[El Sloth]

Do they really have a quota?

I'm no cop so I obviously speak about this with any authority, but from I understand from conversations with actual cops it seems to depend on the precinct and whoever is in charge. The majority seem to live by the rule that (paraphrased), "if you're not bringing in at least 1 or 2 a month, then you're probably not doing your job. This is a city of 8 mil +. There's always someone somewhere breaking some law."

But then again, there are things like the This American Life segment.

[strata8]

Why are there still trains where train cars don't have vestibules? What rickety ass shit are these cities running?

The oldest trains in Sydney have uncovered walkways between carriages:


...and we're definitely allowed to use them to cross to another carriage, even whilst the train is moving.

Most trains have something like this:

[LeBrick James]

That's a fineable offense? That kinda sucks.

[Ubersnug]

The one that says you're not allowed to move between cars unless it's an emergency and is posted up EVERYWHERE. And the cop did you a favor believe it or not, that could have easily been a court summons, at which point not only are you paying a ticket but you have to lose an entire day of your life showing up.

That's just ridiculous really. In the UK, on surface trains, you can move between carriages as feely and as frequently as you want. What's their justification for such a stupid rule?

[MickeyKnox]

I don't know, man. I always hear people using the "quotas to fill" excuse but they never prove it.

Let's not get crazy now, his particular claim is complete bullshit but NYPD quotas are a very real and very frightening thing.

I've posted this several times on GAF but size and scope of it means it never gets picked up by any other posters:

This story ran in the Village Voice a couple summers ago and made my piss boil.

The NYPD tapes:

http://www.villagevoice.com/2010-05-...81st-precinct/

If you aren't in the mood for a huge print expose then there's a nice quick summary of it from This American Life:

http://www.thisamericanlife.org/radi...n-silent?act=2

[MickeyKnox]

That's just ridiculous really. In the UK, on surface trains, you can move between carriages as feely and as frequently as you want. What's their justification for such a stupid rule?

The fact that you can be very easily maimed or killed doing it?

[salva]

Let's not get crazy now, his particular claim is complete bullshit but NYPD quotas are a very real and very frightening thing. I've posted this several times on GAF but size and scope of it means it never gets picked up by any other posters: This story ran in the Village Voice a couple summers ago and made my piss boil. The NYPD tapes: http://www.villagevoice.com/2010-05-...81st-precinct/ If you aren't in the mood for a huge print expose then there's a nice quick summary of it from This American Life: http://www.thisamericanlife.org/radi...n-silent?act=2

dafuq? That's terrible.

[MickeyKnox]

dafuq? That's terrible.

I live in that neighborhood, shit is a fucking nightmare

[El Sloth]

That's just ridiculous really. In the UK, on surface trains, you can move between carriages as feely and as frequently as you want. What's their justification for such a stupid rule?

Nothing serious really.

In 2005, the MTA made it illegal for riders to cross in between train cars, as riders can slip and fall beneath the train.

NY Times Article from '07:

There, she came across the name of Leroy Lawrence, 51, of Manhattan, who the police say has made a career of a particular kind of subway purse snatching. Last week, he was arrested and charged with robbery in one of the recent crimes on the No. 7 line. Mr. Lawrence’s arrest comes as the police have tried to combat subway crime by increasing their focus on people who ride or walk between cars of a train. “We’ve tried to really hammer down on moving between cars,” said Chief James P. Hall, commander of the police Transit Bureau. “A lot of bad guys move between cars, really, prowling for victims.”

The result has been a sharp increase in the number of tickets handed out for moving or riding between cars, to 3,600 last year from 700 in 2005. This year, the police have handed out 1,955 such summonses. The crackdown has produced other dividends for the police. Among those stopped for moving or riding between cars, the police have arrested 126 people with outstanding warrants. They also arrested four people who were carrying loaded guns and charged 45 people with carrying illegal knives including switchblades. Thanks in part to such tactics, arrests of all types have surged in the subway this year, even as the number of major crimes reported at stations and on subway cars has dropped. There were 351 major felonies reported in the subway system in the first two months of this year, compared with 383 during the same period last year. Meanwhile, the police made 5,444 arrests in January and February, compared with 4,291 in the same two months last year, a 27 percent increase. Slightly more than half the increase has come from a greater number of arrests for fare evasion, according to the police.

[MightyKAC]

It's a shitty shitty law and a shitty shitty way to get money from people.

Sounds like if they actually gave a fuck they would put effort and resources into updating their trains out of the damn stone age instead of fleecing ordinary people out of their money.

[catfish]

How do you expect GAF to react

with a big 'wtf you can't change cars in a train?'

that shit is normal. Rule sounds stupid.

[Wazzim]

that's not so bad. my friend spent a day or two in jail for doing that.

it's like you guys all live in Somalia or something

weird ass laws

[Jipan]

Maybe I didn't say it like that, fine. It was more like, "Man, whatever, this really sucks." Anyway, I feel better right now. Thanks, GAF.

I think it's common sense that you're not supposed to move in between the cars at all especially when the train is stationary. If you wanted to move between the cars that badly, you should've just ran out the car and into the next one; that's what I always do.You live and learn.

On the 7 train whenever I'm going to school, the cops check the train from time to time to check if people are doing it. I've seen people do it when the cops aren't there but it's stupid. You're as vulnerable as I am to getting a ticket; it's as easy as that. Why should you get let off easily as opposed to the next guy? I mean $75 is really not that bad so consider the fact that you got let off the hook fairly easily.

By the way, slightly off-topic, but I hope to see you at this month's meet up; I seem to recall you expressing interest before. Unless you're super busy or something.

[MrOogieBoogie]

I think it's common sense that you're not supposed to move in between the cars at all especially when the train is stationary. If you wanted to move between the cars that badly, you should've just ran out the car and into the next one; that's what I always do.You live and learn. On the 7 train whenever I'm going to school, the cops check the train from time to time to check if people are doing it. I've seen people do it when the cops aren't there but it's stupid. You're as vulnerable as I am to getting a ticket; it's as easy as that. Why should you get let off easily as opposed to the next guy? I mean $75 is really not that bad so consider the fact that you got let off the hook fairly easily. By the way, slightly off-topic, but I hope to see you at this month's meet up; I seem to recall you expressing interest before. Unless you're super busy or something.

Yeah, I know, it's just that I've also had a lot of other stuff piled on me lately, and now this, so I sort of just lost it a bit. I posted this thread in the heat of the moment. I've since calmed down. This was like some terrible icing on a terrible cake. Sorry for the LiveJournal, GAF. :P

And when exactly is the next meet-up?

[El Sloth]

This thread makes me seem like the MTA Defense Force. Jeez, you guys are unreasonable.

It's a shitty shitty law and a shitty shitty way to get money from people. Sounds like if they actually gave a fuck they would put effort and resources into updating their trains out of the damn stone age instead of fleecing ordinary people out of their money.

This is silly. This is the exact thing the MTA has been doing for a while now. If there's anything to bitch about then it should be the yet another incoming fare increase and the talk about taking away the bonus we get when we buy +$10 metro card.

Edit: Not to mention they have huge financial troubles. Didn't they receive some pretty significant budget cuts just two years ago? Then there's this:

The total cost to the operating budget of financing the 2010-2014 capital program could reach $33 billion over the term of the loans, which is nearly $13 billion more than the currently approved financing program.

http://www.osc.state.ny.us/reports/m...pt-11-2012.pdf

[Zilch]

The only people I see changing train cars on the NYC subway look like assholes. Sorry you got caught.

edit: by assholes, I mean "poor people"... who ironically can't afford a mere $75 fine.

[Roger Danish]

The only people I see changing train cars on the NYC subway look like assholes. Sorry you got caught. edit: by assholes, I mean "poor people"... who ironically can't afford a mere $75 fine.

Wow.

[MrOogieBoogie]

The only people I see changing train cars on the NYC subway look like assholes. Sorry you got caught. edit: by assholes, I mean "poor people"... who ironically can't afford a mere $75 fine.

wat

[Zilch]

Hell even the beggars are smart enough to only change train cars at stops, the legal way!

Cool dudes wanna break the rules I guess.

[Mammoth Jones]

Christ. I didn't even know it was a crime to move between train cars in the city. I don't take the subway though. But I do take the train into Penn every day and we all move between cars despite the "no moving between cars!" sign. Not one fuck is given.

[Angry Fork]

This happened on the L train to me, it was infuriating. What made it worse is the train wasn't even moving but he still had to be a dick and wouldn't let me go. I went into another car and he was writing a ticket for another guy who did the same thing. I could have made a run for it but decided to do the 'right' thing which I completely regret. 75$ down the hole over something ridiculously stupid that everyone does without issue. It's like giving tickets for jay walking.

[MightyKAC]

This thread makes me seem like the MTA Defense Force. Jeez, you guys are unreasonable. This is silly. This is the exact thing the MTA has been doing for a while now. If there's anything to bitch about then it should be the yet another incoming fare increase and the talk about taking away the bonus we get when we buy +$10 metro card.

How is that a justification for ANYTHING? If the practice is unsafe then instead of financially penalizing the people for doing then why not accommodate your customers by making it safe. Changing train cars is done all over the world every single day, yet this place makes it a crime? All because they can't be bothered to make a few changes in the name of safety?

Bullshit law is bullshit.

[El Sloth]

How is that a justification for ANYTHING? If the practice is unsafe then instead of financially penalizing the people for doing then why not accommodate your customers by making it safe. Changing train cars is done all over the world every single day, yet this place makes it a crime? All because they can't be bothered to make a few changes in the name of safety? Bullshit law is bullshit.

What the hell are you even arguing about? I was specifically responding to your claim that the MTA wasn't doing anything to modernize the aging subway fleet, which they are.

This happened on the L train to me, it was infuriating. What made it worse is the train wasn't even moving but he still had to be a dick and wouldn't let me go. I went into another car and he was writing a ticket for another guy who did the same thing. I could have made a run for it but decided to do the 'right' thing which I completely regret. 75$ down the hole over something ridiculously stupid that everyone does without issue. It's like giving tickets for jay walking.

My mother has gotten one of these. $150 I think it was. I got charged less for crossing a highway ($75).

[Puddles]

That seems like a pretty ridiculous law to me.

Fucking nanny state.

[MightyKAC]

What the hell are you even arguing about? I was specifically responding to your claim that the MTA wasn't doing anything to modernize the aging subway fleet, which they are. My mother has gotten one of these. $150 I think it was. I got charged less for crossing a highway ($75).

Then I guess I misunderstood you, sorry.

But if they really wanted to modernize their train fleet, something as simple as making it safer to traverse from car to car would have been a GREAT place to start. I suspect that drawing revenue from keeping it UNsafe probably keeps it pretty low on the list of priorities.

[AwesomePossum]

Shit, I used to move through every traincar until I was at the last one back when I'd take the subway real late at night. There was something freeing about doing so. I've only realized it was against the law this year. Surprised I've never gotten a ticket myself, especially considering I live in the city of the ticket-fetishists at the NYPD.

I did once get a $160 ticket for using a senior citizen metrocard an old guy gave me though. The policeman was far as fuck from me too, like he smelled the ticketing opportunity from a mile away. I was gracious considering I could've went to jail for that, and I was shitting bullets since I had a bowl packed with weed in my bag. I've never been so happy to get a ticket in my life.

[El Sloth]

That seems like a pretty ridiculous law to me. Fucking nanny state.

Oh man, if you think this is bad...

City Bans Big, Sugary Drinks at Eateries, Theaters

New York City's health board has passed a rule banning super-sized, sugary drinks at restaurants, concession stands and other eateries. The regulation passed by the Board of Health on Thursday puts a 16-ounce size limit on cups and bottles of non-diet soda, sweetened teas and other calorie-packed beverages.

Bloomberg just doesn't give a fuck anymore.

Then I guess I misunderstood you, sorry. But if they really wanted to modernize their train fleet, something as simple as making it safer to traverse from car to car would have been a GREAT place to start. I suspect that drawing revenue from keeping it UNsafe probably keeps it pretty low on the list of priorities.

Oh, no doubt. I really don't see the MTA having any incentive to make the passage safer or the city repealing the law since it's easy money. I'd imagine a high profile death, a lawsuit, and a public push towards having the safer passageways that other modern trains have would have to happen before any inkling of change. Which is bullshit.

Sorry if I wasn't clear enough in my other post.

[waypoetic]

Ridiculous. Moving through those doors and between traincars is a must on old ass trains if you wanna, say, get to the bistro/cafeteria.

Is this a commuter-train? Like, sit your ass down and dont move around and get off when it's your stop...?

'Merica sure is weird sometimes.

[Ubersnug]

The fact that you can be very easily maimed or killed doing it?

Isn't the space between carriages sealed?



The door you see in the image above has an expanding 'corridor' that creates a contained area to allow passengers to cross between carriages safely. I'm guessing the trains in your area doesn't have this?

[CadetMahoney]

I don't understand what the crime is. Are you not supposed to move between train cars? I've never heard of such a thing being illegal.

Yea, neither have I, but I'm in the UK so that must explain it.

[Filth]

Isn't the space between carriages sealed? The door you see in the image above has an expanding 'corridor' that creates a contained area to allow passengers to cross between carriages safely. I'm guessing the trains in your area doesn't have this?

yeah, if you walk through on a nyc subway and the train turns sharply their is a chance of falling into the tracks / under the train. the only thing stopping you is a thick chain.

the rule is in place because people go in between carts to smoke cigarettes and do drugs. in doing so some people have died. so they just made it that no one can pass through the carts.


edit: should op have been given a ticket? prob not ... he seems like a decent person and some discrepancy could have been used. but we're in the middle of the month and if the cop is low on #'s he has to do what he has to do. thats just the way the job is.

[vicktormerv]

I take the red line at least once or twice a week, Im still not sure what you did wrong. Did you go through the middle doors? Those are almost always locked. Or from one car to the other, which, not sure how thats wrong in any way.

[Puddles]

Honestly, what else are you supposed to do when some hobo starts talking to himself really loudly or when someone gets on the train smelling like shit?

[Maddocks]

are you saying that movies have been lying to me this whole time?

[Johnny Cage In The Shower]

are you saying that movies have been lying to me this whole time?

It all depends on where you do this, the State the movie suppose to take place in etc.

This here is totally legit.

[Natetan]

Isn't the space between carriages sealed? The door you see in the image above has an expanding 'corridor' that creates a contained area to allow passengers to cross between carriages safely. I'm guessing the trains in your area doesn't have this?

look earlier in the thread, they show what an MTA subway car looks like. It's just like the london tube.

the sharp corners excuse sounds lame. get some new trains.

[Filth]

look earlier in the thread, they show what an MTA subway car looks like. It's just like the london tube. the sharp corners excuse sounds lame. get some new trains.

Not the mayor. I can't just get new trains. Plus he's busy making large sodas illegal.

[Megalodactyl]

That sucks, definitely sounds like you got a quota ticket.

[DBT85]

He was fat! Oh the indignity.

[soepje]

Meanwhile in Sweden.

Surveillance cameras in Sweden catch man robbing and ABANDONING drunken victim on subway tracks

Read more: http://www.nydailynews.com/news/worl...#ixzz26Qz8X1Wm
http://www.nydailynews.com/news/worl...icle-1.1159296

[Ingueferroque]

Start saving and stop buying games, $75 fine sucks but shouldn't be impossible..

[rCIZZLE]

The fact that you can be very easily maimed or killed doing it?

If it's a threat to you then why does the city require $75 if caught doing it? I'd think the threat of maiming is worse than a ticket anyways lol.

[soepje]

If it's a threat to you then why does the city require $75 if caught doing it? I'd think the threat of maiming is worse than a ticket anyways lol.

To cover the clean up expenses of brains and blood of the ones fallen.

[PumpkinPie]

That's just ridiculous really. In the UK, on surface trains, you can move between carriages as feely and as frequently as you want. What's their justification for such a stupid rule?

+1. Why don't they just use trains like ours with no gap between the carriages?

[Cosmic Dreams]

Sorry to hear that, OP.

If it makes you feel any better, I got a $275 ticket from a junior cop for cali stopping on an empty two-way street in an empty state park at like 6 in the afternoon. (There was literally us, and two or three cars parked near the lake but the whole place was a ghost town) Fucker hid in the dirt area off road just to get me.

Instead of giving me a warning, he firmly stated I was "endangering the well being of everyone who comes to the park and could've ran someone over" and that my ticket is the consequence to pay...and all I did was a momentary stop. Didn't speed or anything.

Let me state that this guy forgot his lines to tell me when he pulled me over. What a fucking moron.

[Joni]

If it's a threat to you then why does the city require $75 if caught doing it? I'd think the threat of maiming is worse than a ticket anyways lol.

Costs incurred to the train schedule because you need to be cleaned up. And apparantly it also works to easily identify purse thieves roaming from car to car.

[Neki]

It's not even possible to move in between train cars where I live, I have to get off the train, and then enter at the entrance of the next car. lol. Oh Canada, you're so awesome.

[Skilotonn]

I was thinking how is this illegal until I saw the pics/videos in here - I haven't been in NY since I was a kid so I didn't know there was nothing between the cars unlike the trains we have.

Well, at least you didn't expect anyone to sympathize with you, you messed up.

[Hazaro]

I really, really don't, man. To put as simply as possible, I live check-to-check, and barely at that. $75 for me is a huge deal. And it sucks so much it's for as something as harmless as walking through car doors on a train that isn't even in motion.

Then prove it's a financial hardship and tell them your story and contest it.

[rCIZZLE]

Costs incurred to the train schedule because you need to be cleaned up. And apparantly it also works to easily identify purse thieves roaming from car to car.

People dying as a result of moving between stationary train cars must have been a problem then. The more you know.