[Baconsammy]

I would agree with this except that he says "Play Skyrim instead." Kind of destroys any credibility the review might have.

No it doesn't. He reviewed an open-world RPG and thought it sucked. His advice was to play what he thinks is a better open-world RPG. Makes complete sense to me. Just as if a future game like this comes out and the reviewer thinks it pales in comparison to Dragon's Dogma and advises readers to just play DD instead. I have no problem with this.

[UrbanRats]

No it doesn't. He reviewed an open-world RPG and thought it sucked. His advice was to play what he thinks is a better open-world RPG. Makes complete sense to me. Just as if a future game like this comes out and the reviewer thinks it pales in comparison to Dragon's Dogma and advises readers to just play DD instead. I have no problem with this.

You don't see problems with this?

Combat itself - the main draw of the game - is seriously all over the place.

Go play Skyrim instead

Yeah, the main draw of the game, so the more relevant point to a gamer interested in DD it's not good, go play Skyrim instead, which has one of the most horrible action combat system around.

EDIT: To be clear, DD might very well be shit, i don't know (although the demo was very solid, to me) but Skyrim has completely different priorities and it's pretty obvious, the fact that it's an open world RPG doesn't mean jack shit, would you suggest Mafia 2 to someone interested in Just Cause 2, because both are open world shooters with vehicles?

[Baconsammy]

You don't see problems with this? Yeah, the main draw of the game, so the more relevant point to a gamer interested in DD it's not good, go play Skyrim instead, which has one of the most horrible action combat system around. EDIT: To be clear, DD might very well be shit, i don't know (although the demo was very solid, to me) but Skyrim has completely different priorities and it's pretty obvious, the fact that it's an open world RPG doesn't mean jack shit, would you suggest Mafia 2 to someone interested in Just Cause 2, because both are open world shooters with vehicles?

Gimme a break. The guy's problem with the game goes way beyond the combat. Way beyond it. His opinion is that Skyrim is a better game. I can't argue that Skyrim isnt awesome. It is. I'm not going to tell him his opinion is wrong.

edit: true story - When I finished Mafia 2 I asked for recommendations for a similar style of game. Nearly everyone recommended Just Cause 2.

[UrbanRats]

See the edit, i don't have a beef with the review, but that's a pointless remark.

Also, i don't think Skyrim is awesome, and i'm not saying his opinion on the game is wrong, i'm saying i don't see a solid comparison between the two games.

edit: true story - When I finished Mafia 2 I asked for recommendations for a similar style of game. Nearly everyone recommended Just Cause 2.

Well, it was a shitty suggestion then, the two titles are only classified together, they do not share a thing, outside of the shell.
From the way you play them to how the game are meant to convey in terms of experience.
You liked Mafia 2, so a realistic, moody, heavy on atmosphere open world game, with very light sandbox elements, and they suggest you a whacky, over the top, surf-on-jet open world, with a throw away narrative?

[Baconsammy]

See the edit, i don't have a beef with the review, but that's a pointless remark. Also, i don't think Skyrim is awesome, and i'm not saying his opinion on the game is wrong, i'm saying i don't see a solid comparison between the two games.

Mafia 2 and JC2 are so similar that my fellow gamers recommend one when the other is mentioned. If Skyrim is completely different than DD, why do DD enthusiasts constantly compare the two? As in, "I was so disappointed in Skyrim, DD looks to be exactly what I want." Capcom themselves compare it to Oblivion. Oblivion and Skyrim are pretty much identical in design. Hate Skyrim all you want, it's your right, but I don't think comparing the two is a stretch.

Well, it was a shitty suggestion then, the two titles are only classified together, they do not share a thing, outside of the shell. From the way you play them to how the game are meant to convey in terms of experience. You liked Mafia 2, so a realistic, moody, heavy on atmosphere open world game, with very light sandbox elements, and they suggest you a whacky, over the top, surf-on-jet open world, with a throw away narrative?

It was a great suggestion. I ended up loving JC2 far more than Mafia 2.

[UrbanRats]

Don't hate Skyrim, just don't think it's awesome. :P
It's fairly good in doing its thing.

The thing about Skyrim is that it's the most popular fantasy singleplayer rpg, right now (not factoring in Diablo, maybe)it's the latest cool thing, so of course there will be references but, like the comparisons between Tomb Raider and Uncharted 1, the two games were nothing alike, under the skin of ripping Indy.
TeS is peculiar in the way it works, it has that fine detail of interaction and manipulation of the world, while Dragon's Dogma has you running around breaking pots like a more common adventure game, with SOME elements borrowed from more classic open world rpgs (like a big sprawling map).
But as i said about Mafia 2 and Just Cause 2, the open world element is far too broad to be really meaningful in this comparison, so is the Fantasy genre, would you compare Dragon's Dogma with Breath of Fire, because both have dragons and fantasy elements? Would you recommend BoF to a fan of DD? (deliberately extreme example, this one).

I think Skyrim has had a very strong public impact, for whatever reason, and now it's the banner of the whole fantasy-open-world-game, for some people, it seems; still, Skyrim cannot realistically be a good substitute for any game simply involving robes and an open map and, the action deep combat being (by far) the main selling point of DD, i really see the Skyrim suggestion as far fetched, being combat the weakest point of the game by a large stretch.
That's my reasoning, anyhow.

It was a great suggestion. I ended up loving JC2 far more than Mafia 2.

Yeah? Me too, but it's really beyond the point what you'v enjoyed more, the two games have very little in common.

EDIT: Goddamn 503, almost lost the post. :\

[whalleywhat]

It was a great suggestion. I ended up loving JC2 far more than Mafia 2.

This is either just luck or a testament to the greatness of JC2. The only way these recommendations usually work is if you say specifically what you don't like about one game and specifically what you're looking for. The Play review does the opposite of that: it criticizes DD's combat and then recommends a game with largely reviled combat. It makes me question the basis of the criticism.

[Baconsammy]

This is either just luck or a testament to the greatness of JC2. The only way these recommendations usually work is if you say specifically what you don't like about one game and specifically what you're looking for. The Play review does the opposite of that: it criticizes DD's combat and then recommends a game with largely reviled combat. It makes me question the basis of the criticism.

I hate Skyrim's melee combat. I love Skyrim's ranged combat, much more than DD's. I also love Amalur's melee combat far more than DD's, but DD's ranged combat is better than Amalur's. They all have their strengths and weaknesses. Within the review he also recommends numerous other RPGs that he claims DD is aping ...poorly. He just hated the game (the 48 is the giveaway). Best to just chalk it up as the review you toss away when you remove the highest score and the lowest score. If I was wagering, I'd bet we wont see a score lower than that.

[TucoBenedictoPacifico]

Gimme a break. The guy's problem with the game goes way beyond the combat. Way beyond it. His opinion is that Skyrim is a better game. I can't argue that Skyrim isnt awesome. It is.

Oh, but I can. And I already did it in a previous thread, in fact.

I don't even think it's average. As an actual game I think Skyrim is plain *bad*.
Of course it has a lot of cool stuff, some brilliant features, ambitious size and so on, but the mechanics simply don't hold these things together in any decent way and the overall lack of balance and proper design is just baffling.

[Dapperk]

Japanese game panned for clunky controls? Surely GAF will take that to mean deep combat system, steep learning curve, and a required high skill level to play.

[Derrick01]

Japanese game panned for clunky controls? Surely GAF will take that to mean deep combat system, steep learning curve, and a required high skill level to play.

The control system definitely takes time to get used to but the demo doesn't allow you much since it throws you right into a griffon fight. Anytime you have to put the controls on the actual game screen you know you've probably overdone it a bit.

[Tagg9]

It seems to me that you'd need to personally play Skyrim and Dragon's Dogma (not just the demo!) before you can make a call as to whether the comparison is legitimate or not.

[whalleywhat]

Japanese game panned for clunky controls? Surely GAF will take that to mean deep combat system, steep learning curve, and a required high skill level to play.

*avatar quoet*

[soultron]

What in the what. I thought this game was out 22 May WW.

[ezekial45]

What in the what. I thought this game was out 22 May WW.

Gotta increase dat hype with positive buzz.

[PepsimanVsJoe]

Japanese game panned for clunky controls? Surely GAF will take that to mean deep combat system, steep learning curve, and a required high skill level to play.

Not my problem that game reviewers forgot how to play games.

[soultron]

Gotta increase dat hype with positive buzz.

I tell you what: it's weird to see reviews come out before the game these days.

Am I the only one feeling this way?

[UrbanRats]

It seems to me that you'd need to personally play Skyrim and Dragon's Dogma (not just the demo!) before you can make a call as to whether the comparison is legitimate or not.

I played the demo and seen several hours of footage between videos and streams, i don't have my words set in stone, we're just chatting around here ( i don't get paid to give my opinion :P) but i can safely say i understand how the game works pretty well.
I don't need to play Just Cause and Mafia neither, to understand they're pretty different stuff between each other (although i played both).

[ezekial45]

I tell you what: it's weird to see reviews come out before the game these days. Am I the only one feeling this way?

It's not that uncommon. Some games give a week's head start with the review embargo.

[Anteater]

Japanese game panned for clunky controls? Surely GAF will take that to mean deep combat system, steep learning curve, and a required high skill level to play.

huh there's nothing clunky about dragon's dogma's controls though, especially compared to other games, the design allowed the player to pull off a lot of stuff without having to wait, you could jump and air block if you want, aim and shoot while in the air and continue doing so as you land, you could roll on strider, switching between primary and secondary weapons are way faster than something like skyrim, it's actually really accessible in terms of controls, I could tell you how clunky skyrim is and that there are apparent input lag on a dual wielded character in third person view due to the character's basic movement animation.

The review complained about the lack of roll and block on all classes so I'm assuming he's talking about having a hard timing his spells on mage due to long casting.

Edit: and judging from the pictures he's using an overweight mage pawn which is known to have less stamina and speed

[soultron]

It's not that uncommon. Some games give a week's head start with the review embargo.

I just feel that so many AAA mega blockbusters these days have the late embargoes. DD isn't necessarily in that category, I feel.

Anyway, time to dig through these reviews.

[ezekial45]

I just feel that so many AAA mega blockbusters these days have the late embargoes these days. DD isn't necessarily in that category, I feel. Anyway, time to dig through these reviews.

Yeah, DD isn't. They're gonna want to get the positive reviews out as fast as possible.

[Rad-]

I swear, if this game had included proper online co-op most of these scores would be 9's. One of the worst design decisions ever.

[fallingdove]

Gimme a break. The guy's problem with the game goes way beyond the combat. Way beyond it. His opinion is that Skyrim is a better game. I can't argue that Skyrim isnt awesome. It is. I'm not going to tell him his opinion is wrong. edit: true story - When I finished Mafia 2 I asked for recommendations for a similar style of game. Nearly everyone recommended Just Cause 2.

We get it, you want to have Skyrim's babies. There are some of us though that didn't think it was so great and when I had more fun with the DD demo than the shallow/unbalanced slog I felt Skyrim to be, I question Play's 'by the way'. I doubt you would hold the same opinion if the tables were turned.. It sounds like you aren't nearly as interested in DD as you are Skyrim.

[Anteater]

Just read the 360 magazine review, the score deduction mainly comes from the technical stuff like clipping issues (npc clips though objects and even themselves, or clipping when you climb big monsters, etc), they didn't like the letterboxing and thinks they did it as an easy way to improve framerate, the textures are poop and often poop enough that it looks more like poop than actual textures (these are my words, not his, he just says they are sometimes really low res :P).

They said the game could've been optimized with extra development time for all of the above issues, and the reason it's not an "AAA game".

Another thing is that they didn't like how the map don't tell you where exactly the entrances are since it would just mark it on your map and you have to figure out your way in (I think this is a design choice since pawns are theoretically there to give you hints).

They seem to like the pawn system and says they work really well (the learning and adapting to new strategies stuff), they think it's challenging and there are 100hrs of stuff, and the world is a pleasure to explore, blah blah

[Endo Punk]

This game feels like it's sole existence is based on selling DLC. I can tell it will have a lot of DLC. And Im quite certain a new edition probably called Mega Dragons Dogma will released within a year.

Capcom expects to take a hit with this game so they surely have back up with all the BS they will pull.

[Pachterballs]

I'm going to buy this game.

that's what matters to crapcrom.

[Anteater]

This game feels like it's sole existence is based on selling DLC. I can tell it will have a lot of DLC. And Im quite certain a new edition probably called Mega Dragons Dogma will released within a year. Capcom expects to take a hit with this game so they surely have back up with all the BS they will pull.

Wouldn't be surprised with the DLC stuff, but the game alone seems to have enough contents from what we heard, though we don't know until we play it. It's one of the things I'm worrying about even though I usually don't care about DLC stuff, is that the end game might depend on buying DLCs like some of the other rpgs.

[Lucent]

Just read the 360 magazine review, the score deduction mainly comes from the technical stuff like clipping issues (npc clips though objects and even themselves, or clipping when you climb big monsters, etc), they didn't like the letterboxing and thinks they did it as an easy way to improve framerate, the textures are poop and often poop enough that it looks more like poop than actual textures (these are my words, not his, he just says they are sometimes really low res :P). They said the game could've been optimized with extra development time for all of the above issues, and the reason it's not an "AAA game".

These are the reasons I'm willing to buy this game day one and give it a chance:

• The demo was fun. I've played it repeatedly since it was available on PSN
• That RobertCram1 guy and the OXM UK guy are both having lots of fun with it.
• They're trying something new with this pawn system
• I love open world fantasy games like this
• Unlike Bethesda, Capcom allowed footage from both versions to be shown. I'm very confident in getting the PS3 version, whereas I had a bad feeling about getting the PS3 version of Skyrim because of the lack of footage, and I was right about my fear...
• The combat is much much better than something like Skyrim's. Moving is more fluid than the stiff movement of Skyrim's character.
• (Insert more reasons)

I am also hoping that by supporting this new IP, they'll put more effort into the sequel (if they do make one) and improve on all the technical problems. I am upset with Capcom about many of their past decisions with basically killing off MegaMan and the DLC crap they pull. Not having more MH over here than they do. But I'm def getting this game and RE6. These two games really need to be good to me, or I'm disowning them. =l

[Speedymanic]

Will RE6 demo access be through the game (ala Halo 3 beta through CD) or will it come with a voucher of some sort?

If it's through the disc, I'll pick it up when it's sub 20 bucks, if it's a voucher and they are limited in supply, I'll pick up the game, take out the voucher, maybe play the game for a few mins and trade it back in.

The demo didn't sell me on the game, my only real interest is in the RE6 demo, but those reviews are somewhat surprising, thought it would be universally shat upon.

[Natiko]

Pretty good reviews, surprised at the numbers really. I was going to give it a shot regardless but this only further validates my decision.

[soultron]

The Play review mentions you can revive but cannot be revived. My memory is foggy, but isn't this false? I seem to remember video where a pawn revived the player.

[Anteater]

The Play review mentions you can revive but cannot be revived. My memory is foggy, but isn't this false? I seem to remember video where a pawn revived the player.

It's game over if you die, unless it's something like a sleep spell, which your pawns could learn to wake you up, apparently there's a skill that allows you to "continue" after you die called "Pulse of the Dragon" later on so you could resurrect on the spot, but I don't know the requirement and the restrictions

[NeededSleep]

Looks like ill get DD when its under 40 bucks. Not bad reviews really, just other quality games I need to start/purchase before this.
Still need to start KOA:R. :-( .... So far behind on my console gaming.

[LeadProtagonist]

This game feels like it's sole existence is based on selling DLC. I can tell it will have a lot of DLC. And Im quite certain a new edition probably called Mega Dragons Dogma will released within a year. Capcom expects to take a hit with this game so they surely have back up with all the BS they will pull.

It looks like a pretty complete package with tons of hours in it right off the bat. Sure there's room for DLC, but every game shoves out DLC now for the most part. I highly doubt anything's been cut out of the main product.

Plus I don't think Capcom is expecting to take a hit on it. I think their expectations were around 1.5m WW or so. Don't remember entirely.

[shidoshi]

Oh, reviews are going up for this already? I guess I should get mine up. *laughs*

Dragon's Dogma is a really, really cool game with one huge flaw—the Pawn system is garbage. Japan's love for gaming gimmicks stunts what could have otherwise been a totally awesome game. Seriously, the Pawn system... UGH. It's insulting how insulting it is.

[Dresden]

Oh, reviews are going up for this already? I guess I should get mine up. *laughs* Dragon's Dogma is a really, really cool game with one huge flaw—the Pawn system is garbage. Japan's love for gaming gimmicks stunts what could have otherwise been a totally awesome game.

Good news and bad news all at once in one sentence.

[rockman zx]

This is Capcom first attempt at this genre, if I like the core gameplay, I will give them a free pass no matter how many issue the game has.

[shidoshi]

This is Capcom first attempt at this genre, if I like the core gameplay, I will give them a free pass no matter how many issue the game has.

If they gave up wanting to be "different" with core aspects of the Pawn system, Dragon's Dogma 2 could be an extremely interesting project. Not to say that this one isn't worth your time, it's just one of those examples of where I couldn't be more disappointed by a few design decisions by the developer.

[Anteater]

Oh, reviews are going up for this already? I guess I should get mine up. *laughs* Dragon's Dogma is a really, really cool game with one huge flaw—the Pawn system is garbage. Japan's love for gaming gimmicks stunts what could have otherwise been a totally awesome game. Seriously, the Pawn system... UGH. It's insulting how insulting it is.

I think it's just the magazine reviews, I'm actually surprised most reviewers liked the pawn system

Did you have problems with the actual AIs or the pawn system in general? Can't wait to read your review!

[Akai]

If they gave up wanting to be "different" with core aspects of the Pawn system, Dragon's Dogma 2 could be an extremely interesting project. Not to say that this one isn't worth your time, it's just one of those examples of where I couldn't be more disappointed by a few design decisions by the developer.

Well I hope with a potential sequel that they don't get rid of your main pawn. I really love the concept of creating a partner to follow and aid you. Not to mention they would still need to have pawns for those that don't play online...

[eXistor]

Scoring exactly as I predicted I see. No matter, most of us know what's up.

[Sword Familiar]

I think it's just the magazine reviews, I'm actually surprised most reviewers liked the pawn system Did you have problems with the actual AIs or the pawn system in general? Can't wait to read your review!

I think that was his review. He's insulted. Must be a very rude system.

[subversus]

"I like Dark Souls" is the new "I have black friends." SEEMS SO

lol, true

[shidoshi]

Well I hope with a potential sequel that they don't get rid of your main pawn. I really love the concept of creating a partner to follow and aid you. Not to mention they would still need to have pawns for those that don't play online...

That part isn't why I hated the Pawn system. I'll see if I can figure out tomorrow for certain if my review can go up yet or not, and if so, I'll feel like I can talk more about things then. *heh*

[Akai]

That part isn't why I hated the Pawn system. I'll see if I can figure out tomorrow for certain if my review can go up yet or not, and if so, I'll feel like I can talk more about things then. *heh*

My guess is the fact that your secondary pawns don't level up with you, so you are forced to be constantly switching out your party...

[Anteater]

The thing that worries me about the Play review is they are almost repeating my philosophy verbatim about difficulty, and they're using it in contrast with Demon/Dark Souls (good difficulty) and Dragon's Dogma (bad difficulty). Even though the review is particularly poorly written, that strikes a note with me because it's not particularly difficult to point something like this out. It should always - ALWAYS - be your fault you die, never the game's. I have always strongly disagreed with the assertion that Dark Souls/Demon Souls has some random deaths that you can't avoid, with the exception of a few bosses. Almost always if you fail, it's because you haven't properly applied your skills or you were impatient. I hope to hear more about how the game works out, but as always it's GAFers that will determine whether I get this, since actual game publication reviews are LOL at this point in trustworthiness.

I think the difficulty thing play complained about is just the levels, the basic idea is that there are higher level mobs in some regions and dungeons, so you'll probably get killed if you're way below their levels when you wander into them because there are no scaling, they explicitly stated "There's little warning when you're about to face harder enemies", and they complained that being a mage don't allow you to dodge/block those attacks, we don't know his playstyle and what skills there are in the game, so it's hard to tell if his complaints are his fault or the game's.

I don't know if enemies are actually cheap or not but things like chimera seems pretty much like any other action games with all the moves being blockable/avoidable, don't know whether these will fall apart when other enemies come into play. Like say a high level mage nuke you with a fireball before you get a chance to react

[Dehimos]

These are the reasons I'm willing to buy this game day one and give it a chance: The demo was fun. I've played it repeatedly since it was available on PSN That RobertCram1 guy and the OXM UK guy are both having lots of fun with it. They're trying something new with this pawn system I love open world fantasy games like this Unlike Bethesda, Capcom allowed footage from both versions to be shown. I'm very confident in getting the PS3 version, whereas I had a bad feeling about getting the PS3 version of Skyrim because of the lack of footage, and I was right about my fear... The combat is much much better than something like Skyrim's. Moving is more fluid than the stiff movement of Skyrim's character. (Insert more reasons) I am also hoping that by supporting this new IP, they'll put more effort into the sequel (if they do make one) and improve on all the technical problems. I am upset with Capcom about many of their past decisions with basically killing off MegaMan and the DLC crap they pull. Not having more MH over here than they do. But I'm def getting this game and RE6. These two games really need to be good to me, or I'm disowning them. =l

• Skills/Class: Dragon's Dogma is better than Skyrim
• The art/design: fucking old school style
  

[Lucent]

Skills/Class: Dragon's Dogma is better than Skyrim The art/design: fucking old school style

Yay for adding more bullet points!! =D

I seriously do hope this game turns out great though. It can't be all that boring if there are people constantly making videos on the game and gushing over it.

[Lulubop]

I think I'm gonna hold out for a while on this one.