NeoGAF

Originally Posted by Ramenman

Just like DLC, free-to-play, etc, it will suck at first (what Forza did is actually quite terrible, wow).

However there's still hope it can be done right, just like DLC and f2p. Nowadays f2p isn't only that shitty mobile game about grinding for your farm. It is also League Of Legends, World of Tanks, Team Fortress 2, Tribes Ascend, etc. Some of those games I would never have tried if they required an investment upfront, by the way.

And before it's done right, well, vote with your wallet. When I buy something, I always look at the price, and look at what I get. If I don't think it's worth it, I don't buy it. I'm sure you guys do the same.

Anyway you put it, this is the only thing that will dictate wether this becomes a trend or not : does it make money or not. If it makes money, then it means people don't mind it, or even want it. No matter what we, internet people, decide.




I know this isn't the main point of the thread, but I never got the thing about "if it's made after, then it's alright, but day one DLC is a rip off"

Why do people think that if something is produced *before* the release date of a game, then it's obviously part of the budget of the initial game and doesn't cost "additional" money to the devs ?

Devs can do two things at the same time with separate budgets.

And what if a game released without a proper ending, and that ending was then produced a year later and sold as DLC ? would it be alright because it was made after, so "obviously it was a cost for devs, so it's alright we have to pay".

I think what we don't like as players is feeling that the game we buy isn't complete, or that the content on the disc isn't enough for what we paid.

This doesn't have anything to do with *when* the DLC was produced.

I recently bought Ace Attorney 5, and a month later there was a new DLC case available. Do I feel ripped off ? Well no, because the main game is still a complete Ace Attorney on its own. I still wouldn't feel ripped off if the bonus case came out day one, as long as the main game is still a complete experience.

I'm sure you'll agree with that.

It's a complex problem as everyone has its own limits.
What we mean by after release is that we have a problem with Day 1 DLC as they could mean that the game has been cut off. In some cases, we will never know if it was the case or not, but we have seen it happen too often.

We agree that there are good DLC ... but Day1 good DLC ? Not so much.

We stand an a principle position: this kind of questions should never even exist. Why should I worry that the game has been cut off to be able to sell me DLC?

DLC as a way to extend the game after yoiu finished it? Yes!
DLC as a way for devs to make more money for the same dev costs? No.

Again, complex issue and our stance might look unfair in some cases... but it's a matter where the devs interests and ours are opposed.

Canceled my GT6 AE Edition. Well, the first step is the hardest, I'm now officially boycotting all the microtransactions shit games.

Originally Posted by michaelx

Canceled my GT6 AE Edition. Well, the first step is the hardest, I'm now officially boycotting all the microtransactions shit games.

Cancelled it 2 weeks ago...

I won't totally boycott the game though; I'll just buy it second hand.

Reallly late to this party, but heres my take:

If all of the content that can be purchased early is still available to people that want to grind it out, who the hell cares? I've played tons of games with microtransactions and I have yet to buy anything. Just play the game and keep your money.

Originally Posted by Wurdfurd

Reallly late to this party, but heres my take:

If all of the content that can be purchased early is still available to people that want to grind it out, who the hell cares? I've played tons of games with microtransactions and I have yet to buy anything. Just play the game and keep your money.

Because it bleeds out the overall cohesion and design of the game.

Not to mention the mental invasion of real money into what is essentially a special form of entertainment and escapism

When I sit down to play a game that I paid for all I want is the game. The pure look into the designers vision. Not some reminder that some greedy marketer took his creation and threw a store into it.

You think its harmless but its not. It sits there. In the back of your mind. A constant reminder that the game isn't good enough for EVERYONE and that some people need to PAY to avoid PLAYING a game.

If anything I would find Microtransactions INSULTING to both creators and players.

I can only hope this will be like evolution.

There will be companies that want the most grind filled gameplay that doesn't suit the game itself, overly monetising everything they can, and there will be companies that avoid it. Over time, more and more people get disenfranchised a move to purchasing games that avoid these practices and eventually that will wipe out all this nonsense.

I have avoided EA games on principle for quite some time now and really feel no loss what so ever. I believe there is only so much a customer will take before they just stop giving a fuck

Originally Posted by TrevHead

Total Biscuit mentions the topic in his latest Content Patch
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Mpx4R9SY98o

I like how he picked up on MS PR guys using the term grinding as something positive, quite different back before Call of Duty got big, no-one outside of a MMO would ever use it positively.

I noticed the same when clicking on a Crimson Dragon PR vid. The fact the MS PR guy mentioned grinding 3 or 4 times in only 10 seconds astounded me. I must be really out of touch with what modern gamers want nowadays.

I wonder how many ppl who have no problem with MT heavy games also enjoy grinding in long progression systems, maybe a member could start a poll?

They just want to fill bars.

http://www.penny-arcade.com/comic/2010/03/12

Originally Posted by Wurdfurd

Reallly late to this party, but heres my take:

If all of the content that can be purchased early is still available to people that want to grind it out, who the hell cares? I've played tons of games with microtransactions and I have yet to buy anything. Just play the game and keep your money.

I care. Because, if people start buying into that nonsense, then it'll be a green light for publishers to ensure that it shows up in all games. It literally makes no sense to buy a game, then hand the publisher more money just to avoid playing part of it. If part of your game is so damn bad that people with loose wallets and no will power are giving you money to not play it, that part of the game probably shouldn't be in the game in the first place.

It's such a disgusting trend, and hope it dies down like Jim Sterling predicts.

There is something really magical about buying Nintendo games and not seeing the "Walmart Edition" or "Gamestop Exclusive DLC" printed on the box and pay 4.99 to get a 1000 coin pack in Super Mario 3D World so you can buy a key to go straight to the second world! Or pay 9.99 to purchase all the gear and A Link Between Worlds! Its like the games are how the use to be and always should be, you pay the retail price and you're getting a toy, a game and an experience that you play in full. Publishers are treating games as a service and not as games anymore. They try to tell us its optional but the games are designed to make that option super easy and in your face all the time. It's offensive to me when I put a game in that I just paid 59.99 for and I get a pop up text box on day one saying I can go the marketplace and buy more shit to improve the experience.

If you don't like it don't buy it.

Will do.

Now we know how GT6 does it SAME AS FORZA!

We already knew Polyphony's racer would include microtransactions - a first for the series. Now we're nearing the game's Friday 6th December release more information on how these work has been revealed.

Let's start with the virtual currency, credits. Credits, which you use to buy cars and parts, can be bought in 500K, 1 million, 2.5 million and 7 million denominations.

The PlayStation Store updated today with the prices for these. They are as follows:

500,000 In-Game Credits (£3.99/€4.99)
1 Million In-Game Credits (£7.99/€9.99)
2,500,000 In-Game Credits (£15.99/€19.99)
7 Million In-Game Credits (£39.99/€49.99)

The video, below, showcases GT6's cars and reveals one of the top priced, the Jaguar XJ13, which costs 20 million credits. You can grind for it in traditional Gran Turismo fashion or you can buy it straight away if you drop £119.95 - that's the total you pay for two packs of 7m credits, two packs of 2.5m credits and one pack of 1m credits.

The issue is, will Gran Turismo's progression system be adversely affected by microtransactions? Eurogamer's Martin Robinson has been playing the game and tells me GT6's economy works exactly the same as GT5's, with progression, payouts and car prices very similar.

Sony maintains that GT6's microtransactions offer players an alternative fast-track route through the series' famously grindy progression. Eurogamer's review will be published on Friday.

All cars in dealerships:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZaiI2fUpXBs

Anyone concerned by the MT trend should get in this revolutionary thread!