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ahm998
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(08-16-2013, 06:29 PM)
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CANDLE, a dynamic graphic adventure, is officially confirmed for Wii U, however, the interesting thing about the game is that it uses Direct X11 shaders for dynamic lighting.

Final Fantasy 15 producer Tetsuya Nomura suggested that Kingdom Hearts 3 and Final Fantasy 15 can’t be on Wii U because it doesn’t support Direct X11. Either way, check out the Kickstarter video for CANDLE.

Here is what the developers said about bringing the game to Wii U.

“We really want to take Candle to Next-Gen consoles, so we immediately talked to Nintendo and showed them our precious game.”

“We love Nintendo platforms since our childhood has been full of them, so it was natural for us to go for it. We are already thinking about dedicated gameplay on Wii U – we are not doing any kind of quick port. We will designe specific gameplay features for its gamepad: all the menus, inventory and minigames will be tactile-controled on the touchscreen, as well as other unique actions concerning Teku’s candle. We will talk more deeply about this when we start developing all that stuff.”

Good that we get confirmation from indie :)

link
shinobi602
(08-16-2013, 06:30 PM)
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Lies, Wii U can't run DX11.
DMPrince
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(08-16-2013, 06:30 PM)
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inb4 funeral candles joke.
Nirolak
Mrgrgr
(08-16-2013, 06:31 PM)
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Originally Posted by shinobi602

Lies, Wii U can't run DX11.

DX11 shader code can compile down into DX10 shader compatibility.

It runs slower, but this is why DX10 cards can run DX11 shader code (and thus DX11 games).

Now, I'm not an expert on the topic and Nintendo could have shoved more advanced shaders on the Wii U's GPU, but even if they didn't, it would still work.
weaponlordzero
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(08-16-2013, 06:32 PM)
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@ Shinobi602

If you're avatar ever matched your statement. There it is. Ha ha
Crayons
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(08-16-2013, 06:32 PM)
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CANDLE in the wind
Colonel
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(08-16-2013, 06:33 PM)
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Originally Posted by Nirolak

DX11 shader code can compile down into DX10 shader compatibility.

It runs slower, but this is why DX10 cards can run DX11 shader code (and thus DX11 games).

Now, I'm not an expert on the topic and Nintendo could have shoved more advanced shaders on the Wii U's GPU, but even if they didn't, it would still work.

but dont Wii U use 10.1 or eqaul?
suppadoopa
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(08-16-2013, 06:33 PM)
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Hmmm who is more trustworthy, some indie or Lord Nomura?
Starfish Hero
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(08-16-2013, 06:34 PM)
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Originally Posted by Colonel

but dont Wii U use 10.1 or eqaul?

As far as I understand, it uses something close to 10.1 but with a couple of things exclusive to 11 and up.
GulAtiCa
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(08-16-2013, 06:35 PM)
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That looks pretty good.
Nirolak
Mrgrgr
(08-16-2013, 06:35 PM)
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Originally Posted by Colonel

but dont Wii U use 10.1 or eqaul?

If' it's a modified Radeon 4000 line, then most likely yes.

You can run a DX11 renderer on that, and BF3 is a good example of this.
ahm998
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(08-16-2013, 06:36 PM)
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Originally Posted by suppadoopa

Hmmm who is more trustworthy, some indie or Lord Nomura?

Lord Nomura never support nintendo consoles with big names before ....!

So I think indie I trust :)
Infinite
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(08-16-2013, 06:37 PM)
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Originally Posted by suppadoopa

Hmmm who is more trustworthy, some indie or Lord Nomura?

I'll "trust" the guys that tried
Phil4000
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(08-16-2013, 06:37 PM)
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Wasn't Crysis 3 suppose to able to do Dx11 stuff on consoles too. How did that pan out...
Visualante2
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(08-16-2013, 06:37 PM)
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From the gameplay it just looks like it's illuminating billboarded polygons. Doesn't seem very complex in comparison to a fully 3D game like Kingdom Hearts.

I always thought DirectX was a Microsoft thing, and Nintendo/Sony used OpenGL instead.
kinggroin
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(08-16-2013, 06:38 PM)
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I think a DX11 lighting shader is the smallest of reasons why FF15 and KH3 can't be ported to Wii U.

Game in the OP looks alright. Seems to be coming along well enough.
Josh7289
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(08-16-2013, 06:38 PM)
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How could any non-Microsoft console use DirectX?
Nairume
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(08-16-2013, 06:38 PM)
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Originally Posted by suppadoopa

Hmmm who is more trustworthy, some indie or Lord Nomura?

Can the indie make a game in less than 6 years?
Dang0
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(08-16-2013, 06:38 PM)
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They never actually say the Wii U version will use dx11.

Originally Posted by Crayons

CANDLE in the wind

And it seemed to me, you lived your life like a console in the wind, never knowing who to cling to when the droughts came in. I would have liked to have bought you, but I wasn't a kid, your candle burnt out long before, Nintendo ever did.

Love you, Wii U
suppadoopa
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(08-16-2013, 06:39 PM)
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Originally Posted by ahm998

Lord Nomura never support nintendo consoles with big names before ....!

Kingdom hearts on the GBA, DS, & 3DS?
And he was involved in TWEWY
Nirolak
Mrgrgr
(08-16-2013, 06:39 PM)
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Originally Posted by suppadoopa

Hmmm who is more trustworthy, some indie or Lord Nomura?

Originally Posted by kinggroin

I think a DX11 lighting shader is the smallest of reasons why FF15 and KH3 can't be ported to Wii U.

Game in the OP looks alright. Seems to be coming along well enough.

One thing left out of the original article is that he said DX11 feature and hardware power (as in the hardware power you normally associate with DX11 graphics cards on PC).

There are even mobile chips that can do DX11.1 featureset wise, but they obviously don't have the same computational grunt as what was released for PC as DX11 cards when they first came out.
Crawl
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(08-16-2013, 06:39 PM)
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1 candle because wii u is dead right after its first birthday?
Forsaken82
(08-16-2013, 06:41 PM)
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I am confused... where in the article does it specify that this is DX11 dynamic lighting... (or rather, where in the actual developer quote does it specify this)

Is Dynamic Lighting exclusive to DX11?
cyberheater
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(08-16-2013, 06:45 PM)
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Just because it's using DX11 effects on PC doesn't mean that they can port that code fragment to WiiU.

Either they're going to have to remove that feature or fake it by doing something else.
ZeroXZee
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(08-16-2013, 06:45 PM)
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Originally Posted by suppadoopa

Hmmm who is more trustworthy, some indie or Lord Nomura?

"Lord Nomura" = Square-Enix.

C'mon, everyones knows that technical stuff isn't the real reason for Wii U's lack of interest by the devlopers...
Yado
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(08-16-2013, 06:46 PM)
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Looks kind of like A Boy and His blob
Famassu
(08-16-2013, 06:47 PM)
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Originally Posted by shinobi602

Lies, Wii U can't run DX11.

It probably can't if the game in question is a massive scale open(-ish) world RPG that pushes the hardware to its limits, but they can probably use some trickery to make it work when it's a somewhat simple 2d adventure game.
lefantome
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(08-16-2013, 06:48 PM)
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Nice idea to boost their kickstarter.

I'm wondering if all this wii u supports from KS is real or just a way to attract nintendo fans money, probably both of them.
Btw there is nothing weird in it, you can do whatever you want with wii u the problem is in the performance.
Orayn
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(08-16-2013, 06:49 PM)
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Originally Posted by cyberheater

Just because it's using DX11 effects on PC doesn't mean that they can port that code fragment to WiiU.

Either they're going to have to remove that feature or fake it by doing something else.

What's "fake" about getting DX11-equivalent effects running on Wii U's API?

Originally Posted by lefantome

Nice idea to boost their kickstarter.

I'm wondering if al this wii u supports from KS is real or just a way to attract nintendo fans money

It's a fairly indie-friendly system and they expect Wii U eShop versions to sell enough turn a profit. Nothing wrong with that.
Can Crusher
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(08-16-2013, 06:50 PM)
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Seems to me like they use the DX11 renderer in Unity, which then compiles it to DX10.

From Unity site:

Enabling DirectX 11
To enable DirectX 11 for your game builds and the editor, set "Use DX11" option in Player Settings. Unity editor needs to be restarted for this to take effect.

Note that DX11 requires Windows Vista or later and at least a DX10-level GPU (preferably DX11-level). Unity editor window title has "<DX11>" at the end when it is actually running in DX11 mode.

stuminus3
Never buying another games console. Ever.
(08-16-2013, 06:50 PM)
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Originally Posted by suppadoopa

Hmmm who is more trustworthy, some indie or Lord Nomura?

I don't know... which one is the corporate shill?
MaxwellParrish
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(08-16-2013, 06:50 PM)
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From the comment of the article:

Hi guys! Teku Studios here.

Just to clarify, we will ADAPT our DirectX11 features to Wii U, not that it supports them natively. However, we are very happy with Nintendo and its console, and we think that it well deserves that extra effort :)


.... and frankly, the game (while otherwise great) doesn't seem very tecnologically demanding
KKRT00
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(08-16-2013, 06:52 PM)
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Its not using same DX11 shader, its using rewritten shader for WiiU from DX11, same as many other multiplatform games like BF 3 or Crysis 3.


===edit==

Originally Posted by MaxwellParrish

From the comment of the article:

Hi guys! Teku Studios here.

Just to clarify, we will ADAPT our DirectX11 features to Wii U, not that it supports them natively. However, we are very happy with Nintendo and its console, and we think that it well deserves that extra effort :)


.... and frankly, the game (while otherwise great) doesn't seem very tecnologically demanding

Exactly.
lord pie
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(08-16-2013, 06:58 PM)
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Just because an indie team has compiled single shader with shader model 5 (DX11) doesn't mean they require the SM5 feature set or that it shows that a DX10 era platform supports SM5 (which it doesn't - it doesn't support DX at all!).

They have written a simple shader that tints part of the screen to represent lighting from a candle. That's about as simple as you can get for a shader in a modern game. It doesn't magically prove that porting FF15 is trivial. Bloody hell, common sense please!

I'd wouldn't be surprised if the shader compiled perfectly fine against ps_4_0_level_9_1 (DX 9.1 feature set via DX11 interface).

[edit] Thank god some common sense! :-)
Last edited by lord pie; 08-16-2013 at 10:05 PM. Reason: silly type
majik13
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(08-16-2013, 06:59 PM)
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Originally Posted by MaxwellParrish

From the comment of the article:

Hi guys! Teku Studios here.

Just to clarify, we will ADAPT our DirectX11 features to Wii U, not that it supports them natively. However, we are very happy with Nintendo and its console, and we think that it well deserves that extra effort :)


.... and frankly, the game (while otherwise great) doesn't seem very tecnologically demanding


yeah my thoughts exactly. The fully hand painted and animated art is awesome, but besides that the tech seems very minimal...

hell the candle lighting, at least in the small kickstarter vid , could have been just a standard radial gradient brightening the background for all I know. I could not see any examples of actual lighting, let alone dx11 lighting. I am not even sure how they are using lighting on flat planes of art. (gonna assume some displacement or normal/bump mapping) Though I am sure if I saw the game running in person then perhaps would notice something then.

edit: I also didnt watch the whole vid, just till the part where they talk about the dx11 lighting.
Last edited by majik13; 08-16-2013 at 07:03 PM.
javac
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(08-16-2013, 07:03 PM)
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Originally Posted by Crawl

1 candle because wii u is dead right after its first birthday?

So you only put candles on a cake when someone dies? :$
phosphor112
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(08-16-2013, 07:08 PM)
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The art is fucking fantastic. I'm digging these high quality 2D games like Rayman, Dragon's Crown and this.
Starfish Hero
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(08-16-2013, 07:13 PM)
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Originally Posted by KKRT00

Its not using same DX11 shader, its using rewritten shader for WiiU from DX11, same as many other multiplatform games like BF 3 or Crysis 3.


===edit==

Exactly.

Well, that's that I guess.

Originally Posted by javac

So you only put candles on a cake when someone dies? :$

Only make cake when someone dies
ahm998
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(08-16-2013, 07:36 PM)
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Originally Posted by suppadoopa

Kingdom hearts on the GBA, DS, & 3DS?
And he was involved in TWEWY

Consoles=/ handheld
DMPrince
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(08-16-2013, 07:39 PM)
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Originally Posted by Starfish Hero

Well, that's that I guess.



Only make cake when someone dies

lwilliams3
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(08-16-2013, 07:41 PM)
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Originally Posted by Can Crusher

Seems to me like they use the DX11 renderer in Unity, which then compiles it to DX10.

From Unity site:

Thanks for posting that info. Hmm.. things like this blurs the whole dx10.1-dx11 feature debate.
cyberheater
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(08-16-2013, 09:58 PM)
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Originally Posted by MaxwellParrish

From the comment of the article:

Hi guys! Teku Studios here.

Just to clarify, we will ADAPT our DirectX11 features to Wii U, not that it supports them natively. However, we are very happy with Nintendo and its console, and we think that it well deserves that extra effort :)

Just what I thought. I'll be interested to see how the WiiU implementation looks relative to the PC version.
ElTorro
I wanted to dominate the living room. Then I took an ESRAM in the knee.
(08-16-2013, 10:01 PM)
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Originally Posted by Nirolak

DX11 shader code can compile down into DX10 shader compatibility.

There are, AFAIK, also some real limitations although none of them are feature killers.

http://msdn.microsoft.com/en-us/libr...(v=vs.85).aspx

But, of course, what the Wii U's actual hardware is capable of cannot necessarily be described in reference to a general API specification.
Interceptor
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(08-16-2013, 10:18 PM)
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Originally Posted by cyberheater

Just what I thought. I'll be interested to see how the WiiU implementation looks relative to the PC version.

Psssst, they have to do the same for PS4.
charsace
Accidental Member
(08-16-2013, 10:37 PM)
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DX10 was the start of a new DX. DX10 and DX11 are in the same DX family so its possible to run DX11 shaders in DX10. Unity uses HLSL and cg for the shader languages.
Last edited by charsace; 08-16-2013 at 10:39 PM.
Refreshment.01
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(08-16-2013, 10:47 PM)
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1.- Topic title is missleading.

2.- Why hasn't the OP made any corrections to the first post after this clarification?

3.- And Nomura was indeed correct:


Originally Posted by MaxwellParrish

From the comment of the article:

Hi guys! Teku Studios here.

Just to clarify, we will ADAPT our DirectX11 features to Wii U, not that it supports them natively. However, we are very happy with Nintendo and its console, and we think that it well deserves that extra effort :)

All seems really dishonest and a spread of missinformation to fuel console wars. Or more fitting to placate console insecurities.
Last edited by Refreshment.01; 08-16-2013 at 11:10 PM.
Bony Manifesto
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(08-16-2013, 10:59 PM)
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If they're using Unity, I don't think they'll be getting DX11 effects on the Wii U (or any other OpenGL platform), as instead of compiling shaders with Nvidia's Cg, DX11 shaders have to be compiled with Microsoft's own proprietary tool.

I suppose the Wii U Unity build might have it's own special Nintendo-provided compiler that will translate the DX11 calls into something its version of OpenGL supports, but it seems unlikely.

Edit: Oh, it's already been debunked by Refreshment.01 above.

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