[wsippel]

How so? I don't think many here said the Wii U won't be able to run UE4 at all. It'll just be heavily downgraded.

The games need to be downgraded, not the engine.

Not really, I'm sure Mark can say the exact same for 360 or PS3. I think it's foolish to make that conclusion on this statement.

Not necessarily. It's about features, not performance. Wii U is several GPU generations ahead of PS3 and 360. If UE4 requires DX10.1 level, PS3 and 360 are out.

[Celine]

Sounds like what they said about UE3 on Wii.

http://www.joystiq.com/2007/03/08/ma...ine-3-for-wii/

Ummmmm, well, this is kinda a high definition engine. Designed for a certain level of graphics card and certain amount of CPU. You know, I'm sure one of our licensees will squeeze it down into the Wii. The way Ubisoft squeezed Unreal Engine 2 into the PSP," he explained in a little bit more detail exactly why the Wii and Unreal Engine 3 won't become best buddies, "Unreal Engine 3 is designed for a high level shader architecture and the Wii doesn't have that. I mean, you know, it's just not what we've been aiming for, so it's not something we're looking to do or support.

http://computerandvideogames.com/article.php?id=146449

(laughs) I can’t say, I’m under NDA with Nintendo. But I can tell you that we’re not doing, internally any development right now on the Wii. The Wii I’m sure is going to be a fantastic machine and sell really well but it’s kind of below - it’s not Intel integrated graphics but it’s pretty far bellow the kind of min-bar of Unreal Engine 3. If you built a PC with that spec it wouldn’t really be capable of playing an Unreal Engine 3 games decently. They’re aiming at clearly at different audience that what we are. You know, Unreal Engine 3 can’t run on Xbox 1 or PS2 either - and that’s not to say that some of our licensees wont find a way to shoe-horn it into that platform, we certainly have some licensees that are doing some experiments in that area and it could very well happen. But that’s a really tough job. And one thing that has become public knowledge in the last little while is that Ubisoft’s game Red Steel is using Unreal Engine 2, so there will be Unreal Engine games on the Wii. There will be Unreal Engine games on the Wii and hopefully they’ll be successful and maybe we’ll make a little money from it, but Unreal Engine 3 - that’s a little below our target platform.

[Drago]

So, let me get this straight... UE4 could run on WiiU if optimized for it, which Epic won't do themselves, and games that come over won't look as fancy as the other versions?

Or am I completely off?

[Jonm1010]

BlackNMild2k vindicated.

How so?

That guy seems to suggest ue4 is up and running on wiiU and nowhere is that indicated.

[PopcornMegaphone]

So, let me get this straight... UE4 could run on WiiU if optimized for it, which Epic won't do themselves, and games that come over won't look as fancy as the other versions? Or am I completely off?

I suspect if it were easy for UE4 to run on the WiiU adequately they would do it.

[BlackJace]

http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showthread.php?t=475868 Wow its worse than i remember from the time i was lurking

Gracias.

[GDGF]

http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showthread.php?t=475868 Wow its worse than i remember from the time i was lurking

Memories are short.

[Übermatik]

It will always have been capable of running UE4, the question is, to what effect? That we won't know until the system launches and we see the engine running.

[metalslimer]

http://www.joystiq.com/2007/03/08/ma...ine-3-for-wii/

Haha that sounds nothing like the same thing. Wii was missing a huge factor that led to no UE3 Wii games.

[lunchwithyuzo]

They said this about the Wii and UE3, did anyone do it?

No, they said this about Wii and UE2. No official support, but 3rd parties can do whatever they want.

UE2 games were ported to Wii in the end, UE3 games weren't.

[Projectjustice]

No surprised here.

[wsippel]

No, they said this about Wii and UE2. No official support, but 3rd parties can do whatever they want. UE2 games were ported to Wii in the end, UE3 games weren't.

IIRC, Gearbox supposedly managed to port the engine to a certain degree at some point, but never used it.

[Wishmaster92]

UE3 is also scalable down to mobile phones, which used to be around Wii level hardware, but that never helped the Wii with the engine.

You are correct, but you do get what you pay for, and wii u is supposedly going to be cheap by release. I guess it will run out of steam quick, just like the wii did in 2007 and 2008 after metroid prime 3, and ssbb.

[StuBurns]

No, they said this about Wii and UE2. No official support, but 3rd parties can do whatever they want. UE2 games were ported to Wii in the end, UE3 games weren't.

Did you get to that post, just reply, and miss the whole debate including multiple links supporting that claim?

[Instro]

UE3 is also scalable down to mobile phones, which used to be around Wii level hardware, but that never helped the Wii with the engine.

Mobile phone tech supported the correct APIs, the Wii never did. It happens when the tech inside is 10 years old.

[LittleJohnny]

Glad that debate is finally over. Sarcasm or did you not read the article? Actually forget the article, you only had to read one sentence lol

...but Unreal Engine 4 is going to be supremely scalable


That means they can scale it all the way down to current gen or even the PSP apparently, that of course doesn't mean it will still look anything like it will on the platforms that meet it's recommended spec's. ;)

[DXB-KNIGHT]

So WiiU can run UE4 that settles that argument.

[Celine]

UE3 is also scalable down to mobile phones, which used to be around Wii level hardware, but that never helped the Wii with the engine.

the minimun iPhone configuration which UE3 support is 3GS.
It was the first model to offer a fully-programmable graphics pipeline with shader support.

Now guess what the GC architecture from 90's lack ?

[daakusedo]

We've gone through actual 360 and ps3 games footage being inferior by nintendo magic, wiiu behind those same consoles technically and ue4 as a complete no for wiiu.
Not much to go but I believe in the power of imagination.

[MadeInBeats]

UE4 WILL run on WiiU... Tick that box. Glad to put that one to bed... NEXT!

[Hero of Legend]

I once heard that Gearbox was attempting to port UE3 to Wii, clearly this didn't happen and all they did was Samba Wii. However, they are singing a choir about how great the Wii U is, particularly power-wise, so that's extremely encouraging on its own.

Ubisoft is the #1 contender to port UE4 to Wii U, and hey, if they succeed once, they won't have to worry about so much work to use it on their other games. You don't need to rework an engine like that if you already have the job done in the first place, that'd be a waste of time and money.

They got UE2.5 out on day 1 on Wii and 3DS (Splinter Cell 3D), but I don't see other such games from them on 3DS coming up, weird.

[Celine]

That explain exactly my opinion on the Wii U: it's main problem will not be its horsepower compared to Orbis and DUrango: the gap will visually and technically be big but less visible and it will not have the same limits that the Wii had. But its demographic/target placement will be an obstacole in getting a lot of third party multiplatform titles. So, I would like to see less people worried about "specs" and more people worried about "support".

Best post int the thread IMO.

Just release the damn specs Nintendo. All this pro and anti WiiU metal gymnastics stopped being funny a while ago.

I would gladly trade the "specs" for witnessing to Retro or Shin'en early work on WiiU.

[Heavy]

UE4 WILL run on WiiU... Tick that box. Glad to put that one to bed... NEXT!

It will also run on cell phones.

[modulaire]

UE4 WILL run on WiiU... Tick that box. Glad to put that one to bed... NEXT!

.... but it is unlikely that a lot of UE4-games will be on the WiiU. Yes.

[x-Lundz-x]

"I'll state that I don't think it's our intention to bring Unreal Engine 4 to Wii U, but Unreal Engine 4 is going to be supremely scalable. "We'll run on mobile phones and on a wide variety of things, so if a customer decides they want to port an Unreal Engine 4 game to Wii U, they could. But Unreal Engine 3 is a really good fit for that platform." http://www.videogamer.com/news/unrea...ii_u_epic.html

WiiU as powerful as an iPhone 4s confirmed.

[marc^o^]

.... but it is unlikely that a lot of UE4-games will be on the WiiU. Yes.

UE4 helps make games faster, ie in the test process. I don't see why, theoritically, it would not be preferred to UE3, once teams get used to it.

[phosphor112]

This'll become the biggest port begging thread ever.

[GDGF]

This'll become the biggest port begging thread ever.

Heh :)

[Ardenyal]

UE4 helps make games faster, ie in the test process. I don't see why, theoritically, it would not be preferred to UE3, once teams get used to it.

It's also more expensive, probably the most expensive engine around.

[phosphor112]

UE4 helps make games faster, ie in the test process. I don't see why, theoritically, it would not be preferred to UE3, once teams get used to it.

It's supposed to help make games faster because of things like full dynamic lighting. Baking and testing light sources, especially on scripted scenes is very difficult and time consuming.

[MadeInBeats]

It will also run on cell phones.

Thanks for the info; dial for Dyno Rod on your WiiU after a Sunday roast, confirmed.

.... but it is unlikely that a lot of UE4-games will be on the WiiU. Yes.

I'll have to consult my magic 8 ball too.. one sec...



Ummmm??? My mum always knows what to say... She say no... confirmed.

[Forsaken82]

UE4 helps make games faster, ie in the test process. I don't see why, theoritically, it would not be preferred to UE3, once teams get used to it.

If the Wii U doesn't have the processor capable of rendering things like Lighting, shadows and reflections in real time, than it removes the "faster" development times. If the CPU is as poor as its being made out to be, many of the workflows that make UE4 so impressive wouldn't be effective on the Wii U. At least that is my impression of the whole thing.

Note, I am not saying the Wii U is under powered, only IF. That would be a reason why teams would utilize UE3 instead.

[AzaK]

If Mark Rein had to ever to admit to anything of his being on a Nintendo console his head would fall off or something. It's like he's offended at very thought of it.

That's Mark Rein, Nintendo hater.

"I'll state that I don't think it's our intention to bring Unreal Engine 4 to Wii U, but Unreal Engine 4 is going to be supremely scalable. "We'll run on mobile phones and on a wide variety of things, so if a customer decides they want to port an Unreal Engine 4 game to Wii U, they could. But Unreal Engine 3 is a really good fit for that platform." http://www.videogamer.com/news/unrea...ii_u_epic.html

That's confusing. They won't bring UE4 to Wii U? Does that mean its not a target in their editor? If so, that's a shotload of work to get a Wii U target I imagine. They say it's scalable so I imagine he's saying that Wii U has enough features to use UE4, but not bringing it to it is worrisome.

I really expected Nintendo to have worked with them to ensure it was a target. We need clarification.

If you're interested in the breadth and depth that comes from third party support I'm not sure why you'd want to invest in a Nintendo platform as a consumer, anyway.

Well, Nintendo have been harping on about how they need third party support so some of us thought that maybe they'd do everything to ensure cross platform capability 100%. I guess with iwatas statements about us not relying on getting all third party games, this is to be expected.

[StevieP]

The games need to be downgraded, not the engine.

This.

How did I know this thread would be a festering cesspool of stupid?

The Wii U has the necessary unified shader architecture to run the engine in some form (unlike the Wii with UE3), but Epic's not supporting it in their SDK and that (not-so-easy) job would be left entirely to the licensee. With western third parties, don't expect shit in other words (because most of them don't give a damn about putting their premier works on the console and its perceived "family friendly" audience). That doesn't mean it's not possible, just means it's less likely.

Note: the Wii U is either SM 4.x or SM 5.0, depending on what they've done to their VLIW-based AMD GPU since they started it in 2009. The original kit was using an off-the-shelf R700 PC GPU. There are no information/leaks on the final silicon yet.

[MadeInBeats]

That's Mark Rein, Nintendo hater. That's confusing. They won't bring UE4 to Wii U? Does that mean its not a target in their editor? If so, that's a shotload of work to get a Wii U target I imagine. They say it's scalable so I imagine he's saying that Wii U has enough features to use UE4, but not bringing it to it is worrisome. I really expected Nintendo to have worked with them to ensure it was a target. We need clarification. Well, Nintendo have been harping on about how they need third party support so some of us thought that maybe they'd do everything to ensure cross platform capability 100%. I guess with iwatas statements about us not relying on getting all third party games, this is to be expected.

I really think you're jumping the gun with assuming the adoption rate will be sudden and far reaching throughout the games development world. Like others have said, look at what UE3-3.9 is is doing with Samaritan and Star Wars 1313; how many dev studios will be willing to pay the licence, who's to say some of the other engines might be seen as better value. Can you really say for certain UE4 will be in extensive use in 5 years when the Nintendo will be looking to replace the U with new hardware?

If UE4 is really a developers dream as Epic are saying, and it slices weeks or months off development, then any studio will see that value and and want it as their working environment for anything they're working on including WiiU.

[plagiarize]

This. How did I know this thread would be a festering cesspool of stupid? The Wii U has the necessary unified shader architecture to run the engine in some form (unlike the Wii with UE3), but Epic's not supporting it in their SDK and that (not-so-easy) job would be left entirely to the licensee. With western third parties, don't expect shit in other words (because most of them don't give a damn about putting their premier works on the console and its perceived "family friendly" audience). That doesn't mean it's not possible, just means it's less likely. Note: the Wii U is either SM 4.x or SM 5.0, depending on what they've done to their VLIW-based AMD GPU since they started it in 2009.

aaaaand if a company does go through all the work of porting it to Wii U, that isn't going to magically make all their own custom coding work available to all the other devs who might want to run the engine on Wii U.

[mrklaw]

This. How did I know this thread would be a festering cesspool of stupid? The Wii U has the necessary unified shader architecture to run the engine in some form (unlike the Wii with UE3), but Epic's not supporting it in their SDK and that (not-so-easy) job would be left entirely to the licensee. With western third parties, don't expect shit in other words (because most of them don't give a damn about putting their premier works on the console and its perceived "family friendly" audience). That doesn't mean it's not possible, just means it's less likely. Note: the Wii U is either SM 4.x or SM 5.0, depending on what they've done to their VLIW-based AMD GPU since they started it in 2009.

It'll be interesting tonseenwhat the lowest common denominator is next-gen. Will it be intel's HD5000 (or whatever next years IGP refresh is called)? If so, then a scalable set of assets might exist to facilitate WiiU ports. But if developers reset the baseline too high, then ports might become more trouble than they are worth. And with the previous limited success of Wii for 3rd party games, almost any barrier will be one too many.


If enough publishers want it, it'll suddenly be a priority for epic. I don't see any developers doing that legwork themselves just for WiiU

[StevieP]

aaaaand if a company does go through all the work of porting it to Wii U, that isn't going to magically make all their own custom coding work available to all the other devs who might want to run the engine on Wii U.

Correct, unless Epic decides to incorporate that into their SDK behind the scenes (which, let's be honest...). The take away from this thread is that the Wii U can run the engine (it's not the same situation as the Wii in that regard) but that Epic won't be the one doing the work.

It'll be interesting tonseenwhat the lowest common denominator is next-gen. Will it be intel's HD5000 (or whatever next years IGP refresh is called)? If so, then a scalable set of assets might exist to facilitate WiiU ports. But if developers reset the baseline too high, then ports might become more trouble than they are worth. And with the previous limited success of Wii for 3rd party games, almost any barrier will be one too many.

The Wii's third party situation was created by third parties. And yet they still sold more games, by volume, on the Wii than they did on the other consoles (I wish Jokerpedia was around to provide the exact numbers, as I recall him being the one to calculate that).

Who am I kidding, Mark Rein wouldn't put his engine on it even then.

I don't think there is some sort of anti-Nintendo persecution conspiracy. Him (and many third parties) just don't think they could sell "bald space marine kill things 12" on Nintendo's "colourful happy mushroom land" console, if you get my meaning.

[AzaK]

This. How did I know this thread would be a festering cesspool of stupid? The Wii U has the necessary unified shader architecture to run the engine in some form (unlike the Wii with UE3), but Epic's not supporting it in their SDK and that (not-so-easy) job would be left entirely to the licensee. With western third parties, don't expect shit in other words (because most of them don't give a damn about putting their premier works on the console and its perceived "family friendly" audience). That doesn't mean it's not possible, just means it's less likely. Note: the Wii U is either SM 4.x or SM 5.0, depending on what they've done to their VLIW-based AMD GPU since they started it in 2009.

I agree, if Epic is not doing a Wii U target (which is fucked IMO) it's going to severely limit the number of UE4 games. Well, all I hope is that Nintendo do a 4 year cycle, so by the time ue4 is ramping up on PS4/720 they can come out with an even more capable machine. :) Who am I kidding, Epic wouldn't put their engine on it even then.

If we step back a bit though, it's understandable in some ways and fits with Epic's MO. They are about cutting edge and pushing platforms. Being on the high end consoles is a selling point, and being on low end phones, looking all sexy is too. Being average and on a platform thats not promoting or interested in 'teh grafx sex' isn't exciting.

[Mithos]

aaaaand if a company does go through all the work of porting it to Wii U, that isn't going to magically make all their own custom coding work available to all the other devs who might want to run the engine on Wii U.

Yeah that will be the downside of Epic not adapting UE4 to the Wii U themselves sadly.

[jerd21]

This. How did I know this thread would be a festering cesspool of stupid? The Wii U has the necessary unified shader architecture to run the engine in some form (unlike the Wii with UE3), but Epic's not supporting it in their SDK and that (not-so-easy) job would be left entirely to the licensee. With western third parties, don't expect shit in other words (because most of them don't give a damn about putting their premier works on the console and its perceived "family friendly" audience). That doesn't mean it's not possible, just means it's less likely. Note: the Wii U is either SM 4.x or SM 5.0, depending on what they've done to their VLIW-based AMD GPU since they started it in 2009. The original kit was using an off-the-shelf R700 PC GPU. There are no information/leaks on the final silicon yet.

The only way I see devs putting in this work is if Nintendo puts some sort of huge incentives in place to attract third party games and patch up some relationships. In other words, I don't see it happening. Best start working on my gaming PC I suppose.

[plagiarize]

The only way I see devs putting in this work is if Nintendo puts some sort of huge incentives in place to attract third party games and patch up some relationships. In other words, I don't see it happening. Best start working on my gaming PC I suppose.

which large devs do we expect to be using UE4 next gen? EA are moving away from it. Capcom will likely stay in house. So Ubisoft and who else? someone like Ubisoft might do the work so that they can use UE4 for a bunch of multiplatform games, but i'm not expect much beyond that. WB maybe?

[StevieP]

The only way I see devs putting in this work is if Nintendo puts some sort of huge incentives in place to attract third party games and patch up some relationships. In other words, I don't see it happening. Best start working on my gaming PC I suppose.

Ubisoft spent a lot of time and money adapting UE 2.5 to Wii, without any of Epic's help or Nintendo's money iirc.

UE3 just... wasn't portable. Shader Model 3 was a baseline, unlike UE 2.5.

Doesn't mean jack in regards to UE4, but it's not impossible.

[metalslimer]

which large devs do we expect to be using UE4 next gen? EA are moving away from it. Capcom will likely stay in house. So Ubisoft and who else? someone like Ubisoft might do the work so that they can use UE4 for a bunch of multiplatform games, but i'm not expect much beyond that. WB maybe?

Yeah people keep saying how huge UE4 is going to be but 3rd parties are actually moving away from it

EA built Frostbite 2 for next gen
Crytek will of course be using CryEngine
Valve with either keep using current source or finally release the new version with the next Half Life
Square has built Luminous Engine for next gen
Capcom will update their MT Framework
Konami will be using Fox Engine

UE3 seems to be overplayed in how many games actually used it relatively. Off the top of my head outside of Epic themselves, the biggest games to use it was the Mass Effect series, Batman series, and Bioshock series.

[skinnyrattler]

I haven't seen many instances of that, either. I think most people knew that UE4 would be possible on Wii U in SOME form. The real question was would Wii U be able to handle the complete engine as-is, or will it have to be gimped. That question was just answered.

What's the answer, maybe?

[Hoodbury]

What's funny to me is that their first game using UE4: http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showthread.php?t=482242

Looks like it would be a great game for a Nintendo console. It's cartoony and colorful. It's not realistic or excessively gory.

[shinobi602]

What's the answer, maybe?

Gimped.

[StevieP]

What's the answer, maybe?

Gimped.

Right on the top of the page, folks:
http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showpost...&postcount=201

[walking fiend]

What's funny to me is that their first game using UE4: http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showthread.php?t=482242 Looks like it would be a great game for a Nintendo console. It's cartoony and colorful. It's not realistic or excessively gory.

if it was a game firstly announced on Wii U, that thread would be:

"lol, even UE4 can't save Wii U games looking like shit... 3rd parties are never gonna support Wii U with real games", etc.

[Meelow]

http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showthread.php?t=475868 Wow its worse than i remember from the time i was lurking

Yeah people will freak out and than it turns out what they didn't hear, Unreal Engine 4 can be supported on the Wii U it's just Epic right now doesn't have any games in development for Wii U that's using UE4, they are currently using UE3.