NeoGAF

fabricated backlash · (08-06-2013, 02:16 PM)

Originally Posted by cacildo

Dont think this one will "catch". Its too hard.

The DS flashcarts caught on because it was easy as hell. You only needed to put the games on the mini SD card and that´s it.

But with the 3ds more online oriented aproach, it will be a lot harder to boot up the latest releases....

This basically having no chance of working with the next Pokemon means Nintendo won't break any sweat over it.

Unless they have a multiple games/card solution, a homebrew and region free feature, this stuff is basically for pirates and pirates only.

Artemisia · (08-06-2013, 02:18 PM)

Originally Posted by cacildo

Dont think this one will "catch". Its too hard.

The DS flashcarts caught on because it was easy as hell. You only needed to put the games on the mini SD card and that´s it.

But with the 3ds more online oriented aproach, it will be a lot harder to boot up the latest releases....

The games were also tiny and many could fit on a single 2gb card.

Some 3DS games are almost 2gb alone.

Kikujiro · (08-06-2013, 02:22 PM)

It won't be a nightmare even if it works, like easy-to-mod PS1 wasn't a nightmare for Sony. In fact piracy would only help to sell more hardware, like it did for DS and PS1 success.

Red Rudolph · (08-06-2013, 02:23 PM)

It's like OP hasn't ever updated his 3DS firmware, or taken the time to see how often said updates happen to block things like this.

Hint: It's often.

Stumpokapow · (08-06-2013, 02:27 PM)

Originally Posted by Red Rudolph

It's like OP hasn't ever updated his 3DS firmware, or taken the time to see how often said updates happen to block things like this.

Hint: It's often.

this is the first shipping flash card so whatever you are responding to is not what's in the OP

Raysoul · (08-06-2013, 02:28 PM)

Really OP? Nightmare?

POWERSPHERE · (08-06-2013, 02:28 PM)

I just want region free

Madao · (08-06-2013, 02:32 PM)

piracy just needs to be hard enough so that it never catches on with the masses. there's a very small group that will pirate no matter what but the thing that causes problems to nintendo is when anyone can get a card and just put the games and run them.

this sounds like it will be so impractical that only hardcore pirates will be using it.

last i heard, 360 and PS3 also had piracy but it is not having an effect in their sales because it is really inconvenient. the 3DS is closer to this group than either the Wii or DS where piracy was easier than setting up an external HDD.

ryz · (08-06-2013, 02:34 PM)

Originally Posted by cacildo

Dont think this one will "catch". Its too hard.

The DS flashcarts caught on because it was easy as hell. You only needed to put the games on the mini SD card and that´s it.

But with the 3ds more online oriented aproach, it will be a lot harder to boot up the latest releases....

Originally Posted by Artemisia

The games were also tiny and many could fit on a single 2gb card.

Some 3DS games are almost 2gb alone.

You do know that 32GB microSD cards are cheap as hell? They're currently ~20EUR here on amazon.de

Also, this is the FIRST 3DS flashcart. The first NDS flashcards also couldn't do much and were a pain in the ass to use. Don't get your hopes up.

kadotsu · (08-06-2013, 02:35 PM)

With the eShop the last reason for me to even consider buying a flashcard (that doesn't circumvent the region lock) is gone. If I want a game permanently on the system I'll just go digital.

redlemon · (08-06-2013, 02:36 PM)

It's not really that big a deal. Piracy is only a problem when its easy.

Stone Ocean · (08-06-2013, 02:36 PM)

So begins the flashcard dance.

But I doubt this will be as big of a problem as it was on the DS.

Originally Posted by ShinKagato

Waste of money really, all it takes is for Nintendo to update their firmware again and it no longer works. I guess you could turn off updates but that eliminates some of the 3DS's more unique features.

If you buy one of these for the sake of piracy I'd say features are the least of your worries.

Newline · (08-06-2013, 02:37 PM)

Well this is the first card, probably means in a year or so we'll have region free cards that can store multiple games.

I would happily buy a cheap secondary 3DS that I never update to get region free games.

This is good news for me.

BGBW · (08-06-2013, 02:38 PM)

You know, did the idea that Nintendo Zones could send out firmware updates ever come to fruition? What about the one where streetpassing someone with a more up to date 3DS would send the update to you?

Sendou · (08-06-2013, 02:40 PM)

Originally Posted by Raysoul

Really OP? Nightmare?

Widespread and easy piracy on 3DS is pretty much Nintendo's nightmare, yes.

Jaded Alyx · (08-06-2013, 02:42 PM)

Originally Posted by Newline

Well this is the first card, probably means in a year or so we'll have region free cards that can store multiple games.

I would happily buy a cheap secondary 3DS that I never update to get region free games.

This is good news for me.

How do you rip the games from the 3DS game card?

PolarGamer · (08-06-2013, 02:47 PM)

Even if Nintendo cannot pirate proof their handhelds, it is hardly a nightmare. Pirates will pirate and many of them still buy their favourite games.

And the average user base of a 3DS is not likely to even know about this new system.

Talking as a retired lawbreaker.

Kokonoe · (08-06-2013, 02:48 PM)

Pokesav X and Y incoming.

anotherVegan · (08-06-2013, 02:48 PM)

The pirates still need to buy a system. If anything, this gets people to buy more systems. Nintendo wins.

FullMetalx117 · (08-06-2013, 02:50 PM)

Originally Posted by qq more

Also prevents you from getting anything on eShop.

Oh the horror! Not the eshop!

AGoodODST · (08-06-2013, 02:50 PM)

What's with the super sensationalist thread title?

Nintendo's nightmare how exactly? It requires firmware that is already months old. Newer games can be easily made uncompatible by forcing new firmware requirements.

The thing is useless.

Sendou · (08-06-2013, 02:51 PM)

Originally Posted by FullMetalx117

Oh the horror! Not the eshop!

eShop is pretty awesome, dude.

Brawly Likes to Brawl · (08-06-2013, 02:52 PM)

"Nintendo's nightmare coming true"? Most people already upgraded well past 4.5 already.

That being said, I'd love to see a solid region-free exploit happen eventually.

gngf123 · (08-06-2013, 02:53 PM)

I'm not too against the Gateway. As I see it, it's the first step to breaking the region lock and enabling homebrew.

First, get Nintendo checked code to run off something that isn't a normal cartridge, then figure out how to get unvalidated code running.

I just hope it stays really difficult for at least another couple of years.

Aquamarine · 03:01 PM

I would just like to let everyone know that because this disgusting piracy device only works with games 4.5 firmware and below, the following titles are still not yet able to be pirated:

1) Mario and Luigi: Dream Team (force updates to firmware 5.1.0)

2) Animal Crossing: New Leaf (unique NAND-based saving in the cart prevents it working with the piracy device)

3) Future 1st-party Nintendo 3DS games will most likely force firmware 5.1.0, so you can't pirate games released this November (no Pokemon, no Zelda)

Unfortunately, every single other 3DS game can now be pirated.

Really, the last thing any console needs at such an early stage is to become overwhelmed with piracy. It's times like these I HATE the piracy community. You can't even undo region lock with this flashcart... its only purpose is to pirate games. :-(

FrontalMonk · (08-06-2013, 02:56 PM)

back in the day I loved flash carts because it let me carry around all my games on a single cart instead of having to switch them around all the time. With 3DS I don't really care about flash carts because I buy half my games on the eShop anyway so the games I want to go back to again and again are right there at my fingertips, no cart switching.

nullset2 · (08-06-2013, 03:00 PM)

Permanent changes to the firmware

lol

Starwolf_UK · (08-06-2013, 03:02 PM)

Originally Posted by BGBW

You know, did the idea that Nintendo Zones could send out firmware updates ever come to fruition? What about the one where streetpassing someone with a more up to date 3DS would send the update to you?

There have been times when connected to an ordinary hoptspot that I've opened up the system and it is ready to install an update and given a Nintendo zone is a variant of hotspot, it could.

The streetpass thing never happened.

What neither of those could do is install an update.

Aquamarine · (08-06-2013, 03:05 PM)

Originally Posted by Jaded Alyx

How do you rip the games from the 3DS game card?

At the moment, you can't.

The only way to make this piracy device work...is if you actually pirate games.

So it really has no other use than illegally pirating games.

(Now, if you pirate a game you already own, that's understandable).

Dr. Kaos · (08-06-2013, 03:05 PM)

Flash carts for the GB, GBC, GBA and the DS didn't prevent Nintendo from dominating the portables arena. Compared to their offerings, this flash cart is useless and I predict it will crash and burn.

With the internet and forced firmware updates on new games, traditional piracy really is over for all intents and purposes. I wouldn't be surprised if used games sales took off as a result...

GulAtiCa · (08-06-2013, 03:06 PM)

So some stores will be shipping a product that won't really work at the moment cause the firmware it works with is very old? That seems kinda funny to me.

Aquamarine · (08-06-2013, 03:07 PM)

Originally Posted by GulAtiCa

So some stores will be shipping a product that won't really work at the moment cause the firmware it works with is very old? That seems kinda funny to me.

It works with every game except Mario and Luigi: Dream Team and Animal Crossing: New Leaf.

It also will (most likely) not work with any future 1st-party Nintendo games. It may still work with some new third-party games that come out, but that remains to be seen.

This product is most significant because it is the 3DS's first widely available PIRACY ENABLER. With this device proliferating throughout the market, piracy will suddenly start to impact 3DS software revenues at retail.

MarkMclovin · (08-06-2013, 03:08 PM)

Originally Posted by Sendou

eShop is pretty awesome, dude.

Lets be honest here. It isn't really.

But I wonder if hackers will now try to come up with a way to downgrade the firmware. Isn't this how it normally works?

Mpl90 · (08-06-2013, 03:10 PM)

Originally Posted by Aquamarine

It works with every game except Mario and Luigi: Dream Team and Animal Crossing: New Leaf.

It also will (most likely) not work with any future 1st-party Nintendo games. It may still work with some new third-party games that come out, but that remains to be seen.

This product is most significant because it is the 3DS's first widely available PIRACY ENABLER. With this device proliferating throughout the market, piracy will suddenly start to impact 3DS software revenues at retail.

Considering that it requires 4.5/lower firmwares to work, that you can put just one game on the cart...I can't see this becoming so widespread. R4 became a sensation because you had lots and lots of titles in just one SD card, there were even stores selling R4 cards already fulled with games.

MikeE21286 · (08-06-2013, 03:11 PM)

Originally Posted by Kikujiro

It won't be a nightmare even if it works, like easy-to-mod PS1 wasn't a nightmare for Sony. In fact piracy would only help to sell more hardware, like it did for DS and PS1 success.

and PSP success?

/opening can of worms

ryz · 04:34 PM

Just to put things in perspective for all the people screaming "USELESS!": Back in 2005, you had to physically solder the card to the PassMe device so that anything on the NDS could work.

Link with a plethora of infos: http://natrium42.com/blog/?m=200503

====

The Gateway 3DS is WAY more advanced from the start. So please stop posting nonsense.

jwhit28 · (08-06-2013, 03:14 PM)

Originally Posted by ryz

Just to put things in perspective for all the people screaming "USELESS!": Back in 2005, you had physically solder the frickin card to the PassMe device so that anything on the NDS could work.

Link with a plethora of infos: http://natrium42.com/blog/?m=200503

====

The Gateway 3DS is WAY more advanced from the start. So please stop posting nonsense.

The difference is the DS was a still target with no defense.

Irminsul · (08-06-2013, 03:16 PM)

Originally Posted by ryz

Just to put things in perspective for all the people screaming "USELESS!": Back in 2005, you had physically solder the card to the PassMe device so that anything on the NDS could work.

Yes, and the DS firmware couldn't be updated. So there isn't really a comparison here. That thing is useless in its current form.

Starwolf_UK · (08-06-2013, 03:16 PM)

Dumb question. do the laws prohibiting R4s and similar things entering some territories (Japan, UK) apply here too? This is a thing Nintendo did not have for a long time last time the flashcarts came along.

Aquamarine · (08-06-2013, 03:16 PM)

Originally Posted by Mpl90

Considering that it requires 4.5/lower firmwares to work, that you can put just one game on the cart...I can't see this becoming so widespread. R4 became a sensation because you had lots and lots of titles in just one SD card, there were even stores selling R4 cards already fulled with games.

I don't think it will become popular per se...but there will be people out there who will buy a 3DS and pirate all of their games.

Or people who have a 3DS and, instead of going out to the store and buying an older game like New Super Mario Bros. 2, they just pirate it and play it that way.

It's going to hurt publishers regardless of how widespread it is. Piracy has a legitimate impact on software sales. How MUCH of an impact is subject to speculation, but it's definitely a factor.

$h@d0w · (08-06-2013, 03:20 PM)

Originally Posted by Brawly Likes to Brawl

"Nintendo's nightmare coming true"? Most people already upgraded well past 4.5 already.

That being said, I'd love to see a solid region-free exploit happen eventually.

Be aware that we are discussing this on NeoGAF. Most people here keep their consoles updated and are relatively savvy when it comes to maintaining their devices. The 3DS and Vita firmware updates threads were some of the most popular today.

3DS consoles in the retail channel will be sitting on older firmware versions.

ryz just made the point which I was about to post - this is significant because it's the first device and basically the genie is starting to emerge from the lamp.

nickcv · (08-06-2013, 03:20 PM)

Originally Posted by Aquamarine

I would just like to let everyone know that because this disgusting piracy device only works with games 4.5 firmware and below, the following titles are still not yet able to be pirated:

1) Mario and Luigi: Dream Team (force updates to firmware 5.1.0)

2) Animal Crossing: New Leaf (unique NAND-based saving in the cart prevents it working with the piracy device)

3) Future 1st-party Nintendo 3DS games will most likely force firmware 5.1.0, so you can't pirate games released this November (no Pokemon, no Zelda)

Unfortunately, every single other 3DS game can now be pirated.

Really, the last thing any console needs at such an early stage is to become overwhelmed with piracy. It's times like these I HATE the piracy community. You can't even undo region lock with this flashcart... its only purpose is to pirate games. :-(

the only question is: how many 3DS are still around with the required firmware version (4.5)?
and how many can you find in the stores with that firmware version?

firmware 5.0 was released on March 25, 2013 (4 months ago).

Since then we had:

5.1.0-11 - April 4, 2013 (4 months ago)
6.0.0-12(WW) / 11(US) - June 17, 2013 (50 days ago)
6.1.0-12 (WW) / 11 (US) - June 27, 2013 (40 days ago)
6.1.0-12 (US) - July 11, 2013 (26 days ago)
6.2.0-12 - just released

if they need to release a new hw version of this cart every time the firmware is updated this thing will always be DOA

Mpl90 · (08-06-2013, 03:22 PM)

Originally Posted by Aquamarine

I don't think it will become popular per se...but there will be people out there who will buy a 3DS and pirate all of their games.

Or people who have a 3DS and, instead of going out to the store and buying an older game like New Super Mario Bros. 2, they just pirate it and play it that way.

It's going to hurt publishers regardless of how widespread it is. Piracy has a legitimate impact on software sales. How MUCH of an impact is subject to speculation, but it's definitely a factor.

Yeah, I know it's going to have an impact, but I feel it won't be that much, at least for now, given the current status of the solution and the fact it can be blocked through firmwares (and, currently, it has already been blocked).

Especially considering around 85% of US 3DS consoles have been connected at least one time.

$h@d0w · (08-06-2013, 03:24 PM)

Originally Posted by Aquamarine

It's going to hurt publishers regardless of how widespread it is. Piracy has a legitimate impact on software sales. How MUCH of an impact is subject to speculation, but it's definitely a factor.

I've heard stories of parents in the UK seeking out and using R4 cartridges for the DS, it sounded rampant.

delt31 · (08-06-2013, 03:24 PM)

the real dagger is even if you want to stay offline/not update, the new games like Mario are forcing you to update in order to play them. Unless the game dump itself can be played on a lower FW, I would think this is even more limiting.

wrowa · (08-06-2013, 03:33 PM)

Originally Posted by Man God

you don't get it; each card can only hold one game and one save for a game. No one is going to use this thing for piracy.

What else would you use it for? What you stated makes it a terrible device for playing legit games ("It's just like playing with your carts, only more inconvenient!"), but for piracy it's not much more than a slight inconvenience. Having to move games between your PC and the card is not that big of a deal.

Originally Posted by ryz

The Gateway 3DS is WAY more advanced from the start. So please stop posting nonsense.

The DS had no updateable firmware, the 3DS has. Nintendo can and will block these cards. (Which not necessarily means that hackers won't find another way to get their carts working).

Originally Posted by Stumpokapow

this is the first shipping flash card so whatever you are responding to is not what's in the OP

I think Nintendo used to block the 3DS-compatible DSi flash cards as they popped up, so what he said isn't technically wrong.

dallow_bg · (08-06-2013, 03:34 PM)

My extra 3DS is on older FW. I hope region free comes about sometime. It will be ready.

Man God · (08-06-2013, 03:36 PM)

It's a shitty tool for piracy and won't take off is what I meant by that. It would be used for piracy if it was any good.

fabricated backlash · (08-06-2013, 03:41 PM)

Originally Posted by $h@d0w

I've heard stories of parents in the UK seeking out and using R4 cartridges for the DS, it sounded rampant.

I only ever met one other person who bought legitimate DS games, and that's because he lost his R4 and couldn't wait until he got his replacement, so he bought Mario Kart again.

The DS might be the most pirated console of all time.

MasterBalls · (08-06-2013, 03:46 PM)

They'll do exactly what they did with the R4 and make it pretty much impossible to buy one from any big-name site that you'd feel comfortable divulging your credit card number to. I wanted to buy an R4 to try out some emulators (promise) a while back and I had a miserable time finding one.