWhore]

I'd forgotten about their supplying middleware, but it is a very encouraging sign of efforts to bring smaller third parties to the platform. Your last point is still a big concern though. It's hard not to be skeptical given Nintendo's history.

Yeah, there are always little things that Nintendo does to add roadblocks to their own progress. Heck, they practically mined the field with WiiWare. It was easier in some ways to code for homebrew!

I'm getting a better vibe this time around, though. They'll do some things wrong, but I think they're really listening and trying to understand how to make things easier for the smaller developers.

[lednerg]

My only concern would be that Nintendo reaches a point of rough parity with the other two services and stops there. They cannot do that. They are not only up against the functionality of those services but the communities already present and alive there. In order to diminish the power that this network effect has, Nintendo genuinely has to not only come up with something as good, it has to come up with something that innovates or rethinks the space in some manner that provides some meaningful return to customers. That's really hard, especially in a field Nintendo has little prior expertise in.

A free online service with user-based accounts, in which 3rd parties have freedom to do (and sell) whatever they need, on hardware with plenty of communication options available to them is a great start. For Nintendo's part, it's really just a matter of including adequate friend list management, and maybe an achievements/trophies system. Anything beyond that, such as video chat or streaming your game sessions, would be icing on the cake.

PSN and XBL are the best online console services because, well, they're the only ones. As far as what they do that is particularly impressive or interesting, I'm kind of at a loss. Sure, they have massive communities, but that just amounts to something the companies get to brag about. (Besides, it's not like they did anything to get those numbers besides forcing people to use them for online gaming.) There could be one thousand people playing a single game at a time or one hundred, that game's multiplayer matches would still be happening regardless of the total numbers.

Hey, I could be totally wrong and Nintendo's going to have some completely dysfunctional online disaster. I'm open to that possibility. I just don't see what's so complicated about it, especially now that their hardware can cope with the multitasking involved.

[AceBandage]

A lot of devs have been seeing success on the eShop so far. Which really never happened on WiiWare.
They changed quite a few of their policies(like how they get profits) with the eShop that fall more in line with how Steam and Apparently Stores work.

[HylianTom]

A free online service with user-based accounts, in which 3rd parties have freedom to do (and sell) whatever they need, on hardware with plenty of communication options available to them is a great start. For Nintendo's part, it's really just a matter of including adequate friend list management, and maybe an achievements/trophies system. Anything beyond that, such as video chat or streaming your game sessions, would be the icing on the cake. PSN and XBL are the best online console services because, well, they're the only ones. As far as what they do that is particularly impressive or interesting, I'm kind of at a loss. Sure, they have massive communities, but that just amounts to something the companies get to brag about. There could be one thousand people playing a single game at a time or one hundred, that game's multiplayer matches would still be happening regardless of the total numbers. Hey, I could be totally wrong and Nintendo's going to have some completely dysfunctional online disaster. I'm open to that possibility. I just don't see what's so complicated about it, especially now that their hardware can cope with the multitasking involved.

Yeah.. not impressed either. I see it as gamers' Myspace pretty much. I mean, it'd be nice for Nintendo to have the features I spoke of.. but I'm not asking for much, and it isn't that great a technical feat.

[IceDoesntHelp]

How is that possible. The grips and lay-out are exactly the same size. The WB just has an extension in the middle.

Iunno. I just hate the wave bird. Simple as that.

A lot of devs have been seeing success on the eShop so far. Which really never happened on WiiWare. They changed quite a few of their policies(like how they get profits) with the eShop that fall more in line with how Steam and Apparently Stores work.

That's good news! Hopefully Nintendo will continue this practice with the Wii U.

[Azure J]

Nintendo should really be reaching out to small developers who don't have the budget to create major titles for PS4 and Xbox 3. They should also try to replace Microsoft as the home of indie games on consoles. There's enough shared vision that many partnerships should have been made long ago. But I feel Nintendo focuses on creating the best platform for itself, not on making things easier for third parties of any type. I see it as a possibility that NCL might turn things around in this area, but with the way NoA is run, I can't see it happening with western developers. If the eStore on Wii U takes off, it will be in spite of their (lack of) efforts. NoA really need restructuring.

I have said for the longest time that Nintendo should try to snap up middleweight developers that don't have either the numbers or monetary grunt necessary to make a regular presence for themselves in both hemispheres. They could be fostered into teams that show the potential for Nintendo like quality or design sensibilities and used to create a greater portfolio of games in the areas Nintendo hasn't explored traditionally or just to compliment the stuff they've traditionally been strong in. I know I'd prefer a system with a library full of Dreamcast era Sega like quirkiness versus a box with just "AAAA sequels the revengening" just because they have to be there.

Edit: The best part about such a setup is Nintendo would essentially be cultivating the next generation of game design and name recognition if done correctly. Who needs modern Cacpcom bogged down by poor business practice and upper management ruining things for the developers who just want to make games when you could foster a "neo Capcom" from its infancy and give them incentive (job security, promotion, etc.) to remain on good terms with you?

*Note: Capcom is just an example here, but you get the idea I hope.

[HylianTom]

A lot of devs have been seeing success on the eShop so far. Which really never happened on WiiWare.

Nintendo needs to come-up with a much better way of promoting WiiWare/eshop titles. Maybe a preview corner of some sort that's always updated and has a spotlight on one title per week, something that's easily-visible when you turn the console on and see the interface?

Demos could do wonders as well.

[-Pyromaniac-]

Nintendo needs to work on the UI for just about everything. Simple, slick, clean is how everything should be. Right now it's just...gah. 3DS UI is also gah.

[AceBandage]

Nintendo needs to come-up with a much better way of promoting WiiWare/eshop titles. Maybe a preview corner of some sort that's always updated and has a spotlight on one title per week, something that's easily-visible when you turn the console on and see the interface? Demos could do wonders as well.

Well, demos are coming out. One for Muttant Mudds just came out in fact. And there's the spot pass updates for new eShop games. Maybe on the Wii U they can do a channel like that, though the 3DS pushes new games pretty hard already. They are the first thing you see when you open the shop.

[IceDoesntHelp]

Nintendo needs to work on the UI for just about everything. Simple, slick, clean is how everything should be. Right now it's just...gah. 3DS UI is also gah.

I actually think the 3DS UI is nice, but what do I know.

[-Pyromaniac-]

I actually think the 3DS UI is nice, but what do I know.

it sucks. Way too much scrolling is necessary from left to right. Left to right scrolling is bad scrolling.

Also folders. Let us make some goddamn folders. That would go a long way. Things could be better presented overall. I give the 3DS the benefit of the doubt since the screen is so damn tiny but still there are improvements to be made. I expect something very nice, detailed, but simple and clean for the Wii-U. That's why I liked Nibel's mockup so much that he posted a while back. It was a good starting point.

[GhostTrick]

Nintendo needs to work on the UI for just about everything. Simple, slick, clean is how everything should be. Right now it's just...gah. 3DS UI is also gah.

"Simple, slick, clean is how everything should be."

That's how the 3DS UI is.
Simple and clean.

[IceDoesntHelp]

it sucks. Way too much scrolling is necessary from left to right. Left to right scrolling is bad scrolling. Also folders. Let us make some goddamn folders. That would go a long way. Things could be better presented overall. I give the 3DS the benefit of the doubt since the screen is so damn tiny but still there are improvements to be made. I expect something very nice, detailed, but simple and clean for the Wii-U. That's why I liked Nibel's mockup so much that he posted a while back. It was a good starting point.

Eh, I have like...the small squares selected or whatever. So not a lot of scrolling for me.
I guess I'm not picky, I don't need folders.
I like Nibel's mock-up as well, though I'm not expecting something as sleek as that.

[GhostTrick]

it sucks. Way too much scrolling is necessary from left to right. Left to right scrolling is bad scrolling. Also folders. Let us make some goddamn folders. That would go a long way. Things could be better presented overall. I give the 3DS the benefit of the doubt since the screen is so damn tiny but still there are improvements to be made. I expect something very nice, detailed, but simple and clean for the Wii-U. That's why I liked Nibel's mockup so much that he posted a while back. It was a good starting point.

"it sucks. Way too much scrolling is necessary from left to right. Left to right scrolling is bad scrolling."

You can change the numbers of icons on a page.
So, you won't have to scroll.
Left to right is bad scrolling ?
Android uses left to right scrolling, and so do iOS.

[-Pyromaniac-]

"Simple, slick, clean is how everything should be." That's how the 3DS UI is. Simple and clean.

using iOS and then using the 3DS UI is a perfect comparison to how much better things could be if they cleaned it up and made things better presented. And like I said, FOLDERSFOLDERSFOLDERS keeps it from being even close to clean.

edit: I know about the homescreen, I'm not dumb. I was talking about the store and stuff. Also iOS users scroll left to right in single swipes. In the 3DS store you're constantly doing it.

[Krev]

I know I'd prefer a system with a library full of Dreamcast era Sega like quirkiness versus a box with just "AAAA sequels the revengening" just because they have to be there.

That system was the Wii, and the quirky games bombed. Sorry. :(

That aside, I agree that working closely with and building up small, promising developers with something interesting to share would be very smart. For it to work, Nintendo need to make sure that Wii U's ecosystem is receptive to these quirky titles. What's the point in making those investments if the average Wii U owner is going to ignore those games and developers, happy with Wii Sports U and Mario?

[GameplayWhore]

Eh, I have like...the small squares selected or whatever. So not a lot of scrolling for me. I guess I'm not picky, I don't need folders. I like Nibel's mock-up as well, though I'm not expecting something as sleek as that.

It depends on how many icons you have. After a certain number of those, it's too unwieldy to use scrolling-only to navigate through your items, and some sort of category management (like folders or tree widgets) become pretty necessary.

[GhostTrick]

using iOS and then using the 3DS UI is a perfect comparison to how much better things could be if they cleaned it up and made things better presented. And like I said, FOLDERSFOLDERSFOLDERS keeps it from being even close to clean. edit: I know about the homescreen, I'm not dumb. I was talking about the store and stuff. Also iOS users scroll left to right in single swipes. In the 3DS store you're constantly doing it.

Oh then you're right.
The only thing I need in homescreen is folder, then I agree, in the store, they should use up to down scrolling.

[Bagu]

Iunno. I just hate the wave bird. Simple as that.

You're a terrible person :(

[-Pyromaniac-]

Oh then you're right. The only thing I need in homescreen is folder, then I agree, in the store, they should use up to down scrolling.

yeah and then there are the little things like the constant loading between things like friends list and notifications and all that. Once again I'll blame the 3DS size and specs on why it can't be better (though maybe it could I don't know), but I'm definitely expecting something really functional and slick on the wiiU, especially considering it is using flash memory. Should be fast.

[GameplayWhore]

"it sucks. Way too much scrolling is necessary from left to right. Left to right scrolling is bad scrolling." You can change the numbers of icons on a page. So, you won't have to scroll. Left to right is bad scrolling ? Android uses left to right scrolling, and so do iOS.

I use Android. After a while, left to right scrolling annoyed the shit out of me. I use vertical scrolling for lists and folders for switching between semantic groups of icons. I have a lot of apps installed, so it's a cluttered mess otherwise.

Edit: The optimal strategy is always to have everything available as an option but use the simplest options only as a default. That way, every kind of user is well-serviced.

Edit²: By the way, folders are suboptimal for what I want. Palm-OS style category dropdowns are still the greatest thing ever for this kind of interface.

[Krev]

Simple, slick, clean is

the way that you're making me feel tonight.