[PjotrStroganov]

See, I just don't understand this and perhaps that's the fact I started with Paradise first before trying out Revenge. Giant glowing GO-THERE-FOR-THE-LOVE-OF-GOD-YOU-NEED-TO-TURN-NOW! barriers weren't needed for me because after exploring the city on my own and trying out a dozen races or so I did have the paths known well enough and was glad I could take my own routes because they were faster or offered jumps. It wasn't memorising every single track or variation, but just learning a city the same way I would in real life or depending on a navi (flashing street sign on the top left/right or seeing the turn signal). I couldn't tell you street by street the exact path to get to the stadium in Paradise City, but I can easily get there if I'm on the controls without really thinking about it. I finished Paradise, I finished Revenge and honestly with or without barriers I never lost the sense of speed and constantly went near top speed or boosting all the way once I knew tracks on both unless I screwed up and crash. In fact being left to me I could keep drifts and boosts going far longer than I did in Burnout. Not to mention with Paradise if I did screw up, I could use another path or jump and get back into the race rather than having to restart or settle for second or third quite easily, though I still did restarts because I always wanted the best times/runs out of compulsion. Now I've said that, I'm not against them implementing such a feature and would be all for it if it helped get more people to play; I just don't understand how it would actually help be more enjoyable as to me it felt like the same racing experience in both titles if I just followed the given path. It all just seems a bit Mega Man 10 Easy Mode to me. So please, help me to understand and spot what I'm missing.

I played the game to completion so I enjoyed myself with it. But having to learn to navigate the city took a large part of the fun out of racing itself. Secondly, online racing was much less predictable as custom routes were often laid out. Taking a wrong turn was insta-fail as guys in the front knew exactly what the shortest route was. That frustration was much less a part of the SP as rubberbanding AI helped you catch up.

[antitrop]

Can someone explain to me why they thought that Burnout Paradise's "free-roam" racing style was frustrating?

I played the game all the way to one of the highest licenses you can get (can't even remember the name anymore, but more than 30 hours put into the game) and within maybe 5-10 races I had completely figured out how to easily get through the fastest route to the finish line.

The game did a great job of telling you exactly where you needed to go, you have a map in the bottom right, the game displays street signs that blink and shit as you approach an intersection where you need to turn. I mean, if you want to be completely ignorant then I could understand why it would be an issue, but the game gave you plenty of "clues" on how to finish races properly. I guess people just don't want games to have a learning curve anymore.

[wwm0nkey]

I personally just want another super arcade style Burnout in the same line and 3 or Revenge in HD.

[Red Dolphin]

Burnout 2 is the best traditional Burnout game. I am so glad there are many people in this thread that recognise it. I get the feeling a lot of people that prefer the later games never played the first two games before EA picked up Criterion and the series with Burnout 3.

I've played every game since the first one and Burnout 2 is definately the best blend of speed and avoiding traffic. It has been disapointing seeing the series have less and less traffic which each new installment. That's what made Burnout unique as well as one of the only racing games with detailed crashes.

Burnout Revenge was great and had really good track design and shortcuts which were a first for the series. I hate traffic checking though.

I really enjoyed Paradise but they need to make the actual races a closed circuit for the most part. The worst thing in the game was the actual racing but I LOVED the online challenges. So much fun. I am excited to see that the new Need For Speed is basically Burnout paradise with close circuit races.

[daviyoung]

The game did a great job of telling you exactly where you needed to go, you have a map in the bottom right, the game displays street signs that blink and shit as you approach an intersection where you need to turn. I mean, if you want to be completely ignorant then I could understand why it would be an issue, but the game gave you plenty of "clues" on how to finish races properly. I guess people just don't want games to have a learning curve anymore.

This is where I disagree. The game had about 4 navigation tools, and all of them were pretty much useless at high speed.

• The blinkers flashed, but I'm watching the road, not the car.
  
• The road signs flashed, but at speed they came way too late and got confusing at multiple junctions. They seemed buggy to me.
  
• The mini-map is the most useful, but also the most distracting. Look at it and you're guaranteed to crash. Also, why no GPS or target-marking on main map? That would have solved some issues at least.
  
• The compass is fine and dandy as a checkpoint, but when your roads go all over the place in loops, in opposite ways, back onto yourself and around your objective there's no way to tell that the road you're on is the best road.

What Criterion wanted for us to do, was to learn the map. The fool-proof method. That's why the game didn't ship with a restart option, we had to explore and in turn we would memorise the layout of the roads, the shortcuts, the ramps and the junctions. It's also why changing cars was all done in-map and not through options.

It was pretty much a failed experiment though, people wanted a racing game and didn't want to be burdened with the forced learning. Of course, some did, but most didn't. So restarts were patched in.

It's not that people didn't want learning curves, it's that they don't want to have to memorise an entire map to get the most out of their purchase. It was unnecessary, and the visual clues were all but useless once you got into the faster range of cars.

These frustrations are for races and burning routes only though (and getting to a specific place on the map in free roam), road rage and marked man events weren't hampered by borked navigation signals.

[Sp3eD]

Revenges tracks we're way better then anything in 2 or 3. Being a racing game that is the most important thing to me.

[UnholySpectacle]

Burnout 3 > Burnout Revenge > Burnout Paradise

I miss the closed tracks. I tried Paradise for about 4 hours before I gave up on it due to no enjoyment. I never played the first Burnout, and never really enjoyed 2 all that much. I would do unspeakable things to be able to play Burnout 3 online again.

[tamaster92]

Burnout nostalgia is hitting me hard - maybe we should get a burnout HD collection? Like remake 3, revenge and legends in frostbite? That be so so good.

[mrklaw]

Was playing burnout 3 on the xbox 360 last night. Looks surprisingly good for an ancient old xbox game.

Now, should I buy revenge or hold fire for NFS:MW?

[nashb81]

Was playing burnout 3 on the xbox 360 last night. Looks surprisingly good for an ancient old xbox game. Now, should I buy revenge or hold fire for NFS:MW?

Revenge all the way. Also has Takedown been removed from XBL?

[Shaneus]

http://marketplace.xbox.com/en-US/Product/Full-Game-Burnout-3-Takedown/66acd000-77fe-1000-9115-d8024541084b

[UnholySpectacle]

Ha, I love that the first screen that popped up on that page is a multiplayer lobby.

[Shaneus]

Holy shit, Takedown is AWESOME. No vibration it seems, though (might see if a USB controller makes a difference). But still, loving it. I think I've played it before at some stage, but it's definitely the best, with (IMO) Revenge (that was the one that came out on 360 AND the original Xbox, yeah?) coming second.

[BigBlackGamer]

Best racing game ever. Paradise felt like such shit after this game.

this.

[triggaz]

.

!

[rhfb]

Why are GoD games so spendy! They would have a sale if they dropped the price on this :(

[Enter The 36 Chambers]

Holy shit, Takedown is AWESOME. No vibration it seems, though (might see if a USB controller makes a difference). But still, loving it. I think I've played it before at some stage, but it's definitely the best, with (IMO) Revenge (that was the one that came out on 360 AND the original Xbox, yeah?) coming second.

Yes it was. I bought both lol.

[TricksterLoki]

http://marketplace.xbox.com/en-US/Product/Full-Game-Burnout-3-Takedown/66acd000-77fe-1000-9115-d8024541084b

Oh man thank you! I dont want to shell out 120 bucks for a hard drive just to play my original xbox copy of Takedown, now I can using this!

[triggaz]

barriers weren't needed for me because after exploring the city on my own .

Burnout is not about exploring. It's about balls to the wall white knuckle speed and crashing. Exploring the city gtfo with that nonsense.

[triggaz]

Burnout is not about exploring. It's about balls to the wall white knuckle speed and crashing. Exploring the city gtfo with that nonsense.

P.S. I'm playing revenge right now on live and the online works and yes there are people playing. Gottal love XbL

[Dany M]

Ha, I love that the first screen that popped up on that page is a multiplayer lobby.

Paradise is great. They were able to turn a racing game to an open world racing game and it just worked, it was amazing.

[UraMallas]

Best racing game ever. Paradise felt like such shit after this game.

I don't think Paradise was shit but I agree, mostly.

[Shaneus]

Why are GoD games so spendy! They would have a sale if they dropped the price on this :(

So this copy doesn't take your fancy, then?

[FracturedZero]

Takedown was probably my favorite. Finished everything in the main game and just spent hours racing on line. Easily the most fun I had on live in any racing game.

I thought 2 had the best crash mode. I miss that simple here is a junction, drive fast, pick an impact point, watch the damage. Didn't enjoy when they added bonuses and multipliers and what they had in Paradise just stunk.

I loved Paradise. Not quite up there with Takedown or Revenge, but still a great game. I don't think the open world was so much the problem, it was the execution. Midnight Club showed how well racing in an open world can work.

[Shaneus]

Takedown was probably my favorite. Finished everything in the main game and just spent hours racing on line. Easily the most fun I had on live in any racing game. I thought 2 had the best crash mode. I miss that simple here is a junction, drive fast, pick an impact point, watch the damage. Didn't enjoy when they added bonuses and multipliers and what they had in Paradise just stunk. I loved Paradise. Not quite up there with Takedown or Revenge, but still a great game. I don't think the open world was so much the problem, it was the execution. Midnight Club showed how well racing in an open world can work.

What soured me was Criterion's "Wah we're not putting in a retry option, you have to drive around and do it again yourself! Wah!" attitude when it came out. As someone who gets random bouts of hyperfocus with my ADHD, not being able to retry something quickly if I can't get it quite right is fucking infuriating.

But I'm loving Takedown right now. I think I must've rented it on the original Xbox. Soundtrack doesn't do much for me at all, but the game proper us fucking sweet. About the only thing I don't like is that when they show a crash mode replay, the whole thing isn't in realtime... they just show it with the slowdown etc. of in-game. If they showed the car being twisted and manipulated with aftertouch but sped up to full speed... oh man.

[Imbarkus]

Thought I remembered reading somewhere that if you want to play Burnout #1 or Burnout #2 that Gamecube was actually leads platform for those two and is the best version. Anyone else hear this?

[satriales]

I was a QA tester for Burnout Revenge and despite playing it 40hrs a week for 3 months, I never got bored. That's the sign of a great game.

[Shaneus]

Fuck, now I'm gonna have to get Revenge. I've seen it cheap(er than GoD) for about $15 AU so I might have to jump in. They reinstated online as well, didn't they?

[PsychoSoldier]

Burnout 3, for me, was the peak. Revenge is awesome, don't get me wrong, but I think traffic checking being so easy took a little bit away from the experience.

Don't really care for Paradise at all. What I liked about Burnout is the simplicity of it, having to deal with open city navigation ruins a great deal of the charm. What I want to pay attention to in a Burnout game is the traffic and my competition, not my turn signal.

[sp3000]

The best racing game ever made. Nothing afterwards has even come close to it's sense of speed and racing fun

[Nome]

Fun game, but all I remember are awful load times :(

[ResidentDante]

Thought I remembered reading somewhere that if you want to play Burnout #1 or Burnout #2 that Gamecube was actually leads platform for those two and is the best version. Anyone else hear this?

It can't have been for Burnout 1, it was out before the other versions on PS2. From WIkipedia:

Burnout, (Working Title: Shiny Red Car),[1] is a 2001 racing game developed by Criterion Games and published by Acclaim on the PlayStation 2, Nintendo GameCube and Xbox. The PlayStation 2 version was released in North America on November 1, 2001 and Europe on November 16, 2001.[2] The GameCube version was released in North America on April 29, 2002 and Europe on May 3, 2002.[3] The Xbox version was released in North America on April 30, 2002 and in Europe on May 5, 2002.

[Imbarkus]

It can't have been for Burnout 1, it was out before the other versions on PS2. From WIkipedia:

Cool, it didn't make a lot of sense to me. Criterion was so proud of their PS2 prowess when Black came out. Thanks for debunking!

[Nazgul11]

Anyone remember this commercial? http://youtu.be/k8iOY9kfMoU

[DidntKnowJack]

I enjoyed Takedown more, but Revenge is a great game too. But I thought traffic checking was a bit much, and felt like a gimmick. I also thought the game could have used a few more courses/areas. Though honestly Takedown was kind of light on courses as well.

All in all its the last great traditional Burnout game. I liked Paradise, but it just wasn't the same.

[Duxxy3]

The last good Burnout. Paradise sucked.

Was coming to to say this.

[wwm0nkey]

So has anyone here been playing Revenge online again?

[Rice-Eater]

I never bought Revenge even though I loved Takedown soooo fucking much(easily my favorite racing game of all time). I did get Paradise but I hated it because they went to a open world setting. Now that I know that Most Wanted is also a open world, fuck that game to. This thread reminded me that Revenge does exist, and on the Xbox 360 in HD so it's at least somewhat next gen. Well I'll get it today, it may be the last good Burnout or Burnout-esque game we ever see from Criterion as long as they keep doing this "OMG, open world, go where ever you want".

[computers putin']

so Revenge is still online eh? What about Takedown?

[Sojgat]

so Revenge is still online eh? What about Takedown?

No. They should do a HD remake.

[Nazgul11]

Back in March, EA said they were going to shut down the 360 Revenge servers in April.

http://kotaku.com/5894547/ea-takes-d...r-eleven-games

http://www.ea.com/1/service-updates

Did this not happen? I haven't checked since April, since I figured they were already gone.

[Dynopia]

Probably one of my all time favourites.

[wwm0nkey]

Back in March, EA said they were going to shut down the 360 Revenge servers in April. http://kotaku.com/5894547/ea-takes-d...r-eleven-games http://www.ea.com/1/service-updates Did this not happen? I haven't checked since April, since I figured they were already gone.

nope they are still up and running!

[nashb81]

http://marketplace.xbox.com/en-US/Product/Full-Game-Burnout-3-Takedown/66acd000-77fe-1000-9115-d8024541084b

Ah thanks man. For some reason the game didn't show up in XBL.

[Rice-Eater]

Just spent an hour playing Revenge which I got through the Xbox Live Marketplace, SOOOO GOOOOD. I wonder if Criterion will ever return to circuit racing. They're making their 3rd straight open world racing game. I guess that's what they prefer and most people like it that way? Which really fucking sucks because I love Burnout gameplay, but hate this open world races. At least I'll always have Revenge for my HD fix, thank goodness for that.

[Nazgul11]

nope they are still up and running!

Holy shit that's awesome. Good on 'em for keeping them up. It's funny because I'm pretty sure Giant Bomb did a Farewell livestream the week before they were supposed to be taken down.

No. They should do a HD remake.

This. A part of me died the day that Halo 2 and Burnout 3 lost online functionality, and in the case of Burnout, complete multiplayer functionality aside from two player split screen.

Just spent an hour playing Revenge which I got through the Xbox Live Marketplace, SOOOO GOOOOD. I wonder if Criterion will ever return to circuit racing. They're making their 3rd straight open world racing game. I guess that's what they prefer and most people like it that way? Which really fucking sucks because I love Burnout gameplay, but hate this open world races. At least I'll always have Revenge for my HD fix, thank goodness for that.

Need for Speed: Hot Pursuit was a closed circuit racer, not open world. They definitely can still make those games. Most Wanted will only be their second open world game.

[Rice-Eater]

Need for Speed: Hot Pursuit was a closed circuit racer, not open world. They definitely can still make those games. Most wanted will only be their second open world game.

Really, I didn't know that. I've never played the game, but the descriptions basically says it takes place in a open world so that's why I never touched it. I'll take another look again.

[wwm0nkey]

Holy shit that's awesome. Good on 'em for keeping them up. It's funny because I'm pretty sure Giant Bomb did a Farewell livestream the week before they were supposed to be taken down.

I made a thread recently about the servers still being online, there are still some players out there and it would be good to see a few more people play Burnout again :)

[addyb]

Oh how I loved the burnout games. Ive been playing revenge again recently and really enjoy it. I'm not a big racing fan in general but feel that the burnout series ( besides paradise) are amongst my favourite games of all time. Did someone say takedown is available on Xbl ( UK) if so I'm all over that! Not been on my 360 much recently besides playing revenge as im back pc gaming but will deffo dive back on to play takedown if it's available.

[Strike]

I remember having so much fun with this and Takedown on the PS2. Traffic checking did take away some of the challenge though.