NeoGAF

brotkasten · (05-31-2012, 04:10 PM)

Originally Posted by SRG01:

Touchscreens don't belong in notebooks. Why? Because you have to take your hand away from the keyboard and touch the screen. Trackpads work well because you don't have to adjust your position to do something. You can force devices to converge but don't expect them to perform well, like Tim Cook once said.

Touchscreen or kb/m, not both.

The touchscreen won't replace the touchpad on those devices.

Damon Bennet · (05-31-2012, 04:12 PM)

Originally Posted by SRG01:

Touchscreens don't belong in notebooks. Why? Because you have to take your hand away from the keyboard and touch the screen. Trackpads work well because you don't have to adjust your position to do something. You can force devices to converge but don't expect them to perform well, like Tim Cook once said.

Touchscreen or kb/m, not both.

i can imagine occasional touchscreen use quite well. especially if you dont have a mouse, just dragging one window around would be much more convenient. and the hybrid-ultra books will be the shit, i cant wait really.

PhoenixDawn · (05-31-2012, 04:13 PM)

Any idea when this will be released? I haven't been paying much attention to any Windows 8 details and I'm interested in trying out the preview.

Copernicus · (05-31-2012, 04:16 PM)

Originally Posted by PhoenixDawn:

Any idea when this will be released? I haven't been paying much attention to any Windows 8 details and I'm interested in trying out the preview.

Today/Tomorrow

djSyndrome · (05-31-2012, 04:17 PM)

Originally Posted by Jobiensis:

Eh, Nobody with any sense said that. The back end of OS 9 was horribly out dated and had many issues. The OS9->OSX transition was very similiar to 98/ME->WinXP.

This. I was working for AppleCare support when OSX was still relatively new. Every call was 'this is great, but I can't figure out how to _____'. I don't ever recall anyone wishing they could throw the thing away and go back to OS 9.

Mr. B Natural · (05-31-2012, 04:20 PM)

Originally Posted by brotkasten:

The touchscreen won't replace the touchpad on those devices.

Ultrabooks are already very light and top heavy. When you put your hand off the base to touch the top, guess what is going to happen to the laptop on your lap. Which is even more pointless, when you consider that your hand on the keyboard was right beside the touchpad when you decided to take your hand off of it to touch the screen.

Now, to fix this problem, maybe just get rid of keyboard and just make a smaller laptop which is only piece without a pivotal hinge: one handheld screen that you can hold in your hand and point with the other hand. Now that would be a clever little...wait, that exists already? An Ipad you say? Oh...

AdrianWerner · (05-31-2012, 04:21 PM)

Originally Posted by SRG01:

Touchscreens don't belong in notebooks. Why? Because you have to take your hand away from the keyboard and touch the screen. Trackpads work well because you don't have to adjust your position to do something.

trackpads suck because you do need to take your hands away from the keyboard.

THat said, touch screen in laptop doesn't make sense unless it is a convertible. People seems to love Transformer Prime and in such device you don't need to make any compromises, it will work great as a slate and great as

Jobiensis · (05-31-2012, 04:23 PM)

I don't get the hybrid love, sounds like a frankenstein machine that will be incredibly quirky. Most these OEMs have trouble putting together a nicely featured reliable notebook or a nicely featured reliable tablet separately, much less having both devices combined. MS Sideshow version 2.

Originally Posted by brotkasten:

The touchscreen won't replace the touchpad on those devices.

Yes, I can see occasional touchscreen use for laptops as well as desktops, with the majority of the heavy work done by kb/m/trackpad.

AdrianWerner · (05-31-2012, 04:28 PM)

Originally Posted by Jobiensis:

I don't get the hybrid love, sounds like a frankenstein machine that will be incredibly quirky. .

You say quirky, to me it;s a device that makes both notebooks and tablets obsolete.

Copernicus · 04:32 PM

Originally Posted by Mr. B Natural:

Ultrabooks are already very light and top heavy. When you put your hand off the base to touch the top, guess what is going to happen to the laptop on your lap. Which is even more pointless, when you consider that your hand on the keyboard was right beside the touchpad when you decided to take your hand off of it to touch the screen.

It's really not an issue. I messed around with my netbook that has a touchscreen with W7, W8, and Android ICS on it, you get used to using keyboard/mouse/touchscreen combo pretty quickly. When you touch the screen you get enough resistance from the base that tipping it backwards is not even something that crosses your mind. Think about how much resistance it has already to adjust, touch input requires a fraction of that to register.

It's alot more engaging that you would think at first.

Cindres · (05-31-2012, 04:31 PM)

I used the developer preview but hated it and skipped public, will give this a try when they release it just to see if these "new" features add anything to the experience or whether I'm just gonna skip it and stick with 7 (which I'm thinking at the moment).

Toki767 · (05-31-2012, 04:34 PM)

Is that $15 upgrade offer for anyone who has Windows 7 or just people who have recently bought a new computer?

brotkasten · 04:39 PM

Originally Posted by Toki767:

Is that $15 upgrade offer for anyone who has Windows 7 or just people who have recently bought a new computer?

Do you really think Microsoft would basically give away their new shiny OS to 500 million potential customers?

Please.

Quote:

Microsoft Store customers who purchase a Windows 7 PC from June 2nd will be offered a Windows 8 Pro upgrade for only $14.99. The limited-time "Windows Step-Up Offer" will run until January 31st, 2013 — providing upgrades for holiday and sales shoppers.

Cheebo · (05-31-2012, 04:38 PM)

Originally Posted by Toki767:

Is that $15 upgrade offer for anyone who has Windows 7 or just people who have recently bought a new computer?

Verge says it is just for computers purchased at a Microsoft store as well.

Cjdamon042 · (05-31-2012, 04:43 PM)

Originally Posted by brotkasten:

Do you really think Microsoft would basically give away their new shiny OS to 500 million potential customers?

Please.

I'm really hoping the final retail release comes out before my university takes away my MSDN AA account. I graduate in July and I imagine they'll remove me from their databases sometime around then or August.

I got Windows 7 for free this way and I'm hoping to do the same with 8 lol

Cheebo · (05-31-2012, 04:50 PM)

Originally Posted by Cjdamon042:

I'm really hoping the final retail release comes out before my university takes away my MSDN AA account. I graduate in July and I imagine they'll remove me from their databases sometime around then or August.

I got Windows 7 for free this way and I'm hoping to do the same with 8 lol

Retail release isn't till October.

claviertekky · (05-31-2012, 04:50 PM)

Originally Posted by Cheebo:

Retail release isn't till October.

Usually MSDN obtains releases in August.

Cjdamon042 · (05-31-2012, 04:51 PM)

Originally Posted by Cheebo:

Retail release isn't till October.

Originally Posted by claviertekky:

Usually MSDN obtains releases in August.

Hmm, probably not likely I'll be able to do that then. A shame, but not a big loss.

Mr_Zombie · (05-31-2012, 04:52 PM)

Do people really want to touch their monitors and laptop screens? I swear (in my mind) every time some wants to point something on my screen and ends up physically touching it leaving smudges all over it. Smudges are already annoying on smartphones and tablets, why would anyone want them on their desktop screens? :/

Zeppu · (05-31-2012, 04:54 PM)

We should be able to update the CP to this, right?

brotkasten · (05-31-2012, 04:56 PM)

Originally Posted by Cjdamon042:

Hmm, probably not likely I'll be able to do that then. A shame, but not a big loss.

All I can say is, just hope for incompetent admins.

Originally Posted by Zeppu:

We should be able to update the CP to this, right?

Nope.

Mr_Zombie · (05-31-2012, 04:57 PM)

Originally Posted by Zeppu:

We should be able to update the CP to this, right?

No. It will probably be similar to DP -> CP "update", where the installer basically dumps your files and data in a directory and does a clean install.

Zeppu · (05-31-2012, 04:58 PM)

Aaaaw shucks :(

My XBMC is perfectly set up :(

brotkasten · (05-31-2012, 05:00 PM)

Originally Posted by Zeppu:

Aaaaw shucks :(

My XBMC is perfectly set up :(

Make a backup of the settings and database.

Kibbles · (05-31-2012, 05:01 PM)

Originally Posted by brotkasten:

Judging by the implemented features and the stuff that is still missing or would make sense, I don't think they had time to even think about this.

This does not bode well for comfy couch PC.

StudioTan · 05:12 PM

Originally Posted by ShdwDrake:

It doesn't look like its as easy to get to some functions that you normally just pressed start for.

Can you give me an example of which functions you're referring to and I can let you know how they work in Win8?

Originally Posted by lunarworks:

This so much.

A friend of mine got his hands on Win95 when it was in beta, and I was impressed. I installed a Win98 beta when I eventually had my own home PC, and liked it right away. I was accepted as an official beta tester for Win XP, Vista, and 7, and installed those the day they were made available, using all as my primary OS with very few complaints.

Windows 8? I downloaded the consumer preview the moment it was made available, installed it on a spare computer at work, played with it for a few hours, and then pretty much gave up on it.

Now your posts make sense.

The first thing everyone did when they installed the CP is play with the Metro side of things. Some decided it was an abomination the likes of which have never before been seen in the history of computing, some thought it was kind of cool and others were confused or even indifferent.

The thing is once you actually USE the OS as your main machine you realize that at this point, on a desktop machine, you're spending 99% of your time in the desktop environment, which is a nice upgrade in terms of performance yet the same basic workflow as previous Windows OSs. Once you have everything installed you rarely see Metro and when you do, and have it laid out intelligently, the workflow is quicker and more efficient than the old Start menu.

Meanwhile I also have a Windows tablet, so using the OS on that device is a revelation. It works 1000X better than Win7 did and yet it's still Windows. I can still have all my software running on it if I need to but for day to day tablet use I spend 95% of my time in Metro apps because they work better for that form factor.

Obviously being BETA there is stuff unfinished and since this is a paradigm shift in the direction of the OS there is more than average tweaking still to be done, more than during any previous betas.

If your first version of Windows was 95 then most subsequent versions would have been virtually the same in terms of workflow. Pre-Win95 I was mostly using DOS so I know all about having to change the way you typically use your computer.

claviertekky · 05:28 PM

Originally Posted by Zeppu:

We should be able to update the CP to this, right?

I will, and I think so given that there is a Windows Feedback Tool program that is running until July/August for Consumer Preview users.

Testers are given rewards (e.g. Office 2010 or Forza 4/Disney Xbox 360 games).

Otherwise, I'll figure it out. The installations are supposed to be modular.

Liu Kang Baking A Pie · (05-31-2012, 05:28 PM)

Originally Posted by jagowar:

People don't download applications in windows? news to me.

"People don't pay for applications in Windows" is the story. To developers trying to make a living, it doesn't matter how many millions (or billions) use the OS if no one is buying anything.

I used Windows for a decade. I don't think I ever bought a single thing for it. School and work supplied me with Creative Suite and Office applications.

Steelyuhas · (05-31-2012, 05:30 PM)

Um, I expected the download to be up by now.

Any word?

claviertekky · (05-31-2012, 05:33 PM)

Probably will be up by June 1st.

There was no time stamp.

Windu · (05-31-2012, 05:34 PM)

Originally Posted by Liu Kang Baking A Pie:

"People don't pay for applications in Windows" is the story. To developers trying to make a living, it doesn't matter how many millions (or billions) use the OS if no one is buying anything.

I used Windows for a decade. I don't think I ever bought a single thing for it. School and work supplied me with Creative Suite and Office applications.

The app store will probably change that.

Stumpokapow · (05-31-2012, 05:35 PM)

Originally Posted by Windu:

The app store will probably change that.

FWIW, the Mac App Store didn't change it for me. If anything, I'm disappointed because I was hoping the Mac App Store would be a good place to centrally manage all the free shit I have on my computer but half or more of what I use never got added to it.

Liu Kang Baking A Pie · 05:39 PM

Originally Posted by Stumpokapow:

FWIW, the Mac App Store didn't change it for me. If anything, I'm disappointed because I was hoping the Mac App Store would be a good place to centrally manage all the free shit I have on my computer but half or more of what I use never got added to it.

Yep, I'm the same way. Just adding an official store doesn't really do anything. I also don't think having one is particularly influential on getting developers to develop for it or for users to want things. Facebook will develop for the platforms they choose for their own reasons, and users will download their stuff because it's Facebook, not because it's available on the official Apple App Store or something.

Steam is great, and for a lot of us it makes buying games so much easier, but I'm still blown away by how many people don't use it. There are still people that haven't played Portal when that thing has been given away for free so many times.

StudioTan · (05-31-2012, 05:40 PM)

Originally Posted by Stumpokapow:

FWIW, the Mac App Store didn't change it for me. If anything, I'm disappointed because I was hoping the Mac App Store would be a good place to centrally manage all the free shit I have on my computer but half or more of what I use never got added to it.

Are the apps in the Mac App Store usable on both the desktop OS and the iPad? Genuinely curious.

brotkasten · (05-31-2012, 05:42 PM)

Originally Posted by claviertekky:

Probably will be up by June 1st.

There was no time stamp.

The page is already up on MSDN. Download links don't work, though.

PG2G · (05-31-2012, 05:42 PM)

Originally Posted by StudioTan:

Are the apps in the Mac App Store usable on both the desktop OS and the iPad? Genuinely curious.

I'd imagine not, considering they are two entirely different operating systems.

Windu · (05-31-2012, 05:43 PM)

Originally Posted by Stumpokapow:

FWIW, the Mac App Store didn't change it for me. If anything, I'm disappointed because I was hoping the Mac App Store would be a good place to centrally manage all the free shit I have on my computer but half or more of what I use never got added to it.

I assume apple takes a cut from those app sales. The developers probably dont want to see their money go elsewhere. With desktop apps in W8 the store just lists them and provides a link to where to buy them. Metro apps on the other hand can only be sold through the store. With the store basically just serving as an advertisment for the desktop apps i don't see why devs wouldnt put them on there.

claviertekky · (05-31-2012, 05:44 PM)

Originally Posted by brotkasten:

The page is already up on MSDN. Download links don't work, though.

After lunch then.

PwnCakes193 · (05-31-2012, 05:50 PM)

Server 2012 Edition is up, the RP should be out soon.

celebi23 · (05-31-2012, 05:50 PM)

According to this topic on Neowin, individual direct download links are slowly showing up. Only the server versions are up right now.

Kabuki Quantum Lover · (05-31-2012, 05:50 PM)

Originally Posted by Stumpokapow:

FWIW, the Mac App Store didn't change it for me. If anything, I'm disappointed because I was hoping the Mac App Store would be a good place to centrally manage all the free shit I have on my computer but half or more of what I use never got added to it.

Yeah, same. I just have two apps from it (Sparrow and FreeMemory), but everything else is a regular download off some random site.

Izick · (05-31-2012, 05:52 PM)

So can you run this from a Live CD/USB, or still no good on that?

Enco · (05-31-2012, 05:53 PM)

Originally Posted by celebi23:

According to this topic on Neowin, individual direct download links are slowly showing up. Only the server versions are up right now.

Wait so there IS aero? I'm confused.

Menelaus · (05-31-2012, 05:55 PM)

Originally Posted by StudioTan:

If your first version of Windows was 95 then most subsequent versions would have been virtually the same in terms of workflow. Pre-Win95 I was mostly using DOS so I know all about having to change the way you typically use your computer.

It frightens me to know that there may be some people in this thread that used XP as their first OS.

Zombie James · (05-31-2012, 05:55 PM)

Originally Posted by Enco:

Wait so there IS aero? I'm confused.

The new theme isn't in the RC, and we probably won't see it in full until RTM.

StudioTan · (05-31-2012, 06:03 PM)

Originally Posted by PG2G:

I'd imagine not, considering they are two entirely different operating systems.

Well I have no idea, I don't use Apple products and don't pay much attention to them. I did have an iPhone for a little while, it was cool.

I would think one of the incentives for doing Win8 apps is that people can use them on tablets as well as their desktop PCs. Buy once, use everywhere.

ATM there are only 2 Metro apps I use daily on my desktop, Remote Desktop and the weather app, but I have nothing against using them as long as they're well done.

Mr_Zombie · (05-31-2012, 06:03 PM)

Originally Posted by Zombie James:

The new theme isn't in the RC, and we probably won't see it in full until RTM.

Fuck :/
I hope that they at least fixed the bug with snapped windows; the 2px "border" around them is annoying.

claviertekky · (05-31-2012, 06:09 PM)

Originally Posted by Izick:

So can you run this from a Live CD/USB, or still no good on that?

If you have a working installation, supposedly Windows to Go will be available. That will allow you to create a USB session on any computer.

Bullza2o · (05-31-2012, 06:12 PM)

Apparently the x64 iso is out. I guess I'll give it another try.
http://windows8consumer.in/blog/inde...ents/#comments

AdrianWerner · (05-31-2012, 06:15 PM)

Originally Posted by Liu Kang Baking A Pie:

"People don't pay for applications in Windows" is the story. To developers trying to make a living, it doesn't matter how many millions (or billions) use the OS if no one is buying anything.

Oh, please. Don't pretend it's any different on iOS. Aside from games few people actually buy apps on iOS and even among games free games dominate.\
Windows has the biggest software ecosystem around. It wouldn't have one if those devs wouldn't be making living on it.