[Acidote]

She should be charged and the other child taken away from her negligent hands.

And that is, of course, assuming it was a negligency and not malicious. And I do assume that.

[TheExodu5]

Like I said, she has another child. Both very young. My daughter is 5 weeks old this Thursday and I can tell you, sleep deprivation has kicked in hardcore for me. I can't imagine how much worse it would be with 2. I feel like I forget huge parts of my morning on the way to work. She thought the kid was with her husband, her husband thought the kid was with her....running on autopilot at that point.

Pretty much. If there was no intent to harm the child, this can be seen as nothing more than a tragic accident. It could happen to anyone. Awareness is the best way to prevent such a thing from happening.

[ZAK]

"No one is immune to this type of tragedy because all of our brains fail us at one point or another," said Auriemma, whose agency offers tips on how to prevent such events. "It is not for a lack of caring on the parents' part, so a parent should not be judged, because it has to do with a failure of the brain to not work properly."

You could say lack of caring is also a "failure of the brain." You could say this about a lot of things.

This and the nature of punishment make this a complicated issue that I don't pretend to have the answers to. I just don't like to see it brushed off like something trivial or obvious.

[Dreams-Visions]

Enough until she commits suicide. If that happened to me, I'd put a bullet in my head. I wouldn't even think about it.

.......

[Omegasquash]

I get how things can slip by, and I understand no sleep at all (I have a son and a daughter on the way), but there should be charges brought. Not out of malice, not out of me being judgmental...this was negligence on part of a caregiver that resulted in death.

More than anything this is tragic. I'm very sorry for the child and the mother, and I hope for whatever mercy a court may find in their hearts to give her, because the OP is right to a degree...there's nothing that will ever make this woman feel better again.

[Mudkips]

I keep hearing these stories. Isn't there something you can add to the cars to prevent stuff like this?

Car seat with accelerometer.

Park the car when it's latched in and it beeps once every few seconds until you disengage the latch or press a button on the car seat to disable it for 5 minutes (lets you get the baby in, then have 5 minutes to get yourself in and ready to go).

If it's been over 20 minutes, the beep becomes louder, like a car alarm.

Alternatively, just like child safety locks, give cars a carseat mode.
A simple weight sensor in the seat, just like for airbags, to determine if the child is present. Could also calibrate the weight based on the parent pressing a button or latching the seatbelt.
When the car is turned off and the door opened, you can use the same chime system as the door/key minder.
If the baby is still left inside, the car can roll down the window, use the alarm/horn, etc.

Patent pending patent pending patent pending.

a parent should not be judged, because it has to do with a failure of the brain to not work properly

This logic gives a free pass to any fuckup, ever. (Also, it should be "failure of the brain to work properly".)

[aparisi2274]

This is a tragedy and I feel bad for the mom, but in the article it says:

"It appears the mother mistakenly believed that she had dropped the boy off at day care on the way to work, police said"

Now, when I am driving my car, I have a clear view of the backseat via my rear view mirror. If she was driving I assume she would be looking in the rear view to check on the baby. If she had the car seat with the back toward her, I could understand her confusion as you don't actually see the baby.

The other iissue with the above statement from the article is that when she gets out of the car, wouldn't she see the car seat still contained a baby? Unless she has crazy tint on her windows, when she steps out of her car, would she not happen to look in the back seat and perhaps see some tiny legs?

Lastly, if she was driving to work, and the baby was left in the car, was this the quietest baby in the world that she did not hear any cooing, or breathing or some other form of communication from the back seat?

Again, I feel really bad about what happened, but I think it could have been prevented if she perhaps paid a little more attention to her surroundings.

Again, I am not looking to argue with anyone over this as I have stated that it is a real tragedy, I just think she could have been more thorough when exiting her car.

[daw840]

I just don't get how you get out of your car and don't see your kid there. I mean...do people not look? Hell, I look just to check my car....can't imagine....

Rear facing car seats...they need to make front seats safe for children honestly. That would make this a lot better. A way to disable the airbags maybe.

Of the 613 times that this has happened, the news was saying one of the times was actually a NASA scientist. His colleagues have been designing a system to alert the driver of someone in the backseat. A weight sensor or something similar.

[Copernicus]

She should be charged and the other child taken away from her negligent hands. And that is, of course, assuming it was a negligency and not malicious. And I do assume that.

Negligence would be if she left the kid in the car with a juice box to keep cool throughout the day.

[iKeepPlaying]

Wow. Good stuff right there. Pretty good stuff.

C'mon, you can forget a lot of stuff.
You can forget to pay something, to turn on the washing machine, etc. But forgetting your own baby? Who the fuck does that?
Sorry if I think that she deserves to die, but she killed her own baby.

[Black-Box]

why do people do this even with animals?

I never understand why bring them with you if you are going to leave them alone for a period of time in a car

[Arment]

why do people do this even with animals? I never understand why bring them with you if you are going to leave them alone for a period of time in a car

Did you even read the article? She didn't do it intentionally.

C'mon, you can forget a lot of stuff. You can forget to pay something, to turn on the washing machine, etc. But forgetting your own baby? Who the fuck does that? Sorry if I think that she deserves to die, but she killed her own baby.

I'm sure she feels the same. But you're still pretty cruel. Mistakes happen. It's only unacceptable when you aren't making them though, eh?

[Raistlin]

Pretty outrageous they aren't charging the mom.

why?

[Ferrio]

C'mon, you can forget a lot of stuff. You can forget to pay something, to turn on the washing machine, etc. But forgetting your own baby? Who the fuck does that? Sorry if I think that she deserves to die, but she killed her own baby.

Ya sure the husband would love to see his wife killed right after his child. Taking another life solves nothing in this situation.

[Dyno]

A thread like this needs a full disclosure clause. Do you or do you not have kids? I think it's important because it would certainly colour if not inform your opinion on the subject.

I have two kids.

The old saying is "It takes a village to raise a child." Before I had kids I thought this saying was allegorical and nuanced. Maybe it is. After having kids I now know that it also has a far more direct and simplistic meaning. Child raising is a ridiculous amount of work and the more helping hands you have the better off the whole family is. For todays modern nuclear family with relations spread out all over the country and the world, raising kids is harder than ever. There are no breaks. Two people or even one person must often do it all on their own. I think it's one of the big reasons why families are getting smaller and the birth rate is down.

I have been so utterly burnt out, exhausted, and mentally drained raising a family that I started avoiding driving my car whenever possible. Mistakes due to extreme fatigue and stress will be made and hopeful it just doesn't result in something serious like the nightmare scenarios in this thread. All humans suffer from the inheirent limits of their biology. You can't run at 100% at all times regardless of the demands being placed on you. People simply break down trying. Post-Pardum Depression is commonplace and fatigue plays a big role in it.

Each terrible case should be investigated but I don't believe in blanket charges. It's bullshit for a society to not help parents at all and then slam them with a criminal record when they fail. Trust me. Failing this hard as a parent sound like a suicide scenario to me. We as a society don't have enough compassion to collectively raise our young. I think the least we can do is show a bit of compassion for when it all goes horribly wrong.

[LegendofJoe]

The people in here unable to understand how someone could forget their child have probably never experienced severe stress and sleep deprivation. When I was working 30 hours a week and going to school full time I once drove all the way to work on a day I wasn't supposed to be there before I realized what I had done. I've also gone to work with my shit inside out a few times because I was barely aware of what I was doing while I was getting ready. This happened because I was under a lot of stress and I wasn't getting enough sleep. You can literally forget anything and everything if you're stressed enough and lacking sleep.

[joelseph]

ut forgetting your own baby? Who the fuck does that?

600+ people a year. Just because a mistake is a tragedy doesn't mean that it is negligent.

[chris.trejo]

I'd be more worried about her killing herself then giving her any punishment, I can't imagine the guilt she's carrying right now...

[Baconsammy]

why?

Worst case - because now you've just created a legit alibi for any crappy mom that's sick of having a kid. The "whoops!" defense.

[luxarific]

People who are saying they don't understand how this can happen REALLY need to read the Washington Post article (the author won the Pulitzer for it):

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn...022701549.html

Also, a device that can prevent it:

http://www.babyalert.info/index.php?...=index&cPath=6

another one:

http://www.babybeesafe.net/default.html

Iphone app:

http://www.safekids.org/safety-basic...preminder.html

article:

http://www.nytimes.com/2010/05/30/au...pagewanted=all

[NinjaBoiX]

C'mon, you can forget a lot of stuff. You can forget to pay something, to turn on the washing machine, etc. But forgetting your own baby? Who the fuck does that? Sorry if I think that she deserves to die, but she killed her own baby.

Just genuinely suprised by your hardline "eye for an eye" point of view. But fair play, everyone has an opinion.

[winjet81]

She is obviously a danger to her other child, so either that child should be taken away, or she should be put in jail. Babies are completely helpless, so to just brand this as an 'honest mistake' just doesn't cut it.

I can't imagine the suffering her baby went through because of her honest mistake.

[MiniKelly]

As a parent I can definitely understand. It is very sad.

[WillyFive]

Charging her won't do anything.

Her toddler is dead, how worse can it get?

[ghostmind]

Thirteen months is right around the time you are supposed to switch from rear-facing to front-facing (assuming the child is at least 20 pounds).


I remember when my son was 13 months old - he had just started walking on his own and was learning all sorts of things about the world around him. I can't fathom that happening. It's upsetting even to think about it.


EDIT: THat being said, I also can't fathom how she forgot. Dropping my son off at daycare in the morning could get very repetitive yes, but I cannot imagine a scenario where I would forget to do it, no matter how tired or distracted I was.

[Dreams-Visions]

People who are saying they don't understand how this can happen REALLY need to read the Washington Post article (the author won the Pulitzer for it): http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn...022701549.html Also, a device that can prevent it: http://www.babyalert.info/index.php?...=index&cPath=6 another one: http://www.babybeesafe.net/default.html Iphone app: http://www.safekids.org/safety-basic...preminder.html article: http://www.nytimes.com/2010/05/30/au...pagewanted=all

Get out of here with all your reason, logic, research and data.

These mothers should just kill themselves. climb to the roofs of their apartment buildings and swan dive off them mothafuckas. Right, iKeepPlaying?

[joelseph]

She is obviously a danger to her other child

Really now? How exactly? Mistakes happen. Freakish nightmare scenario mistakes happen.

[CrazyDude]

I do have to wonder what is stopping people who have intention of killing their kids from using this as an excuse? Not saying this is the case in this story, but I am thinking of in the future.

[The Grim Heaper]

I'm going to assume that she does it most mornings(drop her child off at the daycare), so... how does she forget about the thing that she should love the most?

I feel for her and the family, but still...

[Baconsammy]

Really now? How exactly? Mistakes happen. Freakish nightmare scenario mistakes happen.

How many mistakes is she allowed before it becomes a crime?

[StriKeVillain]

.......

I can't imagine it'd be easy living with yourself after making a mistake of that magnitude.

[Ferrio]

How many mistakes is she allowed before it becomes a crime?

I'm going to guess she's not going to leave her other child out of her sight for the rest of her life.

[SnakeswithLasers]

This forum never ceases to amaze me.

What a horribly tragic situation.

[ZAK]

Really now? How exactly? Mistakes happen. Freakish nightmare scenario mistakes happen.

It depends on whether you believe mistakes are similarly distributed among all people. If certain people are particularly mistake-prone, it may be reasonable to say that they shouldn't be responsible for raising young children. Whether it's "their fault" or not seems almost irrelevant.

Not necessarily my actual opinion; just seems like a reasonable interpretation that you were missing.

[daw840]

This forum never ceases to amaze me. What a horribly tragic situation.

You'd be surprised. There are a lot of people calling for punishment around here too. It's definitely not just this forum. Seems like its about a 60/40 split. 40% for punishment. Granted, that 40% seems to be a lot of people who don't have kids.

[scy]

Rear facing car seats...they need to make front seats safe for children honestly. That would make this a lot better. A way to disable the airbags maybe. Of the 613 times that this has happened, the news was saying one of the times was actually a NASA scientist. His colleagues have been designing a system to alert the driver of someone in the backseat. A weight sensor or something similar.

There's a prior case with this happening with a motion sensor car alarm going off. The father thought it was just false positives or kids messing with the car.

:(

[bengraven]

My sympathy for the parents.

I know how busy life gets with a young child - it's every parents' nightmare to cause harm to their child in their fatigue.

[DjangoReinhardt]

Really now? How exactly? Mistakes happen. Freakish nightmare scenario mistakes happen.

I think it might have something to do with her own gross negligence being the direct cause of her other child's death.

[joelseph]

I think it might have something to do with her own gross negligence being the direct cause of her other child's death.

Gross negligence? It was a tragic mistake. Gross negligence would have been cracking the window and leaving the kid in the car while you go to get your nails done.

[LosDaddie]

Sad.

But being a parent of a infant/toddler will do that to you. Sleep deprivation is the worst.

[Mammoth Jones]

Rear facing car seats...they need to make front seats safe for children honestly. That would make this a lot better. A way to disable the airbags maybe. Of the 613 times that this has happened, the news was saying one of the times was actually a NASA scientist. His colleagues have been designing a system to alert the driver of someone in the backseat. A weight sensor or something similar.

Put your wallet or cellphone in/under the seat with the kid so you have to physically go there when you get out of your car.

[JohnLacke]

Absolutely tragic. I'm not even going to get into whether she should be charged or not, I just don't know. I can't imagine how shitty she must feel. If she doesn't get charged, I hope she pulls herself together for the sake of her other child.
Here's hoping the family can get past this.

[faceless007]

To play devil's advocate...what's stopping people from just leaving babies they don't want in their car to die of suffocation if we aren't going to charge them with anything when it happens? Best way to kill your kid right there, apparently?

You think people who want to find a way murder their child and get away with it will be deterred by the law?

That WaPo article is a must-read about this issue. But heart-breaking.

[Baconsammy]

I'm going to guess she's not going to leave her other child out of her sight for the rest of her life.

You're also guessing that she didn't do it the first time on purpose. Dismissing gross negligence that results in a baby literally being heated to death is a slippery slope.

[LegendofJoe]

I do have to wonder what is stopping people who have intention of killing their kids from using this as an excuse? Not saying this is the case in this story, but I am thinking of in the future.

Who cares?

The law exists to protect people, how would prosecuting this woman protect other infants from suffering this fate? It wouldn't. Selfish, viscous people with kids that have the intent to be rid of them will find a way to do it, it's up to those we entrust with enforcing the law to determine what their intent was.

[joelseph]

Dismissing gross negligence that results in a baby literally being heated to death is a slippery slope.

The college-armchair-lawyers are out in force today.

[Ferrio]

You're also guessing that she didn't do it the first time on purpose. Dismissing gross negligence that results in a baby literally being heated to death is a slippery slope.

Oh right, I forgot it's some nefarious plot for the woman to kill of her children.

[Tashbrooke]

it is definitely bad parent day today.

[DjangoReinhardt]

Gross negligence? It was a tragic mistake. Gross negligence would have been cracking the window and leaving the kid in the car while you go to get your nails done.

neg·li·gence/ˈnegləjəns/
Noun:
Failure to take proper care in doing something: "some of these accidents are due to negligence".
Failure to use reasonable care, resulting in damage or injury to another.

gross (grs)
adj. gross·er, gross·est
1.
a. Exclusive of deductions; total: gross profits. See Synonyms at whole.
b. Unmitigated in any way; utter: gross incompetence.
2. Glaringly obvious: gross injustice. See Synonyms at flagrant.

[Raistlin]

Worst case - because now you've just created a legit alibi for any crappy mom that's sick of having a kid. The "whoops!" defense.

I doubt it. Like most things, it would be handled in a case-by-case basis.

For example, if you leave your kid in your car while going into a store ... you aren't likely to get the benefit of the doubt since it's possible a parent would do it out of convenience. In this specific case, there is no convenience argument.



That said, I could certainly understand a charge of negligence.