[cameron]

If Nintendo didn't cancel ED2, does Silicon Knights of 2012 have the chops to make it? X-Men Destiny, the last game by SK, was pretty awful in almost every way. And it seems like most of the leads or designers from the original Eternal Darkness moved to Rockstar or other studios a long time ago. I realize this is a dick thing to say, especially when a bunch of devs just got laid off.

[C.T.]

Still angry about Nintendo not helping out Cing, a fully commited Nintendo developer. But Silicon Knights? Understandable.

[Gahiggidy]

Which side of the story is the rumor coming from? Silicon Knights' or Nintendo's?

[Stumpokapow]

You're joking right? Is it in the contract that Epic give you a class on how to use UE3? Hell, maybe they shouldn't have joined the UE3 ban wagon and made their own engine.

They did make their own engine. By illegally, as proven in a court of law, appropriating assets from UE3.

[Cosmonaut X]

This is Nintendo politics I don't understand, or at least I don't agree with. If they want third party love, they better show more interest in their second party first. If they want more core gamers games and generally more games for their systems, they also need to invest in more western studios. They should have secured Silicon Knights IPs and supported them years ago.

They have the IP, and the split was mutual. This isn't "politics"; this is, sadly, smart business. They're avoiding getting entangled in what looks like a collapsing studio, just as they did with Factor 5.

[scitek]

I don't think anyone that adores Eternal Darkness should want the Silicon Knights that made X-Men Destiny to make a sequel.

[walking fiend]

I said I didn't know, so please enlighten me as it would be pretty interesting to know.

I think the Crytek said at their latest interview after going f2p they will continue to still develop AAA games, which take budgets of 10m-30m.

If I remember correctly.

[Shiggy]

I wouldn't be surprised if the license is kept by Nintendo, if SK goes down. So there is always hope...

That's definitely the case. It's their trademark

Darksiders was original IP created by brand new studio Vigil Games. They also worked on Warhammer 40K MMO, but financial instability of THQ shifted focus of the game back to the more traditional "Space Marine" action experience, just with trillion % of more content. Currently they are finishing work on very ambitious DS2.

SK did contract work for Darksiders 1 when THQ cancelled The Ritualist. Must have been some kind of compensation. Btw, The Ritualist wasn't bad, but THQ was just out of money in early 2009.

[Cosmonaut X]

I think the Crytek said at their latest interview after going f2p they will continue to still develop AAA games, which take budgets of 10m-30m. If I remember correctly.

Development budgets, I'd imagine. I'm sure I've seen figures that can double that once you roll in marketing etc.

[Jackano]

They have the IP, and the split was mutual. This isn't "politics"; this is, sadly, smart business. They're avoiding getting entangled in what looks like a collapsing studio, just as they did with Factor 5.

Yeah I agree with the smart business thing for today; But my point was, Nintendo should have done something years before that to avoid this mess. Retro Studios wasn't very healthy at first if I remember correctly some readings, and they benefited from their partnership with Nintendo.

[ProfessorMoran]

? Darksiders was original IP created by brand new studio Vigil Games. They also worked on Warhammer 40K MMO, but financial instability of THQ shifted focus of the game back to the more traditional "Space Marine" action experience, just with trillion % of more content. Currently they are finishing work on very ambitious DS2.

SK did outsource work for Dark Siders.

[walking fiend]

Still angry about Nintendo not helping out Cing, a fully commited Nintendo developer. But Silicon Knights? Understandable.

If they wanted Nintendo's protection, they should have become second party.

These type of decisions have risk: become independent and have all the money for yourself, but sustain all the loss too

Development budgets, I'd imagine. I'm sure I've seen figures that can double that once you roll in marketing etc.

thanks for correction.

[Pie and Beans]

They did make their own engine. By illegally, as proven in a court of law, appropriating assets from UE3.

starting a legal battle with Epic all the while they stole tech and bits and bobs from UE3 to cobble their 'own' engine together was the purest level of disbelief this whole thing got to. Either Dyack surrounded himself with sycophants or he just didn't listen to the screams of "THIS IS A VERY BAD IDEA, INFACT IT IS THE WORST."

[Projectjustice]

Should of just released Too Human with the UE3.

[Krev]

Sad for Wii U, sad for everyone losing their jobs, sad, sad, sad.
Dyack is such a fool.

[Shiggy]

This is Nintendo politics I don't understand, or at least I don't agree with. If they want third party love, they better show more interest in their second party first. If they want more core gamers games and generally more games for their systems, they also need to invest in more western studios. They should have secured Silicon Knights IPs and supported them years ago.

Dyack did not want this because the Wii was underpowered and based on motion controls.

They did make their own engine. By illegally, as proven in a court of law, appropriating assets from UE3.

Funnily, employees on LinkedIn even say about X-Men Destiny that it uses the UE3.

I think the Crytek said at their latest interview after going f2p they will continue to still develop AAA games, which take budgets of 10m-30m. If I remember correctly.

Then the Epic money is even more drastic...

[TheExorzist]

Well, I guess the next SK game won't use UE4, right?

[Pai Pai Master]

Silicon Knight's beef with Epic was that they claimed Epic was taking the money made from licensing Unreal Engine 3 to devs like SK and using it to directly fund Gears of War's development instead of improving third party UE3 tools and support. They claimed they lost millions throughout the development of Too Human as a result.

[JGS]

Buy SK out (They need the money) and create a Mature studio in Canada, hire some of the staff back (They need the job).

[Jackano]

Dyack did not want this because the Wii was underpowered and based on motion controls.

Ok, I see. Seeing where this lead them, it was probably the *best* idea of his life!

[FoxHimself]

Wait, where is this rumor coming from? Are you just speculating? You say "it looks like there have been internal discussions". How do you know this?

[Coppertracks]

if true, LEAK EVERYTHING!!! Art, character models, cut-scenes, music, storylines!

And Then Nintendo needs to let... Retro/Platinum Games have a go?

[grandjedi6]

It's been a long time. They invested into SK in 2000. A wholly different philosophy and strategy at Nintendo back then.

True. I was more wondering why Nintendo repartnered with them for ED2 recently. Dyack must make persuasive arguments.

[Danielsan]

Buy SK out (They need the money) and create a Mature studio in Canada, hire some of the staff back (They need the job).

Why would anyone want to put any money in that horrendous studio?
Some of the people in there might be talented, but as a studio they are absolutely awful, not to mention horribly mismanaged thanks to our friend Dyack.

[EternalDarko]

I absolutely loved Eternal Darkness - see my name, but i don't think the remains of what SK has been the past few years could have made a game that matched the output of the original.
I want Nintendo to give it to someone else, get it made to a good standard, and some time this decade hopefully.

[JGS]

Why would anyone want to put any money in that horrendous studio? Some of the people in there might be talented, but as a studio they are absolutely awful, not to mention horribly mismanaged thanks to our friend Dyack.

You definitely don't want SK to be the studio and you keep Dyack away.

They could get and refine Too Human as well. Not like Nintendo doesn't need IP's.

[The Hermit]

I called it in the thread about Sk vs Epic.

Very sad though.

[Smiles and Cries]

I wonder if this was suppose to be the big finish at E3 but never made it

[Huff]

After the trial, this outcome was basically guaranteed. No one will touch them

[reptilescorpio]

What are the chances of the partially completed works being given to another developer who has time on their hands, say for instance one that passed off development of the sequel to their psychological horror game to a small Indie dev?

[Raide]

What are the chances of the partially completed works being given to another developer who has time on their hands, say for instance one that passed off development of the sequel to their psychological horror game to a small Indie dev?

The vast majority of devs would hate to start half-way through someone else's project, especially the coding, game design and art-style. . If someone gets the IP, they will just start again.

[Blueblur1]

Dyack seemingly had a real "biting the hand that feeds you" and blame game complex going on all through his career. Whether it was blaming game journalists or the entire preview/review system for the savaging his sub-par game received and not actually using that criticism to improve it, or turning on the engine providers when his supposedly amazing game failed to take the world by storm, the guy is like some modern day parable of what happens when you get consumed by weird vengeance all the time. Pity people are obviously losing their jobs, but its been a long time since I've seen a spark of talent at Silicon Knights. They'll achieve much more now not anchored to a ship with a captain that keeps trying to win fights against icebergs.

Couldn't have said it better myself.

[POWERSPHERE]

Fuckin' Dyack. Ruined everything.

[PSFan]

Against

[Sadist]

I feel for the people who lost their jobs. Hope they will find a new one very soon.

And oh man... ED 2... I'm replaying ED right now and the controls are a bit stiff, but man the game is still good. What a shame :(

[Zeer0id]

game over

[Ysiadmihi]

SK of today could not make a worthy sequel to Eternal Darkness anyway. It sucks for those who lost their jobs, but at least if Nintendo decides to revive the series later it will be in the hands of a different developer.

[Madao]

i'm calling it now.

Eternal Darkness 2 by Retro Studios after they finish whatever they're making now in a few years.

if Nintendo really wants this IP to be part of their lineup, this is the most likely scenario.

[Haunted]

oh man

[shintoki]

What are the chances of the partially completed works being given to another developer who has time on their hands, say for instance one that passed off development of the sequel to their psychological horror game to a small Indie dev?

A small team would not be able to handle a large scope project. Or better to say, a small team would not be given a chance to work on a multi-million dollar project that is meant to be a seller.

2nd, this is definitely a long time coming. They were the team whose projects continue to jump generations(ED and Too Human were both PS1/N64 titles at first). They released two titles in the past 8 years, both being wrecks. Nintendo dropping them makes sense and to be honest, I have no desire for the franchise to return anyways. Nor for someone else to take it over. Its not like the franchise did well anyways.

[nikatapi]

i'm calling it now. Eternal Darkness 2 by Retro Studios after they finish whatever they're making now in a few years. if Nintendo really wants this IP to be part of their lineup, this is the most likely scenario.

What if they are already making it?

[Franchuzas87]

Depressing. I was really looking forward to ED2.

The layoffs also sucks.

[LeleSocho]

They are just waiting SK death so they can use the IP without their (shitty) involvement.
Seems a smart move to me.

[Alien Bob]

Heavy Rain was good. Eternal Darkness was crap.

Oh hey, it's opposite day!

[Diddy Kong]

Disappointing. Good luck to those who lost their jobs.

[soultron]

I'm fully aware of the result of the Epic/SK trial, but they're appealing it, are they not?

Also, where are you hearing rumours that the remaining 40 were laid off?

[gketter]

What a crazy developer who always seemed to get way more attention than the output (quality and quantity) deserved. If this is the end after all these years of existence they released what....2 good games? ED and Legacy of Kain

[HeySeuss]

i'm calling it now. Eternal Darkness 2 by Retro Studios after they finish whatever they're making now in a few years. if Nintendo really wants this IP to be part of their lineup, this is the most likely scenario.

Yep. Simply pay for whatever rights Dennis still has for ED that makes them say that ownership of the IP is "complicated" and give it to Retro to work on. I think this will happen as well. Actually, if it ever sees the light of day(which at this point is in serious doubt), that would be the only scenario I see happening.

[Ushojax]

Heavy Rain was good. Eternal Darkness was crap.

[Shiggy]

I'm fully aware of the result of the Epic/SK trial, but they're appealing it, are they not? Also, where are you hearing rumours that the remaining 40 were laid off?

I cannot say whether all remaining 40 employees were laid off, but they were rather extensive. One source (among others) for the layoffs is (now former) SK director Julian Spillane: