[Mechanized]

Wow.

They did it, they really fucking did it. Generic ass generic fantasy MMO #304

[kodt]

Biggest disappointment are that they pretty much admitted it will play just like every other MMO out there, and that the game world is only about the size of Skyrim.

Why not take the game world already designed in Skyrim, Morrowind, Oblivion, etc... and put them together (with some changes of course, but relative to the size).

[Jme]

teaser is up: http://www.elderscrollsonline.com

[Jako]

The main problem is, the setting is already pretty unoriginal, TES games are known for their depth and freedom, this is not Star Wars, the setting itself isn't strong enough to attract the masses.

[Madridy]

They really shouldn't have called it The Elder Scrolls...

[EvilMario]

As much as I love Elder Scrolls lore, I'm not going to play through a shitty cookie cutter MMO to experience it.

[Effect]

Just need a coop mod or expansion for Skyrim. Not this.

That's really all they need to do. As long as the expansions are well done and add to the game world they'd make plenty of money. A co-op or 4/5 player max expansion would have at least allowed them to test if people were willing to play with others in an Elder Scroll world. The type of things they'd want to do. Without sinking millions in an already crowded market. ES stands out because there aren't a lot of games like it on the market.

[J-Rod]

Sounds like a TES game only in name and mythology. I guess that's mostly what's important though when making the sell.

[Hoo-doo]

teaser is up: http://www.elderscrollsonline.com

[vaelic]

-The game features three faction PvP where you fight to take over keeps and use trebuchets and other siege weapons to help do it. At the high end, you can have 100 v 100 battles.

not on the Hero engine it doesn't....

[Houston3000]

Hmm... not interested and I'm a huge Elder Scrolls fan

Wish they were just making a co-op version of the regular game

[vaelic]

teaser is up: http://www.elderscrollsonline.com

waste of a click

[Ventilaator]

-Third person perspective -The game uses a hotbar to activate skills like other traditional MMOs -Visually it looks like other Hero Engine MMOs like SWTOR -The general art style is kind of like RIFT or Everquest 2 -Fast travel exists in the game in the form of wayshrines, which are also your ressurection point, and you can teleport from one wayshrine to any other wayshrine you have already visited -There will be no player housing -There will be no NPC romances or marriage

I hate all of these, because these just scream of just making another fucking MMO game that's safe to ignore.

Oh, and

-NPCs will try to work together and use player like behavior when fighting you, and (at least to my understanding) have stamina as well -They want the AI to be good, so instead of enemies in a dungeon sitting around and waiting to be pulled, you will be attacked by the entire room and they will try to react to how you are playing

every developer for any game ever says some form of this at some point, and still the only examples of exceptional AI in games boil down to like three examples.

[RadioActiveLobster]

Sounds like Michael Gambon narrating that teaser...

[ScreenSplitter]

Sounds like Michael Gambon narrating that teaser...

He also narrates an advert for Sky+.

[Fine Ham Abounds]

Biggest disappointment are that they pretty much admitted it will play just like every other MMO out there, and that the game world is only about the size of Skyrim. Why not take the game world already designed in Skyrim, Morrowind, Oblivion, etc... and put them together (with some changes of course, but relative to the size).

You know, you think of MMOs as expanding existing worlds into something grand. The ES games are all fully realized environments to an extent that is usually reserved for MMOs to begin with. I don't know that I can think of another MMO that's tried to be less ambitious than it's source material.

every developer for any game ever says some form of this at some point, and still the only examples of exceptional AI in games boil down to like three examples.

I'm aware they're not necessarily related systems, but I'm bothered that they make such a claim about real time adaptive AI at the same time they admit combat will be limited to normal MMO fare because of latency.

[spandexmonkey]

Hmm... not interested and I'm a huge Elder Scrolls fan Wish they were just making a co-op version of the regular game

Thats all I ever wanted, not this...

[daedalius]

Hmm... not interested and I'm a huge Elder Scrolls fan Wish they were just making a co-op version of the regular game

Would much prefer this as well.

[mysteriousmage09]

Teaser did nothing for me. This is the biggest backlash i've ever seen for a game reveal, ever. I'm so glad people aren't bending over accepting this shit and know what an Elder Scrolls MMO should be like.

[NullPointer]

Wish they were just making a co-op version of the regular game

I have a feeling that would end up horrible in a completely different way. It wouldn't be the series we've come to know anyway, as the entire design of the game would have to change.

[EvilMario]

Teaser did nothing for me. This is the biggest backlash i've ever seen for a game reveal, ever. I'm so glad people aren't bending over accepting this shit and know what an Elder Scrolls MMO should be like.

It's not quite Wind Waker levels.

[Effect]

It's not quite Wind Waker levels.

That always seemed like it had more to do with a perceived bait and switch in terms fo the game's graphics, not on the actual merits of the game. This seems more focused no just on the look but the design, engine, and if the game is even a good idea or not. This seems worse.

[Dusky]

Sounds like Michael Gambon narrating that teaser...

Definitely sounds like Michael Gambon to me.

Will probably keep an eye on this but still does nothing for me...yet.

[IdeaMan]

The PVP in DAOC was epic, so if ESO has kept quite a bunch of the same genes, it will be interesting. We need more ambitious world pvp in MMO's. The Imperial City idea is exciting, but they MUST implement it cleverly to avoid WoW non-instanced battlegrounds multiple fiascos like Wintergrasp or Tol Barad.

Oh, and i'm SO annoyed by mmorpg's developers reluctance to add player housing, guild towns, in their games, this is a really bad and lazy trend since several years now. It was and remains a key feature of this genre for a lot players, and the expected size of the landmass + presence of big cities + the fact that solo ES (+ the tons of mods dedicated to that) already have houses (and all that comes with it) make this decision clearly disappointing.

We need a sandbox ESO with an intricate crafting system & economy, player houses & towns, a lot of community/social things + of course a huge continent to explore with tons of group quests & dungeons. A way to immerse yourself in the Elder Scrolls universe, live the daily occupations of an adventurer in such setting, with some friends.

And let the story-driven experience for offline titles.

It's the only valid policy Bethesda ! With this approach, you assure two different content, two manners of enjoying Elder Scrolls, you avoid the Blizzard situation where you take too much time releasing Warcraft 4 because you're worried about the impact on subscribers for your online world, you have more guarantees and leverage to ensure that both experiences will be awesome because they will focus on the core features that they are good at, etc, etc.

Don't milk what must be a MMORPG by adding solo-rpg elements to try to force the Skyrim-10millions-of-copies-sold thing on it. Don't postpone an offline ES because of a possible success of ESO.

My two cents :p

[EvilMario]

That always seemed like it had more to do with a perceived bait and switch in terms fo the game's graphics, not on the actual merits of the game. This seems more focused no just on the look but the design, engine, and if the game is even a good idea or not. This seems worse.

The actual game 'changes' might be worse, breaking away from the common Elder Scrolls formula to a standard cut and paste MMO engine, but the reaction is not close to Wind Waker backlash.

Yet. :P

[Ordinator]

No player housing? The hell are they thinking? I consider that essential.

I'll still play it, but man do I feel disappointed. There was so much potential - to see it wasted on a WoW clone is just...man. This seems completely uninspired and not at all worthy of being called Elder Scrolls. I hope I'm wrong.

[ced]

I had no intention on playing a MMORPG even if it was spectacular, but it's a really sad that it ended up like this. It's almost shaming to the ES games.

[Jharp]

Man... they really had opportunity to do something new here. Real time combat instead of hotbar bullshit, first person perspective being the primary focus instead of third... why the bloody fuck did they try to make an Elder Scrolls game more like a World of Warcraft game instead of a goddamn elder scrolls game?

Hell, God of War found a way to implement multiplayer and still remain God of War. If they could do it, Elder Scrolls should have no trouble.

I'm a huge fan of Elder Scrolls lore, having even read both novels (which weren't too bad). I used to be a huge Warcraft lore nut going back to when I played WC2 as a kid, but that all got shit on around the time of Burning Crusade came out, so I needed something else to latch on to, and I replayed Morrowind and discovered how awesome TES can be. With that in mind, I want to check this out for it's exploration of the lore, but if Warcraft becoming an mmo ruined it's lore, I fear the same for TES, and from what we know of it, the gameplay certainly won't be what keeps me interested.

[inky]

Those screens look terrible =S

[QP3]

Hmm... not interested and I'm a huge Elder Scrolls fan Wish they were just making a co-op version of the regular game

I feel like a lot of fans, along with myself, feel this way...so why did they decide to make this a traditional, non-appealing mmo? is it because they can charge a monthly fee?

[BlazingDarkness]

I feel like a lot of fans, along with myself, feel this way...so why did they decide to make this a traditional, non-appealing mmo? is it because they can charge a monthly fee?

$$$

They want some of that WoW dollar

[Naix]

Sounds boring and generic. Been there, done that...

Different IP's, same old shit. It's really sad that devs aren't willing to try something new, just for once.

[NullPointer]

$$$ They want some of that WoW dollar

But they're not going to get it.

[RazorUK]

I have a feeling that would end up horrible in a completely different way. It wouldn't be the series we've come to know anyway, as the entire design of the game would have to change.

I would find co-op acceptable in an Elder Scrolls game, even if it was to follow the Fable 2 route. The host is the main character whilst the 2nd player is a henchman/companion.
Skyrim has the followers and a real player could take over that role instead of it being an AI.

For the majority of Skyrim I don't think that would have been much of a problem, aside from a few scripted events I can think of.
As long as that 2nd player has their own inventory to use, that would have been sufficient for me.

Concerning the MMO, what a wasted opportunity. As most have already pointed out, they've decided to do a generic WOW clone instead of using classic Elder Scrolls gameplay in a MMO environment. They could of done some really interesting things for a MMO with the first person view option, real time combat, the classic skill system and progression etc. Disappointment.

[Confidence Man]

I feel like a lot of fans, along with myself, feel this way...so why did they decide to make this a traditional, non-appealing mmo? is it because they can charge a monthly fee?

You don't expect them to just make games for the entitled, vocal minority, do you?

[Effect]

There are two (not sure if there are more) real time first person combat MMORPGs on the market now. Darkfall Online and Mortal Online. Both have their own problems. You can look at both and see what went wrong and just do a better job using the systems that were in Skyrim. They didn't have to make this a generic WoW clone at all.

[spirity]

Oh, and i'm SO annoyed by mmorpg's developers reluctance to add player housing, guild towns, in their games, this is a really bad and lazy trend since several years now. It was and remains a key feature of this genre for a lot players, and the expected size of the landmass + presence of big cities + the fact that solo ES (+ the tons of mods dedicated to that) already have houses (and all that comes with it) make this decision clearly disappointing.

Player housing I like. Guild halls I'm not so sure about. The EQ2 guild halls pretty much removed all traffic from the cities and made them empty. Players would move from their guild hall directly to the areas they wanted to get to by getting ported straight there. You didn't even need to find a merchant or banker, they were all in your guild hall. It made the world feel smaller and server communities just became guild communities. You didn't see anyone else other than your guildies.

[Snkfanatic]

Yikes....after reading the OP I am not sure about this one at all..

[Mammoth Jones]

$$$ They want some of that WoW dollar

Yea and unfortunately that means that they're going to follow the exact blueprint WoW laid out and not deviate from it much.

-Grind to level cap
-Instanced pvp
-Heroics and Raid for gear
-No Player Housing

After TOR I'm very jaded w/ MMO's right now. It's like some producer is just clicking off a checklist of features that "will make this as popular with wow" without actually sitting down and asking: "Is this really really fun?"

[GungHo]

Yeah. That's how I feel about ToR. I want to play it, but not for monthly fees. And what is so terrible about the Hero Engine?

It runs horribly if you try to render many players on the screen with any sort of texture sharpness and shadowing. It's also very bland. While I happen to like SWTOR, it's got about as much ambient "environmentals" in the various areas as WoW. Which would be ok if it was 2005. NPCs either just stand in one or two places. Some mobs walk around. But it's not a lively world. It seems like a bad fit for a franchise that's purportedly built around presenting a living world. I know there are often compromises made when presenting that vision even in the single player games, but this is an outright departure from that vision.

It looks like they looked at every single cool thing about the Elder Scrolls series, and instead of incorporating those things into an MMO, decided to make a standard MMO. Unfortunately, it is those very things like owning a house/store and being able to loot PC houses that made this idea so beautiful.

I'd probably be less put-off if they just called it FantasyVille and came up with their own IP rather than try to glom on like this and pull down Elder Scrolls. No wonder Bethesda tried to stop them.

Also, I don't understand why they're trying to shoehorn race-based factions into this. It's sounds like an assinine decision made by a suit who was saying "but Warcraft has factions! It's got to be like Warcraft! Warcraft makes money like a money machine. It's got to look like the money machine!"

Is there a technical reason for this not being first person?

No... you just won't see the floaties and the glowies when you're hit, CCed, or have auras up.

[Jharp]

You don't expect them to just make games for the entitled, vocal minority, do you?

The "entitled, vocal minority" is the only way this project will survive. The majority is off playing other, bigger, better MMOs like WoW. The only way this game will stand a chance is to hook in fans of the IP at first and then build from there. World of Warcraft grabbed a lot of people by actually changing up the design of MMOs, because at the time, MMOs were known for being hard, unwieldy, and inaccessible. WoW grabbed the Warcraft fans that the series already had and the jaded MMO fans who wanted something more user-friendly as well as people who still hadn't gotten into MMOs for that reason.

TES Online has to do the same thing, but it seems like they're alienating the TES fans by changing up the gameplay that those fans love, and they aren't grabbing any jaded MMO fans by copying everything else that already exists on the market, nor will they get any new fans to pick up MMOs by being just like everything else out there.

So yes, I would expect them to make a game for what I'm sure you pejoratively refer to as the "entitled, vocal minority." Who do you expect them to make games for? The MMO majority that already have dozens upon dozens of high quality, established games to choose from?

[Apophenia Overload]

I wonder if this can be seen as part of a larger reaction to traditional AAA publishers. Maybe the blowback from Mass Effect 3 and TOR is just the beginning. Maybe gamers are finally starting to wise up to the fact that big budgets and high production values don't mean anything. Or maybe I'm just reading too much into this.

[IdeaMan]

Player housing I like. Guild halls I'm not so sure about. The EQ2 guild halls pretty much removed all traffic from the cities and made them empty. Players would move from their guild hall directly to the areas they wanted to get to by getting ported straight there. You didn't even need to find a merchant or banker, they were all in your guild hall. It made the world feel smaller and server communities just became guild communities. You didn't see anyone else other than your guildies.

Yeah i know the problems that could come with guild halls/cities, but there's a lot of ways to avoid these cases, like having quite a lot of apartments/flats in towns already existing in the game reserved to the active (or other parameters) guilds, some key functions (economy) only available in thes cities, etc.

The "no player housing" is a real pity, maybe by being "vocal", they can change this decision.

[balladofwindfishes]

I'm thinking this has to be non-canon. The Elder Scrolls has a pretty rich lore told through books and many games over the course of centuries in-game.

It seems hard to work around that lore to make a game with millions of chosen and a constantly changing emperor, especially when such a heavy event like that would just get "lost" in history. I don't buy it.

100 years in the based is two Sheogoraths ago, for example. Will this be addressed? If it happens at the end of an age, will the Grey March be accounted for? (I doubt it).

They basically can't do anything meaningful in the story without tossing away established lore. I'm not sure why they opted for 1000 years in the past, versus 1000 years in the future, when they can just do whatever they want and rewrite all the lore than need to.

[sparky2112]

Man, if I were on the development team and came into this thread, I'd be feeling pretty crappy at the moment, unless I knew that, contrary to all expectations, what I was working really IS going to turn the MMO world on its head a bit. As is, I doubt it will, and we're lookin' at a bomba situation here...

[IdeaMan]

Yea and unfortunately that means that they're going to follow the exact blueprint WoW laid out and not deviate from it much. -Grind to level cap -Instanced pvp -Heroics and Raid for gear -No Player Housing After TOR I'm very jaded w/ MMO's right now. It's like some producer is just clicking off a checklist of features that "will make this as popular with wow" without actually sitting down and asking: "Is this really really fun?"

It's the state of the MMO genre since WOW launched actually (besides some exceptions). A real missed opportunity, a case of study for this young industry.

[dinosaur_hunter2]

I adore ES, but I'm just not down with this.

This.

I dont really like the sound of any of this.

And this. I thought the game would do something different than other MMO's, but it seems to me they are following the WoW way. Therefore, I have zero interest in this.

[Zaphod]

We need a sandbox ESO with an intricate crafting system & economy, player houses & towns, a lot of community/social things + of course a huge continent to explore with tons of group quests & dungeons. A way to immerse yourself in the Elder Scrolls universe, live the daily occupations of an adventurer in such setting, with some friends.

I was hoping it would have been like this when I saw the thread title. Then I read the bullet points...

[SquiddyCracker]

Wow, I don't the developers were expecting this kinda backfire. I kinda feel sorry for them, seeing as they did start development on this game when most people weren't burnt out playing traditional MMOs. But then again, traditional MMOs need to start failing if we are ever going to see some change in this area.

I hope for their sake that this game has something that puts it apart from the competition.

[Vinci]

So they quite literally took everything people liked about Elder Scrolls and removed it from inclusion in the MMO. This should do well.


....


The combination of WoW and Guild Wars 2 will doom this.