[Jako]

From what I see, many of you guys aren't so happy about this new announcement. Maybe they should start go with another Fallout or better yet Skyrim 2.

I don't think this is being developed by the same team that made Skyrim (Bethesda is a part of ZeniMax, but I'm not sure how that works).

[HiddenWings]

I don't think this is being developed by the same team that made Skyrim (Bethesda is a part of ZeniMax, but I'm not sure how that works).

Bethesda Game Studios, Zenimax Online, Arkane Studios and others are all developers that are owned by Zenimax media. Bethesda Softworks (which is a publisher) is also owned by Zenimax Media (and is probably publishing this game).

[Jako]

Bethesda Game Studios, Zenimax Online, Arkane Studios and others are all developers that are owned by Zenimax media. Bethesda Softworks (which is a publisher) is also owned by Zenimax Media (and is probably publishing this game).

Bethesda Softworks is the one that published Brink, RAGE and is going to publish Dishonored right?

[TriGen]

I think an Elders Scrolls game that you could play online with other people would be great. This doesn't seem to be that game. Maybe someday.

I agree. I've said before in that "what will be the next big thing" thread that I imagine after online FPS games that some sort of online RPG that is kind of simplified to work with consoles will probaly be a big seller.

Skyrim proved that games that aren't FPS can sell to the mainstream audience, when you couple that with the popularity of online console gaming I think some kind of MMO can sell on both PC and consoles. It just comes down to the game controlling like a single-player game, it can't be to hard for a random to pick up and play.

If there was an open-world place like in an MMO where you can play with your online buddies and level up against NPC's then take that character you levled up into game modes like CoD has, you know team deathmatch, deathmatch, domination, capture the flag, etc..... I think it could be huge.

Gamers that only buy CoD, Madden, AC, also will buy RPG's like ES and Fallout, if they could combine on consoles the addiction of online gaming with gameplay like ES or even some Zelda style it could work.

When you think about it we haven't really seen it attempted on a grand-scale for consoles, that FF mess doesn't really count as for one it was excuted awful and two FF's gameplay doesn't really have that mainstream pick up and play appeal, also the timing wasn't right, but now I think the consumers have shown that they are ready for it.

[HiddenWings]

Bethesda Softworks is the one that published Brink, RAGE and is going to publish Dishonored right?

Yes.

[IdeaMan]

My opinion about this project is already available a few pages before (and it's rather negative), but it would be cool to avoid the doom predictions, at least the ones that nearly WISH the title to bomb and the hundred of people living from it being fired :(

Let's try to be constructive, even if it's hard considering ESO is developed since what, 4 or 5 years, so the chances to see drastic changes (like integration of player housing/towns) following the feedback and the general reception of the community will surely be small.

[mysteriousmage09]

ahahahahahahahahahah Especially the quest: Yes, My Thane - Carry 22 Burdens

I made a little addition of my own. I think he fits right in!

I know it's sloppy as shit so shh!

[Kem0sabe]

It´s depressing that entire "nations", like Morrowind and Skyrim will be reduced to simple zones, they will try to fit as much team park shit into such small areas that the game will feel like your simply going from one attraction to another with no exploration and sense of discovery.

[BigDug13]

Imagine what could have been accomplished if they had devoted those 250 people towards Bethesda Studios projects for the past 5 years. We could have had another Fallout and another ES game selling like hotcakes. Instead we have a DOA WoW clone.

[HiddenWings]

My opinion about this project is already available a few pages before (and it's rather negative), but it would be cool to avoid the doom predictions, at least the ones that nearly WISH the title to bomb and the hundred of people living from it being fired :( Let's try to be constructive, even if it's hard considering ESO is developed since what, 4 or 5 years, so the chances to see drastic changes (like integration of player housing/towns) following the feedback and the general reception of the community will surely be small.

My opinion can be described as "cautiously optimistic". Personally, I think Skyrim combat in a multiplayer game would be terrible, as combat is one of the worst parts of Skyrim. (If you want to see what that looks like, you can check out Darkfall.) At the same time, combat that moves past WoW would be appreciated. Guild Wars 2 has a hotbar. TERA has a hotbar. DCUO has a hotbar, and none of those adhere exactly to WoW-style combat. We'll have to see.

On the engine: I've said this already, but since HeroEngine doesn't run on Mac, and through some arcane sorcery this game does, they've probably re-written (large) parts of it. As for the graphical style, I'm less sure.

On the factions: Yeah, these make no sense.

[Munin]

Guys, it's time to calm down, sit back and watch the thing go down in flames when Bethesda realizes people do in fact not want another World of Warcraft. Then we'll get our singleplayer games back, perhaps around 2015 or so, and everything will be fine.

[Sblargh]

Imagine what could have been accomplished if they had devoted those 250 people towards Bethesda Studios projects for the past 5 years. We could have had another Fallout and another ES game selling like hotcakes. Instead we have a DOA WoW clone.

By now we would have, like, 2 DLCs for Skyrim! And the name of a third!

[poisonelf]

There are times when I can't fathom how entire teams of people whose success seems to indicate they're pretty smart, reach such unbelievably stupid decisions.

So they own a franchise that sells by the millions, the highest selling fantasy franchise for single player games, a combination of hardcore RPG audience and casual gamers that others would murder for, a distinct style of gameplay and artwork, a game that already is being called a single player MMO experience, and...

...They decide to make a WoW-clone, no real time combat, WoW game mechanics, generic artwork... It almost sounds like trolling. Hasn't the long line of failed WoW clones taught anyone anything?

I was actually excited for this. I think a *real* Elder Scrolls MMO could be the revolution in the genre. Elder Scrolls at this point beg for a MMORPG adaptation, I really disagree with all the people saying that the very idea is stupid.
But this attempt sounds to be laughable, unless it's some form of extreme misunderstanding.

We need to see it first, obviously, but if this list is real it's a colossal failure in judgement.

[spirity]

ahahahahahahahahahah Especially the quest: Yes, My Thane - Carry 22 Burdens

Haha, brillliant. Needs about 1000 more meme's and pop culture references in that scene though to give it that true WoW feel.

-I taut I taw a puddycat
Hug 50 Khajit

-You dun goofed
Fall 3ft.. and die. We know you dumb fucks can do it too

-Philosoraptor
Beat the ass of an Argonian in a duel

-Gotta get down on Fry-day
Make an omlette

The de-Evolution of Dance
-Dance in all capitals, naked, by the bank

Forever Alone
-Refuse 50 guild invites

Bear Grills
-Cook some bear meat then drink your own piss

[IdeaMan]

Haha, brillliant. Needs about 1000 more meme's and pop culture references in that scene though to give it that true WoW feel. -I taut I taw a puddycat Hug 50 Khajit -You dun goofed Fall 3ft.. and die. We know you dumb fucks can do it too -Philosoraptor Beat the ass of an Argonian in a duel -Gotta get down on Fry-day Make an omlette The de-Evolution of Dance -Dance in all capitals, naked, by the bank Forever Alone -Refuse 50 guild invites Bear Grills -Cook some bear meat then drink your own piss

We obviously need a recount/dps meter addon with a list of 15 roxorz nickname like "FusRohDaMan"

[mysteriousmage09]

We obviously need a recount/fps meter addon with a list of 15 roxorz nickname like "FusRohDaMan"

lol indeed.

[Vesper73]

Ugh, screens look like a shitty dragon age origins mod

this..

[Jaleel]

...They decide to make a WoW-clone, no real time combat, WoW game mechanics, generic artwork... It almost sounds like trolling. Hasn't the long line of failed WoW clones taught anyone anything?

Well, that's the thing though. Have the WoW clones truely failed? I recall reading a thread not so long ago in regards to SWTOR where EA said they only needed 500,000 subscribers to turn a profit. Keep in mind that's how much they needed to make a profit from a game that is estimated to cost 100 million dollars to make (including advertisement). I'm sure this MMO will have a somewhat smaller budget (totally a guess, I could be wrong).

I'm sure they are expecting to sell a couple million copies on release due to the Elder Scrolls name alone and hope to retain at least anywhere between 500,000 to 2 million as subscribers. And with that, they'll tout it as a great success.

[Bufbaf]

Yeah this will bomb. Just stop development and start over again :/

[spirity]

Well, that's the thing though. Have the WoW clones truely failed? I recall reading a thread not so long ago in regards to SWTOR where EA said they only needed 500,000 subscribers to turn a profit. Keep in mind that's how much they needed to make a profit from a game that is estimated to cost 100 million dollars to make (including advertisement). I'm sure this MMO will have a somewhat smaller budget (totally a guess, I could be wrong). I'm sure they are expecting to sell a couple million copies on release due to the Elder Scrolls name alone and hope to retain at least anywhere between 500,000 to 2 million as subscribers. And with that, they'll tout it as a great success.

EQ1 at its peak had 450,000 subscribers. I think the devs said if they got 100k they'd be happy, which was presumably just above the break even point. The cost of EQ1 would have been a lot lower than WoW and TOR of course, but that should show you that you don't need a ton of subs to turn a profit. They're still releasing expansions for EQ1 too. I think it's on it's 15th.

I guess there's perhaps some truth in the notion that WoW clones are profitable. Not sustainable of course, because everyone quits them and goes back to WoW. But for that initial year they're up I guess they must be covering the production costs and then some. When the subs begin to dwindle, you just cut the number of staff working on the game, cut the number of servers, as it goes into life support. Keep the lights on for as long as its turning a profit, then stick a fork in it when the upkeep doesn't match the income. I dunno. Trying to find some explanation as to why they're still being made because it makes no sense to me.

EDIT
Just checked. EQ1's budget, not including infrastructure costs, was $5m. They were hoping for 30,000 subs in the first two years.

[bengraven]

M'aiq prefers to adventure alone. Others just get in the way. And they talk, talk, talk...

[cartoon_soldier]

Well, that's the thing though. Have the WoW clones truely failed? I recall reading a thread not so long ago in regards to SWTOR where EA said they only needed 500,000 subscribers to turn a profit. Keep in mind that's how much they needed to make a profit from a game that is estimated to cost 100 million dollars to make (including advertisement). I'm sure this MMO will have a somewhat smaller budget (totally a guess, I could be wrong). I'm sure they are expecting to sell a couple million copies on release due to the Elder Scrolls name alone and hope to retain at least anywhere between 500,000 to 2 million as subscribers. And with that, they'll tout it as a great success.

The reason people feel that all WoW clones fail is because none of them reach WoW's level of subscribers, it has nothing to do with whether the game becomes profitable or not.

[Vesper73]

Well, that's the thing though. Have the WoW clones truely failed? I recall reading a thread not so long ago in regards to SWTOR where EA said they only needed 500,000 subscribers to turn a profit. Keep in mind that's how much they needed to make a profit from a game that is estimated to cost 100 million dollars to make (including advertisement). I'm sure this MMO will have a somewhat smaller budget (totally a guess, I could be wrong). I'm sure they are expecting to sell a couple million copies on release due to the Elder Scrolls name alone and hope to retain at least anywhere between 500,000 to 2 million as subscribers. And with that, they'll tout it as a great success.

stop using logic 'n stuff....

[TriGen]

The reason people feel that all WoW clones fail is because none of them reach WoW's level of subscribers, it has nothing to do with whether the game becomes profitable or not.

Yeah, when people compare you to the behemoth it always looks ugly.

[bengraven]

I really find this game a mark of arrogance on the part of Zenimax though.

For years Bethesda has said they don't want to make a multiplayer Elder Scrolls. Then this shows up and shares nothing gameplay wise with the mainline series, but is instead another "____-clone" and not only that, but it obviously hasn't learned from the last couple years of MMO development. I know Penny Arcade already covered this, but compared to the innovations of TOR and Guild Wars, this is a huge step down.

If this was F2P it would be different.



THAT SAID, returning to Morrowind and getting to explore the entire world of Tamriel is really really tempting to me. That said, I'll likely wait for it to go F2P.

[StoppedInTracks]

Graphics are fine, art style is NOT.

[cartoon_soldier]

Yeah, when people compare you to the behemoth it always looks ugly.

Games in the past that haven't deviated too much from the WoW formula have been successful enough for the companies (RIFT, SWTOR, LOTRO, some have kept going profitably after switching to F2P/Freemium Models - Aion comes to mind).

I don't believe any MMO game coming out will reach WoW's level of success.

I really find this game a mark of arrogance on the part of Zenimax though. For years Bethesda has said they don't want to make a multiplayer Elder Scrolls. Then this shows up and shares nothing gameplay wise with the mainline series, but is instead another "____-clone" and not only that, but it obviously hasn't learned from the last couple years of MMO development. I know Penny Arcade already covered this, but compared to the innovations of TOR and Guild Wars, this is a huge step down. If this was F2P it would be different. THAT SAID, returning to Morrowind and getting to explore the entire world of Tamriel is really really tempting to me. That said, I'll likely wait for it to go F2P.

Agreed, this doesn't have the Bethesda stamp on it and it shows. Which also means, we may still get continuing installments in the ES series on the SP side. This is definitely a "let's cash in" decision, maybe after the reveal reaction, Zenimax will involve Bethesda...

I am still interested, and will be looking to follow more information as it comes out. Questing in a full fledged ES universe even for a couple of months, sinking 150 hours into the experience for 65 dollars is same as buying another SP game to me.

[Alpha-Bromega]

THAT SAID, returning to Morrowind and getting to explore the entire world of Tamriel is really really tempting to me. That said, I'll likely wait for it to go F2P.

LOL you know it's gonna be just a comical theme park zone. We're better off just waiting for the Daggerfall Mod

Graphics are fine, art style is NOT.

Well not only is the distinct Art of TES (AT LEAST MORROWIND !!!!!) not present, but apparently this Hero engine is just dog shit

[spirity]

THAT SAID, returning to Morrowind and getting to explore the entire world of Tamriel is really really tempting to me. That said, I'll likely wait for it to go F2P.

It is, but bear in mind you won't be able to do half the shit you can do in Morrowind, or even Oblivion and Skyrim. You'll be strapped in to a linear themepark game that has been spreadsheeted to death. It will be hollow and disappointing. And I imagine numerous "why can't i do this" will flood your mind as you play.

This is one for the MMO fans, but probably not the ES fans.

[Jaleel]

But for that initial year they're up I guess they must be covering the production costs and then some. .

I definitely believe this to be the case.

The reason people feel that all WoW clones fail is because none of them reach WoW's level of subscribers, it has nothing to do with whether the game becomes profitable or not.

I get what you are saying. I guess what I toke issue with is people calling a game a failure just because it doesn't reach similar sales to its respective genre's best seller.

[RoadHazard]

I just hope this turd doesn't negatively affect the real TES series in any way. If by some miracle this game is a success, I'd absolutely hate to see them delay the development of another offline TES game in order not to steal attention away from TESO (I imagine that's why there's no Warcraft 4?).

On the other hand, if it fails miserably, that won't exactly be a good thing for the TES brand either.

Also seems like they're taking a rather huge dump on the TES lore, so I really hope Bethesda just completely ignores the existence of this game when developing TES6.

I'm scared.

[animlboogy]

15 slow-moving pages for the Elder Scrolls MMO that's been rumored for so long...

On a positive note, I guess that's sort of proof that for all the flak NeoGAF gets, we definitely prefer to talk about games we like!

[HiddenWings]

15 slow-moving pages for the Elder Scrolls MMO that's been rumored for so long... On a positive note, I guess that's sort of proof that for all the flak NeoGAF gets, we definitely prefer to talk about games we like!

Did you miss the other thread?

I still think there's not enough info to make a judgment call one way or the other.

[Monocle]

I just hope this and any future multiplayer Elder Scrolls games will be strictly isolated from single player canon. Otherwise, the series' plot is bound to decline.

[rakhir]

M'aiq prefers to adventure alone. Others just get in the way. And they talk, talk, talk...

I laughed out loud and then started to feel sad.

Everything about this game looks terrible. This is NOT what I wanted from an Elder Scrolls mmo :/

[SteveWD40]

If they think they will get away with a sub for this then they really, really overestimate their fanbase.

No player housing for one thing, I don't know an ES fan who doesn't spend half the game collecting cool shit for their house then arranging said shit.

[Munin]

I just hope this and any future multiplayer Elder Scrolls games will be strictly isolated from single player canon. Otherwise, the series' plot is bound to decline.

The "stories" per se have always been shit, it's the lore and setting that make the games interesting.

That being said if this takes off I don't expect to see another single player game within the next 10 years.

[RoadHazard]

I just hope this and any future multiplayer Elder Scrolls games will be strictly isolated from single player canon. Otherwise, the series' plot is bound to decline.

That being said if this takes off I don't expect to see another single player game within the next 10 years.

These two things I'm so very afraid of. If this WoW clone negatively affects the actual TES series in any way (or completely kills it, like WoW has seemingly done with Warcraft) I'm gonna be so pissed off at Zenimax.

[bengraven]

I laughed out loud and then started to feel sad. Everything about this game looks terrible. This is NOT what I wanted from an Elder Scrolls mmo :/

Sadly, there was a game that was basically what I wanted from an Elder Scrolls MMO. But it basically failed.

I honestly wished they had gone the Diablo-clone route and put it in first person. I would love a Borderlands style Elder Scrolls game. You could have the towns be social hubs, but then instance the areas between towns for groups of people playing.

It is, but bear in mind you won't be able to do half the shit you can do in Morrowind, or even Oblivion and Skyrim. You'll be strapped in to a linear themepark game that has been spreadsheeted to death. It will be hollow and disappointing. And I imagine numerous "why can't i do this" will flood your mind as you play. This is one for the MMO fans, but probably not the ES fans.

Exactly. It's so "by the numbers" that I literally had my heart broken by reading the bullet list in the OP. Not that I would have bought it anyway, since I swore off MMOs after getting really bored with TOR.

And then I realized my two favorite Morrowind towns won't even be in the game anyway since they weren't founded back then(Seyda Neen and Caldera), so it's not worth it for a hardcore fan anyway.

LOL you know it's gonna be just a comical theme park zone. We're better off just waiting for the Daggerfall Mod

Which one? XL?

[Pinko Marx]

What hurts even more than this is when(if) this game fails that pretty much ruins the chance for a GOOD TES MMO for a good while.

[poisonelf]

Well, that's the thing though. Have the WoW clones truely failed? I recall reading a thread not so long ago in regards to SWTOR where EA said they only needed 500,000 subscribers to turn a profit. Keep in mind that's how much they needed to make a profit from a game that is estimated to cost 100 million dollars to make (including advertisement). I'm sure this MMO will have a somewhat smaller budget (totally a guess, I could be wrong). I'm sure they are expecting to sell a couple million copies on release due to the Elder Scrolls name alone and hope to retain at least anywhere between 500,000 to 2 million as subscribers. And with that, they'll tout it as a great success.

Well I'll admit that I haven't researched the profits of each game, and I base what I'm saying mostly on what I see in my internet cafes. We have tens of hardcore MMO players and some casuals, and while they all went berserk with hype for Conan, Warhammer, TOR and Aion, they played each for 1-2 month, and now they're either playing WoW or stopped playing MMOs.

So seeing this daily, seeing Conan going free to play, reading doom and gloom articles about TOR etc, yeah, I admit I feel they've all failed.

Even if they did turn some profit though, they certainly were not huge successes to revolutionize the genre. I strongly feel that Elder Scrolls could do that if using a more Elder Scrolls approach. I think it's a shame.

[bengraven]

What hurts even more than this is when(if) this game fails that pretty much ruins the chance for a GOOD TES MMO for a good while.

What's GOOD however is that this ruins the chance for a failed Fallout MMO down the road.

[rakhir]

Sadly, there was a game that was basically what I wanted from an Elder Scrolls MMO. But it basically failed.

I watched few videos on YT of that game and it looks horrible, ugly, empty and boring. :/

I honestly wished they had gone the Diablo-clone route and put it in first person. I would love a Borderlands style Elder Scrolls game. You could have the towns be social hubs, but then instance the areas between towns for groups of people playing.

Absolutely agree, many things from single player games would have to be cut or changed to make it more multiplayer friendly - GW1 style instance-based co-op dungeon crawls would be sweet and something i wished was in Skyrim.

I'm not really sure why this game it's called Elder Scrolls other then to cash in on a brand, since it has so little in common with every other game in the series. :/

[Dresden]

Darkfall always reminded me of Morrowind if it was online and looked worse and ran like shit.

[bengraven]

I watched few videos on YT of that game and it looks horrible, ugly, empty and boring. :/

I tried the open beta a couple years ago and it was very empty, glitchy and laggy as hell (I stared at a wall for 30 minutes at one point, not even able to close the application out with task manager) and had zero attractive qualities. Sadly a mistake.

Absolutely agree, many things from single player games would have to be cut or changed to make it more multiplayer friendly - and GW1 style instance-based co-op dungeon crawls would be great. I'm not really sure why this game it's called Elder Scrolls other then to cash in on a brand, since it has so little in common with every other game in the series. :/

It's just based on the universe.

Everything that makes a TES game fun and attractive is completely gone:

- no XP, but a very creative and unique leveling system
- real time first person combat
- exploration based gameplay
- interaction with the characters and world
- the ability to abandon a quest early on and return hours later and still get a rewarding, fun experience

The idea of spending 20 hours grinding things for the Fighter's Guild without ever reaching a higher rank makes my brain numb.

[MrBelmontvedere]

such a shame... we could have had all sorts of interesting Fallout/SP Elder Scrolls content instead of this filthy garbage. I suppose piracy is to blame, because you can't pirate an MMORPG.

However you also can't sell more than a handful of copies if what you're selling is a stinky turd, even with the ES name thumb-tacked on.

[Ninja Scooter]

LOL! Just came across this. http://pc.gamespy.com/pc/elder-scrol...1224380p1.html

[poisonelf]

such a shame... we could have had all sorts of interesting Fallout/SP Elder Scrolls content instead of this filthy garbage. I suppose piracy is to blame, because you can't pirate an MMORPG. However you also can't sell more than a handful of copies if what you're selling is a stinky turd, even with the ES name thumb-tacked on.

So a company owning a hugely popular and successful fantasy RPG franchise, which outsells all other single player fantasy RPGs where piracy should theoretically matter, decides to enter the potentially immensely lucrative MMO market using said franchise....... because of piracy!

They decide to risk the who-knows-how-many-bajillions needed for developing a big time MMORPG, marketing it, maintaining servers etc, because the single player game which sold millions and was a stellar success..... was plagued by piracy.

Unless you're using some form of sarcasm which I can't detect, in which case I'm sorry, please explain your reasoning.

[Fancy Corndog]

e: nvm, was wrong.

[Yopis]

If this were only a complex sandbox mmo. Guess those days are over. Think I will pass on this theme park clone garbage.