[TheApatheticOne]

Why? Most cross-platform games run better on the 360. Xbox Live is far better than PSN. The 360 isn't plagued with forced installs, massive patches, manually syncing trophies and other annoying shit. It's not like people are choosing the 360 and Live without good reason - but of course it's always best to ignore those reasons when being a patronising cunt.

Thank you.

Between ebay and Buy.com, for the lifespan of the XBox 360, Ill never will have paid more than $2.50 a month for XBL, but a good amount of folks, all of who will drop this biggie sizing a meal or lose it in their car, act like this is some insane amount that they cant squeeze into their budget.

Advertising is on Live, and I never honestly realize it as when I hope online, whether to play a game, watch Netflix/HBO Go, or play music, it doesnt hinder anything whatsoever. This is on top of all the points made by surly.

[Speedymanic]

pay for psn+, rent games pay for xbox live, get a superior service that rarely goes down and is significantly more evolved in every respect and some ads

Fixed that for you.

[KageMaru]

Why? Most cross-platform games run better on the 360. Xbox Live is far better than PSN. The 360 isn't plagued with forced installs, massive patches, manually syncing trophies and other annoying shit. It's not like people are choosing the 360 and Live without good reason - but of course it's always best to ignore those reasons when being a patronising cunt.

lol thanks, now people know I'm really not working =p

[Speedymanic]

Thank you. Between ebay and Buy.com, for the lifespan of the XBox 360, Ill never will have paid more than $2.50 a month for XBL, but a good amount of folks, all of who will drop this biggie sizing a meal or lose it in their car, act like this is some insane amount that they cant squeeze into their budget. Advertising is on Live, and I never honestly realize it as when I hope online, whether to play a game, watch Netflix/HBO Go, or play music, it doesnt hinder anything whatsoever. This is on top of all the points made by surly.

Shut the hell up, we all know that the RRP of XBL is $60 and only $60.

Lying git, I oughta slap you upside the head.

[Speedymanic]

Uhm, will these ads appear in Gold subscription feeds/streams? Gold members are already paying Microsoft, and paid subscriptions should obviously have the option for turning ads on/off.

They will. The ads will also play every hour when you're playing. Your game will be paused and a30 second Axe ad will play.

[Conor 419]

The xbox live price really wouldn't bother me if all Microsoft Studios online games got Custom Game Browsing and Dedicated servers, but this isn't the case for any of them.

[TucoBenedictoPacifico]

Why? Most cross-platform games run better on the 360. Xbox Live is far better than PSN. The 360 isn't plagued with forced installs, massive patches, manually syncing trophies and other annoying shit. It's not like people are choosing the 360 and Live without good reason - but of course it's always best to ignore those reasons when being a patronising cunt.

No, most cross platform games run better on PC, where online services are free.
Better, more omni-comprensive online services, on top of that.

Xbox Live gold subscription was an abuse even in principle, as they are asking to users money for what they should offer for free exactly to attract more customers.
You guys pay inflated prices for software and then you pay Microsoft to allow you to use the multiplayer part of the games you already paid for, and it's even a peer2peer service using your hardware and bandwidth.
It's insane, it's borderline being a scam.

On top of that, they are increasing the amount of mandatory advertising they are forcing on customers' throats, and despise all that people still defend this garbage.
This is some surreal shit.

[BruiserBear]

I can't wait to see the Xbox 720 dashboard. You'll probably be greeted with a full screen ad upon each boot up.

[GeoramA]

I can't wait to see the Xbox 720 dashboard. You'll probably be greeted with a full screen ad upon each boot up.

Seems like that would be okay for a lot of people here.

[Speedymanic]

The xbox live price really wouldn't bother me if all Microsoft Studios online games got Custom Game Browsing and Dedicated servers, but this isn't the case for any of them.

If Sony up their game next gen and offer the exact same service for free, I can see MS doing something like to justify the cost of XBL.

At the moment, they have nothing to worry about as their service is clearly the better...the ball is in Sony's court. The vita shows they can do it, now they just have to roll it out on the PS4 to make MS sweat.

[Montresor]

Seems like that would be okay for a lot of people here.

No it wouldn't.

[upJTboogie]

I can't wait to see the Xbox 720 dashboard. You'll probably be greeted with a full screen ad upon each boot up.

I'm surprised they haven't taken advantage of all the free space under the tiles, seem roomy enough for a video banner.

[Speedymanic]

No, most cross platform games run better on PC, where online services are free. Better, more omni-comprensive online services, on top of that. Xbox Live gold subscription was an abuse even in principle, as they are asking to users money for what they should offer for free exactly to attract more customers. You guys pay inflated prices for software and then you pay Microsoft to allow you to use the multiplayer part of the games you already paid for, and it's even a peer2peer service using your hardware and bandwidth. It's insane, it's borderline being a scam. On top of that, they are increasing the amount of mandatory advertising they are forcing on customers' throats, and despise all that people still defend this garbage. This is some surreal shit.

Explain how ads are being 'forced down customers throats'.

[OldJadedGamer]

Shut the hell up, we all know that the RRP of XBL is $60 and only $60. Lying git, I oughta slap you upside the head.

Any person posting here should be informed enough to not pay full price for XBL. Sure, the average clueless gamer may pay that but if a Gaffer does, they should be ashamed of themselves. There are constant deals reported on GAF. I haven't paid more than $30 for the last 4 years of Live and each of these deals I heard of by reading these very forums.

[Conor 419]

Can someone make a thread about Xbox live being a borderline scam? I'd do it, but I don't quite have the full technical knowledge.

[alr1ght]

yes, yes
http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showthread.php?t=471408

[Dunlop]

Xbox Live gold subscription was an abuse even in principle, as they are asking to users money for what they should offer for free exactly to attract more customers.

It is always the same argument when LIVE is ever mentioned. Obviously everyone would like it to be free

But the online experience would quite simply not exist anywhere near it's current form without the massive investment/risk that MS took to launch LIVE on the Original Xbox. It payed off and has forced Sony and Nintendo (lol) to play catchup. Microsoft keeps adding services and changing the xbox ui to keep it "fresh"..which is obviously workng as well.

Live pulls in over a Billion a year, subscribers keep growing...would you stop charging for it?

[KageMaru]

Seems like that would be okay for a lot of people here.

You don't really believe this, do you? I don't see anyone putting up with an ad when booting up their console.

[Friedreich]

Seems like people are more afraid/angry of the slippery slope rather than the actual application of these ads.

[Durante]

I still can't fathom that people are ok with paying for something and still being subjected to ads.

(No, before you ask, I don't watch TV)

[Deadly Cyclone]

I can't wait to see the Xbox 720 dashboard. You'll probably be greeted with a full screen ad upon each boot up.

You already are now, the Xbox logo. :P

I still can't fathom that people are ok with paying for something and still being subjected to ads. (No, before you ask, I don't watch TV)

You pay for Internet?

[BruiserBear]

Seems like that would be okay for a lot of people here.

Absolutely. In some way, somehow, some people would say it was okay with them.

[Bgamer90]

Since video game consoles are quickly becoming replacements for cable TV, video ads in streaming apps on game consoles was inevitable imo. The ads will be for video steaming apps. Not in-game. In terms of paying for ads, again, it's like cable. You pay for cable TV & still get ads when watching TV content. From this, MS' partnership with video streaming services may grow into getting more exclusive content. So overall, I see both the negatives and positives that can come from this.

[Friedreich]

I still can't fathom that people are ok with paying for something and still being subjected to ads. (No, before you ask, I don't watch TV)

I think the addition of more ads are bad but largely doesn't affect my gaming experience. Is this middle ground so unreasonable?

[Max Knight]

Here's the thing: advertisements on cable television pay for the production of the shows that are on television, while your monthly subscription fee pays the cable company for providing access to those shows (and ads). The same could be said for the production of the programming on Xbox Live.

For the record, I don't even have an Xbox 360, and I run a Linux PC. I am by no means a Microsoft fanboy. Just a little clarification.

[Speedymanic]

Any person posting here should be informed enough to not pay full price for XBL. Sure, the average clueless gamer may pay that but if a Gaffer does, they should be ashamed of themselves. There are constant deals reported on GAF. I haven't paid more than $30 for the last 4 years of Live and each of these deals I heard of by reading these very forums.

You'd be surprised, a lot of non forum goers I know used to use HDUK and other similar sites to get cheap XBL Gold.

I doubt many people beyond the utterly lazy people pay the RRP. Hell, you can get 12 months of Live for less than $30 if you call MS to cancel your sub.

Still, the price is $60 and only $60. Anyone who claims otherwise is a dirty liar and their pants are, in all likelihood, on fire.

[Durante]

You pay for Internet?

I pay my provider to give me bandwidth. This would be akin to them injecting advertisements into all the content I download.

I think the addition of more ads are bad but largely doesn't affect my gaming experience. Is this middle so unreasonable?

In my opinion, yes it is. But I am a lifelong PC gamer, and I'm used to my online gaming being subscription-free and ad-free.
A "middle" solution to me would be having a free advertisment-funded service or a paid ad-free one, that would be somewhat reasonable I guess.

[watership]

Ads!? How horrible! But anyway, Sony will probably have ads too, if they want to be around in a few years.

[TheOddOne]

Seems like that would be okay for a lot of people here.

I hate people that use selective posts to make their point come out stronger. No, people doing that are just as worse as people that would be ok with what your suggesting.

[Emitan]

How come Steam can match XBL feature for feature and it's free? And they don't even get money from people building pcs.

[PsychoRaven]

Well that just makes me all the more glad that I am no longer gold. Here people pay 60 bucks a year now and for what? More ads shoved down their throats. Screw that.

[NullPointer]

Seems like people are more afraid/angry of the slippery slope rather than the actual application of these ads.

Look at all the people that have mentioned cable tv in this thread. Once games are inundated with ads the same folks will just say that its no big deal since we've been OK with ads in the dashboard and apps. Its the same never ending cycle that just leads to more and more invasive advertisement in every aspect of our lives.

This is just made worse considering Xbox live, where most of the 'new features' are free on every other device out there.

[KageMaru]

I still can't fathom that people are ok with paying for something and still being subjected to ads. (No, before you ask, I don't watch TV)

From my POV, it doesn't get in the way or is a hindrance towards my gaming, which is what I do on my game consoles 80% of the time.

The moment I see an ad when booting up my machine or load times extended to fit in ads, then I'll start bitching and complaining. Otherwise it's all petty IMO since it doesn't effect me in the slightest.

[coldfoot]

I can watch it on my iPad and iPhone also but it's a lot more fun on my Kuro with full surround.

There are devices that cost less than a year's subscription to XBL that can play HBO Go. Not to mention everyone's next TV will have all those apps built in anyway.

Samsung/Apple are more of a threat to MS than Sony is, IMO.

[test_account]

So if you dont use the ESPN and Last.fm apps, then you wont see these commercials? Imagine if it was in-game ads, playing a game of i.e Call of Duty and mid into the match everything stops and you see a TV-like commercial hehe.

[LuchaShaq]

I was on the same page of microsoft when all the ads were games, ads for new games coming out/new demos/new xbla stuff? That actually let me know when shit was out, and definitely helped alot of people that don't follow gaming news. Win/Win there.

Then the contest ads...ehhhh at least it's a contest

Then the non contest wow/doritos ads, at leas they are in the corner but gross.

Full on 15-30 sec video ads...fuck off.

[Friedreich]

Look at all the people that have mentioned cable tv in this thread. Once games are inundated with ads the same folks will just say that its no big deal since we've been OK with ads in the dashboard and apps. Its the same never ending cycle that just leads to more and more invasive advertisement in every aspect of our lives. This is just made worse considering Xbox live, where most of the 'new features' are free on every other device out there.

Correct me if I'm wrong here, but the comparison to cable television was presented to support the point that a paid service isn't necessarily devoid of ads. From there, people took it as some silly 1:1 correlation and introduced a different argument.

[OldJadedGamer]

Still, the price is $60 and only $60. Anyone who claims otherwise is a dirty liar and their pants are, in all likelihood, on fire.

If you are a regular poster on GAF and you pay $60 a year for live you should have your gamer card revoked.

How come Steam can match XBL feature for feature and it's free? And they don't even get money from people building pcs.

The big question is, if all these other services are out there and equal in quality... and free, why do people keep paying for Live?

[BruiserBear]

So if you dont use the ESPN and Last.fm apps, then you wont see these commercials? Imagine if it was in-game ads, playing a game of i.e Call of Duty and mid into the match everything stops and you see a TV-like commercial hehe.

Well, you'll still continue to see all the ads that are already in the Xbox dashboard.

[Dorrin]

The newest dashboard is just one big ad so I guess it makes sense. Where is my game I want to play? Ow it is the small box in the upper left hand corner next to the huge ads... gotcha.

[KongRudi]

Fantastic.. Bring back the retro with unskipable comercials.. :)
They should port UCS from windows aswell, and maybe install a credit card slot in future Xbox arcades, and bring back coin-up features.. :)

[TucoBenedictoPacifico]

Explain how ads are being 'forced down customers throats'.

What's to explain, exactaly? TV-like ads browsing a paid service are just ridiculous.

It is always the same argument when LIVE is ever mentioned. Obviously everyone would like it to be free

yeah, well, it's not about what people would like, but what they should pretend.

But the online experience would quite simply not exist anywhere near it's current form without the massive investment/risk that MS took to launch LIVE on the Original Xbox.

I'm sorry but this is a bad smelling pile of bullshit. Most of what's offered on the Live service is not even for free, beside being a online infrastructure for games, the service itself is just a showcase to other paid content.
You are essentially paying the ticket for the "privilege" to enter in a shop and watch to the shelves.
Yeah, well, that and multiplayer for games... Which is free on any other platform and it's even peer-to-peer most of the times for Xbox games (and when it's server based, servers are offered by other companies, like EA for Battlefield).

It doesn't strike you odd that virtually any gold service on 360 is available for free on PC?
I mean, Jesus Christ, Steam is completely free, does a better job than Live in many ways and it even offers options to disable its popup advertises from the settings menu.
And you pretend to tell me that Microsoft, which is a hundred times bigger, *needs* those subscription money to maintain their crappy online thing? When they already took royalties out of those online games you purchased?

Live pulls in over a Billion a year, subscribers keep growing...would you stop charging for it?

...Which proves the whole "Subscriptions are needed" as a pile of crap.

[coldfoot]

As long as people, more importantly Americans (XBL Gold attach rate is much lower outside US/UK) don't realize that subscription costs add up over time, XBL will never be free.
That's why many people buy the $199 iPhone with ~$75/month phone bill for 2 years instead of buying the $649 unlocked iPhone with a $45/month Straight Talk subscription that uses the exact same AT&T network.
I favor the Apple model, sell the main hardware at a nice profit, but don't do this subscription to access apps bullshit. That's why I hope Apple enters the console space and teaches everyone a lesson on how to be REALLY profitable.

[lucius]

The article says ads in certain apps if it gets worse yeah I would be upset, but I think to get more quality apps sooner on Live this may help. If it gets real bad I would not keep Gold.

[RukusProvider]

There are devices that cost less than a year's subscription to XBL that can play HBO Go. Not to mention everyone's next TV will have all those apps built in anyway. Samsung/Apple are more of a threat to MS than Sony is, IMO.

What device can I buy that costs $35 that does HBO GO on my TV???

Frankly, why would I want to add MORE devices to my HT? I like consolidation. If the 360 could provide me full cable lineup, I'd drop my DVR also.

Next gen, I expect the Xbox 3 to be my gaming, blu ray, dvd, streaming, music and media all in one device. I'd happily buy multiple boxes for around the house and have everything centralized.

[PrimaNocta]

I honestly do not even notice the ads. I go straight to whatever i'm planning to do when I load up the 360. Whether it be a game or Netflix-HBO GO(only 3 things I use it for).

Plus, who is still paying $60 a year for gold? I keep seeing this figure but I'm always finding deals between $30-$40 for a 12 month subscription. I'm more than happy to pay for a great service like xbox live. You can't expect a service as good as this with all the features and apps to be maintained and updated for free.

Please do not bring up that PSN is free. As much as I love my PS3, Xbox Live is a just a much better online experience.

[Speedymanic]

So if you dont use the ESPN and Last.fm apps, then you wont see these commercials? Imagine if it was in-game ads, playing a game of i.e Call of Duty and mid into the match everything stops and you see a TV-like commercial hehe.

Wrong. The ads will play during games, too. Why else would people claim they are mandatory and they are forcing these ads down consumers throats. How else can they do that if not by implementing them in game.

The Mcdonalds ad that was in the DX load screen was an alpha test, now they've moved to beta. Final release will see them force you watch 5 mins of ads for every 15mins of play time. refuse to watch them and you'll be locked out of your console for 24 hours.

Oh and you'll be paying $60 a year for the pleasure.

[Deadly Cyclone]

How come Steam can match XBL feature for feature and it's free? And they don't even get money from people building pcs.

Hats.

[TheOddOne]

Well, you'll still continue to see all the ads that are already in the Xbox dashboard.

I guess forum users are gonna school me about things I should be annoyed at. Hook me up to GAF machine, stat.

Wrong. The ads will play during games, too. Why else would people claim they are mandatory and they are forcing these ads down consumers throats. How else can they do that if not by implementing them in game. The Mcdonalds ad that was in the DX load screen was an alpha test, now they've moved to beta. Final release will see them force you watch 5 mins of ads for every 15mins of play time. refuse to watch them and you'll be locked out of your console for 24 hours. Oh and you'll be paying $60 a year for the pleasure.

:O


:P

[coldfoot]

What device can I buy that costs $35 that does HBO GO on my TV???

LIST price, not what you get on a deal. It's called Roku.