[bengraven]

How dare I assert what the Bible says on the subject at hand I have simply stated what I feel is a sin based upon the Bible. What is and is not a sin has nothing to do with how I deal and talk with others. I am on a equal level with everybody and quite guilty and deserving of Hell. It would be dumb for me to chastise others for their sins when I am in the same boat. I have my beliefs about what is and is not a sin, but that does not make me call others out for their sins as that is between them and God.

It's your attitude, the way you deliver your message, and ignorance (example: after being called out as a nutjob, you still keep putting faith in Slick's work). I believe you came in here with an agenda to defend organized religion regardless of the counter-points, based on your posts. I think it's admirable to have a faith, but to come in with an agenda to call someone out on their decision in their faith is not a very Christian thing to do.

Granted, this is a discussion board and we should see all spectrums of discussion and I'm not saying you should leave, but I'm saying the way you carry yourself is the kind of thing that caused Chi to leave organized religion - since that self-piety will cause arrogance eventually.

My wife and her friends also abandoned the church but remain staunch Christians. Their favorite saying is, "It's Christianity that's the number one cause of atheism" and your attitude is proving that.

I'm not sure what point you're trying to make. Christianity exists because it does. There is no Rogerism, there are no Sagainsts. But there is Christianity. So what?

True story: I have Saganist listed as my religion on Facebook. There have been four times that someone has seen it, assumed it said Satanist, and lectured either myself or my wife on "joking about heresy" on Facebook when I could be influencing the future generations of Christians who are turning from God every day. Two of those lectures were from the same person, who both times was told that it's "Sagan, as in Carl" and just a joke because I admire Carl Sagan and his views on the universe, but still felt the need to bombard my Facebook wall with Bible verses about turning from "Satan, as in The Lord of Flies and Lies" on two seperate occasions because they apparently forgot the first time that I was not a Satanist.

[Angry Fork]

I'm not sure what point you're trying to make. Christianity exists because it does. There is no Rogerism, there are no Sagainsts. But there is Christianity. So what?

So if Christ wasn't special, and there are tons of people throughout history just as good as him if not better, why does he have his own religion? And why should anybody 'follow' his word?

[echoshifting]

Right there with you, Chi. Been a non-church Christian for a little over ten years. Your thoughts in the op line right up with my own.

edit: to be clear I'm not planning on jumping into the debate here, just expressing support

[JGS]

So if Christ wasn't special, and there are tons of people throughout history just as good as him if not better, why does he have his own religion? And why should anybody 'follow' his word?

They want to?

[TucoBenedictoPacifico]

I think it's admirable to have a faith

Is it?

[bengraven]

Is it?

Sure, why not?

Don't get me wrong, I believe 100% in "beliefs" vs. "faith". A belief system can evolve, be changed, be strengthened by facts or weakened and re-evaluated by other facts.

But having a faith IN SOMETHING, as in being committed to something, is admirable. Not enviable. And not a reason to be a complete asshole.

[Napoleonthechimp]

Modern Christianity runs counter to the message at the core of the Bible.

Past: Jesus rallied against authoritative temples and the abuses of power, also proclaimed the kingdom of God is within all men (and women).

Present: Churches are the centre of religious power and chief among them is a man who wears a gold hat and been appointed as the ruler of his own city state.

[Kinitari]

Chi! You've never seemed like the judgemental type, and I can see how the inherent judgements of a lot of organized religious communities could slowly grate at you over the years.

Just as long as you find a zone of contentment, stick to it.

[ronito]

Well I've been there with you Chi. If it makes it any easier it was only a matter of time. Truth be told you hung in longer than I expected.

[Crunched]

So if Christ wasn't special, and there are tons of people throughout history just as good as him if not better, why does he have his own religion? And why should anybody 'follow' his word?

That question is not nearly as simple as you're allowing it to be.

@bengraven: I had Discordianism listed as my religion for a few years, but it was lost on people.

[Game Analyst]

How does this show that one sin that one commandment addresses is any different than another sin mentioned in a different commandment?

Judas knew what he was doing was wrong. That is who Jesus is talking about.

The Bible says there are different types of sins.

1. Sinning when we know its wrong (Hebrews 10:26)
2. Sinning when we do not know it is wrong (Leviticus 4:2).

Every time I have heard someone ask a Christian why they condemn homosexuals because loving a same sex partner in a committed relationship is a lot better than murdering someone, they are always told that it is a sin and all sin is equal in the eyes of God.

In the following verses, Jesus is talking about believers and explaining to Peter that the more we know, the more we are going to be held accountable for. We will also be punished differently by how much knowledge we have and what we did with it.

"And a servant who knows what the master wants, but isn’t prepared and doesn’t carry out those instructions, will be severely punished. But someone who does not know, and then does something wrong, will be punished only lightly. When someone has been given much, much will be required in return; and when someone has been entrusted with much, even more will be required."

Someone who hasn't been pardoned (forgiven) by Jesus is in a different camp all together.

[The Lamp]

This is LiveJournal-y, I apologize in advance: After thinking about this for a long time. I've come to the determination that I will never set foot inside a church again. I simply cannot resolve my political views, and things I know in my heart to be the right thing, with what I hear from those I share my faith with. Even in cordial and polite discussions with other Christians, there is no sway, and a base line zealotry when it comes to issues like abortion and gay marriage. I do not feel that abortion is the appropriate choice, however, I don't feel that it is an option I should be allowed to take off the table for others. Yes, I beleive that if we emphasize sexual responsbility and education in schools that the number of unnecessary abortions can be reduced, but I also cannot get in line with the idea of taking away safe, professional medical facilities and professional personnel from those who choose to have one, just because its not a right choice for me. As it comes to gay marriage. I simply do not see this as a threat to the family. Being shitty parents or having a shitty marriage is a threat to the family, not two people who want to commit to each other. I don't understand why so many Christians and the Christian establishment think that this is some sort of slippery slope into depravity. If you see a gay couple walking down the street and it makes you question the legitimacy of your heterosexual union, doesn't seem to me like it's the gay couple that needs to examine their relationship. And I certainly don't think 2 men holding hands is going to turn little Johnny gay. There is so much going on interally with the religious establishment of modern Christianity that is going to destroy the faith, rather than outside forces. The Christian religion is not under attack. If anything, we're being checked for being incredible assholes. If the world is rebuking us, shouldn't we look within ourselves? Instead of calling for a moral crusade against the world? The history of our religion has been one of persecution and redemption. Is it right that as the most dominant global religion, we use that to persecute others? To throw others to figurative lions? We are being lead by Pharisees. The Christian leadership has nothing better to do than tell the whole world how to lead their lives, and how moral and pious the Christian leadership has been and all the sacrifices they are making for their flocks. What stalwart shepards. They might as well put on makeup and wander the marketplaces, trying to convince other that they fast harder than everyone else. I am grateful for accepting Jesus into my life. I am a better person for it. But it doesn't mean that I have to fall in lockstep with everyone else. Jesus was a Jew, a rabbi, but one who did not simply obey those who were in power. I'm not saying that I am the revolutionary Jesus was. Far from it. But I'm no longer willing to give my time or finances to support the organized Christian faith. Bah. I've rambled too long. It kills me to think of it any longer. tl;dr: I quit organized religion. Slow your roll Atheist-GAF, I'm still a Christian.

But what do you think about this scripture?

Hebrews 10:24-26
"And let us consider one another in order to stir up
love and good works, not forsaking the assembling
of ourselves together, as is the manner of some, but
exhorting one another, and so much the more as
you see the Day approaching. For if we sin willfully,
after we have received the knowledge of the truth,
there no longer remains a sacrifice for sins."

Is there a single scripture that encourages separating from other believers? God doesn't want His followers to isolate themselves, He wants them to commune. Half of the New Testament deals with procedures believers should follow with each other and in the church, there's a structure laid out to leadership, dealing with other people sinning against you, and everything. The Bible lays out that people sin when they are "drawn away" (James 1) by their desires, so I'd say the Bible is pretty clear about the dangers of isolating yourself.

I would suggest that if you're a Christian, at least try looking for a different church, group, or Bible study or something, maybe. Not all "churches" are the same and it's unfortunately not uncommon for some of them to not be places you'd want to visit. It's not hard to be at a church that sucks and then write them off forever. I've had to do some church swapping before, myself.

[Dude Abides]

Surely a major urban center like Chicago must have one of the more sane and humane varieties of Christian church that you could join.

[LCGeek]

Modern Christianity runs counter to the message at the core of the Bible. Past: Jesus rallied against authoritative temples and the abuses of power, also proclaimed the kingdom of God is within all men (and women). Present: Churches are the centre of religious power and chief among them is a man who wears a gold hat and been appointed as the ruler of his own Nation state.

Slight correction.

Catholics have real power and it's foolish to ignore the impact. They will keep on going and no extinction level event is going to deal with a culture that buries it shit in bunkers. People can deal with this problem before they learn to use science even more to pervert their ways.

[Angry Fork]

They want to?

You want to be a slave to someone else's will?

That question is not nearly as simple as you're allowing it to be.

It is. Christ is given free reign because billions have been indoctrinated into it in this time of human history. Before him it was Zeus, Osiris, etc. the immense never ending list of deities.

[Kinitari]

But what do you think about this scripture? Hebrews 10:24-26 "And let us consider one another in order to stir up love and good works, not forsaking the assembling of ourselves together, as is the manner of some, but exhorting one another, and so much the more as you see the Day approaching. For if we sin willfully, after we have received the knowledge of the truth, there no longer remains a sacrifice for sins." Is there a single scripture that encourages separating from other believers? God doesn't want His followers to isolate themselves, He wants them to commune. Half of the New Testament deals with procedures believers should follow with each other and in the church, there's a structure laid out to leadership, dealing with other people sinning against you, and everything. The Bible lays out that people sin when they are "drawn away" (James 1) by their desires, so I'd say the Bible is pretty clear about the dangers of isolating yourself. I would suggest that if you're a Christian, at least try looking for a different church, group, or Bible study or something, maybe. Not all "churches" are the same and it's unfortunately not uncommon for some of them to not be places you'd want to visit.

Obvious hidden reason for wanting people to keep going to church aside, doesn't this seem a bit... hand-holdy to you?

I mean Chi is a big boy, he can be trusted to remain pious all by himself. Let him worship on his own in his own way, I doubt that will bar him from heaven - and if it does, that's kind of ridiculous.

[bengraven]

That question is not nearly as simple as you're allowing it to be. @bengraven: I had Discordianism listed as my religion for a few years, but it was lost on people.

Ha, that's awesome. The ADD generation and their "I don't understand that and don't have the three seconds to Google it, so let me move on to this baby picture...".

But what do you think about this scripture? Hebrews 10:24-26 "And let us consider one another in order to stir up love and good works, not forsaking the assembling of ourselves together, as is the manner of some, but exhorting one another, and so much the more as you see the Day approaching. For if we sin willfully, after we have received the knowledge of the truth, there no longer remains a sacrifice for sins." Is there a single scripture that encourages separating from other believers? God doesn't want His followers to isolate themselves, He wants them to commune. Half of the New Testament deals with procedures believers should follow with each other and in the church, there's a structure laid out to leadership, dealing with other people sinning against you, and everything. The Bible lays out that people sin when they are "drawn away" (James 1) by their desires, so I'd say the Bible is pretty clear about the dangers of isolating yourself. I would suggest that if you're a Christian, at least try looking for a different church, group, or Bible study or something, maybe. Not all "churches" are the same and it's unfortunately not uncommon for some of them to not be places you'd want to visit. It's not hard to be at a church that sucks and then write them off forever. I've had to do some church swapping before, myself.

It doesn't really sound like he's saying "stay together or burn alone". It's like "hey, you know, think about hanging out with like-minded people...no worries if you don't want to, but consider it at least...I mean...why not?" as well as somewhat saying "you should gather with other people so they can judge you if you flail".

[Dunk#7]

It's your attitude, the way you deliver your message, and ignorance (example: after being called out as a nutjob, you still keep putting faith in Slick's work). I believe you came in here with an agenda to defend organized religion regardless of the counter-points, based on your posts. I think it's admirable to have a faith, but to come in with an agenda to call someone out on their decision in their faith is not a very Christian thing to do. Granted, this is a discussion board and we should see all spectrums of discussion and I'm not saying you should leave, but I'm saying the way you carry yourself is the kind of thing that caused Chi to leave organized religion - since that self-piety will cause arrogance eventually. My wife and her friends also abandoned the church but remain staunch Christians. Their favorite saying is, "It's Christianity that's the number one cause of atheism" and your attitude is proving that.

I really do not understand how I would come off that way. I am one of the nicest people and I tend to get along with everybody.

I did come in to see what reason caused the drop of organized religion and the points seemed counterintuitive to me so I asserted a couple of thoughts. What is wrong with that? I did not feel that it was proper to be upset with a congregation for following biblical teachings if you believe in the teachings of the Bible.

How in the world would I ever be arrogant about something like this? I am a terrible sinner just like everybody else and deserving of Hell. How could I ever be arrogant about that position?

[The Lamp]

Obvious hidden reason for wanting people to keep going to church aside, doesn't this seem a bit... hand-holdy to you? I mean Chi is a big boy, he can be trusted to remain pious all by himself. Let him worship on his own in his own way, I doubt that will bar him from heaven - and if it does, that's kind of ridiculous.

It's not that it would bar him from heaven, and I'm not trying to hold his hand, but the Bible encourages Christians to encourage and advise each other based on what scripture says; it's not out of our place (1 Corinthians 6 speaks about this).

It's not about how it would keep him from Heaven, that's not how Christian doctrine works. It's just, according to scripture, unwise (and disobedient to God) to cut yourself off from Christian fellowship because it causes you to struggle with sin on your own and the Devil to play to your desires, with no one there to help you, encourage you, talk some sense into you, etc.

I'll step aside, though, obviously, since he knows what he's doing.

I wasn't sure from the context of his post whether he was implying he wasn't going to hang out with Christians anymore or if he was just going to look for a different crowd--which is fine. He shouldn't be around a community of people that are damaging towards him, but I encourage him to find a community that he does enjoy, instead.

[Crunched]

You want to be a slave to someone else's will? It is. Christ is given free reign because billions have been indoctrinated into it in this time of human history. Before him it was Zeus, Osiris, etc. the immense never ending list of deities.

Religion is about marketing. Early Christians found an attractive message and a sustainable audience. I don't think Carl Sagan or Mr. Rogers are similar. A modern equivalent would be, I don't know, Apple maybe.

Our modern day concerns are different from those people who existed when these religions were starting out, except those concerns which exist as part of our nature (meaning of life, what happens after death I would say are the big two). Elements of religion have been adapted to work for those in power and it remains easy to ensnare people with supposed answers for unanswered mysteries.

I am kind if rambling at this point, trying to get stuff down quickly from my phone.

[Dude Abides]

It's not that it would bar him from heaven, and I'm not trying to hold his hand, but the Bible encourages Christians to encourage and advise each other based on what scripture says; it's not out of our place (1 Corinthians 6 speaks about this). It's not about how it would keep him from Heaven, that's not how Christian doctrine works. It's just, according to scripture, unwise (and disobedient to God) to cut yourself off from Christian fellowship because it causes you to struggle with sin on your own and the Devil to play to your desires, with no one there to help you, encourage you, talk some sense into you, etc. I'll step aside, though, obviously, since he knows what he's doing.

He already said his faith is based on the words of Jesus, not fanfic that somehow made its way into the text like Hebrews and Corinthians.

[bengraven]

I really do not understand how I would come off that way. I am one of the nicest people and I tend to get along with everybody. I did come in to see what reason caused the drop of organized religion and the points seemed counterintuitive to me so I asserted a couple of thoughts. What is wrong with that? I did not feel that it was proper to be upset with a congregation for following biblical teachings if you believe in the teachings of the Bible. How in the world would I ever be arrogant about something like this? I am a terrible sinner just like everybody else and deserving of Hell. How could I ever be arrogant about that position?

That would be fine and well, but you were determined to prove to him that his views on this were wrong and stated why several time. Passive-aggressive is still the same form of aggression.

[Game Analyst]

Obvious hidden reason for wanting people to keep going to church aside, doesn't this seem a bit... hand-holdy to you?

The book of Acts Models for us what the first century church looked like. How did it look? Well, believers would always gather together, study God's Word (the Old Testament), prayed together and ate together.

"All the believers devoted themselves to the apostles’ teaching, and to fellowship, and to sharing in meals (including the Lord’s Supper), and to prayer."

This is what all of the Apostles and believers did when they were not sharing with those that did not know Jesus.

[JGS]

Modern Christianity runs counter to the message at the core of the Bible. Past: Jesus rallied against authoritative temples and the abuses of power, also proclaimed the kingdom of God is within all men (and women).

Again, this is incorrect. Jesus rallied against particular groups & there is nothing to indicate that Jesus rallied against organization in general or against organization for the purpose of folowing his teachings in particular. It's quite the opposite. Organization is good. There would be an order of leadership and followers of Christ would listen to these ones appointed & qualified to get direction from him.

God's Kingdom is certainly within reach of everyone but not just by standing there like a bump on a log and disassociating oneself from the means of inheriting that kingdom.

You want to be a slave to someone else's will?

It's cute that you think you're not beholden to someone/something now.

[The Lamp]

He already said his faith is based on the words of Jesus, not fanfic like Hebrews and Corinthians that made its way into the text.

But Jesus affirms the scriptures.

And by the way:
http://www.blueletterbible.org/faq/d...rt.cfm?id=1215

[SoulPlaya]

Maybe you just need to find a church that shares your views? You live in Chicago, man, I'm SURE there are a few out there that do. I think you would enjoy to have people share your views on certain issues.

[jaxword]

How in the world would I ever be arrogant about something like this? I am a terrible sinner just like everybody else and deserving of Hell. How could I ever be arrogant about that position?

The man condemns everyone and doesn't see that as arrogant. Oh, because he includes himself, that absolves him of his judgment of everyone.

It's funny to see the religious fanatics saying the exact opposite things yet are carefully NOT disagreeing with each other.

What happened to... “Do not judge others, and you will not be judged.

[makingmusic476]

Following the teachings of Jesus? I did not say that at all. http://carm.org/bible-inspired

The additional books were not included in the Bible for several reasons: They were not referenced by Jesus. Jesus directly referenced the entire Jewish canon of Scripture by referring to Abel (the first martyr in the Old Testament) and Zacharias (the last martyr in the OT) (Matt. 23:35). He also never quotes directly from any of the apocryphal writings, but makes numerous references to the Old Testament books. They lacked apostolic or prophetic authorship. They did not claim to be the Word of God. They contain unbiblical concepts such as prayer for the dead (2 Macc. 12:45-46) or the condoning of magic (Tobit 6:5-7). They have serious historical inaccuracies (For more information, see "Errors in the Apocrypha") Errors in the Apocrypha

I think the justification for Biblical errors in your first link and the justification for the disculsion of the Apocrypha due to (in some cases) similar errors in your second link is somewhat humorous.

And what decides what's authentic or inspired? Whichever texts claim to be authentic/inspired? Whichever texts some old Church leader determined were inspired through his own supposed inspiration?

[Solstice]

People should just live by the number one rule:



"Be excellent to each other, and party on, dudes!"

[YoungHav]

lol I would hardly call Christianity organized with its 4000 off-shoots. Jesus needs to come back and unify all the sects.

[Emwitus]

New Testament: Jesus didn't talk about homosexuality. He wasn't a big fan of divorce at all. No mention of abortion in the New Testament.

I think this is a misleading statement but i digress. I also quit organized religion a few years ago, at the time, i thought it was the best decision i had made. What i did not see is how much of an effect not being around other religious people would have on me. I made a commitment to read the bible every day, said i would atleast commit to having some me time with God every week but i slowly fell out of it. Very soon i was barely touching a bible and barely praying. I think the biggest difference a church makes for a person is provide a constant flow of communication between you and God, whether it be through fellowship or through sunday morning surmons.


NOTE: I completely understand why you would leave organized religion but make sure you have some sort of support system in place....IT IS a slippery slope to be honest.

PS: I'm right now trying to get back into a church or have some form of fellowship every week. I need it.

[IISANDERII]

I have such a hard time understanding how religious people can be pro-choice when it comes to abortion.

"Because sometime after [1979] it was decided that the Bible teaches that human life begins at conception.

They all now believe that the Bible teaches that life begins at conception. They believe this absolutely, unambiguously, firmly, resolutely and loudly. That’s what they believed 10 years ago, and that’s what they believed 20 years ago. But it wasn’t what they believed 30 years ago. Thirty years ago they all believed quite the opposite.

We have always been at war with Eastasia. Everyone knows that."

http://www.patheos.com/blogs/slackti...he-happy-meal/

[ChiTownBuffalo]

The other thing that infuriates me is that people don't consider to socio-political climate Jesus rolled around in.

[Angry Fork]

It's cute that you think you're not beholden to someone/something now.

Not to a god, and not because of text that has no basis in fact or evidence. Whatever rules I'm forced to live by that I disagree with are within the real material world and I can use my efforts to change them.

[IceCold]

No the reason stated is that pigs are one of the dirtiest animals More reasons and better explanation here http://www.alislam.org/v/2535.html And when eating pig in islam is acceptable http://www2.alislam.org/askislam/mp3...9850814_07.mp3

Your church has lost a great, level-headed guy Chi. Not really. It's because pigs are more expensive animals to raise. A cow eats grass, it doesn't compete with us for food, but pigs are omnivores like us. Since Islam started in Arabia and that place is mostly desert, they couldn't afford it. So for economical reasons they banned it. The Torah bans camel meat, but the Qur'an doesn't. Guess why? Its okay, pork is kinda gross anyway. The only pig worth eating is bacon.

Don't listen to this person. Pork is delicious and one of the most versatile foods out there.

[Dunk#7]

The man condemns everyone and doesn't see that as arrogant. Oh, because he includes himself, that absolves him of his judgment of everyone. It's funny to see the religious fanatics saying the exact opposite things yet are carefully NOT disagreeing with each other.

Judgement is left up to God. I am not in any position to pass judgement.

I have beliefs as to what is right and wrong, but that does not mean that I am judging others based on those beliefs

[Dude Abides]

But Jesus affirms the scriptures.

He didn't say one word about stuff that was written after he was gone.

And by the way: http://www.blueletterbible.org/faq/d...rt.cfm?id=1215

By the way what? Christian apologists have come up with rationalizations to justify all this peripheral stuff post-facto? What is that supposed to show?

"The Apostles asserted their authority." Convincing!

[Solstice]

Don't listen to this person. Pork is delicious and one of the most versatile foods out there.

Homer: "Marge, are we Jewish?"
Marge: "No..."
Homer: "Woo-hoo!"

[Game Analyst]

The other thing that infuriates me is that people don't consider to socio-political climate Jesus rolled around in.

What do you mean?

He didn't say one word about stuff that was written after he was gone.

So, does this mean you obey what He taught while he was on Earth?

[Angry Fork]

The other thing that infuriates me is that people don't consider to socio-political climate Jesus rolled around in.

Why couldn't he tell the future? Seems like a much more useful power than turning water to wine. Unless God told him everything was on a need to know basis or something.

[Aristion]

tl;dr: I quit organized religion. Slow your roll Atheist-GAF, I'm still a Christian.

I fail to see how this decision in any way precludes your participation in organized religion. Besides, you can't be a Christian and fail to go to Church. It's literally a self-referentially incoherent statement. Jesus says in the Gospel of Matthew that the Church is where he is to be found. Paul (or whoever wrote 1 Timothy) states that the Church is the pillar and foundation of truth.

There are many churches in mainline denominations that would be sympathetic to your political views, so again I don't see how your political views entail an abandonment of religion as a whole. I just see this as an excuse to pursue spiritual autonomy.

[Napoleonthechimp]

Again, this is incorrect. Jesus rallied against particular groups & there is nothing to indicate that Jesus rallied against organization in general or against organization for the purpose of folowing his teachings in particular. It's quite the opposite. Organization is good. There would be an order of leadership and followers of Christ would listen to these ones appointed & qualified to get direction from him. God's Kingdom is certainly within reach of everyone but not just by standing there like a bump on a log and disassociating oneself from the means of inheriting that kingdom.It's cute that you think you're not beholden to someone/something now.

What about this one: Psalm 82:6: "I said, 'You are "gods"; you are all sons of the Most High.'"

Blasphemy straight from the mouth of Jesus Christ. His teachings have a lot in common with Buddhist thought, and the theory that he may (if he existed at all) travelled and learnt with Buddhist monks in his younger days before he reappeared as an adult is certainly an enticing one.

Incidentally, I'm interesting in freeing myself of the chains of cultural conditioning which is at the core of all Buddhist thinking (the one I appreciate is Zen as it eschews reliance on dogmatic thought... unlike nearly all religions and other schools of Buddhist thought).

[jaxword]

Judgement is left up to God. I am not in any position to pass judgement. I have beliefs as to what is right and wrong, but that does not mean that I am judging others based on those beliefs

You say everyone is hellbound, but claim that's not a judgment.

You're not fooling anyone with that doublespeak.

[The Lamp]

He didn't say one word about stuff that was written after he was gone. By the way what? Christian apologists have come up with rationalizations to justify all this peripheral stuff post-facto? What is that supposed to show? "The Apostles asserted their authority." Convincing!

I would say all of this justifies what the apostles wrote after Jesus ascended into Heaven.

But the Helper, the Holy Spirit, whom the Father will send in my name, he will teach you all things, and bring to your remembrance all that I said to you (John 14:26).

When the Helper comes, whom I will send to you from the Father, that is the Spirit of truth who proceeds from the Father, he will testify about me, and you will testify also, because you have been with me from the beginning (John 15:26–27).

But when he, the Spirit of truth, comes, he will guide you into all truth. He will not speak on his own; he will speak only what he hears, and he will tell you what is yet to come. He will bring glory to me by taking from what is mine and making it known to you (John 16:13,14).

Righteous Father, though the world does not know you, I know you, and they know that you have sent me. I have made you known to them, and will continue to make you known in order that the love you have for me may be in them and that I myself may be in them (John 17:25–26).

He said He would continue to make God known, even though He knew He was going die and later ascend to Heaven.

Go therefore and make disciples of all the nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father and the Son and the Holy Spirit, teaching them to observe all that I commanded you; and lo, I am with you always, even to the end of the age (Matthew 28:19–20).

Thus,

All Scripture is God-breathed and is useful for teaching, rebuking, correcting and training in righteousness (2 Timothy 3:16)

If that's not enough for you, and you haven't taken a class or studied up biblical doctrine, then yeah I can say nothing else to you. There's just too much to talk about when it comes to biblical doctrine as a whole for one thread.

[ChiTownBuffalo]

What about this one: Psalm 82:6: "I said, 'You are "gods"; you are all sons of the Most High.'" Blasphemy straight from the mouth of Jesus Christ. His teachings have a lot in common with Buddhist thought, and the theory that he may (if he existed at all) travelled and learnt with Buddhist monks in his younger days before he reappeared as an adult is certainly an enticing one.

What.

Psalms were about 1000 BCE.

[Game Analyst]

What about this one: Psalm 82:6: "I said, 'You are "gods"; you are all sons of the Most High.'"

Here is a commentary on that verse:

"Jesus replied, “It is written in your own Scriptures that God said to certain leaders of the people, ‘I say, you are gods!’ And you know that the Scriptures cannot be altered. So if those people who received God’s message were called ‘gods,’ why do you call it blasphemy when I say, ‘I am the Son of God’? After all, the Father set me apart and sent me into the world." John 10:34–36 Quoting Psalm 82:6, Jesus refers to the Old Testament, wherein judges were called gods because they held the power of life and death in their hands. “Doesn’t Scripture say you are gods?” asked Jesus. “Why, then, are you so upset when I say I am the Son of God?” He throws them a curve ball—and they have a tough time hitting it. a. Is it not written in your law, "I said, ‘You are gods’": The judges of Psalm 82 were called "gods" because in their office they determined the fate of other men. Also, in Exodus 21:6 and 22:8-9, God calls earthly judges "gods." b. If He called them gods, to whom the word of God came: Jesus is saying "If God gives these unjust judges the title ‘gods’ because of their office, why do you consider it blasphemy that I call Myself the ‘Son of God’ in light of the testimony of Me and My works?" i. Jesus is not taking the statement "you are gods" in Psalm 82 and applying it to all humanity, or to all believers. The use of gods in Psalm 82 was a metaphor - and Jesus is exposing both the ignorance and inconsistency of His accusers here.

[Dunk#7]

You think everyone is hellbound, but claim that's not a judgment. You're not fooling anyone with that doublespeak.

I guess I see what you are getting at

But the judgement on that is coming from God. I am not making that judgement on people. I have no idea who is and is not saved. That is up to them to sort out.

Just because I have a belief about what it takes to pass that judgement from God does not mean I am actively judging people.

[Solstice]

Here is a commentary on that verse:

I didn't know the bible came with a commentary track

I guess I see what you are getting at But the judgement on that is coming from God. I am not making that judgement on people. I have no idea who is and is not saved. That is up to them to sort out. Just because I have a belief about what it takes to pass that judgement from God does not mean I am actively judging people.

So you're just judging by proxy?

[The Lamp]

I didn't know the bible came with a commentary track

People who study the Bible, like pastors and scholars, often comment on scripture to let you know more about it. There are a lot of misconceptions sometimes simply because of language and cultural barriers.

[JGS]

Not to a god, and not because of text that has no basis in fact or evidence. Whatever rules I'm forced to live by that I disagree with are within the real material world and I can use my efforts to change them.

Which is tougher than simply leaving a religion you don't agree with. Sounds like your slavery is way worse.