[Monkeylord]

I'm still confused about why whenever I invite any of my friends to join in with goals no-one can join/ All that happens is they follow the links that Facebook provides and end up starting a goal on their own.


Is the system fucked or is it just me?

[Minamu]

Next step, 5* and gold stars possible without power-ups, please :) Crazy scores with them, that's more than alright.

[KieferCrimson]

Next step, 5* and gold stars possible without power-ups, please :) Crazy scores with them, that's more than alright.

Why would you want to play without powerups? It's where the fun is, IMO.

[nicholasbrutal]

To be fair, you guys said you had the coin mechanic because you have to pay for arrows in Zelda, so you're not really the best judges of how games should be compared to other games.

Can't tell if you're serious or just being snarky with that one. You're referring to a comment HMXHenry made on our forums, and while we both work for Harmonix, we're not the same person, as it turns out! For what it's worth, I don't agree with the statement you just made; I don't really know in what context it was originally written. It still doesn't change the fact that Blitz is a different game from our previous beatmatch titles. There are lanes and you hit notes, sure...

I'm still confused about why whenever I invite any of my friends to join in with goals no-one can join/ All that happens is they follow the links that Facebook provides and end up starting a goal on their own. Is the system fucked or is it just me?

That shouldn't happen, obviously, and we're seeing reports of that for some users. We're looking into it!

[toymachine]

Why would you want to play without powerups? It's where the fun is, IMO.

^ This

which is why offline RBB is zzzzzzz

[Minamu]

Why would you want to play without powerups? It's where the fun is, IMO.

Yeah they're fun, I just find it a bit weird that they are essentially required. But maybe it'll be better now with the new prices.

[toythatkills]

Can't tell if you're serious or just being snarky with that one. You're referring to a comment HMXHenry made on our forums, and while we both work for Harmonix, we're not the same person, as it turns out!

It's why I went with "you guys," rather than "you."

I seem to recall you personally made similar comments though, justifying the fact that power-ups are all locked at the start because shooters slowly give you better guns. That's precisely as bad as the Zelda comment.

[PedroLumpy]

The coin thing should probably still be removed entirely, but baby steps I guess, I hope it solves everyone's problems here. Encouraging people to buy DLC by actively making your game worse should not have happened in the first place.

[Mileena]

It's why I went with "you guys," rather than "you." I seem to recall you personally made similar comments though, justifying the fact that power-ups are all locked at the start because shooters slowly give you better guns. That's precisely as bad as the Zelda comment.

It's not like CoD makes you pay money/coins every time you want to use a certain weapon or killstreak. There's no justification of Blitz coin system. It's assbackwards consumer fuckery at it's finest.

[AlStrong]

hm... maybe this has already been covered somewhere, but I noticed my facebook name showed up in the leaderboard beside my gamertag. Is that only for me or do other people see that too?

[thekonamicode]

hm... maybe this has already been covered somewhere, but I noticed my facebook name showed up in the leaderboard beside my gamertag. Is that only for me or do other people see that too?

Only you or people you are friends with can see that.

[gcubed]

they fixed it? SO they removed the stupid need to create a fake facebook account?

[toythatkills]

they fixed it? SO they removed the stupid need to create a fake facebook account?

You still need Facebook if you want to play with your friends, something which has been a standard feature of the Xbox for ten years.

[AlStrong]

Only you or people you are friends with can see that.

Thanks! I got paranoid when I saw that... Will have to relink my account. ahem. :p

[Mister Game]

I'm still confused about why whenever I invite any of my friends to join in with goals no-one can join/ All that happens is they follow the links that Facebook provides and end up starting a goal on their own. Is the system fucked or is it just me?

It's fucked up right now. See my response upthread. We should have a fix up soon.

[jgkspsx]

Blitz is an extremely dumbed down version of Amplitude/Freq. Amp/Freq took actual skill to play. Blitz hardly ever even throws double notes together. If it was as good as Amp, you'd see fewer people complaining about the gameplay without powerups.

On the other hand, I love the songs I've bought for Rock Band (inc. Blitz). I really liked a few tracks on Frequency and Amplitude, but most I didn't care for that much. I never got addicted to Frequency or Amplitude (which I still have, so I may give them a spin for comparison). And loving music is a major reason I play these games in the first place.

Only you or people you are friends with can see that.

XBLA friends, right? Because I see the names of people who are definitely not my friends on Facebook.

[Mister Game]

XBLA friends, right? Because I see the names of people who are definitely not my friends on Facebook.

XBLA friends if they have also linked.

[Plaguefox]

If I understand this right, the recent change in the Blitz economy will satisfy my own play style, but does not address that the game is still designed so that people who aren't as good at these games as I am can still "run out" of gameplay and still have to resort to either unproductive grinding, real money spend, or external social networking to refuel the game. Acceptable in an F2P title, insulting in a paid game, no matter how forgiving you make the settings.

Then again, I might be misunderstanding the recent change, so someone tell me if I'm wrong about this. Remember: I like Harmonix, I'm not just out to shit on some company I have a vendetta against.

[gcubed]

You still need Facebook if you want to play with your friends, something which has been a standard feature of the Xbox for ten years.

yea, so not fixed.

Lets take a system that has worked for over a decade and slap in a social network firewall for no reason.

[jgkspsx]

Then again, I might be misunderstanding the recent change, so someone tell me if I'm wrong about this. Remember: I like Harmonix, I'm not just out to shit on some company I have a vendetta against.

IMO the new balance is great. And it actually provides an incentive for score wars. Now if only Score Wars only let you challenge random people on songs they own...

[BigDug13]

So in order to play this game on Xbox and PS3 the proper way, you also need a PC for facebook? I think this is the first Xbox/PS3 game that requires a second machine.

[FyreWulff]

So in order to play this game on Xbox and PS3 the proper way, you also need a PC for facebook? I think this is the first Xbox/PS3 game that requires a second machine.

Xbox has a facebook app and a browser (in beta, but public soon), PS3 has a browser.

[AlphaTwo00]

they fixed it? SO they removed the stupid need to create a fake facebook account?

It's not needed. I don't get why some of you are having trouble with that.

I'm seeing people who I have on XBL who didn't link their game to a facebook account, and I cam just as easily send a score war challenge to them within the game.

[KieferCrimson]

Someone should edit the thread title and add: NO FACEBOOK ACCOUNT REQUIRED to prevent further outrage.

Why would come in here and tell lies?

Fine, Facebook account feature optional?

[Roto13]

It's not needed. I don't get why some of you are having trouble with that. I'm seeing people who I have on XBL who didn't link their game to a facebook account, and I cam just as easily send a score war challenge to them within the game.

Someone should edit the thread title and add: NO FACEBOOK ACCOUNT REQUIRED to prevent further outrage.

Why would come in here and tell lies?

[jgkspsx]

I'm seeing people who I have on XBL who didn't link their game to a facebook account, and I cam just as easily send a score war challenge to them within the game.

You can challenge somebody on your friends list to any particular song you know you both have?

[Ozone]

So in order to play this game on Xbox and PS3 the proper way, you also need a PC for facebook? I think this is the first Xbox/PS3 game that requires a second machine.

It's not "required" per se, but it's an optional enhancement to the experience.

Also having a second machine will be much more common once Xbox SmartGlass launches.

[Baconsammy]

I can see unlocking powerups as you progress initially, but why make people buy those powerups each time when the entire point of the game is simply to get high scores? It's just silly and completely unnecessary. If the powerups are all good and there's a reason you might want to use specific ones at specific times, then that's the challenge. The challenge shouldnt be figuring out which powerups to use, and then playing songs you dont want to play just to earn the right to be able to buy those powerups.

[web01]

The coin system is broken by design, Harmonix are scum.
The way some of you defenders are trying to spin this is a disgrace.

I shouldn't have to grind songs or link to a Facebook account to play a score attack game.

[Mr. Enigma]

Exactly. I just want to play the damn game. All the social networking/coin bullshit just makes me regret the purchase.

[aku:jiki]

Not really getting the praise for the coin system fixes... You're still losing coins if you don't gold-star it and, to me, that's the goal of the game and I'll only touch a previously gold-starred song again if I'm really bored. So I'll still be slowly losing money as I practice songs I haven't golded yet? Meh.

Also not feeling Score Wars because the only ones I have received have required DLC. I sent one out that the other person didn't play...

I seem to recall you personally made similar comments though, justifying the fact that power-ups are all locked at the start because shooters slowly give you better guns. That's precisely as bad as the Zelda comment.

That's an extra-bad analogy because any FPS that gives you guns that are actually better, and not just different for different preferences or situations, has a broken progression system. Nothing more boring than starting an FPS where the high-level players have multiple heat-seeking rocket launchers and titanium body armor and you have combat fatigues and a knife.

[toythatkills]

Not really getting the praise for the coin system fixes... You're still losing coins if you don't gold-star it and, to me, that's the goal of the game and I'll only touch a previously gold-starred song again if I'm really bored. So I'll still be slowly losing money as I practice songs I haven't golded yet? Meh.

Presumably you're still getting double coins first time you play a song though, and assuming you five-star it on a sight-read, which is generally easy enough, you're making 450 coins profit the first time you play it even with a full loadout. That should cover any further losses until you gold-star it.

[aku:jiki]

Presumably you're still getting double coins first time you play a song though, and assuming you five-star it on a sight-read, which is generally easy enough, you're making 450 coins profit the first time you play it even with a full loadout. That should cover any further losses until you gold-star it.

I'm still refusing to count DLC-based methods as viable, though. Don't turn into thekonamicode now, TTK!

[littleornothin]

Didn't find when searched;

I'm experience a massive slowdown when deploying overdrive for instance Roadrage when theres a lot of notes and/or in Blitz mode. :\

Anyone else? I'm on PS3 obviously ;)

[Mister Game]

Didn't find when searched; I'm experience a massive slowdown when deploying overdrive for instance Roadrage when theres a lot of notes and/or in Blitz mode. :\ Anyone else? I'm on PS3 obviously ;)

There's one visual hitch that we know about: when the track curves way up above the city (We call it "The Overpass") there's a little bit of stuttering.

This actually isn't a framerate hit, it's the camera not being smooth about moving up and down. (Not trying to make excuses, just explain why we didn't catch in during optimization.)

Is that maybe what you say? "Massive" slowdowns isn't something that I've heard much about, nor did we see big persistent performance issues on either platform.

[2&2]

I shouldn't have to grind songs or link to a Facebook account to play a score attack game.

I tried to give it a chance, but this is how I feel. Not to mention the FB app is busted for me and doesn't load from my FB account. So I can't use it if I wanted to.

[SuperPac]

I tried to give it a chance, but this is how I feel. Not to mention the FB app is busted for me and doesn't load from my FB account. So I can't use it if I wanted to.

You on a Mac or using Safari? Try Chrome. Worked for me.

[2&2]

You on a Mac or using Safari? Try Chrome. Worked for me.

I've tried Firefox, Chrome, and Safari. It worked fine at one point. Now it won't load.

[SuperPac]

I can see unlocking powerups as you progress initially, but why make people buy those powerups each time when the entire point of the game is simply to get high scores? It's just silly and completely unnecessary. If the powerups are all good and there's a reason you might want to use specific ones at specific times, then that's the challenge. The challenge shouldnt be figuring out which powerups to use, and then playing songs you dont want to play just to earn the right to be able to buy those powerups.

So you want an RPG where all the items in shops are free because it's completely unnecessary to have to grind/earn coins to buy them and progress. Or a shooter where you have unlimited ammo and health packs, because the point of the game is shooting and it doesn't make sense to limit health or ammunition. That's basically what your post is saying.

RBB would be very plain without the coins system and social hooks. If I could just use any power-up I wanted, then what's the point? It'd be just as boring as you and others say the game is without using powerups. There's no risk to you to keep retrying and retrying and retrying a song for a high score. There'd be no reason for you to try songs you haven't already played. There'd be no reason for you to hook your account up to Facebook and participate in the social goals. There'd be no reason for you to accept any Score War invitations. And all of those things get you more invested in the game.

Well, maybe not you. But, these are all things that social games use to great success.

[Roto13]

So you want an RPG where all the items in shops are free because it's completely unnecessary to have to grind/earn coins to buy them and progress. Or a shooter where you have unlimited ammo and health packs, because the point of the game is shooting and it doesn't make sense to limit health or ammunition. That's basically what your post is saying.

I want an RPG where I don't have to grind for gold for items or MP for spells and I can still use them enough for the game to be fun to play. And I want a shooter where I don't have to go out of my way to search every nook and cranny for ammo and still end up running out of bullets unless I play a few levels using only melee attacks.

RBB would be very plain without the coins system and social hooks. If I could just use any power-up I wanted, then what's the point? It'd be just as boring as you and others say the game is without using powerups. There's no risk to you to keep retrying and retrying and retrying a song for a high score. There'd be no reason for you to try songs you haven't already played. There'd be no reason for you to hook your account up to Facebook and participate in the social goals. There'd be no reason for you to accept any Score War invitations. And all of those things get you more invested in the game.

1) What's wrong with retrying and retrying a song for a high score? It's a score attack game. That's the point.

2) You shouldn't have to be coerced into playing a song. I've played every song in every rhythm and music game I own. Why wouldn't I?

3) Yes, without coins there'd be no reason to do all of the annoying social stuff. Another strike against coins.

[SuperPac]

1) What's wrong with retrying and retrying a song for a high score? It's a score attack game. That's the point.

Nothing! But, if it costs you coins then there's added pressure/risk each time you are unsuccessful. Have you never played Bejeweled Blitz / Solitaire Blitz / etc.? These are score attack games with the exact same mechanic (though perhaps more sinister as they will also sell you coins, which Harmonix is not doing here).

2) You shouldn't have to be coerced into playing a song. I've played every song in every rhythm and music game I own. Why wouldn't I?

So you think you would have played as many different songs in RBB to now if you weren't encouraged to do so via the double-coin bonus? (BTW this also insures that more songs are populated with decent leaderboards too.) Achievements work in a similar way, encouraging you to do something you might not normally.

3) Yes, without coins there'd be no reason to do all of the annoying social stuff. Another strike against coins.

In your opinion, yes. But there are people (myself included) that are enjoying the annoying social stuff and am glad it's there. (Though, I would be happier if there were some way to accept/see status of goals IN the game.)

[AlphaTwo00]

You can challenge somebody on your friends list to any particular song you know you both have?

Yes.

Here, the most absurd test: A friend I know just tried the demo on 360 (so he didn't link his profile to the Facebook app), and I was able to see the 3 demo songs he played, and challenge him on it (obviously a waste of time), but was doable.

[Montresor]

The coin system is broken by design, Harmonix are scum. The way some of you defenders are trying to spin this is a disgrace. I shouldn't have to grind songs or link to a Facebook account to play a score attack game.

Jesus Christ, this is unnecessarily harsh. =/ I think it's a big improvement to have 550-coin loadouts + earn 100 coins per star, when almost everyone in the world will be capable of 5-starring a song on a sightread w/ a full loadout.

However, you will still slowly (much more slowly than before) lose coins replaying old songs if you don't gold-star them, at a pace of 50 coins per song. In the old system, you could have potentially lost 450 coins per song (earning 300 coins while spending 750 coins).

I think what they should do is make a full loadout cost 500 coins instead.

[Baconsammy]

So you want an RPG where all the items in shops are free because it's completely unnecessary to have to grind/earn coins to buy them and progress. Or a shooter where you have unlimited ammo and health packs, because the point of the game is shooting and it doesn't make sense to limit health or ammunition. That's basically what your post is saying. RBB would be very plain without the coins system and social hooks. If I could just use any power-up I wanted, then what's the point? It'd be just as boring as you and others say the game is without using powerups.

Somehow Donkey Kong, Pacman, Asteroids, Geometry Wars (I can go on and on) survived. They're also highscore games. The joy in playing them is attempting to beat your high score, or to beat the high score of others. Ditto Guitar Hero when it came out. Unlock songs, keep playing same songs over and over in an attempt to score higher. The coin system is a poorly designed layer that didn't need to be there.

[Roto13]

Nothing! But, if it costs you coins then there's added pressure/risk each time you are unsuccessful. Have you never played Bejeweled Blitz / Solitaire Blitz / etc.? These are score attack games with the exact same mechanic (though perhaps more sinister as they will also sell you coins, which Harmonix is not doing here).

Why do you keep acting like this is a good thing? This is why I played Bejeweled 2 and not Bejeweled Blitz or any other annoying social game.

So you think you would have played as many different songs in RBB to now if you weren't encouraged to do so via the double-coin bonus? (BTW this also insures that more songs are populated with decent leaderboards too.) Achievements work in a similar way, encouraging you to do something you might not normally.

Of course I would have played all of my songs. Like I said, I've played all of my songs in all of my rhythm and music games because it makes no sense to just ignore some of them. And achievements don't work in a similar way because achievements aren't forced down your throat.

In your opinion, yes. But there are people (myself included) that are enjoying the annoying social stuff and am glad it's there. (Though, I would be happier if there were some way to accept/see status of goals IN the game.)

Well thanks so much for getting your shitty free social game mechanics in my paid downloads. If they wanted to make a Facebook game they should have made a Facebook game.

[web01]

Jesus Christ, this is unnecessarily harsh. =/ I think it's a big improvement to have 550-coin loadouts + earn 100 coins per star, when almost everyone in the world will be capable of 5-starring a song on a sightread w/ a full loadout. However, you will still slowly (much more slowly than before) lose coins replaying old songs if you don't gold-star them, at a pace of 50 coins per song. In the old system, you could have potentially lost 450 coins per song (earning 300 coins while spending 750 coins). I think what they should do is make a full loadout cost 500 coins instead.

Well sometimes the truth is harsh. The problem with gaming at the moment is not enough people are calling out companies for their bullshit and anti consumer practices. Instead you have fools on the Internet that will defend anything to the death.

Harmonix knew exactly what they were doing when they designed the coin economy: trying to milk customers for DLC through the coin incentive, free Facebook advertising and artificially increase the game play length through grinding. Regardless of the band aid fix you still lose coins and the competitive aspect is still locked behind forced Facebook integration.
If they had more faith in the quality of their own game they wouldn't have resorted to these tactics.

Maybe Harmonix is hurting for money now that they are independent, they would be much better off releasing a Rockband 3 lite/free version and getting people back to the music genre and driving new DLC sales that way.

[Montresor]

Well sometimes the truth is harsh. The problem with gaming at the moment is not enough people are calling out companies for their bullshit and anti consumer practices. Instead you have fools on the Internet that will defend anything to the death. Harmonix knew exactly what they were doing when they designed the coin economy: trying to milk customers for DLC through the coin incentive, free Facebook advertising and artificially increase the game play length through grinding. Regardless of the band aid fix you still lose coins and the competitive aspect is still locked behind forced Facebook integration. If they had more faith in the quality of their own game they wouldn't have resorted to these tactics.

Well you're a real piece of work if you're insinuating that I'm a fool that will defend anything.

I've criticized the coin system and the Facebook integration before. I don't like it, but I tolerate it. In fact, I hated the coin system before, but I do appreciate that Harmonix listened to feedback and made the coin losses much more palatable.

[SuperPac]

Somehow Donkey Kong, Pacman, Asteroids, Geometry Wars (I can go on and on) survived. They're also highscore games. The joy in playing them is attempting to beat your high score, or to beat the high score of others. Ditto Guitar Hero when it came out. Unlock songs, keep playing same songs over and over in an attempt to score higher. The coin system is a poorly designed layer that didn't need to be there.

I will say that Donkey Kong, Pac-Man and Asteroids were all originally arcade games where you DID spend coins to beat your high score. That was their primary means of making money back in those days. :) (And I disagree that the coin system in RBB is badly implemented so...)

Why do you keep acting like this is a good thing? This is why I played Bejeweled 2 and not Bejeweled Blitz or any other annoying social game.

The 2.6 million users that play Bejeweled Blitz each day beg to differ.

Of course I would have played all of my songs. Like I said, I've played all of my songs in all of my rhythm and music games because it makes no sense to just ignore some of them. And achievements don't work in a similar way because achievements aren't forced down your throat.

Neither is using coins unless you're playing for score/leaderboard position. In which case Achievements are the same because you don't have to complete all of them, but you get achievement points for doing so. And that can be a significant driver in getting people to play differently.

Well thanks so much for getting your shitty free social game mechanics in my paid downloads. If they wanted to make a Facebook game they should have made a Facebook game.

I would bet that you're going to see more of this in the future. This is not the last time nor the first time this has been done. (Pretty sure you've been able to get in-game rewards for playing FB versions of console games from UbiSoft before, at least. Doesn't Halo Waypoint have something similar-ish?) It's just a little more front and center here than previously.

[Roto13]

I will say that Donkey Kong, Pac-Man and Asteroids were all originally arcade games where you DID spend coins to beat your high score. That was their primary means of making money back in those days. :) (And I disagree that the coin system in RBB is badly implemented so...) The 2.6 million users that play Bejeweled Blitz each day beg to differ. Neither is using coins unless you're playing for score/leaderboard position. In which case Achievements are the same because you don't have to complete all of them, but you get achievement points for doing so. And that can be a significant driver in getting people to play differently. I would bet that you're going to see more of this in the future. This is not the last time nor the first time this has been done. (Pretty sure you've been able to get in-game rewards for playing FB versions of console games from UbiSoft before, at least. Doesn't Halo Waypoint have something similar-ish?) It's just a little more front and center here than previously.

Do you have an idea how many people have bought Bejewled 2? Using coins is mandatory if you want to have fun. The game's boring without power ups. And the optional Facebook stuff for those other games is just that. Completely optional. You could play a Facebook game to raise your assassins' stats in Assassin's Creed Brotherhood but you weren't missing by ignoring it, and you could still easily max out their levels by just playing the game on your PS360/PC. Meanwhile, if I want to have fun when I play songs in Rock Band Blitz, I need to play without the thing that makes the game not suck in the first place, or do Facebook challenges that I can't necessarily do without buying DLC even if I wanted to play every David Grohl song in existence.

[web01]

Well you're a real piece of work if you're insinuating that I'm a fool that will defend anything. I've criticized the coin system and the Facebook integration before. I don't like it, but I tolerate it. In fact, I hated the coin system before, but I do appreciate that Harmonix listened to feedback and made the coin losses much more palatable.

I am obviously speaking in general terms do not try make it personal.