NeoGAF

Originally Posted by JackAubrey

There is nothing wrong with this at all, I can't believe so many of you are having a hissy fit over it.

I never used tokens (ok, i did use a couple ones that i somehow won or came free with vip membership, i dunno, they were there) but i feel this is too much.

I know some rich guy will buy that car in the game for a higher price than the game itself.

Originally Posted by eso76

I never used tokens (ok, i did use a couple ones that i somehow won or came free with vip membership, i dunno, they were there) but i feel this is too much.

I know some rich guy will buy that car in the game for a higher price than the game itself.

If someone wants to be a idiot I say let them, and then just point and laugh.

Originally Posted by eso76

I never used tokens (ok, i did use a couple ones that i somehow won or came free with vip membership, i dunno, they were there) but i feel this is too much.

I know some rich guy will buy that car in the game for a higher price than the game itself.

More fool him then.

I think the system as laid out in the latest WiR is perfectly reasonable. Cash is now easier to earn in the game and the most expensive cars have been reduced in price. It's not going to take too long to buy even the very expensive cars. But if you want to bypass the gameplay then you have to make a dick of yourself with car tokens. The tone of the WiR is that very few people would do such a thing but the option is there for those that do. And if they do, they've got to pay the price.

The LCE comes with a lot of car tokens but there's no way I'd use them to get the F1 car, it cheapens the experience. If the new AI in FM5 is as good as promised I'm going to be making my experience more difficult this time around - thanks to being well rewarded for a podium - should make for a longer, more exciting and enjoyable game.

Originally Posted by JackAubrey

There is nothing wrong with this at all, I can't believe so many of you are having a hissy fit over it.

If you think that playing races and working through the career in such a game as Forza is "grinding" then you are playing the wrong game. Take each corner as it comes, be patient.

The idea that some cars are worth more car tokens than others is perfectly reasonable. These type of games have an internal economy, some cars are worth more than others. Just play the game, enjoy it, and eventually you'll earn the more expensive cars. That's how it works.

Yes it might be expensive if you want to buy enough car tokens to get the F1 car in career mode. But what kind of idiot would want to do that anyway? You may as well watch a movie if you don't want to interact with the gameplay model. Unless T10 comes out and says - this car isn't in the game and you have to pay €70 to get it - then it's a fuss over nothing.

Yeah, now that you earn money everywhere, even in free play, it shouldn't take as long as in FM4 to earn those 6M credits. As you said, if some idiot wants to pay a ridiculous amount of money to get this car immediately then let him be an idiot. I'm not against those practices, as long as the game economy isn't skewed toward buying tokens. From the sound of it, FM5 doesn't seem like that.
Even with the abysmal racing rewards of FM4, I managed to probably buy more than 3/4 of the cars in the game...

Originally Posted by G Rom

Yeah, now that you earn money everywhere, even in free play, it shouldn't take as long as in FM4 to earn those 6M credits. As you said, if some idiot wants to pay a ridiculous amount of money to get this car immediately then let him be an idiot. I'm not against those practices, as long as the game economy isn't skewed toward buying tokens. From the sound of it, FM5 doesn't seem like that.
Even with the abysmal racing rewards of FM4, I managed to probably buy more than 3/4 of the cars in the game...

From your own admission one could reasonably argue that, even as a hardcore fan with hundreds of hours logged in the game, approximately one quarter of the car content in the game still wasn't available to you unless you paid real money to buy car tokens.

Just playing Devil's Advocate here... :P

Originally Posted by p3tran

hmm.. we need to know like ..how much do "expensive" cars cost in game currency,
and how much of that currency you get to win in each race.

It's in the Week in Review. Most expensive cars that were previously 10mil and now 6mil. And we'll get more credits per race than previously. So buying cars is easier - but they aren't gifted by the game for winning events.

So is it true that Fanatec CSR owners (you know, the wheel with Forza branding) are SoL with Forza 5 on Xbox One?

I guess I really shouldn't have expected any better from Microsoft. If it weren't such an expensive investment I might have been tempted by the One for this game alone. But now I'll most definitely pass.

Originally Posted by BADNED

Next week will be a great week, kicking off with amazing stuff!

Originally Posted by drugstore_cowboy

So they are really going with that price?

Mental.

That is insane. I had this preordered after the announcement, I think it was E3, for 199€!
Then they changed the release date and I canceled my order, because no new date was known. And now they come back 3 months later with a new pricetag and for the exact same wheel?

Originally Posted by Fortinbras

It seems like they changed the car token system. I played all the other Forza games and can't remember a car that cost 70 €.

http://www.gamersglobal.de/news/7874...-70-euro-extra
If you want to drive the E21 you either have to grind for "several million" credits or pay 70 €.

Can somebody help me out, what was the system like in FM4?
How much token did I need to buy the most expensive car ingame? I never used them.

But the German fm.net still says on the LE announcement page "the Limited Edition comes with a code of 1.250 car token, which will grant you access to every car in the game".

So I thought I will be able to buy every single car without Credits after redeeming this code as a gift for LE buyers. But now it rather seems with the amount of 1.250 I can buy "even the most expensive car" in the game, but not every single on of them.

Originally Posted by Fortinbras

It seems like they changed the car token system. I played all the other Forza games and can't remember a car that cost 70 €.

http://www.gamersglobal.de/news/7874...-70-euro-extra

If you want to drive the E21 you either have to grind for "several million" credits or pay 70 €.

You earn about 120.000 credits per hour. The Formula 1 Lotus car (and several others) costs about six million credits.

So you can decide if you play the game for 50 hours or pay 70€ if you are insterested in the car.

Is this still Forza or "World of Cars"? What happened to cheat codes?

Originally Posted by flashmouth

So I thought I will be able to buy every single car without Credits after redeeming this code as a gift for LE buyers. But now it rather seems with the amount of 1.250 I can buy "even the most expensive car" in the game, but not every single on of them.

The article in the english site (en-US) said "any car", not "every":

1,250 car tokens (a $9.99 value) that will allow Limited Edition owners instant access to any car in the game

I understand that the amount of tokens provided allow the user to buy even the most expensive car, not every single car in the game, hence the use of "any" instead of "every".

Next week will be a great week, kicking off with amazing stuff!

you're going to reveal the 4 new tracks we're getting for free as soon as T10 feels they are good enough ?
Great.

Originally Posted by Green Yoshi

You earn about 120.000 credits per hour. The Formula 1 Lotus car (and several others) costs about six million credits.

So you can decide if you play the game for 50 hours or pay 70€ if you are insterested in the car.

Is this still Forza or "World of Cars"? What happened to cheat codes?

This can't be right, can it? Play for 50 hours just to earn enough money to buy one (admittedly expensive) car?

Fuck it. Time to grind my Forza level up.

Originally Posted by op_ivy

pretty light in content, though a bit on the forza 5 economy, here is this weeks week in review
http://forzamotorsport.net/en-US/news/WIR_11_15_13

biggest thing of note IMO


also, cars are cheaper and you get bigger boosts in credit gains from upping difficulty and turning off assists.

Bigger boosts for difficulty, finally! it's been annoying in forza where going from say medium to hard is a big jump in skill but only 10% to 20% credit difference

Originally Posted by Zinthar

So is it true that Fanatec CSR owners (you know, the wheel with Forza branding) are SoL with Forza 5 on Xbox One?

I guess I really shouldn't have expected any better from Microsoft. If it weren't such an expensive investment I might have been tempted by the One for this game alone. But now I'll most definitely pass.

Are we still complaining about this? You bought the wheel for Xbox 360 not Xbox One. It still works on your 360. If you are passing on this game and Xbox One why coming in this thread, oh never mind most of GAF are doing this.

I am just as annoy as the next guy as far as BC on both consoles, but I never expect any of my old rig to work with my new rig. If you haven't get your money worth on CSR using it with Forza 3 / 4 and Horizons and even GT5 and any PC racers then wheel should not be your investment.

Well we've see that just being a HID device isn't enough to guarantee compatibility.

Originally Posted by Green Yoshi

You earn about 120.000 credits per hour. The Formula 1 Lotus car (and several others) costs about six million credits.

So you can decide if you play the game for 50 hours or pay 70€ if you are insterested in the car.

Is this still Forza or "World of Cars"? What happened to cheat codes?

hey Yoshi :)
do you have a link with this information I underlined?

Originally Posted by p3tran

hey Yoshi :)
do you have a link with this information I underlined?

Indeed would like to see this also is this with all aids off ect or just normal with all on and come on turn 10 show us some more of the goods

Originally Posted by drugstore_cowboy

Well we've see that just being a HID device isn't enough to guarantee compatibility.

Of course, if the company of your device pulls out of that particular business, you definitely can't guarantee the compatibility on new platforms.

Originally Posted by Green Yoshi

You earn about 120.000 credits per hour. The Formula 1 Lotus car (and several others) costs about six million credits.

So you can decide if you play the game for 50 hours or pay 70€ if you are insterested in the car.

Is this still Forza or "World of Cars"? What happened to cheat codes?

Holy shit! Is this confirmed? If so, that's beyond absurd.

Originally Posted by brotkasten

Of course, if the company of your device pulls out of that particular business, you definitely can't guarantee the compatibility on new platforms.

Yeah I wasn't aware before recently exactly how compatibility happens, I assumed there was a generic wheel driver and they'd all just 'work'.

Firstly, great OT. Well done.

Secondly, unless T10 have upped the racing earnings hugely then I'm afraid we're back to the grinding induced insanity of FM3. I think back then it took 250-300 hours of racing/grinding to afford the '64GTO.
T10 have reduced the price of the GTO to 6mill, but that's still 50-60 hrs of racing to afford 1 car. And now there's no storefront or Auction House to mitigate the grinding. Just batshit insane game design decisions IMO. All hail the cloud..... or something.

Oh, and just plain LOL at the token system.

Originally Posted by Pharaoh 117

Holy shit! Is this confirmed? If so, that's beyond absurd.

No it's not. Read it in context. Read the Week in Review, read some of the posts over the last page or so.

Those that see racing as grinding perhaps shouldn't play a racing game?

I like the grinding.

Now we can get money more readily it seems like a decent trade off, same with GT, feels good to save up and buy one.

Originally Posted by brotkasten

I guess the problem is that this situation could've been avoided if they would just use HID input for the wheel. Instead they actively chose to fuck the customer over and they're not even providing anything in return for it. The new Thrustmaster or MadCatz offer nothing new over the old wheels. It's just a "nope, we're not doing it. buy this new shit instead".

Just like their web browser, they should just go with accepted web standard.

As far as controller not being compatible, doesn't Xbox One use different wireless technology than the 360?

I didn't mind grinding when I was younger and had more time on my hands.lol. Now the thought of grinding tends to grind my gears. There was nothing wrong with how you gained credits in FM4. I just hope they haven't nerfed rivals earnings.

Originally Posted by JackAubrey

No it's not. Read it in context. Read the Week in Review, read some of the posts over the last page or so.

Those that see racing as grinding perhaps shouldn't play a racing game?

the price is still retarded

Originally Posted by JackAubrey

No it's not. Read it in context. Read the Week in Review, read some of the posts over the last page or so.

Those that see racing as grinding perhaps shouldn't play a racing game?

You don't think playing for 50 hours just to earn one particular car is absurd? All Turn 10 will be doing here is alienating anyone but the hardest of hardcore players. There's a meager enough car count as it is without hiding some of them behind grindwalls.

Originally Posted by brotkasten

Of course, if the company of your device pulls out of that particular business, you definitely can't guarantee the compatibility on new platforms.

Why do you think they pull out? Most likely it is because there are very little money to be make in this segment of the market. Sony could easily write drivers for the wheels if they choose to but they are not going to when there is new wheel from Thrustmaster to sell and co-market.

Changes to the economy all seem perfectly reasonable. I am a huge fan of making your individual cars more important, I would nearly 99%of the time sell or just dump the prize cars onto the auction house. Putting the emphasis on earning credits across games play rather than cheesing the auction house will help me a ton, as I will focus on rivals and online racing more so than career.

Philosophically I have no issue with token systems, more options and paths for those who choose to go that way, doesn't effect me at all, but I do like that if you want to skip to that E21 they are going to make it hurt a bit.

Ditching the storefront and auction house is fine, you can still gain notoriety and money by making designs public and letting turn10 pay out by popularity. I assume tuning setup will be the same.

All in all logical stuff all around.

And that's one car. How long am I supposed to race to afford the lotus AND the 1976 Ferrari? 100hrs ? And the McLaren? 150 hrs for 3 cars ?

Or tokens ?

The get credits to get cars is a horrible design... in a time where due to the stupid achivements you can not cheat on games it is stupid to restrict content on a racing game...

Let people play their games we have already paid a lot of money for them...

at least Forza lets you buy any car not stupid license restrictions...

Originally Posted by antiquegamer

Just like their web browser, they should just go with accepted web standard.

As far as controller not being compatible, doesn't Xbox One use different wireless technology than the 360?

That analogy doesn't work, because HID is an industry standard, Webkit isn't. That said, it still made me chuckle.

And yes, the Xbox One uses a different proprietary wireless protocol than the Xbox 360. It still has standard USB ports and an OS that is capable of handling it, though.

Originally Posted by antiquegamer

Why do you think they pull out? Most likely it is because there are very little money to be make in this segment of the market. Sony could easily write drivers for the wheels if they choose to but they are not going to when there is new wheel from Thrustmaster to sell and co-market.

Huh, I thought the Thrustmaster T500RS still works on the PS4?

I've been a fan of grinding ever since Gran Turismo introduced me to the concept many moons ago.

I know people don't enjoy the long and arduous journey to an exclusive or rare vehicle but I revel in that pursuit. A sense of achievement overcomes my every being as I finally reach that momentous occasion. It instills great appreciation for said car and I treat it with respect and loving care as if it were one of my very own children.

I love you hard earned car..

Originally Posted by faberpach

The get credits to get cars is a horrible design... in a time where due to the stupid achivements you can not cheat on games it is stupid to restrict content on a racing game...

Let people play their games we have already paid a lot of money for them...

at least Forza lets you buy any car not stupid license restrictions...

Is there really any other method to create value for a car in the game, though? If every car in the career was free, and the only thing you earned through racing was XP of some kind....what is incentivizing the economy? What are you earning in the career?

I am sure all cars are unlocked for free race if you want to just try them.

Originally Posted by saladine1

I've been a fan of grinding ever since Gran Turismo introduced me to the concept many moons ago.

I know people don't enjoy the long and arduous journey to an exclusive or rare vehicle but I revel in that pursuit. A sense of achievement overcomes my every being as I finally reach that momentous occasion. It instills great appreciation for said car and I treat it with respect and loving care as if it were one of my very own children.

I love you hard earned car..

Agreed.

Originally Posted by AlanzTalon

Is there really any other method to create value for a car in the game, though? If every car in the career was free, and the only thing you earned through racing was XP of some kind....what is incentivizing the economy? What are you earning in the career?

I am sure all cars are unlocked for free race if you want to just try them.

Would it be that bad to just create levels for the players based on the events they have done and a career where you just pick the cars you love and play with them?

why do you need money? where is the fun on having to grind circuit de Catalunya for 5 hours to get a new ferrari?

if it was perfectly build I wouldn mind some money system but it always leads to poor grinding...

Originally Posted by Mascot

You don't think playing for 50 hours just to earn one particular car is absurd? All Turn 10 will be doing here is alienating anyone but the hardest of hardcore players. There's a meager enough car count as it is without hiding some of them behind grindwalls.

I don't think it's absurd. It's just rewarding effort - this has been part of videogames for a long time.

And remember this is just in the career - with all that the name "career" implies - a logical progression where you earn things.

If people just want to play with any of the cars they will be there in the free play section. Nothing hidden behind a "grindwall" there. It just won't be in the career - because the career is a career.

Originally Posted by saladine1

I've been a fan of grinding ever since Gran Turismo introduced me to the concept many moons ago.

I know people don't enjoy the long and arduous journey to an exclusive or rare vehicle but I revel in that pursuit. A sense of achievement overcomes my every being as I finally reach that momentous occasion. It instills great appreciation for said car and I treat it with respect and loving care as if it were one of my very own children.

I love you hard earned car..

Agree thats part of appeal of the game for me if i where handed all the cars on a plate then whats the point

Originally Posted by Rains

Agree thats part of appeal of the game for me if i where handed all the cars on a plate then whats the point

you tune and race the cars?

Originally Posted by saladine1

I've been a fan of grinding ever since Gran Turismo introduced me to the concept many moons ago.

I know people don't enjoy the long and arduous journey to an exclusive or rare vehicle but I revel in that pursuit. A sense of achievement overcomes my every being as I finally reach that momentous occasion. It instills great appreciation for said car and I treat it with respect and loving care as if it were one of my very own children.

I love you hard earned car..

I don't see grinding as a problem or bad game design per se, as long as the game offers enough variety to earn your credits. If you have to do the same 3 lap race over and over again, because it gives you the most credits, then it genuinely sucks.

Grinding is way better than getting handed cars.

I creates way more attachment to a car you buy and a sense of achievement/satisfaction.

Getting gifted reward cars cheapens their perceived value ten fold. It doesn't feel good at all.

In every forza, especially fm4, i felt like i am getting way too much money. Earning +100% all the time plus the crazy amounts you get in rivals and mp are just not making any car special.