[salpa]

Of course the intended platform has not been announced - it has been here for the past 30 years. You cannot "announce" something that already exists.

[Diablos54]

No, UE4 was not created to run on Wii U. That should've been obvious. The question is if it'll still support running on Wii U, even though it's not what they designed it for. Hopefully Nintendo's doing good talks with Epic to figure out the barebones requirement to at least make somewhat easy ports possible on the system.

Stop talking sense. It doesn't belong in GAF, not this close to E3!

[Hot Coldman]

Today in "no shit" news... I think Epic have something on their hands that is going to bring disappointment for them. The next-gen won't be as powerful as they think it will.

[BurntPork]

Seriously, by the time UE4 games start arriving on these 'unannounced platforms' the iPad will probably be more powerful than Wii U.

Good one.

Yeah, that's not happening for a while. The iPad 4 will still be a bit behind current-gen, and even then iOS is an open platform.

[whitehawk]

Like I said, it's just speculation based on what he said. He didn't outright deny the Wii U. Come E3, we'll find out hopefully.

Common sense tells us that UE4 will never reach the Wii U.

[Krev]

But that is not going to happen, regardless of UE4 being on the WiiU. Maybe a few, but if a publisher doesn't think that platform is going to make money from the port, it won't happen. Not to mention these next gen consoles are almost certainly going to be far more powerful than the WiiU, so ports would require a fair amount of effort. Similarly to the Call of Duty games for the Wii, whatever ports end up even happening will be bastardized versions made by some B team. Am I wrong?

Hypothetically it would be much easier to create a Wii U version of a next-gen game than it was to create a Wii version this gen, because Wii U will at least be architecturally similar.
I agree that publishers likely aren't going to bother to go through with this. It also doesn't account for games that take advantage of the next-gen hardware in more ways than using advanced graphics features. For example, a game like Assassin's Creed could never have been brought to Wii, no matter how much the graphics were reconfigured for its shader-less, TEV based GPU.

Of course the intended platform has not been announced - it has been here for the past 30 years. You cannot "announce" something that already exists.

If the primary intended platform for the engine was PC, it would be out already.

Good one. Yeah, that's not happening for a while. The iPad 4 will still be a bit behind current-gen, and even then iOS is an open platform.

I don't think a lot of UE4 games will be released before the release of iPad 5 or 6. And as for the underlined...no, it's not.

[gregor7777]

Today in "no shit" news... I think Epic have something on their hands that is going to bring disappointment for them. The next-gen won't be as powerful as they think it will.

I'm going to go ahead and guess they know exactly how powerful it will be.

[SapientWolf]

Wii U will be a current platform with an active user base purchasing games for the system. I very much doubt Xbox 360 and especially PS3 will have the market tail of PS2.

The big open question is "What will the Wii U user base be purchasing?" The type of titles that will be the vanguard next gen might still sell better on those consoles than the Wii U. Especially while the Wii U install base is smaller.

[I Stalk Alone]

Seriously, by the time UE4 games start arriving on these 'unannounced platforms' the iPad will probably be more powerful than Wii U.

even if performance doubled every 12 months that wouldn't happen unless the wii u was only 240gflops i.e. weaker than the 360.

iPad is only 10 GFLOPS (Apr 11 2010)
iPad 2 is only 19GFLOPS (Mar 11 2011
iPad 3 is only 38GFLOPS (March 16 2012)
ipad 4 maybe 76GFLOPS (2013)
iPad 5 maybe 152GFLOPS (2014)
iPad 6 maybe 300GFLOPS (2015)
iPad 7 maybe 600 GFLOPS (2016)
iPad 8 maybe 1200 GFLOPS (2017)

I highly doubt they can keep the upgrades doubling every year but even if it does...


By the time iPad 8 arrives is when it will be more powerful than WiiU and by that time we will already be talking about the next generation of consoles by Nintendo. Who knows what would have happened by that time. Tablets could go the way of netbooks and be usurped by something else completely.

You also have to realise that the iPad 3 renders at an outrageously high resolution and there goes your power running multiplatfor game sin native resolution. Good luck selling $1 games at AAAA budgets as well.

[AGITΩ]

I honestly don't care too much. I'm kinda scared of another powerhouse attempted generation. I'm fine with a moderate Graphic update and a lot more RAM on new system than trying to go AAAA. It'll kill off so many devs or just make them shift to being handheld and mobile exclusive to keep dev costs low to not eat them up. As much as some gamers want all out specs, I don't find it being good for the industry in this economical state.

[11redder]

There is a completely different and yet equally legitimate way to interpret what he said.

[Medalion]

Xbox 1080 here we go

[Forsaken82]

Seems like this is confirmation that the Wii U isn't the final hardware name and thus has not yet been announced

this is a joke

[clutch.as.it.gets.]

I'm going to go ahead and guess they know exactly how powerful it will be.

I second that. They know what`s up.

[Instro]

No, UE4 was not created to run on Wii U. That should've been obvious. The question is if it'll still support running on Wii U, even though it's not what they designed it for. Hopefully Nintendo's doing good talks with Epic to figure out the barebones requirement to at least make somewhat easy ports possible on the system.

According to some rumors and gaffers this is the case. It will be interesting to see what happens at E3 though.

[BurntPork]

I don't think a lot of UE4 games will be released before the release of iPad 5 or 6. And as for the underlined...no, it's not.

Even 5 or 6 is pushing it. In fact, looking at I Stalk Alone's post, even I was giving too much credit.

And, yeah, I guess it isn't. However, it's definitely not nearly as closed as a console. The very fact that it runs across multiple hardware SKUs means that it's "not as closed" as a console OS. I don't think you can deny that.

[Krev]

The big open question is "What will the Wii U user base be purchasing?" The type of titles that will be the vanguard next gen might still sell better on those consoles than the Wii U. Especially while the Wii U install base is smaller.

Yes, I agree this is the major factor. A lot of publishers likely won't see the Wii U userbase as being worth it for their 'core' games.

even if performance doubled every 12 months that wouldn't happen unless the wii u was only 240gflops i.e. weaker than the 360. iPad is only 10 GFLOPS (Apr 11 2010) iPad 2 is only 19GFLOPS (Mar 11 2011 iPad 3 is only 38GFLOPS (March 16 2012) ipad 4 maybe 76GFLOPS (2013) iPad 5 maybe 152GFLOPS (2014) iPad 6 maybe 300GFLOPS (2015) iPad 7 maybe 600 GFLOPS (2016) iPad 8 maybe 1200 GFLOPS (2017) I highly doubt they can keep the upgrades doubling every year but even if it does...

I doubt the Wii U is going to be tremendously more powerful than the Xbox 360. That said, maybe I should have shifted the target to iPad 7 rather than 6. That said...

You also have to realise that the iPad 3 renders at an outrageously high resolution and there goes your power running multiplatfor game sin native resolution.

...this is a good point.

Good luck selling $1 games at AAAA budgets as well.

What's to say that Apple will never do anything to foster a marketplace that also supports higher budget titles?

Who knows what would have happened by that time. Tablets could go the way of netbooks and be usurped by something else completely.

Anything is possible, but I doubt it. Tablets have long been a vision of future computing seen in science-fiction (such as 2001: A Space Odyssey and Star Trek) because it's difficult to imagine a superior user interface.
Netbooks were always a dead end. I raised an eyebrow when they started to catch on.

[SapientWolf]

I honestly don't care too much. I'm kinda scared of another powerhouse attempted generation. I'm fine with a moderate Graphic update and a lot more RAM on new system than trying to go AAAA. It'll kill off so many devs or just make them shift to being handheld and mobile exclusive to keep dev costs low to not eat them up. As much as some gamers want all out specs, I don't find it being good for the industry in this economical state.

If this generation drags on for too much longer then devs are going to be dropping anyway. Sales-wise, this has been one of the most anemic quarters in years.

From a pure revenue standpoint, sales of consoles and other hardware were $323.5 million, a 35% drop from March 2011. Total gaming sales, which includes hardware, software, and accessories, earned $1.1B, down from $1.47B from the same period last year.

It’s quite hard to believe that game sales are dropping, even when we have huge titles popping out every now and then. But apparently, analysts at PiperJaffray say that there’s a year-on-year decline. They say that the upcoming April NPD report will continue the decline with a 25% drop in game sales at $375 million. Quite a huge number, and increasing by the looks of it.

[TucoBenedictoPacifico]

He's clearly hinting at the Steambox.
You wish.

[Nirolak]

If this generation drags on for too much longer then devs are going to be dropping anyway. Sales-wise, this has been one of the most anemic quarters in years.

Q1 was basically a death march. I expect broad implications over the next year or two.

We already saw Sega implode and EA paring back even more retail products in favor of digital.

[Hot Coldman]

I'm going to go ahead and guess they know exactly how powerful it will be.

I think they do too! And I think they've been pushing for better, but I don't think they'll be completely happy.

[Krev]

And, yeah, I guess it isn't. However, it's definitely not nearly as closed as a console. The very fact that it runs across multiple hardware SKUs means that it's "not as closed" as a console OS. I don't think you can deny that.

Developers have fixed hardware that they can tailor the game for. It's not Android or PC. They can design solely for the high-end, latest release model if they wish, but it should also be a lot easier to create scalable games that work across a variety of hardware when you know the exact specs of those systems.

[Visualante2]

They will probably just support UE3 on it then. Which is no big deal, lots of good games use UE3.

[Fancy Corndog]

Yeah, that's pretty clear. WiiU will be getting a lot of current gen ports, and people will laugh. Nintendo-only peeps will be having too much fun with all of the games they've been missing to care though.

[BurntPork]

Developers have fixed hardware that they can tailor the game for. It's not Android or PC. They can design solely for the high-end, latest release model if they wish, but it should also be a lot easier to create scalable games that works across a variety of hardware when you know the exact specs of those systems.

It's still not as close to the metal, though. If it were, iPad 3 games would be in the same league as Vita games. And then there's the budget issue...

[tranciful]

Good one. Yeah, that's not happening for a while. The iPad 4 will still be a bit behind current-gen, and even then iOS is an open platform.

It's kind of funny, but not too far fetched. iPad3 renders at over 1080p and the graphics are catching up.

[KageMaru]

2-4 years seems kind of extremely long to use an old engine for if you're seriously humoring changing at all.

Exactly this. It's unlikely that many devs will start a series on say UE3.5 then move on to UE4 a couple years down the line. Everyone should realize this first and foremost.

Even titles that started off with UE2, like splinter cell and bioshock, kept that engine throughout it's respective development.

But that is not going to happen, regardless of UE4 being on the WiiU. Maybe a few, but if a publisher doesn't think that platform is going to make money from the port, it won't happen. Not to mention these next gen consoles are almost certainly going to be far more powerful than the WiiU, so ports would require a fair amount of effort. Similarly to the Call of Duty games for the Wii, whatever ports end up even happening will be bastardized versions made by some B team. Am I wrong?

In a way you are both right and wrong IMO.

There are major differences between this and next gen regarding the Wii versus Wii-U. However, I think the biggest factor will be if epic includes any support at all. Devs will already need to do A LOT of work just to make UE4 run well on it's intended platforms. Unless epic offers a development path for the Wii-U, it's unlikely that devs will first put in the effort to make the engine fit on the system before they can optimize it properly.

If 3rd party sales are there to support the investment, it may happen at times, but I have my doubts.

There is a completely different and yet equally legitimate way to interpret what he said.

And that would be? I'm genuinely curious.

[AzaK]

This thing could very well be 2-3 years away if his comments about Unreal Engine 3 ramp up have any bearing on things.

In the meant time Wii U will get UE3 titles galore and when the new MS and Sony machines are out and inevitably run it, it's unlikely that developers will then immediately go "OK, let's throw away this 20-30 millions Wii U install base"

[Krev]

It's still not as close to the metal, though. If it were, iPad 3 games would be in the same league as Vita games. And then there's the budget issue...

I think budget and market issues are what's actually preventing iPad games from being closer to what's on Vita. As it stands, iOS games don't even compete with Resident Evil Revelations or Super Mario 3D Land on 3DS.

[BurntPork]

It's kind of funny, but not too far fetched. iPad3 renders at over 1080p and the graphics are catching up.

Maximum rendering resolution doesn't matter at all, and budgets will never catch up.

[Derrick01]

What's to say that Apple will never do anything to foster a marketplace that also supports higher budget titles?

Easier said then done. These casuals are so used to getting everything for free or $1 that they've shown they care nothing about quality (then again you could say they never did at any price). Not even the all mighty Apple can just change that with a snap of their fingers.

Besides they continue to show no interest in gaming of any real substance.

[Krev]

Easier said then done. These casuals are so used to getting everything for free or $1 that they've shown they care nothing about quality (then again you could say they never did at any price). Not even the all mighty Apple can just change that with a snap of their fingers. Besides they continue to show no interest in gaming of any real substance.

There was that rumour about an Apple internal project to release a game controller, though...
As it stands, it's not very likely, but now that Jobs is gone there's a possibility that they could try to have their cake and eat it too. Bringing the enthusiast gaming demographic that's ready to pay more over to the iOS platform would be a good source of growth.

[DragonSworne]

I think Epic is expecting too much from next gen...

[Krev]

I think Epic is expecting too much from next gen...

Epic want to dictate their vision of next-gen to the platform holders. It may well have been a success with Microsoft.

[Takuya]

I think Epic is expecting too much from next gen...

I don't believe so, there are already platforms that UE4 is intended for, so more than one manufacturer meets their requirements.

[Sho_Nuff82]

Today in "no shit" news... I think Epic have something on their hands that is going to bring disappointment for them. The next-gen won't be as powerful as they think it will.

The current rumor from GDC is that the UE4 demo was running on Durango dev kits, and they've previously made similar comments about it targeting unannounced platforms. Reading between the lines it's obvious that UE4:Wii U as UE3:Wii.

[davepoobond]

UE3 will be for WiiU, obviously.

UE4 will be the new hotness.

[jbug617]

I think Epic is expecting too much from next gen...

Epic did change the 360. Who knows how Microsoft would of done if they didn't increase the RAM.

[Krev]

I don't believe so, there are already platforms that UE4 is intended for, so more than one manufacturer meets their requirements.

Xbox 3 + PC + future imaginary powerful mobile tech.
Though I've no doubt it will hit PS4.

Today in "no shit" news... I think Epic have something on their hands that is going to bring disappointment for them. The next-gen won't be as powerful as they think it will.

I think PS4 will be below what they're hoping for, but Microsoft will kowtow to them just as they did over 512 MB RAM in Xbox 360.

[Zeal]

Like U3, this engine will define what next-gen games really look like. U3 still looks amazing even now (look at TERA), so I can't even imagine the visuals.

[BurntPork]

The current rumor from GDC is that the UE4 demo was running on Durango dev kits, and they've previously made similar comments about it targeting unannounced platforms. Reading between the lines it's obvious that UE4:Wii U as UE3:Wii.

That's impossible. Wii didn't support UE3 because it didn't have programmable shaders, not because it was too weak. Wii U most likely won't have such a technical limitation. If Wii U doesn't run UE4, it won't be due to tech. Wii U's not an overclocked 360, contrary to popular belief.

[Takuya]

Xbox 3 + PC + future imaginary powerful mobile tech. Though I've no doubt it will hit PS4.

PS4 and XBOX (3)? will be supported platforms definitely. PC is a no brainer, but it's not 'unannounced'.

[KageMaru]

That's impossible. Wii didn't support UE3 because it didn't have programmable shaders, not because it was too weak. Wii U most likely won't have such a technical limitation. If Wii U doesn't run UE4, it won't be due to tech. Wii U's not an overclocked 360, contrary to popular belief.

What possible reason is there other than tech?

[kinggroin]

....we're going to see a repeat of this gen, aren't we?

[Krev]

PS4 and XBOX (3)? will be supported platforms definitely. PC is a no brainer, but it's not 'unannounced'.

I was just saying that I think of the coming consoles, only Xbox 3 will be all they are hoping for from the next generation.

[jett]

Why is it so important to some people that Unreal Engine 4 be announced for the Wii U? I just don't get it.

To keep hope alive that the Wii U will be comparable to PS4/Durango

[Takuya]

I was just saying that I think of the coming consoles, only Xbox 3 will be all they are hoping for from the next generation.

Why do you think that?

[Hot Coldman]

The current rumor from GDC is that the UE4 demo was running on Durango dev kits, and they've previously made similar comments about it targeting unannounced platforms. Reading between the lines it's obvious that UE4:Wii U as UE3:Wii.

Eh, OK. That's believable. Krev's point about MS previously being happy to appease Epic is a good one. I always got the vibe that Epic were trying to get MS/Sony to target UE4 rather than the other way round, but I guess it's just the standard give and take.

The Samaritan thing always confused me- them showing that, and then saying "UE4 will be even better!". Maybe 'better' is relative in this case.

[Sho_Nuff82]

I was just saying that I think of the coming consoles, only Xbox 3 will be all they are hoping for from the next generation.

I think it's far more likely that the PS4 and Xbox 3 are closer to one another than either are to the Wii U.

[HigherLevel]

Epic knows what's up. The next Xbox and Playstations are gonna be beasts. I'm sure they will focus on core games first like this gen and then later when it's cheaper try to pull in the casual crowd.