Looks like there's growing... angst in the Senate against Reid and standing up to him since the House failed to. Fuck that noise. Guys like McCain and Graham are shitstains. I guess grampy got over the Tea Party hurting his feelings and is now emulating the group of people who were tenacious in their efforts to put a personal agenda ahead of getting something done with Reid (i.e. the House Republicans who ripped McCain to shreds just a few days ago!). This fucking farce needs to end. We've got 3 days and 7 hours before default.
The Vitter Amendment is a horrible idea, and income verification for PPACA -- why? If you lie about your income you will pay for it (literally).
Defeat from the jaws of victory?@sahilkapur: And now Heitkamp, Pryor, Klobuchar, King & Donnelly say they're negotiating w/ Collins and other Rs. No agreement yet.
Yeah, honestly I find people brandishing the Confederate flag just as offensive as the Nazi flag. It disgusts me how socially acceptable it is to plaster the confederate flag everywhere (at least in rural Indiana I see it a lot. On car bumpers, flying on flag poles, etc.)Originally Posted by APKmetsfan
I have no patience for the confederate flag. Flag should representative of a shameful period in US history, not a point of pride.
Sing Dixie, be proud of certain traditions but the confederacy shouldn't be a part of that.
Fucking Blue Dogs always ruining everything. Goddamn.Originally Posted by APKmetsfan
nuke ^
Defeat from the jaws of victory?
New Conspiracy Alert: Reverse Birtherism
So I talked to my tea party loving father today and he revealed to me the new conspiracy that he and other right-wingers are now spreading. He is willing to concede that Obama was born in Hawaii, as faking that birth certificate isn't possible, but this group of tea partiers now think Obama only managed to get into Columbia and Harvard because he claimed he was from Kenya. As proof, my dad said that Obama's grades were too poor to be accepted to either of those universities unless he was some from third world nation, and that the biography about Obama that mentioned him being from Kenya also resulted due to this claim in college. Additionally my dad said that Obama's classmates at Columbia have said they never saw Obama in class, so somehow Obama had gotten an exception from Columbia that he didn't need to go to class because the classes were too hard for him.
My response: yeah-okay.gif
Maybe McCain feels like he can show the tea party how to get concessions without being a braindead dick. Basically a "here's how it's done, losers" move.Based on tweeting from our boy Costa: McConnell backs the Collins plan, and Graham is going to be "Cruz-esque" on insisting that the Vitter Amendment be part of the final result, implying he'd filibuster or something to ensure it happens.
Looks like there's a growing angst in the Senate against Reid and standing up to him since the House failed to. Fuck that noise.
Guys like McCain and Graham are shitstains. I guess he got over the Tea Party hurting his feeling and is now emulating the group of people who were tenacious in their efforts to put a personal agenda ahead of getting something done with Reid.
Regardless, I hope Reid is simply wasting time with this sequester battle. A clean DL and CR should be the main goal. The Collins plan isn't going anywhere, and it's clear republicans won't budge on sequestration unless Reid holds out until the 15th or 16th. I'd rather not do that, and just take the win they played to win in the first place: clean DL and CR.
The Senate won't have the balls to do it.Originally Posted by APKmetsfan
nuke ^
Defeat from the jaws of victory?
If that tweet is true, that's a fucking shame. It sets a horrible precedent because while the "minor"" changes to the ACA will happen, on Jan. 31 we go through this all over again, and there won't be any "minor" changes left in regards to the ACA to pursue afaik, so we'll be looking at delaying it as the next hot ticket item for the GOP to fap over in these oh so glorious manufactured crises they love to peddle onto the American people.
Yeah right. More like the old senile maverick with an ego is showing off his elder troll status but looks just as stupid. edit: Frankly, he looks dumber because he's been around long enough to know better.Originally Posted by PhoenixPause
Maybe McCain feels like he can show the tea party how to get concessions without being a braindead dick. Basically a "here's how it's done, losers" move.
Regardless, I hope Reid is simply wasting time with this sequester battle. A clean DL and CR should be the main goal. The Collins plan isn't going anywhere, and it's clear republicans won't budge on sequestration unless Reid holds out until the 15th or 16th. I'd rather not do that, and just take the win they played to win in the first place: clean DL and CR.
Reid needs to be careful, he doesn't want to try and drag this out too long if he has a few Democrats already on board with the Collins plan. Things could change very quickly and in the worst way if he runs out the clock despite losing support among his own party.
Problem is, if it is repealed now it's one less thing to prevent the GOP from getting what they really want later on: delaying the individual mandate.Klobuchar really wants that medical device tax repeal apparently. The tax is going to be repealed eventually anyway, so I don't exactly know why she's risking fucking up Reid's game-plan over it.
Yeah I agree. I think the ideal plan would be to use the medical device tax as a concession when trying to to reverse the sequester. It's going away at some point, but there's no strategic reason to get rid of it right now with the shutdown/DL.Problem is, if it is repealed now it's one less thing to prevent the GOP from getting what they really want later on: delaying/defunding the individual mandate.
lol that doesn't sound too confident to me, Harry."It's moving. Not sure in what direction," said Reid of the discussions as he walked into the U.S. Capitol building on Sunday morning and was asked how negotiations were progressing.
Also:
I too kind of share with them in that concern: who's to say the GOP will finally have the resolve to vote for this thing? Sure, privately a lot of congressmen have admitted to wanting to vote for something clean/clean-ish, and some 20 have said so publicly, but who is to say they finally will do it? I think so many of them have let their political prospects and how the Tea Party could potentially shatter it stand in the way of preventing the economy from crashing and burning, which will hurt most of these people a lot more outside of the Tea Party friendly districts... why can they not see this?They remained acutely aware, however, that any solution developed in the Senate will have to be approved by the House and probably very quickly.
"Here's what I'm worried about," Republican Senator Lindsey Graham told ABC's "This Week," "a deal coming out of the Senate that a majority of Republicans can't vote for in the House."
"I'm hopeful that the House can get their act together," Republican Senator Kelly Ayotte said on CBS's "Face the Nation."
Not the women and children and babies at risk.
Not the fact that the CDC isn't open and doing it's job
Not the fact that 800,000 people and countless other are directly or indirectly affected.
No. Gotta focus on the vets 'storming' the barricades and stage stupid pictures like the raising of the flag over barriers in front of the White House.
It's fucking disgusting.
The older you are, the more likely you'll be sympathetic to the GOP. They're just whipping up what they perceive to be a subsection of their base.Originally Posted by Notrollious
It amazes me. Of all the huge issues currently going on at the moment, the republican and tea party focus on veterans memorials.
Not the women and children and babies at risk.
Not the fact that the CDC isn't open and doing it's job
Not the fact that 800,000 people and countless other are directly or indirectly affected.
No. Gotta focus on the vets 'storming' the barricades and stage stupid pictures like the raising of the flag over barriers in front of the White House.
It's fucking disgusting.
"Your knowledge of economics shows your lack of economic knowledge" is pretty great.Originally Posted by GhaleonEB
Since PoliGAF loves comments from The Crazy.
http://www.businessinsider.com/heres...-cliff-2013-10
There's a fine line between "whipping up" the base and a little something called incitement.Originally Posted by Baraka in the White House
The older you are, the more likely you'll be sympathetic to the GOP. They're just whipping up what they perceive to be a subsection of their base.
Protip: If we default, it's the latter.
Man, Cantor is really a shitstain for designating himself as the ONLY PERSON able to bring up a CR unless he says otherwise.
So much for Republicans loving freedom! HOW MANY MORE EXAMPLES DO THE AMERICAN PEOPLE NEED TO SEE TO REALIZE THESE PEOPLE ARE INSANE
I'm not sure what's worse. The fact that they're using veterans as political pawns, or that they have such low respect for the American people that they believed it would make us follow blindly besides them.Originally Posted by Notrollious
It amazes me. Of all the huge issues currently going on at the moment, the republican and tea party focus on veterans memorials.
Not the women and children and babies at risk.
Not the fact that the CDC isn't open and doing it's job
Not the fact that 800,000 people and countless other are directly or indirectly affected.
No. Gotta focus on the vets 'storming' the barricades and stage stupid pictures like the raising of the flag over barriers in front of the White House.
It's fucking disgusting.
Reid already shot down the Collins plan and never liked the Vitter amendment, I doubt he'll agree to anything like that with McConnell. And obviously if McConnell is having productive meetings with Reid, it means the sequester stuff has been dropped.@JohnJHarwood 26m
Aide: Senate D leaders optimistic of deal after "productive" Reid-McConnell talk. Haggling over length of CR/debt hike but expect to resolve
Man, I'm so tired of this shit.Originally Posted by PhoenixPause
Reid already shot down the Collins plan and never liked the Vitter amendment, I doubt he'll agree to anything like that with McConnell. And obviously if McConnell is having productive meetings with Reid, it means the sequester stuff has been dropped.
I wish we could all go out for drinks
Please end, in the best way possible, and soon.
edit: And what really sucks is we have no reason to believe the GOP will respond positively to this. I'm thinking Wall Street and co. really whipped the establishment into shape but we'll see. All this 'productivity' could be for naught.
Even worse is the fact that Republicans are generally the ones to oppose increasing spending on Veteran's benefits.I'm not sure what's worse. The fact that they're using veterans as political pawns, or that they have such low respect for the American people that they believed it would make us follow blindly besides them.
On another forum I frequent, the veterans charade is working in full swing.I'm not sure what's worse. The fact that they're using veterans as political pawns, or that they have such low respect for the American people that they believed it would make us follow blindly besides them.
I don't understand how people don't realize they are being so easily manipulated, some of these characters are like some mustache twirling, puppy kicking, scooby doo villians.
My family ate it up and it's disgustingI'm not sure what's worse. The fact that they're using veterans as political pawns, or that they have such low respect for the American people that they believed it would make us follow blindly besides them.
"Those brave veterans stormed the barricades and are taking them to the white house"
"Good, Obama is a self righteous prick"
"The house has put so many bills, Obama wants it his way or the highway and is shutting down the government because of it"
I still live at home so I can't do much other than ignore it, otherwise I would call them all fucking dumb cunts and are supporting a terroristic party.
I just can't fucking take it any more.
Well, the closed memorials and closed parks are some of the most visible consequences.Originally Posted by Notrollious
It amazes me. Of all the huge issues currently going on at the moment, the republican and tea party focus on veterans memorials.
Not the women and children and babies at risk.
Not the fact that the CDC isn't open and doing it's job
Not the fact that 800,000 people and countless other are directly or indirectly affected.
No. Gotta focus on the vets 'storming' the barricades and stage stupid pictures like the raising of the flag over barriers in front of the White House.
Few people ever see the inside of the CDC under any circumstances.
As a teen I clashed a lot with my parents over them voting for Bush in 2000, but even they were smart enough to realize how much of a fuckup he was by the end of his first term, and voted for Kerry. They've been reliable Democrats ever since and despise the GOP.
Getting duped by a politician is one thing but to consistently eat up the propaganda without being able to think critically about the state of the nation is horrifying.
I'm sorry, lots of veterans died for this country and had it not been for a lot of them our country could be fundamentally different today, I realize that -- but to get enraged over a veteran not being able to walk through a monument or what have you as we are on the brink of default is just so incredibly stupid. People are acting like veterans have been denied all rights granted to other American citizens; like they've been thrown in solitary confinement until a deal is reached; it is ridiculous and has no basis for being a rational argument.
Classic American idiocy. "I HAVE TO SEE IT WORKING TO UNDERSTAND THE EFFECT DERP." Read a few lines about the CDC and what they help protect us against and you should be able to understand why they are just as if not more important than walking down a fucking trail somewhere. Seriously.Originally Posted by Samarecarm
Well, the closed memorials and closed parks are some of the most visible consequences.
Few people ever see the inside of the CDC under any circumstances.
Well I'm old and it is not working with me.Originally Posted by Baraka in the White House
The older you are, the more likely you'll be sympathetic to the GOP. They're just whipping up what they perceive to be a subsection of their base.
And I can't see how things can work with anyone when they are not even self-consistent. Bush came into office with a surplus. He then did tax-cuts. Then the Affgan war. Then more tax-cuts. Then completely pointless expensive Iraq war. And then unfunded Medicare part D. But the time Bush left office, the budget had gone from a surplus to $1Trillion deficits.
And now they want to be viewed as the saviors of fiscal responsibility. WHAT? FFS. They have zero credibility on that. Reagan ran up more debt than every president before him COMBINED. Dick Cheney rolled into office and said "Reagan proved deficits don't matter!" . . . and they want to be viewed as our fiscal saviors. You gotta be fucking kidding me.
It works for crazy people, people's who's self-interests are helped by the GOP view (rich people), and by religious conservatives. and racists.
a) where's the photo op in the CDC or food stamps or whatever?Originally Posted by Notrollious
It amazes me. Of all the huge issues currently going on at the moment, the republican and tea party focus on veterans memorials.
Not the women and children and babies at risk.
Not the fact that the CDC isn't open and doing it's job
Not the fact that 800,000 people and countless other are directly or indirectly affected.
No. Gotta focus on the vets 'storming' the barricades and stage stupid pictures like the raising of the flag over barriers in front of the White House.
It's fucking disgusting.
b) it fits with the now-classic GOP narrative of Dems hating the military.
Democrats have been "negotiating" with Republicans since January of 2009 in the form of giving away far too much considering they didn't get nearly enough in return. They're negotiating now, too. Hopefully it'll live up to the true definition of the word, at least more than usual, this time around.Originally Posted by Samarecarm
such resolve
very shutdown
wow
so negotiate
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2013/1...n_4094336.html“We have been involved in productive, bipartisan discussions with Sen. Collins and other Republican senators, but we do not support the proposal in its current form. There are negotiations, but there is no agreement,” the statement said, with Sens. Heidi Heitkamp (D-N.D.), Joe Donnelly (D-Ind.), Angus King (I-Maine), Pryor, Klobuchar and Manchin signing on.
So at least for right now it seems like they are okay with some parts of Collins' plan, but aren't on board with it yet.
starting to get convinced Dem senators are just trolling nowWorth noting:
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2013/1...n_4094336.html
Democrats have absolutely no reason to compromise on anything. They have the public opinion on there side and the GOP is imploding as we speak. Their best option is to wait as long as possible to make a deal.Worth noting:
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2013/1...n_4094336.html
So at least for right now it seems like they are okay with some parts of Collins' plan, but aren't on board with it yet.
thus being the reason why there is no agreement, unless they're attempting to temper Reid's expectations...Democrats have absolutely no reason to compromise on anything. They have the public opinion on there side and the GOP is imploding as we speak. Their best option is to wait as long as possible to make a deal.
You should visit inner Georgia some time. There's confederate flags flying from flag masts on highways. They are unashamedly brazen.It disgusts me how socially acceptable it is to plaster the confederate flag everywhere (at least in rural Indiana I see it a lot. On car bumpers, flying on flag poles, etc.)
Ok now my brain's shorting out on this one. How are they talking about sequester as law of the land after 2 freaking weeks of talking about defunding Obamacare with nothing in return? How? And this is with Democrats offering sequester all along.Worth noting:
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2013/1...n_4094336.html
So at least for right now it seems like they are okay with some parts of Collins' plan, but aren't on board with it yet.
They probably have a point that dems have to give something up to end the sequester, but god damn it, how is their hypocrisy not immediately transparent to everyone?
They're not, still, really.Originally Posted by Clevinger
So what happened to that whole "We won't negotiate just to reopen the government/pay our bills on time"?
Hoyer pointed this out to Boehner's face the other day in a private meeting, apparently.Ok now my brain's shorting out on this one. How are they talking about sequester as law of the land after 2 freaking weeks of talking about defunding Obamacare with nothing in return? How? And this is with Democrats offering sequester all along.
They probably have a point that dems have to give something up to end the sequester, but god damn it, how is their hypocrisy not immediately transparent to everyone?
.One speaker went as far as saying the president was a Muslim and separately urged the crowd of hundreds to initiate a peaceful uprising.
"I call upon all of you to wage a second American nonviolent revolution, to use civil disobedience, and to demand that this president leave town, to get up, to put the Quran down, to get up off his knees, and to figuratively come out with his hands up," said Larry Klayman of Freedom Watch, a conservative political advocacy group.
I mean, we're at the point where fucking Reid.....REID is keeping Dems and to some extent Obama in line.
The guy who pussied out on fillibuster who we called a massive failure has brought the GOP to its knees, fucked over the House and Tea Party, and probably going to get a deal that's heavily favorable to Dems.
Twilight Zone, am I in it?
not really, Reid gets a bad rap for things he doesn't deserveOriginally Posted by TacticalFox88
So....yeah....why haven't we talked about Reid's sudden employ of his titanium balls?
I mean, we're at the point where fucking Reid.....REID is keeping Dems and to some extent Obama in line.
The guy who pussied out on fillibuster who we called a massive failure has brought the GOP to its knees, fucked over the House and Tea Party, and probably going to get a deal that's heavily favorable to Dems.
I actually thought Reid won the filibuster thing and said as much.Originally Posted by TacticalFox88
So....yeah....why haven't we talked about Reid's sudden employ of his titanium balls?
I mean, we're at the point where fucking Reid.....REID is keeping Dems and to some extent Obama in line.
The guy who pussied out on fillibuster who we called a massive failure has brought the GOP to its knees, fucked over the House and Tea Party, and probably going to get a deal that's heavily favorable to Dems.
Reid caved a bit during the fiscal cliff, but the Dems still won that one.
And Reid will eventually win this one, too.
smhRobert Costa
@robertcostaNRO
Roll Call: "A Graham aide explained he intended to force a Senate vote on the issue"
http://blogs.rollcall.com/wgdb/graha...bt-limit-deal/
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