[Haly]

People who say don't go to Rome are stupid. Do not listen to them. There's seriously nothing in Pisa aside from the tower. I just stopped there from Florence to go see it then jumped on a train to Cinque Terre.

Well I don't think anyone should avoid Rome entirely but I think Florence is a nicer place to stay overall.

Agreed on Pisa though, boring ass place with nothing but the tower and you can't even enter it.

[criesofthepast]

Visit the south of Italy if you can. It puts the north to shame. Go visit my family in Cosenza, I'll let them know your coming. :)

[Goldrusher]

Don't skip Flanders!

[Seanbob11]

I would suggest you fly to Glasgow or Edinburgh rather than London, then once you're finished here in Scotland get the train down to London.

Scotland, especially the west coast is very wet but has beautiful scenery. I suggest you visit both Glasgow and Edinburgh. They're only about 40 miles apart anyway. Edinburgh castle is quite touristy but it's amazing seeing a castle in the middle of a city. Going into any pub in Edinburgh you'll meet people and easily become friends, we're a friendly bunch, especially if we're in our favourite place - a pub. You should really visit the highlands somewhere because even I can't get over the views from the north.

[bengraven]

Go the UK and wave at CCTV cameras.

[Zeer0id]

Well, I'm excited! Many, many photos please. :D

All the best on your travels.

[soco]

I found london to be pretty boring overall. The good part was the people.


Stockholm is one of the most beautiful cities in Europe, and it's one of the few I'd return to.


Austria is beautiful too. Salzburg is fantastic. Vienna is fun to get lost in.

[tirant]

Go like this London Paris Nice Madrid Ibiza Venice Athene Germany Amsterdam Dublin And back to london for austin texas.

Avoid Madrid and go to Barcelona.

[Tence]

Not understanding the hate for Rome. I went there (17 years ago :P) and it was absolutely awesome. Nicest 'big city' I've been to in Europe.

I cannot judge Venice, haven't been there... but my brother and some friends who went there say it is the most overrated stinking piece of shit there is. Can't confirm that though.

[Dennis]

Congrats on all that GAF money letting you travel the world.

And don't worry about EatChildren staging a coup while you are gone. I am sure he wouldn't do that.

[wolfmat]

Avoid Madrid and go to Barcelona.

Bring a skateboard so that you blend in

[Des0lar]

Hey Evil, hit me up if you should ever come to Austria. I will try my best to show you some awesome places!

Also we have awesome Nazi Flak Towers!






And other fun stuff:



And of course beautiful landscapes :D

[BruiserBear]

I will certainly be living vicariously through Evil's travels. I'm too scared of flying to visit Europe anytime soon. :/

[Goldrusher]

I will certainly be living vicariously through Evil's travels. I'm too scared of flying to visit Europe anytime soon. :/

Take a transatlantic cruise ship?
Takes 6 days.

edit:

Though thinking about it, you might have to take a plane back...
Most transatlantic cruises are one-way, as the ships are moved from being used in the Caribbean (Winter) to the Mediterranean (Summer).

[Firestorm]

Not understanding the hate for Rome. I went there (17 years ago :P) and it was absolutely awesome. Nicest 'big city' I've been to in Europe. I cannot judge Venice, haven't been there... but my brother and some friends who went there say it is the most overrated stinking piece of shit there is. Can't confirm that though.

When in Venice, buy a Rolling Venice card as soon as you exit Santa Lucia train station. It's 4 EUR. With it buy a 72 hour discounted transit pass for 18 EUR. You shouldn't be in Venice longer than that. Take at least one day visiting the surrounding islands of Murano, Burano, and if you have time, Torcello and Lido. Much nicer than central Venice imo with their own flair. Central Venice also nice to wander a bit if you can stand the tourists. Much nicer when it gets dark and a little quieter.

[el retorno]

Go the UK and wave at CCTV cameras.

That's really creepy walking around and seeing all those signs. I know I'm being watched in every city but dont tell me about it!

Avoid Madrid and go to Barcelona.

Don't listen to this man Madrid > Barcelona. Though Madrid isn't really as English friendly like other cities in Europe. I'll be there at the end of June early July.

[bengraven]

That's really creepy walking around and seeing all those signs. I know I'm being watched in every city but dont tell me about it!

Just wave!

[Llyranor]

As others have said, Bruges is great. Really great sights. Ghent is very quite close/similar, but much less touristic, though. Near Bruges, there's the Diksmuide preserved 'Trench of Death' from WW1, which was pretty neat. Wasn't a huge fan of Brussels/Antwerp, though.

Are you a WW2 enthusiast? In Holland, we went a trip following Hell's Highway from Neerpelt --> Eindhoven --> Nijmegen --> Arnhem. Loved it, but more for the historical richness than in a touristy sightseeing way. I found people in Netherlands nicer than in Belgium, better drivers too!

Haven't explored that much of France. Some of Paris (I missed out on the Catacombs, definitely need to go see that next time!). Normandy (again, this is more if you want to visit the WW2 beaches - Pointe du Hoc should be amazing to see, though we didn't venture that far west. The Arromanches leftover Mulberry harbours, though - wow! Feels like you're visiting some ancient ruins. Again, this is if you have a particular interest in that area of history. Otherwise, there are so many other things to do elsewhere.

Brittany is nice. St-Malo is a nice fortress city, I guess. Between Normandy and Brittany, Mont-St-Michel is amazing. You should definitely at least dedicate a daytrip to go there.

London is awesome for museums. British Museum is best museum ever. Ever. They must have plundered from every civilization, haha.

If you like tanks, drop by the Bovington tank museum in the UK. It has so many bloody tanks! It has the only remaining functional Tiger tank in existence.

Also we have awesome Nazi Flak Towers!

Nice! I definitely need to check that out on my planned trip to Germany/Austria this December.

[Vigilant Walrus]

Rome is overrated, Venice is awesome though. The view from Montmartre is uncontested. The best food in London is either Spanish, French or Indian.

1) rome is not overrated. what the hell is wrong with you? It's the most amazing city I have ever been too. Outragous amounts of history, cheap good food, lots of possibilities - drive an hour north and you can ski, an hour south and its at the beaches.
Never been to venice.


2) Montmartre is nice but lets not get ahead of ourselves. jesus. do you just throw out random statements sir??

[wolfmat]

Don't go to Verdun.

[Llyranor]

Don't go to Verdun.

Why not? Aren't there still trenches and craters from the battle? I'd have wanted to visit it one day.

[Hasardeur]

Nice! I definitely need to check that out on my planned trip to Germany/Austria this December.

there's also a climbing wall on one of the the towers near the city center (you can see it on the other picture)

[wolfmat]

Why not? Aren't there still trenches and craters from the battle? I'd have wanted to visit it one day.

They're still there, yes. It might be the most depressing place I've ever visited. I was down for 2 weeks. Concentration camps are also super-depressing, but Verdun is something you can skip without losing much; I would've preferred never having been there because it just tells a dark tale of 10 months of death for nothing without a real lesson, but the CCs certainly make you a better person if you've seen them in my opinion. Not so much for Verdun. That's just on the level of torture porn. 698,000 battlefield deaths.

[el retorno]

They're still there, yes. It might be the most depressing place I've ever visited. I was down for 2 weeks. Concentration camps are also super-depressing, but Verdun is something you can skip without losing much; I would've preferred never having been there because it just tells a dark tale of 10 months of death for nothing without a real lesson, but the CCs certainly make you a better person if you've seen them in my opinion. Not so much for Verdun. That's just on the level of torture porn. 698,000 battlefield deaths.

What are the "better" CC (still feels messed up to use that word)? I've heard Auschwitz is pretty touristy which turns me off.

[Digishine]

Don't skip Flanders!

Try to use real time pics and not those tourist pics.

[Stinkles]

Crete. Its like Greece but quiet and somehow more ancient and African. Repetitive but amazing food

[wolfmat]

What are the "better" CC (still feels messed up to use that word)? I've heard Auschwitz is pretty touristy which turns me off.

Auschwitz was an extermination camp. Extermination camps are another thing entirely.

What impressed me most was the Krematorium Buchenwald. The camp itself was mostly demolished though.
Sachsenhausen has a good museum, and the administrative buildings are still intact.
Dachau is probably the easiest to visit, seeing as it's near Munich. And everything is intact afaik.

[Stinkles]

also, Rome is fucking amazing - ignore the haters, assume rude waiters and walk everywhere. Naples on the other hand is a shithole. Neapolitan gaf? Your city is a shithole and its all the fault of the local's. Jesus wept. Such an amazing place, potentially.

[Llyranor]

Is it actually a good time to visit Greece? How big a deal is the economical/political instability re: tourism?

They're still there, yes. It might be the most depressing place I've ever visited. I was down for 2 weeks. Concentration camps are also super-depressing, but Verdun is something you can skip without losing much; I would've preferred never having been there because it just tells a dark tale of 10 months of death for nothing without a real lesson, but the CCs certainly make you a better person if you've seen them in my opinion. Not so much for Verdun. That's just on the level of torture porn. 698,000 battlefield deaths.

Hmm, I don't view it that way (though, I haven't been there). For me, such places could help me gain perspective (on my own life), and better understanding of what went on there, what conditions the men there must have endured, etc. I do believe there is a lesson there, if only for the events to be remembered so that it never repeats again (who am I kidding? history always does), particularly now that WW1 survivors are so few. In 20-40 yrs time, who will remember? I don't think history deserves only to be kept in books that the younger generations will just skim through.

[H.Protagonist]

also, Rome is fucking amazing - ignore the haters, assume rude waiters and walk everywhere. Naples on the other hand is a shithole. Neapolitan gaf? Your city is a shithole and its all the fault of the local's. Jesus wept. Such an amazing place, potentially.

I lived there for four years as a kid, and I'm sad to say that you are not wrong. A scary place in many ways. :( But, given our navy's habit of destroying places (I am so sorry, Dunoon) I doubt it's just the locals.

[arnoldocastillo2003]

Hey Evil don't forget that on 6th on July the parties of "San Fermin" starts and are a total week of parties everyday on Pamplona, that is near the Basque Country on Spain, please Evil you need to visit at least Bilbao and the San Fermin Party on Pamplona.

http://es.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sanfermines

[Goldrusher]

Try to use real time pics and not those tourist pics.

What are those?

[Alx]

Is it actually a good time to visit Greece? How big a deal is the economical/political instability re: tourism?

I was there less than 1 year ago, and I thought it wasn't very pleasant for tourists... strike that, it was terrible : national trains canceled, replaced by bus, but with almost no information but a crumbled paper pinned on a wall (even the departure boards didn't work), information booth that were randomly closed or opened (don't respect the time table either), and not very helpful (I had to go through 3 people to find someone aware that there were no international trains... since 6 months !), metro closed because of demonstrations,...

Maybe it you travel by car or just want to stay on a sunny beach, you'll be fine. But from my experience I wouldn't recommend it.

[wolfmat]

Hmm, I don't view it that way (though, I haven't been there). For me, such places could help me gain perspective (on my own life), and better understanding of what went on there, what conditions the men there must have endured, etc. I do believe there is a lesson there, if only for the events to be remembered so that it never repeats again (who am I kidding? history always does), particularly now that WW1 survivors are so few. In 20-40 yrs time, who will remember? I don't think history deserves only to be kept in books that the younger generations will just skim through.

Well, my thoughts on that:
(0) I don't know if it will help you gain perspective on your own life, I can't really comment on that, but it didn't help me at all, it just made me depressed and angry. We visited Verdun together with French exchange students, and it was a horrible experience for everyone. We were 60 kids who couldn't speak for 3 hours because we were so completely baffled. I don't know.
(1) You just can't imagine. It doesn't help going there. It's impossible to imagine what went down there, even if you're standing right in front of the craters. Think about how those came about. "Oh, so here's where something exploded" is what you're thinking? Well, you're wrong. "Here's where something exploded and threw bodies around, and then something else exploded and threw bodies around 3 hours later, and so on for 10 months" is more like it. Go there and you'll see that it's hard to grasp at all why it looks like that.
(2) Of course there is a lesson there, but it's a lesson that isn't learned! Which is crazy! It's one of the worst modern battles ever, and they kept on fighting such battles regardless. See Stalingrad, specific Vietnam, Kosovo, Iraq battles. Humans apparently only need 25-30 years (one generation) to detach themselves from the most atrocious happenings imaginable. That just fucks me up and makes me cynical to a degree that isn't helping matters.

[donkey show]

Remember Evilore, if you ever swing by the Manchester/Sheffield area, you got a place to stay. :)

When you go down to Germany, definitely swing by Trier. Has the Porta Nigra (Black Gate) and the Karl Marx house. Should be some great wine fests in the area as well.

[Hasardeur]

Is it actually a good time to visit Greece? How big a deal is the economical/political instability re: tourism?

I think you'll be fine if you avoid Athene and other larger cities (note: the Acropolis really isn't that great anyway)

the best part of Greece are the islands (Rhodes, Crete), I doubt that the situation for tourists has changed much there

[wolfmat]

When you go down to Germany, definitely swing by Trier. Has the Porta Nigra (Black Gate) and the Karl Marx house. Should be some great wine fests in the area as well.

And the landscape is amazing, and the people are so nice in the area. Also, more wine.

[donkey show]

And the landscape is amazing, and the people are so nice in the area. Also, more wine.

Yup. The drive up from the A62/A1 to Trier from Kaiserslautern was always amazing. Plus, you're not that far from Luxembourg/France/Belgium!

[phisheep]

Really, though, I'd like to see the normal Euro sights, sure, but that's toward the bottom of my priorities. I want to immerse myself culturally, meet and befriend locals and travelers and hear their stories, go to interesting places and difficult places, shoot a ton of photography, drink many many kinds of beer, meet some NeoGAF members along the way, and most of all let go. Then chronicle it on NeoGAF, in words and photos. Extensively, for your entertainment and my satisfaction. ... Over in LA, Seth C strongly recommended that I stay in hostels rather than hotels, regardless of the financials, just because you get to meet many more people that way. So I'll be going that route. ... What's missing, currently, is what to actually do.

This sounds awesome Evil, I've travelled around Europe quite a bit - but I wish I could see it as an outsider.

Maybe reconsider hostels though (or at least just doing hostels). You'll meet a lot of fellow-travellers there but you won't get close to assimilating the local culture. At least some of the time (for me it would be most of it) stay at local guest-houses in small towns, you'll meet more people through the owners, as they always seem to have local tradesmen and so on popping in and out. If you're brave enough (I'm not, but my father was dead good at this) just turn up at some place in the middle of nowhere and ask around until you find someone to put you up for the night. You meet all sorts of interesting people, word gets around and the following morning everyone in town wants to talk to the stranger who just turned up.

Of course, bars/pubs/inns are a good place to meet the locals as well, though you do need to get the conversation going - in a bar in Cyprus I once memorably met a Lebanese terrorist freedom fighter, and we had a good long chat about our relative hours of work (his were worse), holiday allowances (his were way better) before he left and I made friends with the owner and dined on the fish-heads left over from his customers' meals.

How's your languages? Pretty well anywhere north and east of France you'll be fine with English, but France, Spain and Italy can be a bit troublesome at times.

Anyhow. You've got a whole load of time to spend and there's no need to make detailed itineraries and stuff like that. Plenty of chill time too.

Might be worth adding a few ferries into the journey too. Otherwise your UK time might be too London-ish. Like the idea of coming into Scotland first, as otherwise you'll probably never get there, and it is worth seeing. Edinburgh and a bit of Highlands probably to start with, then possibly work your way southwest for the Plymouth-St Malo ferry which (a) avoids London altogether for now and (b) takes you to or past York/Durham/Oxford/Bristol.

At the end you can always get back to London via Malmo or Calais or something.

That aside, I'd try to avoid too much generic stuff. For example, the Kensington Museums in London are indeed awesome, but probably not a whole load different from say the Smithsonian. And completely crammed full of tourists.

I tend to go for the slightly lesser-known stuff, like Pitt Rivers in Oxford, John Soanes in London, Musee Rodin and the Catacombs in Paris and so on. I'll make an exception for te Louvre and the Rijksmuseum though.

It's tough to get anywhere close to locals in the biggest cities, so I tend to go for slightly smaller ones. Hamburg (and if you are up that way take in Luebeck) and Munich in Germany, Barcelona in Spain, Florence/Bologna in Italy, one or two of Bristol/Liverpool/York/Cardiff in the UK, Utrecht and Delft in Netherlands (though I DO like Amsterdam, you meet all kinds of interesting people there if you get up really early in the morning). Haven't been to Berlin since the Cold War ended so I am probably a bit out of date there.

And whatever you do, do not go to Madrid when it is raining. The entire city snarls up because Madridians do not know where their windscreen-wiper switch is. Death trap.

Another thing I sometimes try, and works most of the time, is to go to places that used to be important but aren't any more. Well-preserved faded glamour beats rubbernecking tourists, especially if you get to talk to older residents. Loches in France, Luebeck(again), Valetta (in Malta) - or pretty well anywhere with some serious history and folk memories (with the dishonourable exception of Merthyr Tydfil, the ancient capital of Wales, which is no longer even a grotesque caricature of whatever-it-once-was).

You'll probably go through France least twice. Make one of them down the West coast and take in the Dordogne valley. Climb up Rocamadour:



You probably need to take in one serious palace, which probably ought to be Versailles (or St Petersburg) - and after that you never need to see another one.

On the whole tour you probably only got one big choice, which is how far north and how far south to go - the rest of it you can make up as you go along. East/West ain't too bad, not for someone accustomed to continental USA. But the difficult journeys would be something like Greece-Rhodes-Cyprus-Egypt and back, and at the other end something like Estonia/Finland/North Sweden/Norway/Sweden/Denmark. In both cases seas (whether going across or around them) and ferry timetables come into operation, plus there's a whole load of interesting stuff at the other end that you might want to hang around for.

Good luck. Enjoy. Ignore everything I said probably. Come and stay over if you are down my way and we can either (a) visit Wells and recreate the scenes from Hot Fuzz on location or (b) visit Wales and I can show you around the bottom half or (c) if you want to meet locals you can mind the shop and me and Mrs P can have a day off.

[Dynamite Ringo Matsuri]

Man... I've always wanted to go backpacking through EU so I'll be looking forward to reading about your travels. You should try to visit the "Giants' Causeway" in Ireland. It was the setting for the cover of Houses of the Holy.

[SteveWinwood]

I'm pretty biased (lived there for a couple years) but depending on how far east you're going definitely stop by Budapest. I also lived in Kiev for a couple years. I don't necessarily recommend visiting there lol.

Also Norway is amazing. Nicest people ever.

[985boi]

Eastern Europe hellhole? I wanna hear more about it.

[Woorloog]

Crete. Its like Greece but quiet and somehow more ancient and African. Repetitive but amazing food

Interesting description.

Can confirm food being good though.

[Mordeccai]

Just wanted to thank everybody for contributing in this thread, I've greatly enjoyed reading up on all of these places.

It all just really makes me want to pick up and leave the States and just roam around Europe.

[Foreign Jackass]

Auschwitz was an extermination camp. Extermination camps are another thing entirely. What impressed me most was the Krematorium Buchenwald. The camp itself was mostly demolished though. Sachsenhausen has a good museum, and the administrative buildings are still intact. Dachau is probably the easiest to visit, seeing as it's near Munich. And everything is intact afaik.

Auschwitz is a concentration camp. Birkenau is the extermination part. So you can basically see the two things at the same time, and then kill yourself.

I did go there and didn't kill myself, but it was a pretty sad experience. Especially Birkenau.

[Seth C]

I lived there for four years as a kid, and I'm sad to say that you are not wrong. A scary place in many ways. :( But, given our navy's habit of destroying places (I am so sorry, Dunoon) I doubt it's just the locals.

It's mostly the locals (or perhaps immigrants helping). That and the perinially striking trash collectors. Ugh. It's dirty and unpleasant. Only worth going to get to Pompeii, Herculaneum, and anacapri.

Also, while you won't necessarily meet true locals when you tau in hostels, often they are from a city nearby, another country neighboring, or something similar. Either way they are like minded and can give you a temporary partner to go out and meet true locals. Guest houses are good, but you're less likely meet people to join in adventures with.

[filler]

madre de dios...

[Musha_Soturi]

If you're in London on 7th July you should definitely come to the meet-up, where I can pretty much guarantee you'll be worshipped like a god. But whenever you do end up coming you should have a beer with me. I can also offer a spare room in London.

[wolfmat]

Auschwitz is a concentration camp. Birkenau is the extermination part.

I didn't know this.

[Technosteve]

can i come on this europe trip, my english is pretty good.