[Captain Smoker]

Well by page 3 we already have a boatload of Nintendo fans whining about the thread. How much worse will it get by page 10? The thread is fine unless you're predisposed to freak out about anything negative about Nintendo. Just dont click on those threads.

Well, the problem is this: http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showpost...29&postcount=4

You can whine about raging Nintendo fans as you wish, but threads like this create 50% misinformation. I don't see any significant benefit comparing it to the comprehensive Q&A - thread.

[Black Republican]

Sony did it with the ps3. It went from complete shit to good in a couple years. You can do it too, just got to try....

pretty much

[KevinCow]

Context is important, which blog sites often obscure in their own spin. This is what he said: http://www.nintendo.co.jp/ir/en/libr...0606qa/02.html

It still doesn't make sense.

If they aren't internally good enough at online stuff to catch up with the competition, then go out and hire some people. There are people out there who do that for a living.

Get those people to match the functionality the other consoles have, and then tailor it to fit the family friendly Nintendo approach. There's no reason a decent online system and a family friendly environment have to be mutually exclusive.

I used to question whether their refusal to fully embrace online was a result of incompetence or a lack of understanding. It seems like it's a little bit of both.

[The Lamp]

Thank God. Online multiplayer, Co-op, Achievements, graphics, etc. Those things are all pointless filler that just detract from the core experience of playing a game. it's good that they aren't going in that direction because it's ruining gaming

I can understand achievements.....maybe graphics in some cases.....but online multiplayer and co-op are actually part of playing the game. So what exactly do you mean? If you're talking about shoehorned multiplayer modes in games that are typically single player, that's one thing. But how is online multiplayer or co-op ruining a game like Smash Bros., that only ever existed as a multiplayer game? In that case, it's just expanding its features to the logical next step.

[GitarooMan]

I think this quirky online implementation is going to be a long term issue and I would venture to guess it is one of the reasons ea/activision, etc. have not been jumping up and down in excitement and support. They and other companies are heavily invested in building loyalty and monetizing online play (call of duty elite, battlefield premium, gigabytes of dlc). If Nintendo can't provide an infrastructure to made these programs as easy to operate and distribute as on other platforms there will always be just be lukewarm support.

[ColtraineGF]

It seems he was saying that, since they were going in a different direction than the existing networks already available, it would not be correct to say that they are 'catching up', implying they were going to match the featureset of the other two exactly. So arguments about "basic functionality", I don't see yet, since I haven't even seen how Wii U does it.

If Iwata claims that they are going into a newer direction, then that's what people will have to look at when it comes, and not immediately discount it as not being a PSN/XBLA clone.

I'll wait and see about how they go about things with their Miiverse, along with whatever other functions they have, before I "pass judgment", so to speak.

[oatmeal]

Phewf!

I was hoping the Wii U would be a next gen console.

Thank fuck for proving me wrong, Iwata-san.

[Skiesofwonder]

this was obvious when they announced friend codes would be back. they simply don't have the kind of staffing or teams needed to put together the kind of robust online experience we've come to expect. that's been clear for years. this article is just confirmation of what we already knew. ...and yes, I think it's fucking horrible that they didn't either (a) expand their hiring to compensate for this clear gap or (b) farm that development out to some other company. being okay with failing to compete in the arena where gaming has moved to is not okay.

(A) they have done. (B) was rumored, but looks less likely now.

But the title is extremely misleading. Iwata is not saying their online service won't be a quality one, he is just saying that Nintendo couldn't build a better online by out microsoft'ing the Xbox Live with creating their own version. Instead, they are creating a unique and quirky Nintendo online service. Does that equal quality? the verdict is still out. But Nintendo introduced some very interesting concepts that have the potential to be great at their last Nintendo Direct.

[Mikey Jr.]

The next generation starts with the WiiU!!!.........or something.

[Mashing]

Here's a grand idea. Why not hire a consultant firm to design your online infrastructure if you do not have the expertise in house. If it means you have to spend money on new equipment, then so beat it. In my eyes he just admitted that they do not want to do this because they do not want the expenditure.

[Gospel]

I can understand achievements.....maybe graphics in some cases.....but online multiplayer and co-op are actually part of playing the game. So what exactly do you mean? If you're talking about shoehorned multiplayer modes in games that are typically single player, that's one thing. But how is online multiplayer or co-op ruining a game like Smash Bros., that only ever existed as a multiplayer game? In that case, it's just expanding its features to the logical next step.

those are ruining gaming because i shouldn't have to deal with other people when enjoying a game. they are just distractions. why can't we all just go back playing against AIs and the Cpu and like it.

[Vandiger]

So this MiiVerse is like a well-integrated Sony Home lite. Catchy title OP :P

[Baconsammy]

I can understand achievements.....maybe graphics in some cases.....but online multiplayer and co-op are actually part of playing the game. So what exactly do you mean? If you're talking about shoehorned multiplayer modes in games that are typically single player, that's one thing. But how is online multiplayer or co-op ruining a game like Smash Bros., that only ever existed as a multiplayer game? In that case, it's just expanding its features to the logical next step.

I assumed he was being sarcastic. If he wasn't....whooo.

those are ruining gaming because i shouldn't have to deal with other people when enjoying a game. they are just distractions. why can't we all just go back playing against AIs and the Cpu and like it.

Oh shit he was serious. Damn you, graphics! Damn you for ruining my games.

[Dreams-Visions]

They're the "Diablo 3" kinda friend codes, not the "key 16 digits on each side" kinda friend codes.

Oh i see (I think). So they'll be universal, rather than different game to game?

You know, for all the shit (and IT IS A LOT OF SHIT) that Nintendo gets for anything related to the Internet, building something like Xbox Live... is not easy. At all.

you're goddamn right it's not easy. BUT...they've had damn near 8 years to observe Xbox Live and how it matured. To study it and think about and make plans to hire the kind of staff they need to make a competent online service. They've had several years to watch Sony go from basically nothing with the PS2 to a competent online service with PSN.

Having made it to 2012 while only being able to offer up excuses as to why they've shown so little improvement over all these years and no clear path for improvement...it's shame-worthy. They should--at minimum--been able to develop a system that looks like the original Xbox Live. Parties, universal mics, universal name. Still behind current developments, but generally better than friend codes.

maybe it's more improved than i realize, but things don't sound a metric ton better than the Wii's online service...and it really needs to be a metric ton better than that.

(A) they have done. (B) was rumored, but looks less likely now. But the title is extremely misleading. Iwata is not saying their online service won't be a quality one, he is just saying that Nintendo couldn't build a better online by out microsoft'ing the Xbox Live with creating their own version. Instead, they are creating a unique and quirky Nintendo online service. Does that equal quality? the verdict is still out. But Nintendo introduced some very interesting concepts that have the potential to be great at their last Nintendo Direct.

I see. Well yes it doesn't need to be as good. It just needs to get the basics. As long as it has basic universal chat with mics, some party mechanic and universal names...it'll be sufficient.

[schuelma]

I really think you have to read the entire thing and not take every translated word literally to get a possible sense of where they are going.

Nintendo hurt itself by not talking online at all, allowing peoples worst fantasies to take root in threads like these.


Hell, Gearbox said like last month they were satisfied with the online for Aliens or something like that.

Bad article headlines/interpretation, made worse by Nintendo's baffling E3 strategy.

[rpmurphy]

It still doesn't make sense. If they aren't internally good enough at online stuff to catch up with the competition, then go out and hire some people. There are people out there who do that for a living. Get those people to match the functionality the other consoles have, and then tailor it to fit the family friendly Nintendo approach. There's no reason a decent online system and a family friendly environment have to be mutually exclusive. I used to question whether their refusal to fully embrace online was a result of incompetence or a lack of understanding. It seems like it's a little bit of both.

If you connect the first paragraph to the second one, it sounds like Nintendo doesn't want to directly copy XBL and PSN because they are more conscious about creating a safe community for all ages so that it will not ruin their image of being a family-friendly platform.

[Lyphen]

I wonder if there's something dysfunctional with Japan's software and networking engineering programs that consistently places them behind. The low adoption of PCs probably doesn't help any.

[MYE]

Sure you can but realize that I am not the source of said title.

Oh, i know. I clicked on the link (unfortunatly)

[ClovingWestbrook]

Here's a grand idea. Why not hire a consultant to design your online infrastructure if you do not have the expertise in house. Wow, what a novel concept.

Yep. I wonder how long ago they began working on the network. We saw bits and pieces of it with the DSi but surely they knew where we were going as an industry and the world in general. How important online would play in entertainment and gaming in particular. I'm shocked that they didn't begin building it prior to the release of the Wii.

[upJTboogie]

Thank God. Online multiplayer, Co-op, Achievements, graphics, etc. Those things are all pointless filler that just detract from the core experience of playing a game. it's good that they aren't going in that direction because it's ruining gaming

;)

[The Lamp]

If you connect the first paragraph to the second one, it sounds like Nintendo doesn't want to directly copy XBL and PSN because they are more conscious about creating a safe community for all ages so that it will not ruin their image of being a family-friendly platform.

I for one don't see why they value that image so much since families have absolutely no problem buying Xboxes and PS3s nowadays.

[fernoca]

Guess we just got ClovingSteam'd. :p

But yeah, suspicious title aside, it is expected. Trying to play catch up for the sake of it would be dumb. Heck, many like Steam and Steam is a platform that is not trying to be like Xbox Live. At the same time, the problems with PSN is that they've been trying to play catch-up to Xbox Live and not succeeding. Cross game chat never materialized, the in-game XMB was added as an after thought and it shows, Home is a completely separate experience of the rest of the platform..is like everything is segmented instead of been cohesive.

The Wii U already seems to include nice features like more integration with "social aspects" and unless I read wrong it even includes one feature that many has been asking: the option to suspend games. You can also take pictures and clips of games and the basic stuff about voice/video/text chat is there. So it would be a matter of how they make it their own, instead of just trying to copy or play catch-up what others do.

[Always-honest]

Well, you've got to start somewhere..

[rpmurphy]

I for one don't see why they value that image so much since families have absolutely no problem buying Xboxes and PS3s nowadays.

Their platform userbase also range down to a much younger age than the Xbox and PS platforms and also have a much higher percentage of female users. They don't exactly have the same set of demographics.

[Penguin]

I for one don't see why they value that image so much since families have absolutely no problem buying Xboxes and PS3s nowadays.

The same reason that Disney is still Disney even though some parents have no problem taking their kids to see more "mature" content.

It defines them as a company for the most part. A safe-haven for any and everyone who wants to enjoy games.

[tuffy]

One can argue that Nintendo should have started working on a comprehensive online network much sooner. But a lot of people have the impression that "not trying to catch up" is synonymous with "not trying to build an online network" - which isn't what Iwata is trying to say.

[OldJadedGamer]

this was obvious when they announced friend codes would be back. they simply don't have the kind of staffing or teams needed to put together the kind of robust online experience we've come to expect. that's been clear for years. this article is just confirmation of what we already knew. ...and yes, I think it's fucking horrible that they didn't either (a) expand their hiring to compensate for this clear gap or (b) farm that development out to some other company. being okay with failing to compete in the arena where gaming has moved to is not okay.

Not investing the boatload of money they made from the DS or Wii into a network for their new systems is inexcusable.

[BlueTsunami]

Phewf! I was hoping the Wii U would be a next gen console. Thank fuck for proving me wrong, Iwata-san.

[daebo]

I don't understand why they just don't team up with Valve and incorporate Steam into it for online gaming..

And is it too much to ask for cross game chat?

[TunaLover]

In the Iwata Q&A it reads more like they don't want to rush online structure just because the competence being advanced (that being a not smart strategy), but I guess it can get better latter in Wii U life.

[OldJadedGamer]

[img]http://i.imgur.com/aEvgA.jpg[img]

Oh man, it just isn't the same with new systems coming out without Wollan.

[Quixzlizx]

Seems like someone paraphrased Iwata in a really slanted way.

That's racist.

It's true that the Wii-U can't launch at parity with XBL or PSN, but the Wii and PS3 both launched at the same time with virtually the same functionality, and look what happened there. I hope they are at least attempting to catch up this time.

[Dunlop]

Not investing the boatload of money they made from the DS or Wii into a network for their new systems is inexcusable.

this

Sony and Microsoft took a bloodbath in costs to setup their infrastructure. Nintendo easily could have invested in this with some of the profits from the Wii/DS to have something competative by now (not better).

As I mentioned to nauseum, they have lived off their IP's for 2 decades and will continue to do so and be thanked for it

[The Dutch Slayer]

:(

I would pay $50 a year for a Nintendo Live equal but sadly it will never come than :(.

[Baconbitz]

This is....fantastic!

This is the "sit".

[walking fiend]

In the Iwata Q&A it reads more like they don't want to rush online structure just because the competence being advanced (that being a not smart strategy), but I guess it can get better latter in Wii U life.

According to CVG, they will never catch up, NEVER; Wii U will be offline only.

[Live Free or Die]

wow, what a defeatist attitude.

[RagnarokX]

The interview is threadworthy, but the title makes it sound like Nintendo isn't going to try. Iwata says they can't quickly catch up or overcome and they want to avoid direct comparisons to networks that have been established for years.

[Mikey Jr.]

those are ruining gaming because i shouldn't have to deal with other people when enjoying a game. they are just distractions. why can't we all just go back playing against AIs and the Cpu and like it.

So dont play with other people? I have no idea what you are talking about.

[Rhindle]

I don't have a problem with them not wanting to play catch-up, or wanting to take a different approach.

But at this point they need to at least have a coherent plan for rolling out whatever their different approach is. They need to be getting developers on board, they need to be getting people excited about about it and givingthem a reason to buy the console they're launching in a couple of months.

They've obviously known this for a very long time. And yet all we have so far is an awkwardly implemented bulletin board system.

[Cerebral Assassin]

As I mentioned to nauseum, they have lived off their IP's for 2 decades and will continue to do so and be thanked for it

You can mention as often as you see fit, doesn't make it true(the majority of their success with Wii & DS is based on new IP, Wii____, _____ Training, Nintendogs etc.)

They've obviously known this for a very long time. And yet all we have so far is an awkwardly implemented bulletin board system.

You missed videochat, the ability to see what games are currently being played in your region/language, the ability to tie messages to particular parts of levels, the ability to take screenshots & send them to your friends, plenty has been shown that isn't currently available on competing services.

[Skiesofwonder]

this Sony and Microsoft took a bloodbath in costs to setup their infrastructure. Nintendo easily could have invested in this with some of the profits from the Wii/DS to have something competative by now (not better). As I mentioned to nauseum, they have lived off their IP's for 2 decades and will continue to do so and be thanked for it

Ummm.... Nintendo has been hiring a ton of people for online and they are taking some big risks already with what little we have seen from their Miiverse. Nintendo is taking online seriously this time, just not like core gamers expect/want (another Xbox Live). BTW, we already know the WiiU will have custom accounts, forums, video chat, photo sharing, dark soul-online integration possibilities, some form of achievements, and the whole Miiverse thing.

[Wyndstryker]

It's posts like this that further lead to the confusion on Nintendo's strategy when reading the actual original source clears things up. Leads to good comedy reads though

[LiK]

FRIEND CODES 4 LYFE

[SykoTech]

Looks like all that talk about capturing the hardcore gamers was just a bunch of hot air.

At this point, I just hope that their online service offers demos.

[Why would you do that?]

It's good that he's honest, but personally, it's not something I care about, since I don't like online gameplay. That said, I do hope that they do have a good system in place that's better than the Wii's, even if it's only 3DS level, where you can see what games your friends are playing and join them.

... its the headline of the original source...

This is the third time in three days that someone complained about the thread title, even though it was the title of the article. People should check the titles of the articles before throwing around accusations to the OP. :p

I say that in case I make a news thread. lol.

[Petrichor]

the bieber miley thing is from the original cover but it strangely works.

[gamergirly]

wow, what a defeatist attitude.

Even Nintendo can admit that Xbox Live is the king of console online gaming ATM. It's one of the things I love about the company. It doesnt mean that they will never come up with their OWN strong online infrastructure. It's just going to take some time. At this point, probably longer than Wii U lol

[Skiesofwonder]

Looks like all that talk about capturing the hardcore gamers was just a bunch of hot air. At this point, I just hope that their online service offers demos.

It will.

[FireCloud]

Well, you've got to start somewhere..

I agree. Nintendo SHOULD have the best online experience. They have the advantage of seeing what works and doesn't work well with Microsoft and Sony's online and can choose to make sure that their service is better. However, I believe what Iwata is saying is such things don't just come into existence over night. It will be interesting in a couple of years to look back at online gaming during the current generation to see if it still holds up or not.