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scandisk_
Member
(10-29-2013, 02:51 PM)

Originally Posted by Perkel

I see what you did there. But i think you botched your work



Crushed blacks and nice sharpen filter. I can't get aliasing since Killzone shots are 1080p with good AA..

too late arrrghhhhh..
Wishmaster92
Member
(10-29-2013, 02:52 PM)
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Originally Posted by Skeff

Depending on what's happening it's between 2fps and 15fps difference between PS4 and XB1.

720p vs 900p too. I didn't expect it tbh.
TheZink
Junior Member
(10-29-2013, 02:52 PM)
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Originally Posted by PaNaMa

Just watched the IGN video too:
http://ca.ign.com/videos/2013/10/28/...ics-comparison

The XBONE version has a crisper image, again. PS4 has a blur filter going on.
I don't know if it's FXAA or the upscaler.

PS4 fan here, and but XBOne has a much nicer image. It's just cleaner. Less muddy/blurry. In every video I've watched, multiple sources.

Yeah. Im still torn a little. Ive got both systems ordered and want to cancel one and pick up the other later on. I really love the One TV stuff even though a lot dont. I really cant tell too much of a difference except the One looks a little clearer with more jagged edges. I really dont know what to do. Most of my friends are going One but I dont want to make a bad choice. Son of Mother! This is the only game I really wanted to pick up at launch.
cyberheater
PS4 PS4 PS4 PS4 PS4 PS4 PS4 PS4 PS4 PS4 PS4 PS4 PS4 PS4 PS4 PS4 PS4 XBOX PS4 PS4
(10-29-2013, 02:52 PM)
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Originally Posted by Maninthemirror

Oh crap lol thats huge
And the higher framerate is on the system with a higher resolution and AA

I know it looks like that but if you take a very close look at the graphs below the image you'll notice that... Fuck it.

PS4 definitely wins on this one.
tkalamba
Member
(10-29-2013, 02:52 PM)
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Originally Posted by Toma

True but then again, PS4 will be better optimized as well by then. Since both versions get more optimization and X1 gets added another effect on top, it wouldnt seem unlikely for the FPS gap to widen a bit more.



Its more likely to become bigger in my opinion.

Or the FPS gap could shrink. At this point we don't know what changes DICE has to implement.
Skeff
Member
(10-29-2013, 02:53 PM)
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Originally Posted by StuBurns

We don't know AO will hurt performance, it depends if they've made strides in optimization.

Well, if we're playing that game, what makes you think only the XB1 will continue to get optimizations?
tinfoilhatman
all of my posts are my avatar
(10-29-2013, 02:53 PM)
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Overall I like the PS4 shots slightly better but seriously tell me the PS4 has a quality hardware up scaler equivalent to the 360?

Upscalign on the PS3 was dreadful in comparison
KKRT00
Member
(10-29-2013, 02:53 PM)
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Originally Posted by foxbeldin

Thats so misleading.

---


And why are people saying that Xbone version does not have AA? It has AA, same FXAA filter as Xbox 360, PC and PS4.
You all just finally realized how awful 720p is even with decent postAA when upscaled to 1080p. Something PC gamers were saying for years.
THEaaron
Junior Member
(10-29-2013, 02:53 PM)
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Originally Posted by Horsemama1956

Wait, so my PC games which are a lot sharper than console games are just filled with noise? Damn this whole time.

The PS4 version looks like it's running high Post Process AA which makes it blurry. So basically if the PS4 version looks inferior in anyway it because the Xbox version looks worse and our perception is just fucked up?


There is a difference between high resolution textures and noised textures.
Kinyou
Member
(10-29-2013, 02:53 PM)
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Originally Posted by Toma

Its more likely to become bigger in my opinion.

not if the framerate was unoptimized . Again, I'd love to know what other fixes he's talking about
StuBurns
just talking loud
and saying nothing
(10-29-2013, 02:53 PM)
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Originally Posted by Toma

True but then again, PS4 will be better optimized as well by then. Since both versions get more optimization and X1 gets added another effect on top, it wouldnt seem unlikely for the FPS gap to widen a bit more.

We really can't assume anything in that regard.

If they're happy with the PS4 version, but no the XBO version, it's possible that it's all hands on deck with XBO. Not to say that will be the case at all. Just that who really knows.
CREMSteve
Member
(10-29-2013, 02:54 PM)
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Originally Posted by tinfoilhatman

Overall I like the PS4 shots slightly better but seriously tell me the PS4 has a quality hardware up scaler equivalent to the 360?

Upscalign on the PS3 was dreadful in comparison

Up scaling is a moot point if everything is 1080p.
eot
Member
(10-29-2013, 02:55 PM)
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Originally Posted by KKRT00

Thats so misleading.

Of course, it's cherry picked.
Glorious Ownage
Member
(10-29-2013, 02:55 PM)
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If the "blurriness" is a result of the software upscaler on the ps4 can't they make adjustments for that after the fact?
Toma
Let me show you through these halls, my friend, where treasures of indie gaming await...
(10-29-2013, 02:55 PM)
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Originally Posted by StuBurns

We really can't assume anything in that regard.

If they're happy with the PS4 version, but no the XBO version, it's possible that it's all hands on deck with XBO. Not to say that will be the case at all. Just that who really knows.

True, true. Just saying what I think is more likely to happen, which is just a vaguely random guess of course.
foxbeldin
Member
(10-29-2013, 02:55 PM)
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Originally Posted by KKRT00

Thats so misleading.

What is misleading? Graphs are hard cold data and i took it from the op.
Perkel
Banned
(10-29-2013, 02:55 PM)

Originally Posted by Skeff

With AO I would not be surprised to see 30fps at times on XB1, It's already dipping to mid 30's.

Yeah AO is one of those things that is reaaaaly stressful on hardware. For my rig usualy it is 5-10fps alone depending on game geometry.

Also this really depend on quality of it. Good AO can reaaaaly be taxing for hardware meanwhile AO with small draw distance and shitty quality won't change that much.

Good AO in Skyrim via ENB is most of the time for my rig 5-10fps difference on average.
Skeff
Member
(10-29-2013, 02:55 PM)
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Originally Posted by Wishmaster92

720p vs 900p too. I didn't expect it tbh.

I got laughed at 3 months ago for saying it, not many people did expect it.

Originally Posted by StuBurns

We really can't assume anything in that regard.

If they're happy with the PS4 version, but no the XBO version, it's possible that it's all hands on deck with XBO. Not to say that will be the case at all. Just that who really knows.

It's extremely unlikely people making the PS4 version would be re-assigned to the XB1 version because, they are not experienced in it, it would actually be slower as the experienced with XB1 coders would have to teach the PS4 guys.
Valnen
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(10-29-2013, 02:56 PM)
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Originally Posted by CREMSteve

Up scaling is a moot point if everything is 1080p.

True, but you can't guarantee every game will be native 1080p on PS4 forever, which is why if Sony isn't going to mandate native 1080p resolution for games, they need a good hardware scaler.
tinfoilhatman
all of my posts are my avatar
(10-29-2013, 02:56 PM)
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Originally Posted by CREMSteve

Up scaling is a moot point if everything is 1080p.

Agreed but based on this and other news we'll have a fare share amount of sub 1080p games on PS4.......not cool especially if the scaler produces a sub par image.
mangochutney
Member
(10-29-2013, 02:56 PM)

Originally Posted by tinfoilhatman

Overall I like the PS4 shots slightly better but seriously tell me the PS4 has a quality hardware up scaler equivalent to the 360?

Upscalign on the PS3 was dreadful in comparison

It won't need one after the initial batch of sub-1080p getting-to-grips-with-the-system games are out of the way.

Isn't this the only sub 1080p game so far?
Monty Mole
Member
(10-29-2013, 02:57 PM)
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Originally Posted by Kerub

To be fair, the frame rate is more balanced on Xbox One.

:D
shinra-bansho
Definitely Not Y2Kev's Alt Account
(10-29-2013, 02:57 PM)
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Originally Posted by Perkel

I see what you did there. But i think you botched your work

Crushed blacks and nice sharpen filter. I can't get aliasing since Killzone shots are 1080p with good AA..

I thought the crushed blacks were just due to the limited RGB so my "XB1 filter" was just reducing the color balance to 13-236 range and applying a shapen filter (this is in ImageJ other programs might have better filters).
Majanew
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(10-29-2013, 02:58 PM)
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Originally Posted by foxbeldin

To be fair, the PS4 version drops lower than the XB1 version when the smoke stack falls:





The PS4 version still has aliasing problems, too. Even with the blurry AA applied.
Night Angel
Member
(10-29-2013, 02:58 PM)
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Originally Posted by Lynn616

Cheat? If people like the X1 image better that is not a cheat or a trick.

Well, if a comparison is being made and one item has had a filter applied that is well known to look "better" to people who hate accurate color representation and image fidelity, that doesn't really set a level playing field, does it?
Maninthemirror
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(10-29-2013, 02:58 PM)
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Originally Posted by TheZink

Yeah. Im still torn a little. Ive got both systems ordered and want to cancel one and pick up the other later on. I really love the One TV stuff even though a lot dont. I really cant tell too much of a difference except the One looks a little clearer with more jagged edges. I really dont know what to do. Most of my friends are going One but I dont want to make a bad choice. Son of Mother! This is the only game I really wanted to pick up at launch.


Xbox one


Ps4


From the ign vid . The aliasing is due to the sharpening filter on x1 not a blurring filter on ps4. In fact ps4 looks more cinematic and x1 looks more cartoony
StuBurns
just talking loud
and saying nothing
(10-29-2013, 02:58 PM)
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Originally Posted by Skeff

It's extremely unlikely people making the PS4 version would be re-assigned to the XB1 version because, they are not experienced in it, it would actually be slower as the experienced with XB1 coders would have to teach the PS4 guys.

Interesting. I know PS3 and 360 system programmers tend to specify, but I thought PS4 and XBO were close enough that developers wouldn't have specific teams anymore. If that's the case, then I guess it does make sense.
Backfoggen
Member
(10-29-2013, 02:58 PM)
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Originally Posted by foxbeldin

What is misleading? Graphs are hard cold data and i took it from the op.


Man get a load of this junk frame rate on PS4 that's embarrassing

both versions hold 60 pretty well at least in SP
tkalamba
Member
(10-29-2013, 02:59 PM)
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Originally Posted by Majanew

To be fair, the PS4 version drops lower than the XB1 version when the smoke stack falls:





The PS4 version still has aliasing problems, too. Even with the blurry AA applied.

and this is why the comparisons at this point are pointless. We likely don't even have the final retail versions for either console.
Respawn
Banned
(10-29-2013, 03:00 PM)
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Originally Posted by foxbeldin

Oh my
Papacheeks(GRPodcast)
Junior Member
(10-29-2013, 03:00 PM)
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Originally Posted by TheZink

Yeah. Im still torn a little. Ive got both systems ordered and want to cancel one and pick up the other later on. I really love the One TV stuff even though a lot dont. I really cant tell too much of a difference except the One looks a little clearer with more jagged edges. I really dont know what to do. Most of my friends are going One but I dont want to make a bad choice. Son of Mother! This is the only game I really wanted to pick up at launch.

Are you basing your opinion on the Single player footage? Everyone is using the Multiplayer footage as a basis. Which according to Jack Frags is no comparison. Better frame rate on PS4 with the double the pixel density.

The single player stuff is, to me whatever, because it's within a controlled environment. Meaning certain effects and assets are used just for cinema tics, and linear levels. Much more controlled performance for both boxes. Where it matters is in a less controlled environment. Meaning people playing online exploiting the game. There are no predefined animations for characters, no timed explosions, and set pieces. The level's can get destroyed in real time by "Multiple" variables.

This is where frame rate and Image quality count. And this is where we see the PS4 version shine.
Dragon1893
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(10-29-2013, 03:01 PM)
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Originally Posted by Skeff

With AO I would not be surprised to see 30fps at times on XB1, It's already dipping to mid 30's.

Unless there's further optimization to compensate, frame-rate will probably take a hit of 3-4 fps on average is my guess.
chris0701
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(10-29-2013, 03:01 PM)
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Originally Posted by foxbeldin

[img]bbt8ewe.png[/img]

It isn't not same frame, dude. The explode in XO is more pronounced;lol
beast786
Member
(10-29-2013, 03:01 PM)
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I am really surprise how big the difference .

I assumed the difference wouldn't be linear to theoretical benchmark. So I assumed the difference would be less than 40% at max.

to see greater than 50% count in addition to AA and better frame rate is shocking to me.

Couple of facts after the first comparison thread.

1) developers aren't gimping the more powerful console for parity sake (at least dice didn't) kudos to them
2) The difference between next gen console will be much much bigger than any current gen platform differences
PhatSaqs
(10-29-2013, 03:01 PM)
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Originally Posted by Backfoggen


Man get a load of this junk frame rate on PS4 that's embarrassing

lol
CREMSteve
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(10-29-2013, 03:02 PM)
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Originally Posted by tinfoilhatman

Agreed but based on this and other news we'll have a fare share amount of sub 1080p games on PS4.......not cool especially if the scaler produces a sub par image.

Outside of BF4, which games are not 1080p? I don't think I'm aware of any others...
ToD_
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(10-29-2013, 03:02 PM)
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Originally Posted by Glorious Ownage

If the "blurriness" is a result of the software upscaler on the ps4 can't they make adjustments for that after the fact?

It just uses FXAA and has been upscaled to 1600x900. The X1 version would look a lot "blurrier" if they didn't use sharpening. Please note, sharpening is not a desirable effect as it gives white halos to everything and looks artificial. The, what most people call blurry PS4 shots, are more natural looking.

The PS4 version in this particular comparison adheres to the normal video standards, and the X1 version is altered by DF's capture hardware. Objectively the PS4 version is better in regards to video quality here, but because of this alteration, many find the X1 to look more desirable.

I hope the sharpening isn't something the X1 does natively when upscaling <1080p resolutions.
andycapps
Member
(10-29-2013, 03:02 PM)
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I don't like whatever AA they're using for the PS4 version. Probably not something that would keep me from getting the game, but it looks like they smeared vaseline over everything. I assume that could also be an issue from the sub-1080p signal being upscaled to 1080p, but either way, not a fan of how blurry it looks. Fix this shit, Guerrilla!
foxbeldin
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(10-29-2013, 03:02 PM)
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Originally Posted by chris0701

It isn't not same frame, dude. The explode in XO is more pronounced;lol

It's the curve not the frame that's of interest.
DirtyLarry
Member
(10-29-2013, 03:02 PM)
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Originally Posted by MikeE21286

Wait what....if resolution doesn't make visuals look better than I just...I don't know what we're talking about here.

Of course it makes it look better, especially in the real world on a 55" TV.

But on YouTube comparison videos? There is not a huge difference especially to those who do not know what they are looking for.

So again I say, the more important story is the fact one console has to significantly lower its resolution and rely on "tricks" to achieve a comparable image to the clearly more superior higher resolution.

there are plenty of people saying they do not see a difference, and some that even feel the sharpness of the one looks better, and my point was simply that is because there is much less going on behind the scenes, and on crappy YouTube compressed videos, sure, it is easy to say they look comparable, to some even identical, but that is clearly not the case.
potam
Ask me about my terrible taste.
(10-29-2013, 03:03 PM)
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Can anyone give me a tl;dr on what we've learned, aside from 900p?
plagiarize
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(10-29-2013, 03:03 PM)
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Originally Posted by Backfoggen


Man get a load of this junk frame rate on PS4 that's embarrassing

both versions hold 60 pretty well at least in SP

and the framerate analysis gives the PS4 version a clear advantage overall.

but you know, whatever. facts.
TheZink
Junior Member
(10-29-2013, 03:03 PM)
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Originally Posted by Maninthemirror

Repeating for those who missed it

Originally Posted by Lynn616

Cheat? If people like the X1 image better that is not a cheat or a trick.

Originally Posted by Maninthemirror

Xbox one


Ps4


From the ign vid . The aliasing is due to the sharpening filter on x1 not a blurring filter on ps4. In fact ps4 looks more cinematic and x1 looks more cartoony

Thank you. I hadnít seen that. Definitely looks more realistic on the PS4. More subtle but believable.
Riky
Member
(10-29-2013, 03:04 PM)
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I've got a 50" Plasma Panny so I think the PS4 version will be the way to go for me, I wonder how much difference I would see on my Lounge Toshiba 37" 1366x768 LCD though.

Also has anyone found out if the voice control and body tracking are available on the PS4 camera yet?
Metalmurphy
Banned
(10-29-2013, 03:04 PM)
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Originally Posted by KKRT00

Thats so misleading.

Why is it misleading? Watch the whole video, it's pretty consistent. No point in trying to pretend the X1 isn't performing worst even at a lower resolution.



That said, I'm impressed on how both versions manage to maintain 60fps most of the time.
BigJoeGrizzly
Junior Member
(10-29-2013, 03:04 PM)
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Originally Posted by ElTorro

Look at the graph from DF. The biggest FPS delta is about 15 FPS with PS4 at 50FPS and XBO at 35FPS.

But even then, the Xbone version nicely recovered (as did the PS4 version when it occasionally dipped). You really only see the noticeable dips (based on the frame rate readings) during extremely intense scenes, and even then the Xbone at worst is in the mid 30s range, and quickly recovers to 60 fps or near it. I don't think most will have issues with the frame rates of either console version to be honest (especially since neither seems to ever dip below 30, which would be VERY noticeable).

Its a similar situation that used to happen to me when I built a gaming PC for BF3, and used either an HD 7970 GHz or GTX 680 (with an Intel Core i5 chip of course). Most of the time the game would be a consistent 60 fps, but in really intense scenes it could dip into the mid 30s, which was still pretty acceptable since it didn't happen often. Also good to know that a DICE dev acknowledged that the HBAO would be added to the Bone version (among other things?) in time for the release version.
Coulomb_Barrier
Member
(10-29-2013, 03:04 PM)
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I think shit is going to explode again when DF or others do the Xbox One MP comparison against the PS4 version.

I think the framerate gap will be bigger in this case.
KKRT00
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(10-29-2013, 03:04 PM)
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Originally Posted by foxbeldin

What is misleading? Graphs are hard cold data and i took it from the op.

Its the only one moment in whole video with such a difference. There is also [as already pointed out] similar drop fps but in Xbone favor later in this same level. But generally through the whole video framerate hold up almost steady 60fps in combat and the difference between both version are max 2-4 fps.

So, Your shot is very misleading, because it doesnt show anything about real performance in SP campaign.

---
Last edited by KKRT00; 10-29-2013 at 03:09 PM.
Respawn
Banned
(10-29-2013, 03:04 PM)
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Originally Posted by Majanew

To be fair, the PS4 version drops lower than the XB1 version when the smoke stack falls:





The PS4 version still has aliasing problems, too. Even with the blurry AA applied.

Damn that's also bad
velociraptor
Junior Member
(10-29-2013, 03:04 PM)
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Is it me or does BF4 on the PS4/XBO actually look beautiful? I expected this game to look like dog shit.

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