[Quadratic]

Exactly what I was thinking, they both cost roughly the same but I'm sure to receive a massive boost in performance upgrading from my 5770, compared to upgrading my cpu to ivy bridge.

I forgot the "4GB" before you quoted me but I guess you got my point. I'm upgrading from a GTX 460 so I expect to be able to play maxed out at 1920X1200. Maybe a 2GB model might be sufficient enough.

[Mr Swine]

Do poeple honestly believe that Haswell will OC a lot better than a IB which both are on the same die size? I think that Haswell will OC just as bad as IB but is around 20% faster than it at the same speed. I really don't think that poeple with SB will want to upgrade to Haswell next year

[1-D_FTW]

Do poeple honestly believe that Haswell will OC a lot better than a IB which both are on the same die size? I think that Haswell will OC just as bad as IB but is around 20% faster than it at the same speed. I really don't think that poeple with SB will want to upgrade to Haswell next year

I'm skeptical myself. I know Feist has made reference to it being a worthy chip, but the cynic in me thinks Intel is basically road-mapping everything with the notebook market in mind. I'm not really optimistic anymore.

[Huw_Dawson]

To clarify - for video encoding and live video streaming, Ivy Bridge will not improve significantly on Sandy Bridge? So I should just hop on the 2500k bandwagon and wait to see how well the next set of processors does?

To me, the most significant thing is the native USB 3.0 support. Fingers crossed it finally means that a USB 3.0 device can actually be trusted to be actually universal from this year onwards.

[rhfb]

Yikes. Since Haswell will require a new mobo chipset, and I've held off through Sandy Bridge, guess I'll be using my Q9550 for another year.

Might stick with my Q9550 too and just get a better GPU with the savings of not getting a new motherboard/cpu/ram.

SSD + GPU will be a huge boost over my 7200RPM drive and slow broken ass 4870 :(

[1-D_FTW]

To clarify - for video encoding and live video streaming, Ivy Bridge will not improve significantly on Sandy Bridge? So I should just hop on the 2500k bandwagon and wait to see how well the next set of processors does? To me, the most significant thing is the native USB 3.0 support. Fingers crossed it finally means that a USB 3.0 device can actually be trusted to be actually universal from this year onwards.

You might want to post that in the PC thread. For gaming the i7 offers no improvement over the i5 2500k. But for encoding and streaming, I'm pretty sure you want i7. Ask in that thread. There are guys into that who can tell you what you're really looking for.

[DEO3]

Will the SB CPU/MBs drop in price as a result of this?

[Mr Swine]

Will the SB CPU/MBs drop in price as a result of this?

So far IB seems to be cheaper than SB according to some sites

[x-Lundz-x]

Worth waiting to purchase over getting a core i7 2700k now?

[crimzonflame]

When will these hit the market? I will be building a new computer in May for Diablo 3.

[·feist·]

Instead of retyping the same thing, I'll repost what I mentioned to Sethos. Many of you already know this, but, for those who don't, some things to keep in mind:


Retail stepping is different from previous ESs.
I'd recommend waiting until IB launches, and reading as many retail part reviews as you can (at least 5-7+); particularly those with average, and max air/water overclocking results.

Ivy Bridge launch is going to be a hell of a thing. So many folks on a collision course with reality. Not really for Desktops. Performance is barely faster than Sandy which came out over a year ago. The next design from Intel is next year. Ivy is mostly reduced power for mobile devices. You can call it tick+ or whatever, it doesn't matter. It's basically sandy bridge. Haswell next year will have a new CPU cache design and other improvements.

I think you misunderstood what I was getting at. The second sentence should clear it up. That post isn't really about Intel, at all.

I'm skeptical myself. I know Feist has made reference to it being a worthy chip, but the cynic in me thinks Intel is basically road-mapping everything with the notebook market in mind. I'm not really optimistic anymore.

Heh. Yeah, "hell of a thing" isn't reading well.

[Mr Swine]

When will these hit the market? I will be building a new computer in May for Diablo 3.

Monday next week!

[1-D_FTW]

Heh. Yeah, "hell of a thing" isn't reading well.

I know you've mentioned you've considered doing a Maxwell thread (but already felt you had enough with the AMD thread), but I'd really be interested in you laying Maxwell out some time in layman's terms that us mortals could understand. I want reasons to be excited.

[zoku88]

According to whom? Tweaktown didn't get that but maybe they were an anomaly. When is the official embargo up? Don't want to make a decision just on one set of benches.

It was in the anandtech article in the OP for the 3770K (I believe?) linked in the OP.

Only under load. Idle was the same.

[kuroshiki]

Intel IGP is still an ass. Any semi-serious gamer should get dedicated gpu.

[x-Lundz-x]

When will these hit the market? I will be building a new computer in May for Diablo 3.

Exactly what I am doing. I guess I'll just wait if they are out next week.

[sk3]

I don't care how well or poorly it overclocks, I'm getting a 3570K next week. I plan to use the igpu 4000 until the geforce 660/670 start rolling out, so I need IB. Hopefully those should hit within a month?

[Hazaro]

Instead of retyping the same thing, I'll repost what I mentioned to Sethos. Many of you already know this, but, for those who don't, some things to keep in mind: Retail stepping is different from previous ESs. I'd recommend waiting until IB launches, and reading as many retail part reviews as you can (at least 5-7+); particularly those with average, and max air/water overclocking results.

Yup. If you aren't reading 5+ articles with 20 page reviews you aren't doing ti right :p

It was in the anandtech article in the OP for the 3770K (I believe?) Only under load. Idle was the same.

fwiw I talked to the intel rep at PAX about anandtech benches (power consumption) and he just told me to look at retail launch.

I don't care how well or poorly it overclocks, I'm getting a 3570K next week. I plan to use the igpu 4000 until the geforce 660/670 start rolling out, so I need IB. Hopefully those should hit within a month?

670 should be near end of this month as with Ivy.

[brotkasten]

And I skipped SB earlier this year for this ... I really hope it wasn't a mistake and the retail chips will look better when it comes to power consumption and overclocking.

[pestul]

Looks like I'll be sticking with my i7 920 @4GHz for a little while longer at least. I can't believe my setup will be 3yrs old later this year and it still feels like a blazing fast pc. :S

[Eiji]

And I skipped SB earlier this year for this ...

Hah, I skipped SB since early LAST year for Ivy......

[Shambles]

Blarg, don't think I can wait for Haswell. My Q6600 is getting long in the tooth. I'll end up buying SNB if it performs noticeably better after air overclocking, otherwise I'll take an IVB chip for the power savings if the performance comes out about the same.

[-COOLIO-]

Intel IGP is still an ass. Any semi-serious gamer should get dedicated gpu.

it can run starcraft on high at 40~ at 1080p thats more than enough for playing the majority of pc games at great settings. igfx also has way less heat, way more battery life, can fit in a thin chassis, and has a longer lifetime

[·feist·]

Yup. If you aren't reading 5+ articles with 20 page reviews you aren't doing ti right :p

Hate you, Haz. You know what I mean. Some products you want to get as broad a cross section as possible.

Intel IGP is still an ass. Any semi-serious gamer should get dedicated gpu.

You've managed to miss the point. Among the list of things you've overlooked:

http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showpost...postcount=1034
http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showpost...postcount=1020 (skip forward to HSA)
http://www.intel.com/content/www/us/...o-general.html

That's without even touching on how much they stand to gain from buyers of their "ass" iGP, over sales of $400-800 discrete options, and how gaming as a whole benefits from iGP advances.

I know you've mentioned you've considered doing a Maxwell thread (but already felt you had enough with the AMD thread), but I'd really be interested in you laying Maxwell out some time in layman's terms that us mortals could understand. I want reasons to be excited.

You've got Nvidia on the brain, silly. Uh, maybe? Would you believe I was saving myself for Skylake?

Dammit, GAF. Why won't one of you start a Haswell --> Skymont thread?

[Mr. Wonderful]

To clarify - for video encoding and live video streaming, Ivy Bridge will not improve significantly on Sandy Bridge? So I should just hop on the 2500k bandwagon and wait to see how well the next set of processors does? To me, the most significant thing is the native USB 3.0 support. Fingers crossed it finally means that a USB 3.0 device can actually be trusted to be actually universal from this year onwards.

Not true. There will be a significant upgrade to video encoding performance thanks to the second generation of Intel's QuickSync technology.

[dark10x]

I want to see benchmarks first before deciding. If you guys were me and had a choice, would you add another gtx 680 for SLI or instead of doing that, upgrade from an I7 975 Extreme to Ivy Bridge?

SLI ruins framerate consistency so I would stay clear of that.

[xemumanic]

Wow, a CPU, RAM, and mobo upgrade would cost me less than $570. That's an insane deal for a high-end chip.

I'm planning on going from an Intel Core 2 Duo E6850 with 4GB of RAM to a Core i7 3770 with 16GB of RAM. In all, I'll actually end up spending $700-750 because I'll also need a new OS drive (maybe an SSD), and one of those pre-sealed water coolers. I could spend less and get an i5 or something, and be really cost-effective, but I want this new machine to last me a while.

I can't believe its going to be such a cost effective upgrade, considering what I get. It's a bigger jump in horsepower than I've gotten in the past......15 or more years.

[mrklaw]

it can run starcraft on high at 40~ at 1080p thats more than enough for playing the majority of pc games at great settings. igfx also has way less heat, way more battery life, can fit in a thin chassis, and has a longer lifetime

any benchmarks of laptop IGP versions? Want to get a view on how much of an improvement over sandy bridge and low-end discrete GPUs this will be.

[brotkasten]

Hah, I skipped SB since early LAST year for Ivy......

That's hard. It's not that bad for me, I'm still rocking a Q6600 @ 3.6 GHz and don't play (m)any games, but I just want new hardware and a board with EFI, because the post screen takes longer than booting Windows.

[dr. apocalipsis]

Not really, the Phenom II is competitive with Nehalem. So for a lot of things, it's about an the same as an Intel generation ahead of the Core 2 stuff.

Not true, my sir.

Second generation of Core 2, Yorkfield, still have higher IPC than any AMD processor, including Phenom II, Bulldozer or Llano. 4 years after their release.

Thuban x6 can compete due to extra cores, but thats it. Per thread performance, power consumption or OC headroom still behind Q9000 series.

so if i want an integrated gfx laptop, is it time to choose intel over amd yet?

Intel CPU + AMD GPU still the way to go in laptops. Maybe Kepler can change that, but Nvidia wasn't so good at mid-low range so far.

Will the SB CPU/MBs drop in price as a result of this?

Don't hold your breath. Intel do not drop prices ever, because that would devaluate new releases. Just have a look at 775 or 1366 prices.

To me, the most significant thing is the native USB 3.0 support. Fingers crossed it finally means that a USB 3.0 device can actually be trusted to be actually universal from this year onwards.

And true 3.0 performance too:

http://techreport.com/discussions.x/22775

So far, it looks like lower TDP and power consumption, negligible CPU improvement, huge GPU improvement, but problematic temps. I'm not sure if Intel could be able to fix temps in future steppings, or it's an issue due to Trigate being unable to dissipate heat.

It's an upgrade worth only to AM3/775 gaming users eager to mount high end GPU's over GTX570 or multi GPU setups. I would not upgrade anything over i7 920 for raw performance. Maybe only for performance/watt.

[Imp the Dimp]

AMD Phenom II X4 965@3,4 Ghz

Should I skip Ivy?

[chaosblade]

AMD Phenom II X4 965@3,4 Ghz Should I skip Ivy?

I wouldn't upgrade for the sake of upgrading, but if you're upgrading anyway then yes, you'd see a pretty nice improvement.

[Edvardelis]

Will the SB CPU/MBs drop in price as a result of this?

Nope. Prices pretty much stay the same until the stock runs out.

[Huw_Dawson]

And true 3.0 performance too:

Which is very good news for companies like Blackmagic who have been having hell with getting their bandwidth-intensive products working reliably!

I might well go for an Ivy Bridge system then, once I've got the money together.

[bigmit3737]

I have a E5200.

I was looking for a Q9550 because I don't really want to upgrade fully yet, but Q9550 used are expensive because they are rare now, no?

I was thinking of a full upgrade end of the year or next year.
The next set of chips come out early next year?

[1-D_FTW]

I have a E5200. I was looking for a Q9550 because I don't really want to upgrade fully yet, but Q9550 used are expensive because they are rare now, no? I was thinking of a full upgrade end of the year or next year. The next set of chips come out early next year?

Yeah. They have a premium because they're sought by people with dual cores who want an upgrade without ditching their entire system.

I sold my Q9400 last month for 150.

I don't think there's been any speculation on when Haswell is releasing other than 2013. But with the less than smooth roll out of Ivy Bridge, I wouldn't go expecting Haswell to be rolling out in early 2013. Even if it's possible, it'd be poor business on Intel's part.

[·feist·]

UBM TechInsights takes first look inside Intel’s latest Ivy Bridge processor
An industry-first by Intel, 3D Tri-Gate technology makes processors possible at the 22nm process node and beyond.
http://www.ubmtechinsights.com/uploa...2004112012.pdf




"A TEM cross section of an Ivy Bridge chip (above) taken by TechInsights shows the 3-D transistors."


Logic Detailed Structural Analysis of the Intel 22nm Ivy Bridge Processor
http://www.ubmtechinsights.com/repor...ReportKey=7837

Analysts start Intel Ivy Bridge CPU teardown
http://www.eetimes.com/electronics-n...e-CPU-teardown

In its initial tests, UBM TechInsights found gate pitches of 90nm in the embedded SRAM array in the processor. It also found logic regions with gate lengths of 22 nm. The exact naming of a process generation is part art and science, expert say. Even inside Intel debates rage about exactly what gate lengths to use as a name for a chip process.

UBM TechInsights aims to deliver two reports based on its examination of the Ivy Bridge chip. It will release about May 4 a logic detail structural analysis report covering the chip’s process technology, embedded memory, logic cells, logic and I/O transistors with high res images of the chip and its key regions. The company aims to deliver about May 18 a second report on transistor characteristics of the CPU. It will include an analysis of the DC electrical properties of the chip’s NMOS and PMOS transistors, data on its gate and channel leakage current and performance benchmarks measured at three temperature levels.

"A die photo of the Ivy Bridge chip (top) also taken by TechInsights, is compared to a die photo of a current Intel Sandy Bridge i7 2600K CPU (bottom)."

Intel to Present on 22-nm Tri-gate Technology at VLSI Symposium
http://www.electroiq.com/blogs/chipw...symposium.html


"TEM images of Intel 22-nm PMOS tri-gate transistor (a) and source/drain region (b)"

[·feist·]

HP EliteBook 8470p Review – Intel Ivy Bridge Shines
http://www.laptopreviews.com/hp-elit...shines-2012-04

[BigTnaples]

Nice, I will be picking up one of these, along with a new mobo a SSD and a ton of ram.

Should be a great upgrade from my q6600 and 4gb.

[brotkasten]

When is the embargo up?

[Reikon]

Not true, my sir. Second generation of Core 2, Yorkfield, still have higher IPC than any AMD processor, including Phenom II, Bulldozer or Llano. 4 years after their release. Thuban x6 can compete due to extra cores, but thats it. Per thread performance, power consumption or OC headroom still behind Q9000 series.

I never said anything about IPC. At the same price point, Phenom II wasn't much slower than Lynnfield at stock speeds.

[dr. apocalipsis]

Maybe because 'stock' speed means the Lynnfield was at 2'66Ghz and the Phenom II was at 3'6Ghz. With no oc margin (cap at 4ghz when using x64 OS), greater power consumption and TDP. Phenom II was cheaper because it was a worse CPU and platform by far.


Intel about 95W TDP

The first consumer samples from Intel's new processor family Ivy Bridge is as we uncovered earlier being shipped with a TDP value of 95W. This is a well thought out strategy according to the processor giant, despite that the models which is being launched has a TDP value that never exceeds 77W. Intel's new Tri-Gate technology using 22 nanometer transistors should have made it possible for the manufacturer to lower the power consumption on their new Ivy Bridge processors, despite that they at the same time has increased the calculation power compared to todays Sandy Bridge processors. When Intel launches their third generation Core architecture at the end of April, neither of them will get a TDP value that exceed 77W, which also includes the most powerful models that's equipped with four cores and Hyper-threading like their flag ship Core i7-3770K. Most ironic is that the processors, at least the models at the top will be sold with a TDP at 95W. The reason for this according to Intel is that they've chosen to keep the product segments maximum TDP value [Read: The LGA1155 platform]. This despite that the processor curcuits in the packages will work with a maximum TDP value at 77W and many times, even lower. The second and most relevant reason to keep their TDP value at 95W though, is the compatibility between the different processor familys within the LGA1155 platform. Intel is concerned that motherboard manufacturers will see oppurtunities to develop products with VRM and power supply sections that will only be able to handle LGA1155 processors with a maximum TDP at 77W, which is something that would make the motherboards incompatible with several processor models from the LGA1155 platform, maybe even future models from Intel. By setting what they call it a "segment TDP" at 95W Intel gives the signal to their motherboard partners that all the motherboards should be built with VRM sections that is capable of running processors with a 95W TDP. The bottom line is that on the day of the launch Intel will sell Ivy Bridge processors with a 95W TDP that really is manufactured and developed to a maximum TDP value of 77W. That means that Ivy Bridge will NOT consume more that 77W at the standard performance. It also looks as this is something that Intel plans to continue with in the foreseeable future.

http://www.nordichardware.com/news/6...um-of-77w.html

It looks like retail Ivy Bridge, along BIOS updates for the mobo, are improving the OC a lot:




First and unpolished OC, user said.

Old Bios


New Bios (-0.12 Vcore)


http://forums.anandtech.com/showpost...&postcount=515

[·feist·]

To solder your IHS, or not to solder your IHS. Expect to see this more often.

i7 3770K die




Also...

Not true, my sir. Second generation of Core 2, Yorkfield, still have higher IPC than any AMD processor, including Phenom II, Bulldozer or Llano. 4 years after their release. Thuban x6 can compete due to extra cores, but thats it. Per thread performance, power consumption or OC headroom still behind Q9000 series.

This is incorrect.

You may want to re-run some benchmarks, readings, and OCs to refresh your memory. Baring access to the parts you mentioned, have a look at reviews.

[dr. apocalipsis]

Funny thing is Intel use to solder only high end CPU HIS.

Sure they are treating Ivy socket 1155 as a mid range CPU.

This is incorrect. You may want to re-run some benchmarks, readings, and OCs to refresh your memory. Baring access to the parts you mentioned, have a look at reviews.

No need to:

http://www.anandtech.com/bench/Product/80?vs=49

Yorkfield have better IPC than Deneb and Thuban. Have better Oc than Deneb and similar to Thuban. And have lower power consumption than both aided by HKMG.

Also Thuban and Deneb have better IPC than Zambezi, as Yorkfield or Conroe have.

Tell me how can I be incorrect about that.

[·feist·]

And this would be one of the reasons for that cross section. Plus, it helps to have multiple samples of different Intel, and AMD products from the last few generations.

No need to: http://www.anandtech.com/bench/Product/80?vs=49 Yorkfield have better IPC than Deneb and Thuban. Have better Oc than Deneb and similar to Thuban. And have lower power consumption than both aided by HKMG. Also Thuban and Deneb have better IPC than Zambezi, as Yorkfield or Conroe have. Tell me how can I be incorrect about that.

That's hardly definitive, or that reliable, ultimately. If you're going to make broad sweeping generalizations without providing evidence, it would be good if you present more than one link, as a follow up.

Something like this would be a better starting point:


http://www.pcper.com/news/Processors...quashed-dragon


Bench is a basic, quick reference tool. That's all. Does it account for changes in BIOS, driver updates, and other revisions which may be critical to performance, and stability? Gremlins, and unexpected variances you may come across during testing? The result of sub-par/average/cherry samples being compared to other sub-par/average/cherry products?

Whether or not you take into account the different states of Intel and AMD's 45nm maturity, you seem to be forgetting their actual OC ability, and power consumption. You have various examples at the above link. Here's one:



All of those improved with time, skill, and luck of the draw. As for performance, it's glaringly obvious how, and why, AMD has fallen behind, but IPC isn't the static metric it's often made out to be. If it were, the Intels would be faster across the board. That isn't the case. Hell, it's regularly confused with IPS. Again, links and these rough results along with them:

http://www.anandtech.com/bench/Product/399?vs=50
http://www.anandtech.com/bench/Product/399?vs=49

[·feist·]

Leader in 22nm New Core i7-3770K starter evaluation

01: - 2012 Process Update Intel 22nm processor board ... 02: - still LGA1155 interface 22nm i7-3770K debut 03: - CPU-Z screenshot Detailed i7-3770K specific parameters 04: - Ivy Bridge, architecture, 4: not only the Tick to change a light ... 05: - new HD Graphics 4000 Nuclear significant support DX11 standard ... 06: - Turn on Moore's Law, a new era of 3D transistor technology simple ... 07: - 14 models ready the first desktop-class Ivy Bridge About 08: - the basis of hosting the Ivy Bridge 7-Series chipsets Profile 09: - i7-2600K battle comparison test i7-3770K 10: - SiSoftware Sandra 2012 11: - wPrime gives 12: - the PCMark 7 13: - CineBench R11.5 14: - 7-Zip 15: - H.264 Encoder, 16: - x264, the HD the Benchmark 17: - MediaEspresso 6.5 18: - 3DMark 11 19: - Just Cause 2 20: - dust 3 21: - Battlefield 3 22: - Call of Duty: Modern Warfare 23: - frequency test - SiSoftware Sandra 2012 24: - wPrime gives 25: - 7-Zip 26: - H.264 Encoder, 27: - x264, the HD the Benchmark 28: - CineBench R11.5 29: - Standby / full load power consumption compared 30: - i7-3770K Core graphics performance - challenge APU 31: - 3DMark 11 32: - Street Fighter 4 33: - Resident Evil 5 34: - Devil May Cry 4 35: - dust 3 36: - Just Cause 2 37: - Call of Duty: Modern Warfare 38: - Performance slightly enhance the great / Nuclear significant progress

[brotkasten]

i5 3570k + Maximus V Gene, here I come.

E: Wait, the 3570K doesn't have VT-d, but the standard 3570 does? What the fuck, Intel?

[dr. apocalipsis]

And this would be one of the reasons for that cross section. Plus, it helps to have multiple samples of different Intel, and AMD products from the last few generations. That's hardly definitive, or that reliable, ultimately. If you're going to make broad sweeping generalizations without providing evidence, it would be good if you present more than one link, as a follow up. Something like this would be a better starting point: http://www.pcper.com/news/Processors...quashed-dragon Bench is a basic, quick reference tool. That's all. Does it account for changes in BIOS, driver updates, and other revisions which may be critical to performance, and stability? Gremlins, and unexpected variances you may come across during testing? The result of sub-par/average/cherry samples being compared to other sub-par/average/cherry products? Whether or not you take into account the different states of Intel and AMD's 45nm maturity, you seem to be forgetting their actual OC ability, and power consumption. You have various examples at the above link. Here's one: All of those improved with time, skill, and luck of the draw. As for performance, it's glaringly obvious how, and why, AMD has fallen behind, but IPC isn't the static metric it's often made out to be. If it were, the Intels would be faster across the board. That isn't the case. Hell, it's regularly confused with IPS. Again, links and these rough results along with them: http://www.anandtech.com/bench/Product/399?vs=50 http://www.anandtech.com/bench/Product/399?vs=49

I'm having hard times trying to understand your point. So far, all you posted proves what I'm saying.

Higher IPC at same clocks, better OC (total clock and % from stock, as your own table reads), less power consumption. I will say more, C2Q have smaller die size too (214 mm² vs 258 mm², no IMC in C2Q tbh). Hell, Phenom II have a die size and power consumption closer to i7 Nehalem, but without the performance.

Phenom II x4 tops at 4ghz OC talking about 24/7 in x64 2x2Gb or more setups, you can see Q9650 over 4,4Ghz.

Once again, we tried XP 64-bit, Vista 64-bit, and Windows 7 64-bit and the results are always the same. As we near 4GHz, the voltage requirements increase dramatically and the clocking ability of the processor decreases in much the same manner. This does not occur in a 32-bit operating system, which happens to be the recommendation for any sort of benchmarking activities with the Phenom II.

http://www.anandtech.com/show/2819/9

Phenom II was about price, not about tech.


Anyway, returning to OP, as anyone said yet, now we know why IB have that poor temps under OC with that unsoldered HIS. Clever move from Intel trying to set an higher gap between sockets. Not cool.

[ParityBit]

So the top IB is the i7-3770k correct? I am moving from an old core 2 duo.

Will we be able to purchase from newegg/amazon tomorrow if the rumors are true?

[_woLf]

So the top IB is the i7-3770k correct? I am moving from an old core 2 duo. Will we be able to purchase from newegg/amazon tomorrow if the rumors are true?

The mods at overclock.net are doing a launch party build tomorrow, and they said the NDA drops at 12PM EST (noon?) so it looks like the rumors are true.