[Smellycat]

The worst Hell is Heaven. In Hell, at least you will get stimulus. In Heaven, everyone is blissful in a mundane unchanging experience forever. All the sins that actually make life worth living, all the excitement, all the adventure, its all gone. Just you and numbing "bliss" for the rest of eternity, under the eternal dictatorship of the will of God. No change, no future, a distant memory of a fuzzy past, and an eventual happy boredom decaying the curiosities of your personality and consciousness into a soft and vague non-existence. At least in Hell, you can still sin, feel pain, desire freedom, want to rebel, and presumably retain your free will. You'd have a better chance of retaining some personality, even if its locked up in a fiery dungeon for eternity. You and your fellow captive souls, united in their desire to destroy the God who felt it was acceptable to comdemn you to eternal torture for not conceding to the whims of a millenia-old book with no evidence. You'd have a goal and hope, and that would keep you human.

L O L

[kudos.]

So many shitheads.

[SnakeswithLasers]

So many shitheads.

So kinda like GAF?

[Verelios]

I always thought hell would just be eternal, unreasonable, agonizing enslavement that bordered insanity. And it would continue anew the very next day, so you couldn't even get used to the situation.

[Kitsunebaby]

Really, any existence post death would suck. I can't imagine being capable of conscious thought, and also being content. Without the possibility of an end, I would go insane.

That said, extreme physical torture could certainly make all that way way worse. Dante's Inferno was terrifying to me.

[Vulcano's assistant]

Another interesting visions by artists:
Zdzislaw Beksinski

Wayne Barlowe

[BuddyJoeHooker]

I remember an episode of the Twilight Zone where a mobster went to "heaven" and everything he did worked out from him, everything was staged for him to succeed. He had no thrill of robbing banks and winning bets. It was actually Hell. Could it be so psychologically damaging?

[Eggman]

Wanna know hell? Stinky armpits.

[Trip Warhawkins]

Wanna know hell? Stinky armpits.

Female? That's heaven for moi.

[Timedog]

Aside from whether or not you personally believe in Hell, or any sort of afterlife, the idea of Hell has always been enough to send chills down my spine (especially when I'm in a pretty contemplative mood, like I've been today) What would be the worst possible punishment for you? Personally, if Hell ended up being nothing but an empty, endless void for me to wander through alone for eternity, that would make me go nuts. I feel like I'd be relatively OK with the eternal torture or something like that, as long as there were other souls there with me. I mean, eventually you would become numbed to the pain, and then you could just chat it up with the dude next to you or something. But the idea of zero social interaction for eternity is far more frightening than any fiery torture chamber. What about you GAF? What's the worst Hell you can think of?

Becoming numb to the pain defeats the purpose of hell. You're thinking too much in terms of physiological bodily harm and the bodies coping mechanisms. Hell is just your soul. Whatever the "pain" is, it likely transcends logic and of course bodily function (since you have no body). The torment is infinite in both length and severity.

Female? That's heaven for moi.

Female stinky armpits from the right woman is quite nice.

[agrajag]

lol at the "get used to it" comments

[eudaemonic]

Enjoy: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/William-Adolphe_Bouguereau

Wow... hard to believe his name was used as an insult. Thanks for that - I'm always in awe at that level of talent.

[mclaren777]

The worst Hell is Heaven. In Hell, at least you will get stimulus. In Heaven, everyone is blissful in a mundane unchanging experience forever. All the sins that actually make life worth living, all the excitement, all the adventure, its all gone. Just you and numbing "bliss" for the rest of eternity, under the eternal dictatorship of the will of God. No change, no future, a distant memory of a fuzzy past, and an eventual happy boredom decaying the curiosities of your personality and consciousness into a soft and vague non-existence.

Where did you get that horrendous view of Heaven?

[Loofy]

A common depiction of hell(or the equivalent) in asian culture is eternal darkness.

Papercuts would be bad too. Constant paper cuts.. then once in awhile they throw salt at you.

[speculawyer]

An eternity of this:

There is no way I could have survived that place.

[Reversed]

Like this.

Wanna know hell? Stinky armpits.

Think of strong soy sauce.

[Barrage]

Does anyone have a scan of an issue of Alan Moore's Swamp Thing, where (..tryin' to do this without spoilers)..."somebody" asks Swamp Thing how long they've been in hell? Always that was a great moment, and frightening depiction. Moore ruins it later in the run, by making Hell appear cartoony.

[TheVampire]

I really cant see such a loving God creating a place to punish people for all eternity.

[GusBus]

I've heard hell described in a very interesting manner by an orthodox rabbi I once knew.
He proposed that hell is not the classic "fire and brimstone" that is asserted by most, rather it is a period after death where your life is reviewed in excruciating detail. God essentially sits down with your soul (yet you're conscious of it) and plays you a "highlight real" of "footage" of your life. He then asks you "is this what you made of your life?" (materialistic pursuits, no charity, treating others poorly, basically being a flawed human who never took a step back and examined his deeds although Judaism, like Islam, traditionally has bit more in terms of ritual that is expected - The Sabbath, Kosher, etc.) and at that point one is simply so "embarrassed" that the process of "hell" is completed. Then, you move on to "the next world" (heaven is a term traditional Judaism shies away from for various reasons) or the "world of truth" and the process is complete.


P.S. This is not necessarily a widespread belief in Judaism but some of those of the more Orthodox/traditional rooted folks have a belief like this (i.e. it's not written in the Torah but some great Rabbi's of yesteryear had a tradition like this they passed down).

[Raonak]

I really cant see such a loving God creating a place to punish people for all eternity.

most gods aren't loving at all.


It's nice i don't have to worry about such things as I have no soul.

[Valnen]

I don't believe in hell, because if hell exists, then heaven surely can't. Why? Well because heaven would not be eternal bliss for someone like myself who has had loved ones that surely went to hell according to the church. So heaven would be a miserable experience for someone like me. Eternity without my loved ones? Yeah, no thanks. The worst hell I could possibly think of is either heaven or hell existing. Going to either would suck.

We'll create hell anyway. When we're able to upload people's consciousness into computers...simply make hell as a computer program, and trap people in it forever. Seems like a fitting punishment for murderers and rapists and such.

[mclaren777]

I'm both fascinated and dismayed by some of the posts in this thread.

[GusBus]

I really cant see such a loving God creating a place to punish people for all eternity.

I'm Jewish so I'm unaware where the eternity part comes in. Is that part of Christian dogma?

Also, your point (not to turn this in to a religion thread) is not that great and I hate when atheists use it. If you're asking the question "why bad things happen to good people?" or "how could a God be so cruel?" you're already acknowledging that you believe that the world should be a perfect and utopian setup. If everything is random and we're here by accident, why and how could it ever be like that?
My point, and this may be hard to get across, is that by even asking the question you're holding (and somewhat believing) god to some standard of right and wrong in which you would expect if he was "kind" the world would be perfect. Which, if so, would eliminate the need for his/her/its existence.
Does this make any sense?

[GillianSeed79]

Here's my two cents. If we really have free will, Hell should not be a place of eternal punishment and torment but simple non-existence. Nothing. Just imagine not existing, no thoughts, just complete and utter darkness. You wouldn't even be able to percieve it. You'd simply not exist or have consciousness. That's more terrifying to me than whatever Dante wrote about. Absolute and total nothingness.
One of the promises of heaven is eternal life per se. I'd like to think of heaven as closeness to God rather than waking up in simply life 2.0. I imagine eternal “life” as we know it would be as much of as a hell than anything else.

[NaturalHigh]

The worst Hell is Heaven. In Hell, at least you will get stimulus. In Heaven, everyone is blissful in a mundane unchanging experience forever. All the sins that actually make life worth living, all the excitement, all the adventure, its all gone. Just you and numbing "bliss" for the rest of eternity, under the eternal dictatorship of the will of God. No change, no future, a distant memory of a fuzzy past, and an eventual happy boredom decaying the curiosities of your personality and consciousness into a soft and vague non-existence. At least in Hell, you can still sin, feel pain, desire freedom, want to rebel, and presumably retain your free will. You'd have a better chance of retaining some personality, even if its locked up in a fiery dungeon for eternity. You and your fellow captive souls, united in their desire to destroy the God who felt it was acceptable to comdemn you to eternal torture for not conceding to the whims of a millenia-old book with no evidence. You'd have a goal and hope, and that would keep you human.

If you're in a permanent bliss it won't feel bad...you just typed all that and basically nullified your own post.

[IrrelevantNotch]

I'm Jewish so I'm unaware where the eternity part comes in. Is that part of Christian dogma? Also, your point (not to turn this in to a religion thread) is not that great and I hate when atheists use it. If you're asking the question "why bad things happen to good people?" or "how could a God be so cruel?" you're already acknowledging that you believe that the world should be a perfect and utopian setup. If everything is random and we're here by accident, why and how could it ever be like that? My point, and this may be hard to get across, is that by even asking the question you're holding (and somewhat believing) god to some standard of right and wrong in which you would expect if he was "kind" the world would be perfect. Which, if so, would eliminate the need for his/her/its existence. Does this make any sense?

How on Earth did you make that leap?

Here's my two cents. If we really have free will, Hell should not be a place of eternal punishment and torment but simple non-existence. Nothing. Just imagine not existing, no thoughts, just complete and utter darkness. You wouldn't even be able to percieve it. You'd simply not exist or have consciousness.

So basically what it was like before being born

[Devolution]

Female? That's heaven for moi.

Female stinky armpits from the right woman is quite nice.

Wait what?

[Xilium]

I would think that you could become used to or accept anything if you had an eternity to do so. I always found the concept of hell odd considering that the eternity part of it guarantees some form of immortality, which instantly negates one of the greatest fears of all, death. Without the possibility of death, both the mind and the body will eventually become numb to any kind of pain or undesirable thoughts.

If you're in a permanent bliss it won't feel bad...you just typed all that and basically nullified your own post.

I believe the general idea is that many of what we would consider "blissful" experiences are sinful acts. Many atheist, myself included, can only envision heaven as a relatively boring place to be, when compared to our current lives.

[GusBus]

How on Earth did you make that leap?

Because a totally random universe has no sense of right and wrong or meaning to it. By even asking the question you're assuming that there should be some form of order.

[ZombieSupaStar]

Wait what?

about 4 posts away from face farting aphrodisiac confessions i think.....

[bonesmccoy]

I've read that, within Catholic Christianity, Hell is 'merely' the complete absence of God. So what Hell is relies on how God is defined and understood. Thomas Aquinas called God ipsum esse subsistens, or subsistent being itself, which makes this suggested absence both interesting and extremely difficult for me to fathom.

[Xilium]

Because a totally random universe has no sense of right and wrong or meaning to it. By even asking the question you're assuming that there should be some form of order.

This is only true if you believe that morality is given to us by a god. Besides, right and wrong are relative terms to begin with and have no predetermined values which I think falls in line with the concept of a random universe.

[IrrelevantNotch]

Because a totally random universe has no sense of right and wrong or meaning to it. By even asking the question you're assuming that there should be some form of order.

Inanimate objects like the the stars in the sky and the planet we live on may not have any sense of right and wrong but self aware being like ourselves are well equipped to make that distinction.

[Fallout-NL]

So your theory is life itself is hell?

If you do a lot of flying.

[GusBus]

This is only true if you believe that morality is given to us by a god. Besides, right and wrong are relative terms to begin with and have no predetermined values which I think falls in line with the concept of a random universe.

Come on. Relativism is untenable and most philosophers will back me up. There is objective morality; whether you want to attribute it to some higher power or not is your own decision.

[jdogmoney]

Because a totally random universe has no sense of right and wrong or meaning to it. By even asking the question you're assuming that there should be some form of order.

By asking he's making it a conditional.

IF a just God exists THEN the world should be better.

[Since the world as is appears to not have any benevolent deity at the helm, I'm not sure what your point is.]

[keyboardcat]

spiders, spiders everywhere.

like, the floor is just filled with spiders, they crawl up all the walls.

and on the ceiling, oh god they're on the ceiling.

[GusBus]

By asking he's making it a conditional. IF a just God exists THEN the world should be better. [Since the world as is appears to not have any benevolent deity at the helm, I'm not sure what your point is.]

Why? Because as humans we have some preconceived notions of what a world with a just god should be like? We'd like to think that ideally the good would get rewarded and the evil would suffer because god is so "just". Realistically however, that would totally undermine any sense of purpose in our lives just drive the question of existentialism harder. Bringing god into the equation at least allows us to consider (albeit, without any evidence) that our lives are complex, meaningful, and have some form of higher purpose (i.e. fixing and bettering the world).

Allow me to add that despite my ramblings I'm not entirely sure I'm a "believer" but I do find the notion of a god comforting even if he allows terrible shit to happen.

[Open Source]

As a game designer, I design experiences for humans - human instincts and reflexes, capabilities, understanding. By understanding human nature and thought processes, I can construct experiences that make sense to them at a basic level.

One of the critical facets of any game is the system of consequences: rewards for positive development and playing the game in one or more of the ways it was intended to be played, and negative feedback for undesirable actions and lack of development. As humans, we respond well to short-term consequences but have trouble with long-term.

I can't understand why a designer would obscure the connection between actions and consequences to the point where feedback felt random rather than tied to those actions. Or why the most important of the consequences would be veiled behind a wall of confusing and conflicting dogma. It's as if the game was not designed around human nature and perceptive abilities.

[Zaptruder]

I've heard hell described in a very interesting manner by an orthodox rabbi I once knew. He proposed that hell is not the classic "fire and brimstone" that is asserted by most, rather it is a period after death where your life is reviewed in excruciating detail. God essentially sits down with your soul (yet you're conscious of it) and plays you a "highlight real" of "footage" of your life. He then asks you "is this what you made of your life?" (materialistic pursuits, no charity, treating others poorly, basically being a flawed human who never took a step back and examined his deeds although Judaism, like Islam, traditionally has bit more in terms of ritual that is expected - The Sabbath, Kosher, etc.) and at that point one is simply so "embarrassed" that the process of "hell" is completed. Then, you move on to "the next world" (heaven is a term traditional Judaism shies away from for various reasons) or the "world of truth" and the process is complete. P.S. This is not necessarily a widespread belief in Judaism but some of those of the more Orthodox/traditional rooted folks have a belief like this (i.e. it's not written in the Torah but some great Rabbi's of yesteryear had a tradition like this they passed down).

Hell is a wasted life. But rewatching it would be fine. All those games and TV shows and books. It's a veritable cornucopia of some humanity's more exquisite outputs.

And the porn. Holy crap, there was just so much.

[Brawndo Addict]

As a game designer, I design experiences for humans - human instincts and reflexes, capabilities, understanding. By understanding human nature and thought processes, I can construct experiences that make sense to them at a basic level. One of the critical facets of any game is the system of consequences: rewards for positive development and playing the game in one or more of the ways it was intended to be played, and negative feedback for undesirable actions and lack of development. As humans, we respond well to short-term consequences but have trouble with long-term. I can't understand why a designer would obscure the connection between actions and consequences to the point where feedback felt random rather than tied to those actions. Or why the most important of the consequences would be veiled behind a wall of confusing and conflicting dogma. It's as if the game was not designed around human nature and perceptive abilities.

I understand this is off-topic and that you're just using video games to make a point about God, but do you really think all game design should emphasize short-term consequences and immediate feedback? I find the most enjoyable parts of games are not knowing how one's choices will play out and what, if any, the long term consequences will be. I find myself quite fond of games where there are no morality points and choices/decisions can have far-reaching implications. The Witcher 1/2 come to mind most immediately. I find games with meters or bars often remove actual thought/choice and reduce it to min/max or binary 'good/evil' playthroughs.

To make something of this post on-topic, uh, I guess that's an analogy for free will or something. yeah.

[jdogmoney]

Why? Because as humans we have some preconceived notions of what a world with a just god should be like? We'd like to think that ideally the good would get rewarded and the evil would suffer because god is so "just". Realistically however, that would totally undermine any sense of purpose in our lives just drive the question of existentialism harder. Bringing god into the equation at least allows us to consider (albeit, without any evidence) that our lives are complex, meaningful, and have some form of higher purpose (i.e. fixing and bettering the world). Allow me to add that despite my ramblings I'm not entirely sure I'm a "believer" but I do find the notion of a god comforting even if he allows terrible shit to happen.

Why?

[sturmdogg]

The worst Hell is Heaven. In Hell, at least you will get stimulus. In Heaven, everyone is blissful in a mundane unchanging experience forever. All the sins that actually make life worth living, all the excitement, all the adventure, its all gone. Just you and numbing "bliss" for the rest of eternity, under the eternal dictatorship of the will of God. No change, no future, a distant memory of a fuzzy past, and an eventual happy boredom decaying the curiosities of your personality and consciousness into a soft and vague non-existence. At least in Hell, you can still sin, feel pain, desire freedom, want to rebel, and presumably retain your free will. You'd have a better chance of retaining some personality, even if its locked up in a fiery dungeon for eternity. You and your fellow captive souls, united in their desire to destroy the God who felt it was acceptable to comdemn you to eternal torture for not conceding to the whims of a millenia-old book with no evidence. You'd have a goal and hope, and that would keep you human.

So, you've been to Hell?

[JoeTheBlow]

Volcano's.

Thats where the idea of Hell came from. There is an unimaginable amount of terrifying magma below our feet right now, most of the planet is made of it.
Getting a few glimpses of that, usually in scary god-like power displays gave our ancestors the idea that there is some scary shit down there.
Its on the same level as there being gods of thunder.

For most of the time they thought you just got burned forever down there. Sounds bad enough to me, no need to expand on that.

[cacophony]

Slayer blasting 24/7, massive demon circle pits

[GusBus]

Why?

Everyone would attempt to behave perfectly if they knew that a "just" god would immediately react tit for tat. Why would anyone bother questioning the meaning of existence if they knew that life is obviously "set up by god" as a "test" (which it wouldn't be much of) of man's behavior and the good he could achieve?

[amar212]

It makes no sense that you end up trapped in eternal horrible torture of beyond-universal proportions just because you were bad-boy for one unimaginably small fraction of time that lasted 70 year approx.

Or you did just one of the any sin that any religion sentences with Ticket to Hell™ and did not said "I am sorry".

Makes no sense. Sorry.

And also, I would really want to know about that "70 virgins" thingie. How the actual number was established, does anyone knows the real origin of that specific causality and I would also love to know what would a sane man do with 70 virgins? I'd understand 70 Vegas strippers or 70 San Fernando Valley professionals, but virgins? So, you do something in the "favour of the God" and once you die suddenly God gives you 70 innocent young girls to do whatever you like with them? What kind of sick outcome is that? 2 decades later and I still can't comprehend that.

Thanx for the potential answers.

[Vilam]

I always imagined hell would be like the Big Donut level in Mario Kart 64. Satan endlessly chasing me in circles.

[pitcairn55]

Other people.

This is my feeling too. L'enfer, c'est les autres. Not all other people though. Just certain individuals. My old maths teacher springs most readily to mind. Such a bastard. Having to spend eternity with him would be cruel indeed.

I still have a hard time believing in nonexistence, it wouldn't be like a dark void, it would just be nothing. Time and space disappearing, that in itself seems like something so amazing I don't think we will go through it. The worst that will happen is we lose our individual consciousness and become part of some universal consciousness.

Universal consciousness? The GAF Hive Mind, you mean?

Non-existence doesn't seem so bad to me. To paraphrase Mark Twain (I think), none of us existed for the billions and billions of years that passed before we were born, and it didn't bother any of us.

When I die I shall be content to vanish into nothingness.... No show, however good, could conceivably be good forever.... I do not believe in immortality, and have no desire for it.

[SuperEpicMan]

Im not religious but I wouldn't think hell would inflict torture and violence on an individual, it would be your soul that resides in hell leaving any physical form on earth, because of this any pain would have to be emotional.

If anyone has had sleep paralysis, they will know just how terrifying and emotionally painful they are, as a result if I were subject to a perpetual experience like sleep paralysis, I think that could cause me greater pain than anything physical related such as sitting in fire or something.