[maomaoIYP]

Wouldn't a long term relationship pretty much be marriage in everything but name? I think the whole purpose in the state recognizing it is to promote it.

Yes it would. But I don't need a state to recognize whether I'm being responsible for my partner and children. If I'm responsible, I do it because I care about my family, not because the state recognizes it.

[Raelson]

I don't think I'll ever get married. My parents aren't married and have been together for 30 years.

[el retorno]

Yes it would. But I don't need a state to recognize whether I'm being responsible for my partner and children. If I'm responsible, I do it because I care about my family, not because the state recognizes it.

That works for you but there are others who'd like the state to recognize the fact that they have joined into a union. I don't think it hurts you that they do.

[captainraincoat]

Been with my partner for almost 10 years and have 2 kids...the only incentive for my mrs is that she would have the same last name.

Would make no difference in our relationship if we were married or not...and wed be 20k better off

[maomaoIYP]

That works for you but there are others who'd like the state to recognize the fact that they have joined into a union. I don't think it hurts you that they do.

Oh sure, I don't mean prohibit marriage. Those who want to, of course should. But there should be no social stigma attached with those who have a family that aren't married. Because in this day and age it's just a formality....a really expensive one.

Been with my partner for almost 10 years and have 2 kids...the only incentive for my mrs is that she would have the same last name. Would make no difference in our relationship if we were married or not...and wed be 20k better off

This is pretty much what I mean.

[el retorno]

Oh sure, I don't mean prohibit marriage. Those who want to, of course should. But there should be no social stigma attached with those who have a family that aren't married. Because in this day and age it's just a formality....a really expensive one.

Marriage licences are not a ""really expensive formality"

Ceremonies are optional.

[CrudeDiatribe]

it has benefits on legal things and taxes. Especially re: kids.

In the United States (and perhaps other countries) but not all.

In Canada, the only tax advantage I've seen is the ability to share credits around; one credit we each used to be eligible for is based on household income, so that's gone. Legally there is little to no difference between married and common-law spouse in terms of estates, company benefits, etc (depends on province, though).

One thing I do think would improve the marriage system is borrowing from Quebec, and give un-married couples/parents all these rights automatically without having to get married.

In most provinces in Canada, common law unions are very similar if not identical to marriage. The real differences come out when a couple splits up. In Québec, for instance, there is no spousal support from the wealthier ex- to the poorer, as in a divorce.

If you live in Canada and are in or are heading towards (one year living together!), you would do well to learn the differences where you live.

(in fifth year of one in Nova Scotia here)

Who wants to live life lonely? Living like a social hermit is a good way to develop depression. Get married, have kids, live the good life.

What does getting married have to do with having kids and living the good life?

[shira]

Here is a short commentary on the marriage of Adam and Eve (the first human marriage). Does marriage still have a role in society? If people want society to prosper, then I would say yes. If they want it to fail, like it has been for a while now, then no.

With the diminishing role of religion in society (well some religions anyway)
And the stigma of bastard almost completely reduced I would say no.

SocIety doesn't seem to need religion to prosper.
Especially with higher ups making terrible mistakes and scandals.

[SillyEskimo]

It has a place in my life and that's all thatbreally maters to me. Outside of the importance to my wife and I, I don't really care what others think and feel about the pros and cons of marriage. People can debate it all they want, it has no effect on my personal experience or situation. The great thing about marrige is that no one has to do it. I had a co-worker who left her lifelong "boyfriend" of 25yrs and all she had to do was say "It's over" and walk out the door. It was still a mess though due to entangled finances, house, kids, ect, but at least she is saving money on a lawyer (so far).

I always get a weird emjoyment out of people that have never been married shouting down marriage though. It's like listening to rich white dudes talk about discrimination. NeoGaf shows it's age in so many ways, lol.

[Air]

When done right? Yes, no doubt. However, getting married just to have a title or for any other dumb reason needs to go.

[maomaoIYP]

I always get a weird emjoyment out of people that have never been married shouting down marriage though. It's like listening to rich white dudes talk about discrimination. NeoGaf shows it's age in so many ways, lol.

Lolwhut? Marriage is a lifestyle choice. You're comparing a lifestyle choice to being rich, or white, or being discriminated against? So do you get a weird enjoyment out of listening to people refusing to do crack cocaine even though they've never had it before?

[Gareth Bale]

Isn't this a GCSE RE question?

[Gaborn]

I think some people are focusing on really the wrong issues here. The issue doesn't seem to be "is marriage necessary today" because the answer is clearly not. Rather it seems to me the issue is does marriage still provide a stabilizing relationship to some couples? Is it the best way to give an incentive to young couples with children to stay together? Would a focus on marriage reduce the number of single parent homes and if so is that beneficial?

And then on the other side, the potential downsides of alternate policies.

[ElectricBlue187]

Marriage is set up to protect women, only the more and more equal society gets the less and less useful marriage becomes for men or women but especially men because there is usually no upside unless the woman is way more wealthy than the man. This applies the same way for gay marriage too probably. I don't have anything against marriage but I doubt I will do it again.

[Misterhbk]

When you get old, your kids have their own lives, andyour friends are either dead or just as senile as you, that's when you'll wish you'd gotten married.

[The Technomancer]

Formal, legal marriage doesn't necessarily have a place in society, although its going to stick around.
Long-term two parent relationships (regardless of parent sex) are the best way to raise children though.

[soul creator]

I think civil marriage is best seen as a type of business partnership.

Since I would assume that if you love somebody, you would love them regardless of whatever paperwork supports that. In theory, it should just be seen as a simple way to handle certain financial realities for people who plan to share them for the foreseeable future.

[Dany M]

In Quebec, a long-term relationship is automatically granted the same legal rights as a marriage after a set time - so they are essentially the same thing. I could see marriage being useful to get those rights as soon as possible though.

Same thing in the US I believe. Some states only.

[The Technomancer]

Same thing in the US I believe. Some states only.

Yeah, definitely some states only, there was some legal knottiness when my step-grandfather passed away because he and my grandmother never formally married.

[YoungHav]

Marriage is stupid and should die swiftly. The only reason I'm getting married is gov't benefits, but the hype train has far exceeded its value. The most important day of a girl's life? lmao really? I have seen people waste 10's of thousands of dollars on some stupid princess wedding.

The part that cracks me up is my friend went to a Christian college and so many fucking people got married at 18yrs old just so they could have sex and not piss off "The Lord"... nearly a decade later and a lot of them are getting divorces... people let a book troll their sexuality.

[Shambles]

So people say they're cool with committing to raise children for 20-30 years but having to sign a paper at the courthouse goes beyond their boundries? Suuuuuuuure, you can trust them to stick around. People who hate marriage are generally bitter husks who have personal issues. At least in Canada (and the USA I'm sure) where marriage has nothing to do giving away your property (Heaven forbid you stop being selfish for five seconds). Live together with someone else for 6 months? BAM, you're commonlaw and they can try to take half your stuff anyways.

[Mammoth Jones]

Of course marriage still has a role in society. The people stating that "marriage should die" are really baffling me. If you don't like marriage: Don't get married, LMAO. Problem solved. Some people want to get married, some don't.

But it definitely still has a place in society.

[Zoe]

Yeah, definitely some states only, there was some legal knottiness when my step-grandfather passed away because he and my grandmother never formally married.

Only 10 states have common law marriages, and I know that in the case for Texas at least, it's something you have to declare legally. It's not assumed by cohabitation.

[maomaoIYP]

So people say they're cool with committing to raise children for 20-30 years but having to sign a paper at the courthouse goes beyond their boundries? Suuuuuuuure, you can trust them to stick around.

So you're saying signing a paper at the courthouse guarantees that they will stick around? Responsible adults having children is an active decision on their part, they aren't teenagers who had drunken sex at a party and had their condom break. If you can't trust someone in the first place you shouldn't be having children with them.

[el retorno]

Same thing in the US I believe. Some states only.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Common-law_marriage
?

So people say they're cool with committing to raise children for 20-30 years but having to sign a paper at the courthouse goes beyond their boundries? Suuuuuuuure, you can trust them to stick around. People who hate marriage are generally bitter husks who have personal issues. At least in Canada (and the USA I'm sure) where marriage has nothing to do giving away your property (Heaven forbid you stop being selfish for five seconds). Live together with someone else for 6 months? BAM, you're commonlaw and they can try to take half your stuff anyways.

I wouldn't go that far but the "outlaw marriage" "lol love" people are a little weird.

[teruterubozu]

Marriage is supported as a societal institution.
The question should be: should current society be dismantled?

[JJD]

Of course marriage still has a role in society. The people stating that "marriage should die" are really baffling me. If you don't like marriage: Don't get married, LMAO. Problem solved. Some people want to get married, some don't. But it definitely still has a place in society.

Pretty much this.

[Enco]

Of course marriage still has a role in society. The people stating that "marriage should die" are really baffling me. If you don't like marriage: Don't get married, LMAO. Problem solved. Some people want to get married, some don't. But it definitely still has a place in society.

This is an obvious point that many seem to miss.

No one is forcing you to get married. There is ZERO need to get rid of it. Absolutely nothing will be gained whatsoever.

[Count Dookkake]

It's a decent back-up plan.

[Hartt951]

Religion has nothing to do with marriage in America. In fact, the basic, minimum way to get legally married is to sign papers at a courthouse. Some people then choose to add religious ceremonies, but it's not at all necessary.

This.

Marriage /= Religion. It absolutely still has a place in our society and it always will so long as we remain human beings capable of loving.

[thetrin]

I think marriage can be a wonderful thing, but the issue is that society seems to foist it on people. Not on purpose, but the pressures of normality force some people to get married, when those two people clearly should not get married.

That doesn't mean marriage is inherently bad, because it's really not. Marriage, I'm sure, can be deeply enriching. As a culture, though, we don't view it as a choice. We view it as a natural progression of adult life. You are somehow not a complete human if you don't get married.

Plenty of people in this thread will probably deny that, but me and many others have felt those pressures growing up.

[Cubsfan23]

Who wants to live life lonely? Living like a social hermit is a good way to develop depression. Get married, have kids, live the good life.

pretty sad you equate not being married and not having kids as being "lonely"

[Phoenician_Viking]

Here in Denmark a lot of girls that i know are having kids and long term relationships without being married. Anecdotal, i know, but marriage cost a lot of money.

[SquiddyCracker]

I think marriage can be a wonderful thing, but the issue is that society seems to foist it on people. Not on purpose, but the pressures of normality force some people to get married, when those two people clearly should not get married. That doesn't mean marriage is inherently bad, because it's really not. Marriage, I'm sure, can be deeply enriching. As a culture, though, we don't view it as a choice. We view it as a natural progression of adult life. You are somehow not a complete human if you don't get married. Plenty of people in this thread will probably deny that, but me and many others have felt those pressures growing up.

That is true, and even the phrasing of the OP suggest that marriage is part of the natural progression of adult life.

The whole child-adult-married-kids-death progression is awfully linear, and no one should feel pressured into following it.

You want kids but don't want to get married?
You don't want any kids but want to get married?
You don't want any kids nor do you want to get married, but you are in a long-term relationship?
You don't want any kids, nor do you want to get married or be in a long-term relationship?

Go ahead, they're all equally as "valid", life-fulfilling, joyful, whatever.

[Backwards Marathon]

Was playing Apples to Apples yesterday and for "Primitive" I put down "Marriage", didn't win the round though.

[Hartt951]

That is true, and even the phrasing of the OP suggest that marriage is part of the natural progression of adult life. The whole child-adult-married-kids-death progression is awfully linear, and no one should feel pressured into following it. You want kids but don't want to get married? You don't want any kids but want to get married? You don't want any kids nor do you want to get married, but you are in a long-term relationship? You don't want any kids, nor do you want to get married or be in a long-term relationship? Go ahead, they're all equally as "valid", life-fulfilling, joyful, whatever.

I agree with you completely. I don't believe anyone should be forced into any aspect of the "normal" life progression, including the school-job part. If someone wants to surf everyday and is able to maintain a lifestyle where they can support that desire then that's absolutely awesome. People should do what makes them happy, regardless of whether it fits in with the social norm.

That being said, it's asinine for people to claim that marriage should be done away with or that it should go die in a fire. Some people want to get married and it absolutely has no effect on you if someone decides to get married. For some people, marriage holds an important place in their heart. If you don't like marriage don't do it, but advocating getting rid of it is absolutely ridiculous.

[demosthenes]

Well when you want to be in a long term relationship, it has benefits on legal things and taxes. Especially re: kids. I do get annoyed at people that think they HAVE to get married, like it's a state they must get into and sacrifice all of their shit to attain it, so now they're an "adult". I also think people marry too young. I'd have nothing against setting the minimum age to be married at 21 nationwide.

Actually from the recent stuff I have seen, more people are waiting now to get married. Along with that while marriage on a whole is down, the amount of people staying married is the highest it has been in like 40 years or something.

This is an obvious point that many seem to miss. No one is forcing you to get married. There is ZERO need to get rid of it. Absolutely nothing will be gained whatsoever.

Exactly, it's just the people that feel they're right and nobody else can be right mentality that makes people want to get rid of it.

[demosthenes]

Here in Denmark a lot of girls that i know are having kids and long term relationships without being married. Anecdotal, i know, but marriage cost a lot of money.

What? Explain this. It will only cost a lot of money if you think you need to invite 150+ people and make a big deal about it. I know a guy @ work that was like this, let his wife pressure him into having a huge wedding (250+ people) and he's still paying it off years later b/c they spent so much money.

[Emitan]

I can't even get married where I live! Hell, I probably can't even adopt.

Feels bad, man.


EDIT: Oh, I can adopt. Neat. Don't really want kids too badly though.

[Emily Chu]

I don't know, but it sure is expensive x10 that add kids.

[JJDinomite]

I'm cool with marriage. Helps build families and successful lives.

[Half and half]

I was unemployed, so I was able to get onto my wife's health insurance when we got married.

It's not necessarily a good reason to get married.

[disappeared]

I went to a friend's wedding once. Ended up hooking up with one of the bridesmaids.

[Emitan]

Here is a short commentary on the marriage of Adam and Eve (the first human marriage). Does marriage still have a role in society? If people want society to prosper, then I would say yes. If they want it to fail, like it has been for a while now, then no.

lol this post is hilarious

[Aesthet1c]

This is the dumbest fucking argument ever.

If you don't like marriage or feel like it needs some kind of "reform", then don't get fucking married.

To me, I wouldn't choose any other way to be with my spouse. It's a bigger commitment than saying "hey let's stay exclusive for a while".

I also see no problem with people who would prefer just to stay partners or live together or whatever, but saying marriage has no place in our current world is just stupid.

[Phoenician_Viking]

What? Explain this. It will only cost a lot of money if you think you need to invite 150+ people and make a big deal about it. I know a guy @ work that was like this, let his wife pressure him into having a huge wedding (250+ people) and he's still paying it off years later b/c they spent so much money.

No, one does not need to invite 150 people to the weddings for it to cost money. There´s always the paper work, and finding a new apartment to move into. A couple will invite family and friends. That´s a lot of people already. They need to rent a place to throw the wedding reception. They need to pay for catering, food drinks, and decoration. Even if it´s only 50 people the wedding will still cost between 20-30k minimum. And that´s not taking into account moving into a new apartment, or going on a honeymoon, or marrying in a church.

[Vulcano's assistant]

Society hasn't really changed much in the last couple of decades, so I say that is not a very good question. I don't think it's a matter or whether it "still" has a role, because is not marriage what changes. We could ask, however, "What changes will society suffer to get to a point were marriage is irrelevant?"

[Aesthet1c]

No, one does not need to invite 150 people to the weddings for it to cost money. There´s always the paper work, and finding a new apartment to move into. A couple will invite family and friends. That´s a lot of people already. They need to rent a place to throw the wedding reception. They need to pay for catering, food drinks, and decoration. Even if it´s only 50 people the wedding will still cost between 20-30k minimum. And that´s not taking into account moving into a new apartment, or going on a honeymoon, or marrying in a church.

Only if you are getting married by the Pope himself and plan to have Jay-Z DJ your wedding reception.

That is an absurd number. I got married with a really nice reception for less than 5k, and we could have went a lot cheaper if we wanted.

[dehydratedbabies]

they shall become one flesh

[EatinOlives]

Of course marriage still has a role in society. The people stating that "marriage should die" are really baffling me. If you don't like marriage: Don't get married, LMAO. Problem solved. Some people want to get married, some don't. But it definitely still has a place in society.

Frankly, and I know I'm gonna get a lot of shit for this, I'm willing to bet the vast majority of the "marriage should die, it's a piece of shit" posts are made by forever-alone types pretending that the concept is beneath them to make themselves feel better.