• Register
  • TOS
  • Privacy
  • @NeoGAF

mattp
Member
(02-04-2013, 07:30 PM)
mattp's Avatar
i hope they don't change the buttons. the colors are useful in games with prompts. makes it easier to recognize the button. color + shape

edit: this is assuming they change the icons in games to be monochrome as well, which would make sense cuz it would match teh controller
Mista Koo
Member
(02-04-2013, 07:31 PM)
Mista Koo's Avatar
New one for the new page:



Larger version - Comparison with the PS3 controller
  • The touch pad is clickable, click anywhere for start click bottom left for select (similar to the Macbook's touch pad).
  • Wider with longer handles.
  • Share button.
  • New shoulder buttons.
Noisepurge
Member
(02-04-2013, 07:36 PM)
Noisepurge's Avatar

Originally Posted by Mista Koo

Very nice!
Haunted
(02-04-2013, 08:32 PM)
Haunted's Avatar

Originally Posted by Arkham

I'm not talking about space, talking about usability. You're questioning why we should have a dpad when we have sticks to move the cursor, and I'm turning that around into why should we have dedicated cursor keys when we have a touchpad/mouse to move the cursor. The dpad offers very specific input advantages over sticks and buttons, not to mention merely being an additional method of input.

I'd say the difference between mouse/touchpad and arrow key menu navigation are much bigger than the difference between dpad and analogue stick menu navigation.

That said, I don't think we need arrow keys in particular on a keyboard. Any 4 buttons could take over the up/down/left/right duty (in fact, most keyboards even have a second set of arrow keys, on the numpad - these are pretty much unnecessary, imo).

Your second argument is much more interesting. What specific input advantages over sticks and buttons does the dpad offer and which genres make use of that?
Last edited by Haunted; 02-04-2013 at 08:36 PM.
dragonknight337
Junior Member
(02-04-2013, 08:47 PM)
dragonknight337's Avatar
I want colored buttons like 360 ^_^, looks good on the mockup. Or maybe like the one with the shapes in led.

I am sick to shit of the DS design, the last time it was comfortable was against the even more wretched claw. But if they at least make it bigger, and go 360 triggers with concave analogs with the left as primary position, it's cool.

Or at least offer that as an alternate separately/maybe interchangeable analogs/positions like the MLG controller. Otherwise, it's back to third party controllers again.
Ainaurdur
Member
(02-04-2013, 09:08 PM)
Ainaurdur's Avatar

Originally Posted by Haunted

Your second argument is much more interesting. What specific input advantages over sticks and buttons does the dpad offer and which genres make use of that?

Precise direction input. Especially useful when you need to input rapidly.
Easy answer is the Fighting genre. But the need is in other genres as well. The time it takes to tilt and release an analog stick is often too long, and will never be as good as a digital d-pad.
Role playing games are a big reason for me to keep the d-pad. Perhaps mainly for menu screens, when going through long item lists, d-pad means more precision in quickly getting to and stopping on what you want to select.
Movement in any 2D game is much better with a d-pad than an analog stick.

And this may sound odd, but I still prefer to play driving games like Gran Turismo 5, with the d-pad. Just feels like I have more precise control over my steering than I do when attempting to use an analog stick.

Originally Posted by dragonknight337

I am sick to shit of the DS design, the last time it was comfortable was against the even more wretched claw. But if they at least make it bigger, and go 360 triggers with concave analogs with the left as primary position, it's cool.

Or at least offer that as an alternate separately/maybe interchangeable analogs/positions like the MLG controller. Otherwise, it's back to third party controllers again.

It sounds like you just want an Xbox 360 controller to be compatible with the Playstation. That is basically what you described.
As for third party, that would possibly save you money. So it'd be a win anyway, right?

--- --- ---

I don't intend to be rude to anyone, we all have opinions and preferences as to what feels right in our hands, we are all different. But something I see that keeps popping up is a desire for one company to make their stuff just like the other company because it is better etc.

What I want to say is, perhaps some of us are simply Xbox players, some Nintendo, and others are Playstation. Play the system with the hardware that is more suited for you, and accept that other people like the other console's controller the way it is.
Yes, there is always room for improvement, no controller is perfect. Not saying that. Just that, we still need variety in our gaming choices.
Not one single box of stagnation. :)

Originally Posted by Cake Boss

So is it a touch screen or a touch pad thats on the back of the vita?

Touch Pad.
Last edited by Ainaurdur; 02-04-2013 at 09:16 PM.
Cake Boss
go home you're drunk
(02-04-2013, 09:14 PM)
Cake Boss's Avatar
So is it a touch screen or a touch pad thats on the back of the vita?
Jzero
Member
(02-04-2013, 09:17 PM)
Jzero's Avatar

Originally Posted by Cake Boss

So is it a touch screen or a touch pad thats on the back of the vita?

Dude it says it in the title.
RoboPlato
I'd be in the dick
(02-04-2013, 09:18 PM)
RoboPlato's Avatar

Originally Posted by Mista Koo

New one for the new page:



Larger version - Comparison with the PS3 controller

  • The touch pad is clickable, click anywhere for start click bottom left for select (similar to the Macbook's touch pad).
  • Wider with longer handles.
  • Share button.
  • New shoulder buttons.

The spacing of the buttons on this one look great. Love the layout.
Jack_AG
Banned
(02-04-2013, 09:20 PM)

Originally Posted by kairu



Took another stab trying to simplify things a bet and taking some other ideas from others (liked roboplato's select/start location!)

My fave. I like the fact that the entire face is flat and seamless and not raised around the d-pad and face buttons. Well done.

Very clean lines.
MuseManMike
Member
(02-04-2013, 09:27 PM)
MuseManMike's Avatar
Colorless buttons just look better.
dragonknight337
Junior Member
(02-04-2013, 09:30 PM)
dragonknight337's Avatar

Originally Posted by Ainaurdur


It sounds like you just want an Xbox 360 controller to be compatible with the Playstation. That is basically what you described.
As for third party, that would possibly save you money. So it'd be a win anyway, right?

well, no, unless I sell the one it comes with, >_>

I just want an improvement, and the 360 controller just happens to have the two things it needs desperately - triggers that don't require buying accessories to make them tolerable and to ditch the convex and go back to when they had it right with dual analog. I can tolerate symmetrical sticks, I just wish they were spaced further apart. Like this:


would be fine to me.

I did forget about the dpad. I hope they do adopt the vita d-pad and drop the segmented one.
Mista Koo
Member
(02-04-2013, 09:40 PM)
Mista Koo's Avatar

Originally Posted by RoboPlato

The spacing of the buttons on this one look great. Love the layout.

I love you <3

Originally Posted by MuseManMike

Colorless buttons just look better.

While colorless is indeed more stylish/modern, I hate this dull future where everything lacks color. Colors can be charming and refreshing when done right:



Call me shallow, but this was one of the reasons I picked the 360 over the PS3 :P
maquiladora
Member
(02-04-2013, 10:27 PM)
maquiladora's Avatar
CNET talkin about the gaf mockups.

http://news.cnet.com/8301-10797_3-57...roller-design/
MikeE21286
Member
(02-04-2013, 10:27 PM)
MikeE21286's Avatar

Originally Posted by Mista Koo

New one for the new page:



Larger version - Comparison with the PS3 controller

  • The touch pad is clickable, click anywhere for start click bottom left for select (similar to the Macbook's touch pad).
  • Wider with longer handles.
  • Share button.
  • New shoulder buttons.

This is far and away the best one I've seen yet.
weekend_warrior
Banned
(02-04-2013, 10:33 PM)
weekend_warrior's Avatar

Originally Posted by maquiladora

CNET talkin about the gaf mockups.

http://news.cnet.com/8301-10797_3-57...roller-design/

Awesome.
MikeE21286
Member
(02-04-2013, 10:37 PM)
MikeE21286's Avatar

Originally Posted by weekend_warrior

Awesome.

your avatar :lol
SpoonyBard
Member
(02-04-2013, 10:43 PM)
SpoonyBard's Avatar

Originally Posted by Mista Koo

I love you <3


While colorless is indeed more stylish/modern, I hate this dull future where everything lacks color. Colors can be charming and refreshing when done right:

Call me shallow, but this was one of the reasons I picked the 360 over the PS3 :P

And colours are easier to remember that just symbols. Well, it's easy to remember the X symbol and triangle symbol (mostly because it points up), but the circle and square are easy to mix up, especially as the symbols are almost the same colour. That's bad UI design right there...

Gamecube had actually the best main button layout in modern (?) consoles in pure UI design perspective. The buttons were colour, size, and shape coded in addition to letter. Now I'm not expecting Sony to copy that, and fully expect that we will be stuck with the old four symbols. Just making a random comment :)
Last edited by SpoonyBard; 02-04-2013 at 11:00 PM.
R10Neymarfan
Member
(02-04-2013, 10:50 PM)
R10Neymarfan's Avatar

Originally Posted by Mista Koo

New one for the new page:



Larger version - Comparison with the PS3 controller

  • The touch pad is clickable, click anywhere for start click bottom left for select (similar to the Macbook's touch pad).
  • Wider with longer handles.
  • Share button.
  • New shoulder buttons.

I actually like this one.
onQ123
Junior Member
(02-04-2013, 10:55 PM)
onQ123's Avatar

Originally Posted by maquiladora

CNET talkin about the gaf mockups.

http://news.cnet.com/8301-10797_3-57...roller-design/

Gaf is on a roll.
Arkham
The Amiga Brotherhood
(02-04-2013, 11:03 PM)
Arkham's Avatar

Originally Posted by Mista Koo

I love you <3


While colorless is indeed more stylish/modern, I hate this dull future where everything lacks color. Colors can be charming and refreshing when done right:



Call me shallow, but this was one of the reasons I picked the 360 over the PS3 :P

Sorry, it all comes across as too Fisher Price for me. Aesthetics were not an Xbox strong point in either generation. Gah, even the avatars looked like FP people.
waypoetic
Member
(02-05-2013, 03:03 AM)
waypoetic's Avatar

Originally Posted by Mista Koo

New one for the new page:



Larger version - Comparison with the PS3 controller

  • The touch pad is clickable, click anywhere for start click bottom left for select (similar to the Macbook's touch pad).
  • Wider with longer handles.
  • Share button.
  • New shoulder buttons.

I like it. I like it very much actually!
AuthenticM
Member
(02-05-2013, 03:18 AM)
AuthenticM's Avatar

Originally Posted by Mista Koo

New one for the new page:

This kicks ass. Now I'm going to be disappointed by whatever Sony comes up with.. Can you update this design to have six face buttons ? A Plus and a Minus button ? Make it look good; you can do it !
Pachterballs
Banned
(02-05-2013, 03:29 AM)
Pachterballs's Avatar

Originally Posted by Mista Koo

New one for the new page:



Larger version - Comparison with the PS3 controller

  • The touch pad is clickable, click anywhere for start click bottom left for select (similar to the Macbook's touch pad).
  • Wider with longer handles.
  • Share button.
  • New shoulder buttons.

dayummmn!!!!!


nice that this got written up on cnet.

http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showthread.php?t=511201

updated OP with most of the controllers
Last edited by Pachterballs; 02-05-2013 at 03:37 AM.
James Sawyer Ford
Member
(02-05-2013, 04:34 AM)
James Sawyer Ford's Avatar
I've never played a FPS on a gaming laptop, but is a touchpad an acceptable replacement for a mouse?

Will touchpad control be superior to the right analog stick?
bobbytkc
ADD New Gen Gamer
(02-05-2013, 04:38 AM)

Originally Posted by James Sawyer Ford

I've never played a FPS on a gaming laptop, but is a touchpad an acceptable replacement for a mouse?

Will touchpad control be superior to the right analog stick?

Nope. Considering its position, I think it is more for menus and interface rather than for direct control.
James Sawyer Ford
Member
(02-05-2013, 04:39 AM)
James Sawyer Ford's Avatar

Originally Posted by bobbytkc

Nope. Considering its position, I think it is more for menus and interface rather than for direct control.

I think most people have the mockups wrong. Touchpad is likely to take up a lot more real estate than most people are predicting.
bobbytkc
ADD New Gen Gamer
(02-05-2013, 04:42 AM)

Originally Posted by James Sawyer Ford

I think most people have the mockups wrong. Touchpad is likely to take up a lot more real estate than most people are predicting.

Possibly. Good thing we'll probably know in about 2 weeks. Can't imagine them revealing the console without showing off the controller as well.
RoboPlato
I'd be in the dick
(02-05-2013, 04:44 AM)
RoboPlato's Avatar

Originally Posted by James Sawyer Ford

I think most people have the mockups wrong. Touchpad is likely to take up a lot more real estate than most people are predicting.

Yeah, I think the "same size" part of the quote is misleading. Devs don't have the final controller yet. I expect it to at least be a good deal wider than the DS3.
James Sawyer Ford
Member
(02-05-2013, 04:49 AM)
James Sawyer Ford's Avatar

Originally Posted by RoboPlato

Yeah, I think the "same size" part of the quote is misleading. Devs don't have the final controller yet. I expect it to at least be a good deal wider than the DS3.

Exactly, the DS3 is not a controller that is ergonomically designed for a touchpad.

The whole controller will look substantially different and probably bear little resemblance to the dual shock form of old (as other rumors have suggested).

I think a controller that is around the same size as the Vita makes sense - touchpad only slightly smaller than the Vita's touch screen, larger buttons than the Vita, and of course places to rest the palm of your hand on either side. But I think the general layout will be similar in terms of button positioning, touch screen, and analog sticks.
TimeEffect
Member
(02-05-2013, 05:00 AM)
TimeEffect's Avatar

And the newwwwwwwwwwww GAF mockup champion.... Misttaaaaaa Koooooo
fixuis
Member
(02-05-2013, 05:02 AM)

Originally Posted by Mista Koo

New one for the new page:



Larger version - Comparison with the PS3 controller

  • The touch pad is clickable, click anywhere for start click bottom left for select (similar to the Macbook's touch pad).
  • Wider with longer handles.
  • Share button.
  • New shoulder buttons.

Sold! Best one yet. Love the fact that he battery indicator is up front as well!
weekend_warrior
Banned
(02-05-2013, 05:13 AM)
weekend_warrior's Avatar

Originally Posted by Mista Koo

New one for the new page:



Larger version - Comparison with the PS3 controller

  • The touch pad is clickable, click anywhere for start click bottom left for select (similar to the Macbook's touch pad).
  • Wider with longer handles.
  • Share button.
  • New shoulder buttons.

I must be the only one who doesn't like this mock-up. It just looks like a stretched DS3, the touchpad looks tiny and even smaller with the start/select and indicator taking up space, plus I really liked how the Vita style graphic looked on the others. I really like your previous mock-up though.
MuseManMike
Member
(02-05-2013, 05:14 AM)
MuseManMike's Avatar
I don't like it either.
Graphics Horse
graphics horse
graphics horse
does whatever a
graphics horse does
(02-05-2013, 05:16 AM)
Graphics Horse's Avatar

Originally Posted by James Sawyer Ford

Exactly, the DS3 is not a controller that is ergonomically designed for a touchpad.

The whole controller will look substantially different and probably bear little resemblance to the dual shock form of old (as other rumors have suggested).

I think a controller that is around the same size as the Vita makes sense - touchpad only slightly smaller than the Vita's touch screen, larger buttons than the Vita, and of course places to rest the palm of your hand on either side. But I think the general layout will be similar in terms of button positioning, touch screen, and analog sticks.

Can't see touchpad being more than 3.5 inch diagonal like a laptop touchpad.

Originally Posted by Mista Koo

New one for the new page:

I like the look of the circles but I'd prefer the top to be a straight line so the pad can be taller.
Last edited by Graphics Horse; 02-05-2013 at 05:18 AM.
kittens
Member
(02-05-2013, 05:17 AM)
kittens's Avatar
Nah, I really hope the Dual Shock gets a major revision. I don't want the same uncomfortable controller I've had to put up with for three console generations. Make it more ergonomic, please.
Slayer-33
Liverpool-2
(02-05-2013, 05:18 AM)
Slayer-33's Avatar

Originally Posted by MuseManMike

I don't like it either.

.
RoboPlato
I'd be in the dick
(02-05-2013, 05:19 AM)
RoboPlato's Avatar

Originally Posted by weekend_warrior

I must be the only one who doesn't like this mock-up. It just looks like a stretched DS3, the touchpad looks tiny and even smaller with the start/select and indicator taking up space, plus I really liked how the Vita style graphic looked on the others. I really like your previous mock-up though.

The stick, button placement, and grips look really great to me. It's only a slight change but it definitely seems more ergonimic. I also think the touch pad will be bigger and look more like the Vita one but I hope the handles look like this one.
Mista Koo
Member
(02-05-2013, 05:36 AM)
Mista Koo's Avatar

Originally Posted by fixuis

Love the fact that he battery indicator is up front as well!

Wait, I thought that was the player indicator? Isn't that what the red lights on the top were for?

Originally Posted by weekend_warrior

I must be the only one who doesn't like this mock-up. It just looks like a stretched DS3, the touchpad looks tiny and even smaller with the start/select and indicator taking up space, plus I really liked how the Vita style graphic looked on the others. I really like your previous mock-up though.

The plan was to make something that looks as much as the DS3 as possible.
Also the indicators on the touchpad are just graphical, the whole touchpad is touchable (the buttons require clicks).
weekend_warrior
Banned
(02-05-2013, 05:42 AM)
weekend_warrior's Avatar

Originally Posted by RoboPlato

The stick, button placement, and grips look really great to me. It's only a slight change but it definitely seems more ergonimic. I also think the touch pad will be bigger and look more like the Vita one but I hope the handles look like this one.

They look the same as on a DS3. And the problem with the DS3's grips/ergonomics isn't just the length it's the girth, they're too thin to allow you to wrap fingers around them like you can do with the 360 pad. Ideally the grips would be larger, with the face buttons and shoulder buttons closer to each other so they fall right where your fingers would be when you hold it. Similar to these 2 designs-

Originally Posted by Mista Koo

Small edit on the one kairu made:



No need for the touch pad boundaries, the texture should feel different.

Originally Posted by jett

With bigger sticks:





I personally do hope it goes away, it's not ergonomic or aesthetically pleasing.

hastethedav
Junior Member
(02-05-2013, 05:49 AM)
hastethedav's Avatar
I really hope Sony keeps the durability up on controllers, my DS3 I got on my ancient PS3 still feels brand new, on the other side I have gone through multiple 360 game pads, particularly the battery latch going haywire. I am going to assume and have faith in Sony since the build quality of the Vita seems top notch as well.
Graphics Horse
graphics horse
graphics horse
does whatever a
graphics horse does
(02-05-2013, 05:53 AM)
Graphics Horse's Avatar

Originally Posted by Mista Koo

Wait, I thought that was the player indicator? Isn't that what the red lights on the top were for?

Yes. It flashes when it's charging and stuff but it tells you which player it is.
I think one of the rumours suggested each player being assigned a light colour, and that colour being used by a camera for tracking like move sounds very possible if they're bundling in a camera.
Last edited by Graphics Horse; 02-05-2013 at 05:55 AM.
R10Neymarfan
Member
(02-05-2013, 05:53 AM)
R10Neymarfan's Avatar

Originally Posted by dragonknight337

well, no, unless I sell the one it comes with, >_>

I just want an improvement, and the 360 controller just happens to have the two things it needs desperately - triggers that don't require buying accessories to make them tolerable and to ditch the convex and go back to when they had it right with dual analog. I can tolerate symmetrical sticks, I just wish they were spaced further apart. Like this:


would be fine to me.

I did forget about the dpad. I hope they do adopt the vita d-pad and drop the segmented one.

Anyone from Sony look at this stuff? With some tweaking and size modification I would love for this to be the DS4. All you need to do is add bluetooth 4.0 and a sixaxis plus
Xplatformer
Member
(02-05-2013, 05:55 AM)
Xplatformer's Avatar

Originally Posted by Mista Koo

New one for the new page:



Larger version - Comparison with the PS3 controller

  • The touch pad is clickable, click anywhere for start click bottom left for select (similar to the Macbook's touch pad).
  • Wider with longer handles.
  • Share button.
  • New shoulder buttons.

OK...I hate the DS3 and most PS3 controllers...but this thing is sexy. If they get the damn triggers right I'm sold. Even for FPS titles.
Kenak
Member
(02-05-2013, 05:57 AM)
Kenak's Avatar

Originally Posted by hastethedav

I really hope Sony keeps the durability up on controllers, my DS3 I got on my ancient PS3 still feels brand new, on the other side I have gone through multiple 360 game pads, particularly the battery latch going haywire. I am going to assume and have faith in Sony since the build quality of the Vita seems top notch as well.

I've had this problem numerous times as well. Every time I mention it on Gaf, I'm told it's just me.
RoboPlato
I'd be in the dick
(02-05-2013, 05:59 AM)
RoboPlato's Avatar

Originally Posted by Xplatformer

OK...I hate the DS3 and most PS3 controllers...but this thing is sexy. If they get the damn triggers right I'm sold. Even for FPS titles.

After the Move trigger I'm not worried at all about the triggers on the DS4. Just give that a bit more resistance and it'll be a perfect trigger.
BobTheFork
Member
(02-05-2013, 05:59 AM)
BobTheFork's Avatar
Those designs are cool but I hope Sony never puts the whole Dpad above the line. I fucking love having it separated.
hastethedav
Junior Member
(02-05-2013, 06:00 AM)
hastethedav's Avatar

Originally Posted by Kenak

I've had this problem numerous times as well. Every time I mention it on Gaf, I'm told it's just me.

Bought the MW2 edition even went the the midnight opening, came home and both controllers suffered this issue, I just made some good use of duct tape, just a pain when you keep logging in and out due to accidentally tapping the back of the controller
vivftp
Member
(02-05-2013, 06:01 AM)
vivftp's Avatar
Why not, I'll post my Vita as it is simply because I'm EXTREMELY happy with how comfortable it's been since I got my Nyko Power Grip. I like that my hands are further apart compared to the dual shock and if they were to make the PS4 controller feel like this but with larger sticks/buttons and triggers and all, I'd be overjoyed

Xplatformer
Member
(02-05-2013, 06:07 AM)
Xplatformer's Avatar

Originally Posted by vivftp

Why not, I'll post my Vita as it is simply because I'm EXTREMELY happy with how comfortable it's been since I got my Nyko Power Grip. I like that my hands are further apart compared to the dual shock and if they were to make the PS4 controller feel like this but with larger sticks/buttons and triggers and all, I'd be overjoyed


LOL. And people thought the DUKE was big. It looks usable and comfortable as can be, but Sony won't be providing a TRANSFORMER with their next console.

The DS4 has got to have
1) better triggers
2) more space between the analog sticks
3) concave tips to the sticks
4) longer handles

If they can pull off those 4 things I wouldn't even care if the thing looked identical to the DS3 but 20% larger.

Thread Tools