While I'm not too worries about the progression in this particular game it's only going to get worse from here.
This industry is digging its own grave, and in some weird way I kinda want this industry to crash and burn (weird thing to say when you're in the industry, I know) just so we can do it again - do it right.
Man, I couldn't disagree more. I'm actually pretty comfortable with most microtransactions. They don't "offend" me per se. I won't be buying anything within GT that relates to money. Nor would I with Forza. It's when the economy starts to shift that gets me upset.In short, if you choose to denounce the practice, denounce them both. If you choose to excuse the practice, excuse them both. I see little room for a logical position in-between.
If one game removes multiple features that existed in previous iterations to accommodate MTs, while the other maintains the same game but with MTs tacked on, sorry but that is not splitting hairs to me. I am entitled to dislike one approach more.Wrong. Read again. I am not telling you to hate anything, I am telling you these are identical practices, and should be addressed as such. You can't be a relativist about the practice of microtransactions in this circumstance, because both games do it, but both titles allow you to progress without them.
It's not a relavist issue that you are presenting, but rather false equivalence.
Last edited by Jomjom; Yesterday at 07:33 PM.
Anti-consumer would be making it ridiculously hard for the grinding costumer to obtain the car, when it sure as hell looks like people who are paying for micro-transactions are the ones getting the short-end of the stick. But NeoGAF and all, let's read the title and not the article.Whats anti-consumer about letting someone buy credit to pay for a car? I don't see whats anti-consumer about this.
And cancel our pre-order based on this as well, disregard people who are playing the game saying that its easier to earn money than GT5.
That is not anti-consumer. But when you take away half of a game (F4 to F5 in terms of missing tracks and cars), and then charge people to get those cars back, is anti-consumer.Whats anti-consumer about letting someone buy credit to pay for a car? I don't see whats anti-consumer about this.
Oh good, I was tired of talking about Forza.
Amazingly, from the looks of the OP, they've somehow managed to make the MTAs in this game even worse. <golf clap>
Amazingly, from the looks of the OP, they've somehow managed to make the MTAs in this game even worse. <golf clap>
Panic level... rising. Sorta tempted to cancel pre-order until we know more after it ships out but I'm too much an addict to give up the series no matter the circumstances.
There's paying a premium to access stuff and there also charging people out the ass for trying to take it lazy. I'm really hoping it's the latter. If, and if it's a normal economic progression like past GT titles? Even before the seasonals and other misc bonuses in GT5 things weren't that bad.
We'll see if this is pricing of stuff deliberately looking to pick up whales or if they're actually trying to tease in the more normal player. Pleeeeeeeeeeease guys, tell me this is just a whale trap. You can't possibly be this stupid after watching Forza the past few weeks, right?
There's paying a premium to access stuff and there also charging people out the ass for trying to take it lazy. I'm really hoping it's the latter. If, and if it's a normal economic progression like past GT titles? Even before the seasonals and other misc bonuses in GT5 things weren't that bad.
We'll see if this is pricing of stuff deliberately looking to pick up whales or if they're actually trying to tease in the more normal player. Pleeeeeeeeeeease guys, tell me this is just a whale trap. You can't possibly be this stupid after watching Forza the past few weeks, right?
So you can earn all the cars without buying the credits? basically the credits are a cheat for people that dont want to play the game like you're suppose to? pretty much how ea does some stuff? I'm ok with this.
Holy crap. How the hell does this shit happen? I feel really bad for racing sim fans right now.
Last edited by RoboPlato; Yesterday at 07:37 PM.
I highly doubt it. Consoles releasing provides an opportunity to experiment with new revenue streams to recuperate rising costs. It might get worse from here, but I'm fairly confident a nice balance will be found.While I'm not too worries about the progression in this particular game it's only going to get worse from here.
This industry is digging its own grave, and in some weird way I kinda want this industry to crash and burn (weird thing to say when you're in the industry, I know) just so we can do it again - do it right.
Yeah, pretty much. That's a fairly clear difference. I do find the inclusion of micro/macro-transactions pretty sickening in a full priced game to begin with. But when the in-game economy is tangibly altered to push that shit, that takes things to a whole new level.Originally Posted by chubigans
It's when the economy starts to shift that gets me upset.
It's not about you, it's about the whales or something.Originally Posted by simplythebest
So you can earn all the cars without buying the credits? basically the credits are a cheat for people that dont want to play the game like you're suppose to? pretty much how ea does some stuff? I'm ok with this.
If you're:Originally Posted by alexandros
You don't see anything anti-consumer in paying double the price of the actual game for one in-game car?
a) dumb enough to do it;
b) don't have enough time to play the game for some hours and fucking earn it;
c) you're a very wealthy man.
No. I don't see why I should care about other people's irresponsible use of their money.
If you really want to play that card , then it's pro consumer as long as the game is not changed to make it harder to earn credits or get cars.Originally Posted by alexandros
You don't see anything anti-consumer in paying double the price of the actual game for one in-game car?
Choice isn't anti consumer , Forza'd model was. I've no issue with someone wealthier than me buying progression as long as my game isn't affected.
Was kinda intetested in checking this out, but now I won't be going anywhere near it, and will actively discourage anyone on the fence about it to steer clear as well. The more we support cancerous practices like these, the more games (and gamers) will suffer.
Because it can cause real societal harm, you know like people with kids who spend their monies on gambling, cigarettes, booze, and maybe even microtransactions?If you're:
a) dumb enough to do it;
b) don't have enough time to play the game for some hours and fucking earn it;
c) you're a very wealthy man.
No. I don't see why I should care about other people's irresponsible use of their money.
So this isn't negatively affecting the gameplay? And it has far more content than Forza 5? Is this correct?
Day 1.
The whales don't have internet so they can't get login bonuses, meaning the 8 million credit race would give then only 4 million credits.Originally Posted by drugstore_cowboy
It's not about you, it's about the whales or something.
Instead of racing 3 times to get 20 million they would have to grind 5 races!
It's absurd I tell ya!
Why is it any of your business what other people spend their money on?Originally Posted by Untalkative_Bunny
Because it can cause real societal harm, you know like people with kids who spend their monies on cigarettes, booze, and maybe even microtransactions?
Correct. The game is also getting something like 28 free Vision GT concept cars.So this isn't negatively affecting the gameplay? And it has far more content than Forza 5? Is this correct?
Fuck off Sony, this is disgusting.
While I'm not too worries about the progression in this particular game it's only going to get worse from here.
This industry is digging its own grave, and in some weird way I kinda want this industry to crash and burn (weird thing to say when you're in the industry, I know) just so we can do it again - do it right.
Anti-consumer would be if it's a car that's locked in a game that you already paid for with no way of accessing it unless you pay for DLC (like an unlock key). As it stands, you can still access the car through normal gameplay.Originally Posted by alexandros
You don't see anything anti-consumer in paying double the price of the actual game for one in-game car?
You wont be forced into microtransactions, just like you aren't in Forza.Originally Posted by silver.tongue
The information in the thread title is meaningless without knowing the way the economy of the game works.
In GT5 you could win up to 8.000.000 credits in a single race with Seasonal + Consecutive Log in Bonus.
If that's still the case, you don't have to buy credits with real money.
I don't have GT6 yet. I'll have to wait and see if you're forced into microtransactions.
Its good to see more people being a bit more sensible about this finally, realizing that there's a lot more to it than just 'microtransactions=bad'. It might have taken a Sony game to get people to stop and actually think about how this all matters, but hey, its something at least. The endless, mindless bashing was getting pretty tiresome.
Some of the responses here, in a core gamer forum, sadden me and frighten me in equal measure. The iceberg is in front of us yet the band keeps playing.
while i do condemn this type of business and have already in my posts, if GT6's economy and reward system is similar to GT5's , we shouldnt have to grind 1/1000th as much as Forza 5's problem. that game got fucked up.
Only if it psychologically pressures me into it by gimping the game.Originally Posted by alexandros
You don't see anything anti-consumer in paying double the price of the actual game for one in-game car?
If it's just GT5 with microtransactions tacked on as an afterthought, well you know the story about a fool and his money...
20mil credits is actually the limit how much money can you have inside the game. And there are very few cars that cost that much.
I personally don't give a shit but I'm glad that society as whole does. That is why we have helmet/seat-belt laws, restrictions on tobbacco, the FDA, and a bajillion other things that impinge on personal freedoms for the good of the group.Why is it any of your business what other people spend their money on?
& I'd say whale catching micros fall under the same umbrella as gambling, which is another area where society interferes with personal freedom.
Why is the thread title still not changed yet?
Not trying to justify the practice, but its somewhat disingenuous to cherry-pick a particularly expensive car and use that as an example.
What I mean is, there has to be a huge difference between ordinary and super-cars in terms of cost in in-game currency otherwise game balance would be broken. The reality is that if the top stuff is easy to acquire, its value is diminished and that of the stuff more ordinary is reduced to absolutely nothing.
As soon as you start offering "boosters" in terms of offering in-game currency for real money, you obviously can't be handing it out cheap in huge amounts as it basically is going to be effecting low-price (in-game) cars as much as high-price ones, so it has to be priced fairly high to begin with.
The upshot of this attempting to retain balance at the low-end, is to make buying high-end cars for real money ludicrously expensive. Which is of course great news for people looking to create sensationalistic headlines, and bad news for "whales", but ironically much better for regular players looking to earn their way through by legitimate means.
What I mean is, there has to be a huge difference between ordinary and super-cars in terms of cost in in-game currency otherwise game balance would be broken. The reality is that if the top stuff is easy to acquire, its value is diminished and that of the stuff more ordinary is reduced to absolutely nothing.
As soon as you start offering "boosters" in terms of offering in-game currency for real money, you obviously can't be handing it out cheap in huge amounts as it basically is going to be effecting low-price (in-game) cars as much as high-price ones, so it has to be priced fairly high to begin with.
The upshot of this attempting to retain balance at the low-end, is to make buying high-end cars for real money ludicrously expensive. Which is of course great news for people looking to create sensationalistic headlines, and bad news for "whales", but ironically much better for regular players looking to earn their way through by legitimate means.
That's the thing, people usually only listen/read to the part of the information that they like or that matters to them. Initially, people saw how hard it was to make money in Forza, that's why the outrage, because it felt like you were forced into microtransactions.Originally Posted by Seanspeed
You wont be forced into microtransactions, just like you aren't in Forza.
Its good to see more people being a bit more sensible about this finally, realizing that there's a lot more to it than just 'microtransactions=bad'. It might have taken a Sony game to get people to stop and actually think about how this all matters, but hey, its something at least. The endless, mindless bashing was getting pretty tiresome.
I don't have Forza either, but apparently T10 made some changes that allow you to make money quick, right?
It's sad that it took an internet outrage to get that going, but at least it worked.
No, it didn't. It(Forza) does have some changes that affect it negatively, but its nowhere near as bad as everybody is making it out to be.while i do condemn this type of business and have already in my posts, if GT6's economy and reward system is similar to GT5's , we shouldnt have to grind 1/1000th as much as Forza 5's problem. that game got fucked up.
That's the thing. Once they're in the game there will always be pressure to do this.Yeah, pretty much. That's a fairly clear difference. I do find the inclusion of micro/macro-transactions pretty sickening in a full priced game to begin with. But when the in-game economy is tangibly altered to push that shit, that takes things to a whole new level.
If the amount of in-game busywork is set at G1, all the people under the curve to the right are willing to go through that, so they won't purchase any of the microtransactions.
If you have MTAs in the game, the bean-counters will realise this and say, hey if you move it up a bit - say up to G2 - all the people under the graph to the left aren't willing to complete the grind (for whatever reason, maybe they are lazy, maybe they just don't have enough time). Now they're potential MTA customers. A lot of them will just say fuck it and just not complete the game, but some of them - and it doesn't take many to make this worth it - will buy something that will accelerate their progress or make the game easier in some way.
With these launch games, of course they will initially set the grind level the same as the previous game. This is all about setting the tone for the next-gen, as evidenced by the sheer number of launch titles with MTAs in them. Make them just part of gamers background noise, and you can stick them in any game! I personally find it abhorrent.
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