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Steve Youngblood
Don't blame us. Blame yourself or God.
(08-01-2013, 09:45 PM)
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This is a followup from this embarrassment of a thread: http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showthread.php?t=641703

First of all, let's get this out of the way. I know in the grand scheme of things, PS4 hype is winning out over Xbox One hype on this forum. However, when someone posts an Xbox One thread -- even if it comes across as PR fluff -- there's no need to summarily dismiss it. If you're interested in Major Nelson's take on things, then join in and participate. If you take issue with what he's saying, then by all means contest his points. But do so in a way that isn't just a snide dismissal of his position as a PR person.

Now, with that out of the way, here's the link to the Major Nelson piece:

http://majornelson.com/2013/08/01/wh...with-xbox-one/

And here's a couple pieces of information in the link that I noticed some people actually discussing in the previous thread:

Better Matchmaking

Earlier this summer, I talked with Micheal Dunn, Program Manager on Xbox Live Services, about the new Xbox One matchmaking system called Smart Match. The key here is that you no longer have to sit and wait for a game to match you with other players. With Smart Match on Xbox One, I can put in my match request, then switch over and catch up on the posts on Xbox One or watch TV or a movie. When a match is found, Xbox One tells me so I can re-enter the game instantly. Smart Match also matches you with players like yourself, making your multiplayer gaming even more tailored to your game style.
Smart Match

Enhanced Reputation and Enforcement

The Enforcement United program will complement Smart Match’s new reputation system on Xbox One. We’ve updated our proprietary algorithms for monitoring gaming behavior on Xbox Live, expanded scoring elements, engaged our enforcement team and created requirements for games to take reputation into account. The new reputation system is built on a model that accounts for how you behave and whether you positively or negatively affect others. As long as other players or the games you play are not negatively reporting you or your actions, you’ll maintain a positive reputation. Ways to weaken your reputation, for example, would be to join a competitive, veteran area and try to disrupt games, or join a casual play area and be a griefer. We’ve also worked hard to ensure this new system can’t be manipulated by groups of griefers. Our goal is to create a safe and fun place for gamers without BS from trolls and spammers. Casual gamers might not even notice that this new reputation system is in place, but trust me, serious online gamers will be glad it is.


And just as an example, here's a hypothetical bad post that will result in a ban:

I can't take Nelson seriously.

Last edited by Steve Youngblood; 08-01-2013 at 10:03 PM.
Amir0x
demodded, not denutted
(08-01-2013, 09:47 PM)
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Now Smart Match sounds fucking AWESOME, that is a really great feature. Whenever I get a One it's nice to know that'll be there.
model13
Member
(08-01-2013, 09:50 PM)
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Thanks for pressing reset on the thread. I am genuinely excited for the new matchmaking service. When certain game populations get low, I would give up after a couple of minutes or I would queue and then read however that would often result in me missing my match due to distraction.
Silky
(08-01-2013, 09:50 PM)
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Neat!
Vince McMahon
Member
(08-01-2013, 09:51 PM)
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It sounds great to me. Especially for lesser-known titles whose popularity dies off as time goes on. You think I like sitting around for 1 hour for a Culdcept Saga match today? Sheeit. It'll be a godsend.
BabeSlayer
Member
(08-01-2013, 09:51 PM)
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I was already going pure digital but this just makes me even more excited for it. Bring on next gen!
GalacticMouse
Member
(08-01-2013, 09:53 PM)
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Better Matchmaking

Earlier this summer, I talked with Micheal Dunn, Program Manager on Xbox Live Services, about the new Xbox One matchmaking system called Smart Match. The key here is that you no longer have to sit and wait for a game to match you with other players. With Smart Match on Xbox One, I can put in my match request, then switch over and catch up on the posts on Xbox One or watch TV or a movie. When a match is found, Xbox One tells me so I can re-enter the game instantly.

Note the underlined section: This portion doesn't even make sense. They're basically saying, "You don't have to wait anymore! Just watch tv until it's ready!" Last I checked, that's waiting.

Smart Match also matches you with players like yourself, making your multiplayer gaming even more tailored to your game style.

This sounds pretty cool. I play shooters pretty casually and I hate it when Halo or CoD dump me into a match with tons of people that have everything unlocked already. It makes me lose interest when I'm getting my ass whooped, so hopefully this turns into something useful.

Personally, I think this one is a good example of how Microsoft has been improperly marketing the console the past few months. They should be touting the benefits of Smart Match without trying to mince words so people think that matchmaking will move way faster when, in reality, they're really just making matchmaking a better service. Not every piece of PR has to have "Xbox One does TV!" stuffed into it.

I don't really take issue with the Xbox One's existence like some people do, but this is the type of stuff that's made me think twice about whether I'll pick one up down the road.
Last edited by GalacticMouse; 08-01-2013 at 09:57 PM.
theytookourjobz
Junior Member
(08-01-2013, 09:53 PM)
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Both consoles are shaping up to be awesome. I'm glad I don't have to choose and am able to pick up both.
polyh3dron
couldn't find a lab with German shepherds
(08-01-2013, 09:53 PM)
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Yeah because you can get in a whole TV show or movie while you wait for your smart match right? What ever happened to waiting a few minutes?

This is almost as bad as the demo where the Star Trek movie screen shrinks and the guy is buying a ticket to the movie's sequel as he ignores the original movie that is currently playing in front of him.
Syntax
Junior Member
(08-01-2013, 09:54 PM)
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The key here is that you no longer have to sit and wait for a game to match you with other players.

Of course you have to wait for the system to find you a match. What they're saying is that now you can do other things on the Xbox One while you wait.

The statements they're making all seem nice but it's doubtful things will really change with regards to matchmaking. Maybe if their new version of a reputation system works out it'll make matches more pleasant but who knows.
Last edited by Syntax; 08-01-2013 at 10:01 PM.
CitizenCope
Member
(08-01-2013, 09:54 PM)
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I never knew achievements would cross over. I have a shit ton but I was actually looking forward to everyone getting a reset.
jond76
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(08-01-2013, 09:55 PM)
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Yeah, looks like there are starting to be some compelling reasons to go all digital with the One.
ultron87
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(08-01-2013, 09:56 PM)
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Originally Posted by GalacticMouse

Note the underlined section: This portion doesn't even make sense. They're basically saying, "You don't have to wait anymore! Just watch tv until it's ready!" Last I checked, that's waiting.
.

Well it says "sit and wait". In that case "sit' means sitting on the matchmaking screen while a little wheel spins around (or whatever). With the multitasking you can switch to TV or a digital game and then be able to get right back to your game when it is ready.

Being able to switch to TV isn't that compelling but launching a Geometry Wars equivalent for the five minutes it might take my less popular game to find a match sounds pretty cool.
dogmanstaruk
Member
(08-01-2013, 09:57 PM)
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I can't take Nelson seriously.
Amir0x
demodded, not denutted
(08-01-2013, 09:57 PM)
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Originally Posted by GalacticMouse

Personally, I think this one is a good example of how Microsoft has been improperly marketing the console the past few months.

Note the underlined section: This portion doesn't even make sense. They're basically saying, "You don't have to wait anymore! Just watch tv until it's ready!" Last I checked, that's waiting.

I don't really take issue with the Xbox One's existence like some people do, but this is the type of stuff that's made me think twice about whether I'll pick one up down the road.

Note the italicized section: This sounds pretty cool. I play shooters pretty casually and I hate it when Halo or CoD dump me into a match with tons of people that have everything unlocked already. It makes me lose interest when I'm getting my ass whooped, so hopefully this turns into something useful.

I think this is a pretty wrong interpretation. It basically means what it says - you don't have to have the console sit and wait and matchmake. The console can now do other things while a game is matchmaking, so you don't have to wait staring at the matchmaking screen. This is pretty friggin' rad. I can't tell you the amount of times I just gave up and ended up closing out the game altogether and sometimes even the console itself.

Now if I can do other things I want to do on Xbox One while it's happening, then it doesn't matter how long it takes for the game to matchmake because I'll be occupied by something I enjoy doing.
ChosenPredator
Member
(08-01-2013, 09:57 PM)
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thank you OP, for starting this thread up again it's almost impossible to talk xbox one otherwise. I really like the matchmaking news seems pretty cool.
Etaber
Junior Member
(08-01-2013, 09:57 PM)
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One thing I'd like to find out is if you can queue for more than one thing at a time. That way I can list a bunch of less popular games or DLC and then grab whichever one pops first.
TRios Zen
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(08-01-2013, 09:58 PM)
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I have 50 some-odd friends on XBOX live who I met playing Gears, Halo and COD before the party system. Since the party system it seems every time I get in a match outside of a party there's some fool playing their stereo at insane levels, or some pre-pubescent teen yelling obscenities or screaming at his mom that he'll go to bed soon.

IF the new matchmaking and reputation system helps fix that, I'd gladly drop parties to meet more gaming friends.
Vince McMahon
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(08-01-2013, 09:58 PM)
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Originally Posted by Amir0x

I think this is a pretty wrong interpretation. It basically means what it says - you don't have to have the console sit and wait and matchmake. The console can now do other things while a game is matchmaking, so you don't have to wait staring at the matchmaking screen. This is pretty friggin' rad. I can't tell you the amount of times I just gave up and ended up closing out the game altogether and sometimes even the console itself.

And let's not forget how it goes in 1v1 games.

Waiting forever for someone else who dug up the game, mute the TV, fuck around on the computer and keep an eye on it...glance later and see someone in there furiously going ready/not/ready/not trying to get your attention. By the time you grab your controller to hit Ready they're gone.

urghleb ipjfpomwe
anexanhume
Member
(08-01-2013, 09:58 PM)
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It sounds like they've put a lot of work and thought into matchmaking. I hope Sony can copy or exceed some of these features.
Hilbert
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(08-01-2013, 09:58 PM)
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Originally Posted by Amir0x

I think this is a pretty wrong interpretation. It basically means what it says - you don't have to have the console sit and wait and matchmake. The console can now do other things while a game is matchmaking, so you don't have to wait staring at the matchmaking screen. This is pretty friggin' rad. I can't tell you the amount of times I just gave up and ended up closing out the game altogether and sometimes even the console itself.

Now if I can do other things I want to do on Xbox One while it's happening, then it doesn't matter how long it takes for the game to matchmake because I'll be occupied by something I enjoy doing.

I would set up a match in virtua fighter, then basically go and do something completely different while waiting for someone to show up. This feature sounds GREAT.
mittelos
Member
(08-01-2013, 09:58 PM)

Originally Posted by polyh3dron

Yeah because you can get in a whole TV show or movie while you wait for your smart match right? What ever happened to waiting a few minutes?

This is almost as bad as the demo where the Star Trek movie screen shrinks and the guy is buying a ticket to the movie's sequel as he ignores the original movie that is currently playing in front of him.

I thought someone made a fair point in the other thread that it may be a nice feature for a game with a limited on-line community. But generally, yeah, this sorta feels like a solution that few were asking for.
Syntax
Junior Member
(08-01-2013, 09:59 PM)
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Originally Posted by Etaber

One thing I'd like to find out is if you can queue for more than one thing at a time. That way I can list a bunch of less popular games or DLC and then grab whichever one pops first.

Now that's a good idea.
Liamario
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(08-01-2013, 09:59 PM)
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Originally Posted by GalacticMouse

Note the underlined section: This portion doesn't even make sense. They're basically saying, "You don't have to wait anymore! Just watch tv until it's ready!" Last I checked, that's waiting.

Indeed. I can already do that by flicking over to the tv. If it was the case that I could play the single player or even another game, this feature would be worth talking about.
Brashnir
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(08-01-2013, 10:00 PM)
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It's kind of sad that any thread even remotely positive towards Xbox One needs a mod disclaimer at the head around here.

That said, these features don't mean much to me, though hopefully the enhanced reputation stuff pans out. They said similar things about the 360's reputation system prior to launch, and those ended up being entirely meaningless.
bj00rn_
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(08-01-2013, 10:00 PM)
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Originally Posted by polyh3dron

Yeah because you can get in a whole TV show or movie while you wait for your smart match right? What ever happened to waiting a few minutes

It was an example, it's optional. If waiting on a static screen is your thing, then you can still do that.
TRios Zen
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(08-01-2013, 10:01 PM)
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Originally Posted by Liamario

Indeed. I can already do that by flicking over to the tv. If it was the case that I could play the single player or even another game, this feature would be worth talking about.

I thought this had been stated - that you could play another game while waiting. Maybe I misunderstood something though.
NullPointer
#INTESTINAL
(08-01-2013, 10:01 PM)
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Originally Posted by Liamario

Indeed. I can already do that by flicking over to the tv. If it was the case that I could play the single player or even another game, this feature would be worth talking about.

The big difference is when you flick to your TV, assuming that you're using the same screen here, you don't get an on-screen notification when your match is ready.

My favorite part of this queuing is having it work in the background while you're currently playing a match. Seems like the kind of thing that most people would notice right away and find useful.

They mentioned it once with Killer Instinct on Fallon, but I haven't heard it since. Isn't that a huge speed increase to matchmaking (subjectively)?
Steve Youngblood
Don't blame us. Blame yourself or God.
(08-01-2013, 10:01 PM)
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Originally Posted by dogmanstaruk

I can't take Nelson seriously.

I would have thought that this would have been explicitly clear based on the contents of the OP, but just in case it wasn't, don't do this.
IOnEI Falcon
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(08-01-2013, 10:02 PM)
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Originally Posted by CitizenCope

I never knew achievements would cross over. I have a shit ton but I was actually looking forward to everyone getting a reset.

I wonder if there will be an option or maybe we can finally delete games even with just one achievement.
Gotchaye
this space intentionally left blank
(08-01-2013, 10:02 PM)
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I'm always fascinated by reputation systems for online communities. There are a lot of really interesting possibilities there that go way beyond "50 people downvoted you and so you have to play with racists for the rest of your system's life". I wish they'd talk about the specific algorithms they have in mind, but I can understand not wanting to share those for fear of enabling abuse.
besada
The were all in love with dying; they were doing it in Texas.
(08-01-2013, 10:02 PM)
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Originally Posted by mittelos

I thought someone made a fair point in the other thread that it may be a nice feature for a game with a limited on-line community. But generally, yeah, this sorta feels like a solution that few were asking for.

I think the theory is that instead of just jumping in a quick match, which always resolves pretty quickly, that you can get more specific in your desires, which will lead to more waiting. So, instead of jumping into whatever slayer match is ongoing in Halo, I'll be able to specify the map, the weapon types allowable, number of players, level of player, etc.

The more specific you get, the more you're going to wait.
ultron87
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(08-01-2013, 10:02 PM)
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Originally Posted by TRios Zen

I thought this had been stated - that you could play another game while waiting. Maybe I misunderstood something though.

They've definitely said you can still do this with downloaded games. The only thing I'm not sure of is if you can switch from a disc game to a downloaded game.
GalacticMouse
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(08-01-2013, 10:03 PM)
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Originally Posted by Amir0x

I think this is a pretty wrong interpretation. It basically means what it says - you don't have to have the console sit and wait and matchmake. The console can now do other things while a game is matchmaking, so you don't have to wait staring at the matchmaking screen. This is pretty friggin' rad. I can't tell you the amount of times I just gave up and ended up closing out the game altogether and sometimes even the console itself.

Now if I can do other things I want to do on Xbox One while it's happening, then it doesn't matter how long it takes for the game to matchmake because I'll be occupied by something I enjoy doing.

But what are you going to do instead? I mean, matchmaking isn't going to suddenly take enough time that it makes sense for you to watch a sitcom or something, so really they're just hyping the fact that the console is better at multitasking and letting you put the game in the background while you browse the web, set up a skype call, watch TV, etc, right?

I guess I'm not sure how else to interpret it. Based on my understanding, the console isn't going to be powerful enough to run two games simultaneously, so you won't be able to, say, switch into Assassin's Creed's single-player campaign while the console is matchmaking a Halo game for you, right?

Originally Posted by ultron87

Well it says "sit and wait". In that case "sit' means sitting on the matchmaking screen while a little wheel spins around (or whatever). With the multitasking you can switch to TV or a digital game and then be able to get right back to your game when it is ready.

Being able to switch to TV isn't that compelling but launching a Geometry Wars equivalent for the five minutes it might take my less popular game to find a match sounds pretty cool.

I agree with your last point, but I didn't get the impression that the console would be able to "run" two games at a time, just remember your current state in one game if you switch back and forth between the game and TV/Netflix/Movie/etc. If I'm wrong, then yeah, that would be a nice feature for sure.
Last edited by GalacticMouse; 08-01-2013 at 10:05 PM.
Satchel
Banned
(08-01-2013, 10:03 PM)
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Originally Posted by Steve Youngblood

First of all, let's get this out of the way. I know in the grand scheme of things, PS4 hype is winning out over Xbox One hype on this forum. However, when someone posts an Xbox One thread -- even if it comes across as PR fluff -- there's no need to summarily dismiss it. If you're interested in Major Nelson's take on things, then join in and participate. If you take issue with what he's saying, then by all means contest his points. But do so in a way that isn't just a snide dismissal of his position as a PR person.

Finally. Thank you.
Vince McMahon
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(08-01-2013, 10:03 PM)
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Originally Posted by ultron87

They've definitely said you can still do this with digital games. The only thing I'm not sure of is if you can switch from a disc game to a digital game.

It's like being handcuffed to a dead body :(
Garryk
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(08-01-2013, 10:03 PM)
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Originally Posted by TRios Zen

I thought this had been stated - that you could play another game while waiting. Maybe I misunderstood something though.

You can.

I think the cool part of this is you can be playing a game and someone can invite you to a SmartMatch session. This way you can keep doing what you are doing while your party gets sorted.
RazorEdge
Banned
(08-01-2013, 10:04 PM)
So why is there always a new thread if this guy says something about "his" console?!

Who cares? It's just marketing...
NullPointer
#INTESTINAL
(08-01-2013, 10:04 PM)
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Originally Posted by besada

I think the theory is that instead of just jumping in a quick match, which always resolves pretty quickly, that you can get more specific in your desires, which will lead to more waiting. So, instead of jumping into whatever slayer match is ongoing in Halo, I'll be able to specify the map, the weapon types allowable, number of players, level of player, etc.

The more specific you get, the more you're going to wait.

I wonder how specific you can really get.

Have they finally managed to find a decent compromise between the ease of matchmaking and the fine grained control of server browsers?
Longhorn Fan
Junior Member
(08-01-2013, 10:05 PM)
The matchmaking feature sounds like something I already do. I start matchmaking and then switch the input to TV or simply get my laptop and surf the web while I wait. I guess it will be nice to have all this done instantly.

Edit: Actually, the ability to switch between games may be really nice. Playing an Xbox live arcade game while I wait would be awesome.
Last edited by Longhorn Fan; 08-01-2013 at 10:26 PM.
Raymo
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(08-01-2013, 10:05 PM)
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It sounds like what they were promising with reputation on Xbox 360. Sounds like they just need the beefed up back end to implement it.
Somnia
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(08-01-2013, 10:05 PM)
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One other awesome feature is say you are playing Dead Rising, you can queue up in match making in BF4 without leaving DR3. When it finds a match you can just accept and immeditaly load into the match... Well if you went digital otherwise you have to swap discs.
Vince McMahon
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(08-01-2013, 10:06 PM)
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Originally Posted by NullPointer

I wonder how specific you can really get.

Have they finally managed to find a decent compromise between the ease of matchmaking and the fine grained control of server browsers?

I hope they give a lot of control. Since it lets me do other things while searching, let me control how desperate I am to play people at my own skill level that are like me - and if I'm ready to go and say "fuck it, don't wanna wait anymore" then let me make that choice and get dumped into "screaming babby game" if I desire.
Syntax
Junior Member
(08-01-2013, 10:06 PM)
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Originally Posted by besada

The more specific you get, the more you're going to wait.

That's always been a problem, though. Many people are against the notion of paid DLC for multiplayer games because it fragments the community and the pools of players created result in a decline in online matches. So this kind of multiplayer filtering could further dilute available options. It's not going to be an issue for a popular game around release time, but could become problematic otherwise.

It's great to have choice but we should consider the ramifications of those choices.
Garjon
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(08-01-2013, 10:07 PM)
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The problem with the Smart Matchmaking is that it hinges entirely on the quality of the matchmaking itself; it's a bit pointless if I'm getting put into matches with people of as unequal skill as normal. This also brings up two other things:

1. Is matchmaking going to be done on the XB1 OS itself rather than in-game? For this new system to work, surely this would have to be the case. Are we going to see devs lose control over their servers this gen?

2. Does this effectively mean the end of server/game lists? This is reaching a little bit, I accept, but I am not seeing any mention of this anywhere.
Satchel
Banned
(08-01-2013, 10:07 PM)
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Gonna be really interesting to see how the reputation system works in the wild. Because if it does, that would be a pretty amazing feat.

More so if its fully automated. As far as I know, when I report someone on 360 there's a team of people that need to investigate every case.
GalacticMouse
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(08-01-2013, 10:08 PM)
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Originally Posted by Somnia

One other awesome feature is say you are playing Dead Rising, you can queue up in match making in BF4 without leaving DR3. When it finds a match you can just accept and immeditaly load into the match... Well if you went digital otherwise you have to swap discs.

Can someone source this? I keep seeing people saying it but I haven't seen it in any articles. I was always under the impression that the console can only keep one game in it's "current state" suspension while it does other OS/TV tasks, but didn't think you were able to jump back and forth between multiple games.
Dabanton
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(08-01-2013, 10:08 PM)
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What I'd really like is an option so you can be put in matches where people are using their mics.

I haven't played it for yonks but didn't Halo 3 have an option like that?
eorl
Banned
(08-01-2013, 10:08 PM)
Uh, it is pretty easy to understand that what the new matchmaking system allows you to do is simply queue up and then jump back into your single-player portion of your game while you wait.

I don't actually understand why that is so hard to grasp, they even show a picture of someone waiting for a match while playing Forza 5 single-player. It will just pop up a toast notification letting you know when your match is ready.

This to me sounds like a great feature for the Xbox One. Now i don't have to sit there waiting in a lobby while i watch my screen slowly fill up. I can just switch back to a game and enjoy completing more fun stuff while I wait. This multitasking sounds like it will finally offer a good alt tab function to consoles, allowing users to spend more time doing everything the console has to offer.

Probably expect this to appear on the PlayStation 4 as well.
Artex
Junior Member
(08-01-2013, 10:08 PM)
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I don't really understand the point of SmartMatch. Matchmaking takes like 30 seconds; I barely have time to piss as it is.

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