Considering what it costs to develop a game, and the small fraction of that cost that it takes to localize a game, I always find it very hard to believe that bringing a game to the US could ever not be cost effective. All the hard work is done. All the large costs are sunk.
Just fucking do it, NoA, you cheap bastards.
Perhaps this makes sense for NOA, but I don't think it's entirely true for Nintendo as a whole. Though people like to say say that the Operation Rainfall games were already translated in Europe, from what I can recall, there was a lot of activity surrounding The Last Story and Xenoblade bubbling on GameFAQs before "Operation Rainfall" formally came about. Before any European announcements were made.
Pandora's Tower, if I recall, became part of the push when a short clip of it appeared in one of Nintendo's investment slides. I believe it also had the first reveal of Kirby's Return to Dreamland in its Wii form. Pandora's Tower got sucked into Operation Rainfall because it looks kind of like a Square Enix game and people just assumed it was some sort of Final Fantasy + God of War.
My memory might very well be wrong, but that's the way I remember it happening. At any rate, it certainly influenced Europe after as seen from the promotional coins. There was a contest to win a special promotional coin if you bought Xenoblade, Last Story, and Pandora's Tower. Note that the first two are big RPGs by former Squaresoft people, while the latter is a completely unrelated dungeon crawler by a licensed anime game developer. Operation Rainfall is the only way the three are connected.
...Mind you, I'm not saying that these campaigns will work, since they probably won't. But I don't think Nintendo is deliberately ignoring them entirely. Information is a useful thing to have.
Pandora's Tower, if I recall, became part of the push when a short clip of it appeared in one of Nintendo's investment slides. I believe it also had the first reveal of Kirby's Return to Dreamland in its Wii form. Pandora's Tower got sucked into Operation Rainfall because it looks kind of like a Square Enix game and people just assumed it was some sort of Final Fantasy + God of War.
My memory might very well be wrong, but that's the way I remember it happening. At any rate, it certainly influenced Europe after as seen from the promotional coins. There was a contest to win a special promotional coin if you bought Xenoblade, Last Story, and Pandora's Tower. Note that the first two are big RPGs by former Squaresoft people, while the latter is a completely unrelated dungeon crawler by a licensed anime game developer. Operation Rainfall is the only way the three are connected.
...Mind you, I'm not saying that these campaigns will work, since they probably won't. But I don't think Nintendo is deliberately ignoring them entirely. Information is a useful thing to have.
Last edited by L Thammy; Today at 12:03 AM.
Yeah, the fact that digital is now an option and you don't have to bother with actually shipping discs all across the country means it's easier than it's ever been to bring games over.
Also, one thing Reggie and friends failed to understand is that it's not always about the individual game sales, but about how having a steady stream of games impacts the overall health of your platform.
These jokers essentially abandoned the Wii, and suddenly they're surprised when nobody shows up for its successor.
Also, one thing Reggie and friends failed to understand is that it's not always about the individual game sales, but about how having a steady stream of games impacts the overall health of your platform.
These jokers essentially abandoned the Wii, and suddenly they're surprised when nobody shows up for its successor.
You know, i love my 3DS, but now I'm starting to see why Nintendo continues to be an easy target for the press and gamers. They have absolutely no finesse.
As Reggie stated, the problem was NOA wanted to make it happen, but they couldn't promise us something right then and there until they had to come up with a right marketing approach for it, but it also had other projects that took higher priority too. Itt took time, and quite frankly, it took longer than it should have, but that's how it played out. We should have had Xenoblade out sooner for North America, especially when it was already localized, but as XSEED stated, just because a game is already translated, it doesn't mean all the work is done to publish it. Both Nintendo and XSEED took quite a while to get Xenoblade and Last Story and Pandora's Tower released, but they did do it. Nintendo should look into not region locking its consoles, but gamers did have the option to import Xenoblade from Europe by resorting to a very simple and cheap solution to hack their Wii to play imported games on it.Originally Posted by Dragonzord
There's a difference between a petition to port a game or make a new game
and
a petition to BEG for the release of a title that you already put out in japan years ago. a title that fits into a genre that this market is starved for. a title you put out IN ENGLISH a year ago. a title we can't import because you fucking region lock your systems.
Last edited by Hiltz; Today at 12:08 AM.
Localizing Xenoblade wasn't going to make or break their platform and you still haven't said how doing projects to lose money while already losing money will benefit them. That's what he's talking about, the small small minority that would buy that game isn't worth the money they stand to lose. Even 60k people of current WiiU owners isn't worth losing any real sum of money off of and that's assuming they all decide to forever abandon their console because of a single game not being localized which is absurd. Again, what are they gaining by losing money?Originally Posted by toddhunter
He is talking about their attitude as it remains today. Made sense then, doesn't make sense now.
It isn't just about gaining people, it is now about not losing people. With people building a digital library and being tied more to platforms it is going to be increasingly important to keep gamers engaged.
As the full pocket of S&P2 out in our gaming department can attest to, you can absolutely lose big on localizing a game. We haven't been able to get rid of it during its various fire sales.Originally Posted by Leondexter
Considering what it costs to develop a game, and the small fraction of that cost that it takes to localize a game, I always find it very hard to believe that bringing a game to the US could ever not be cost effective. All the hard work is done. All the large costs are sunk.
Just fucking do it, NoA, you cheap bastards.
What's that Reggie? You want Nintendo's grave dug 50 feet deeper? Got it!
Not fucking much Reggie. Most of the work had already been done by NoE.The deal was, how much of a localization effort is it?
When you don't localize your cool games, why on earth would I invest in future consoles when I don't trust that you'll treat your Western customers well. I haven't bought a Wii U yet, even though there are several upcoming games I'm interested in, partly because I don't trust Nintendo as a publisher for their more niche stuff.
I'm an admitted Nintendo basher, but really this is a lame comment from Reggie. You would think their line would be "oh absolutely we pay attention to our fans and what they want".
Big companies need to do some kind of Kickstarter thing.
Like Sega or Nintendo.
"If we presell _____ # of copies, we will develop Shenmue 3" for example. Go just a bit higher than you need to so you can get SOME profit, but then after those copies that were presold are released, everything else is pure profit PLUS imagine what it does for your fanbase, something that is so much more important these days than sales sometimes.
Like Sega or Nintendo.
"If we presell _____ # of copies, we will develop Shenmue 3" for example. Go just a bit higher than you need to so you can get SOME profit, but then after those copies that were presold are released, everything else is pure profit PLUS imagine what it does for your fanbase, something that is so much more important these days than sales sometimes.
What even was the latest game Nintendo was involved with that wasn't brought over despite people showing decent interest? Because I can't remember.
What good would that do? Then you get a billion petitions that don't happen and people get pissed off.Originally Posted by chemicals
I'm an admitted Nintendo basher, but really this is a lame comment from Reggie. You would think their line would be "oh absolutely we pay attention to our fans and what they want".
"YOU SAID YOU WOULD LISTEN TO US BUT YOU'RE NOT DOING EXACTLY WHAT WE TOLD YOU TO DO! NINTENDOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!"
Seriously, all this outrage over a common practice is simple baffling.
Xenoblade, Last Story and Pandora's Tower all made it world wide.
There is not a single WiiU game that Nintendo has any control over that hasn't made it to the west.
Nintendo is even fucking localizing games that other publishers won't like Braverly Default and Layton.
I just... I don't get what is going on here. Are people just really this fucking dense?
So...it was NoE's head honcho making fun of you in public then?
You can try to justify Nintendo of America not localizing games that were 100% developed and translated, but you don't make any sense in doing so. Thinking that XSEED could do it for less? XSEED had to pay to get the rights to publish the games. Print the games. Ship the games. If XSEED could do all that for less than Nintendo of America, maybe XSEED's management should take over NOA.Originally Posted by Zaraki_Kenpachi
Except these aren't binary realities. XSEED and other smaller developers also have much lower costs. To pretend major corporations don't have higher fixed costs and other costs going into development is just ignorant. They most likely have much higher pay, larger teams, and much higher overhead that they have to reconcile than a much smaller company used to localize games. This is also ignoring that the localization effort will be demanded to be much higher quality whether you guys will admit it or not. A working designs or similar "translation" of the original game would be far less acceptable to the vast majority of people if Nintendo did it rather than XSEED, working designs, atlus, etc.
The games were 100% developed and translated for NINTENDO. Released by Nintendo in Japan, Europe AND AUSTRALIA. Perhaps the only reason XSEED could do it for less is because they aren't paying someone like Mr. Fils-Aime to ignore fan requests. Instead, they listen to them?
Who said anything about higher fixed costs? Or, other costs going into development? You might be trying to compare apples to oranges, and not the simple fact NOA didn't publish games already developed. That's fine, and you don't make sense doing so. The facts are XSEED did Nintendo of America's job, because Mr. Fils-Aime was busy scuba diving apparently?
The games were already 100% developed and translated, there was no extra development costs there. The only thing they needed was an ESRB rating, and to release them with a U.S. box art. Must be very difficult for NOA to get together these days...
Disaster: Day of Crisis, 100% developed and translated. Released in Japan, Europe, and Australia by Nintendo in those regions.
Pandora's Tower, 100% developed and translated. Released in Japan, Europe, AND Australia by Nintendo in those regions.
The Last Story, 100% developed and translated. Released in Japan, Europe, AND Australia by Nintendo in those regions.
Do you see the common connection there? NOA was too lazy to bring over 100% developed and translated games to support their own console (the Wii). If NOA doesn't support their own console(s) with 100% developed titles, why should third parties?
I knew it, the Wii U is bad karma for all the Nintendo fans who didn't buy it.Originally Posted by Ridley327
As the full pocket of S&P2 out in our gaming department can attest to, you can absolutely lose big on localizing a game. We haven't been able to get rid of it during its various fire sales.
Got it day 1 and bought a full-priced copy for a friend. No regrets, only tears.
Do you realize how sorry and pathetic this sounds? Think about it for a moment.Originally Posted by chemicals
I'm an admitted Nintendo basher, but really this is a lame comment from Reggie. You would think their line would be "oh absolutely we pay attention to our fans and what they want".
As far as the topic at hand, Reggie was asked a question....and he answered it with the best of his ability without being curt or unprofessional.
I respect your honesty Reggie, but that's a really fucking stupid thing to say. Not listening to your fans will net you a console that struggles to sell 30k most months in the US. Enjoy.
But what fans does Reggie listen to?Originally Posted by stfuppercut
I respect your honesty Reggie, but that's a really fucking stupid thing to say. Not listening to your fans will net you a console that struggles to sell 30k most months in the US. Enjoy.
He doesn't have any authority to make games. That's NCL, and right now, they're doing the best they can.
He can't just force things in to existence.
So what is it you're suggest Reggie does that is, realistically, a good idea?
People (not all) would rather be patronized than spoken to honestly.
The world we live in today.
The world we live in today.
I can respect his honesty when it would be very easy to placate fans with little white lies about the extent of their involvement in the greenlighting process at NOA. We get far too much PR spin out of corporate heads in this industry as it is.
Reggie delivering the #realtalk. I like it.
He's talking about ALL games, if you want to hate him forever for using Xenoblade as an example then by all means but he was obviously speaking more generally when the game isn't full translated already. He's saying that they won't make bad business decisions for a fraction of a fraction of a fraction of the install base, if it's sizable and they can turn a profit than they will but they won't take on losing projects just because. That's all that he's relaying in his statement, if you want to read some evil plot instead of that by all means but that has nothing to do with what I'm saying.Originally Posted by CoffeeGames
You can try to justify Nintendo of America not localizing games that were 100% developed and translated, but you don't make any sense in doing so. Thinking that XSEED could do it for less? XSEED had to pay to get the rights to publish the games. Print the games. Ship the games. If XSEED could do all that for less than Nintendo of America, maybe XSEED's management should take over NOA.
The games were 100% developed and translated for NINTENDO. Released by Nintendo in Japan, Europe AND AUSTRALIA. Perhaps the only reason XSEED could do it for less is because they aren't paying someone like Mr. Fils-Aime to ignore fan requests. Instead, they listen to them?
Who said anything about higher fixed costs? Or, other costs going into development? You might be trying to compare apples to oranges, and not the simple fact NOA didn't publish games already developed. That's fine, and you don't make sense doing so. The facts are XSEED did Nintendo of America's job, because Mr. Fils-Aime was busy scuba diving apparently?
The games were already 100% developed and translated, there was no extra development costs there. The only thing they needed was an ESRB rating, and to release them with a U.S. box art. Must be very difficult for NOA to get together these days...
Disaster: Day of Crisis, 100% developed and translated. Released in Japan, Europe, and Australia by Nintendo in those regions.
Pandora's Tower, 100% developed and translated. Released in Japan, Europe, AND Australia by Nintendo in those regions.
The Last Story, 100% developed and translated. Released in Japan, Europe, AND Australia by Nintendo in those regions.
Do you see the common connection there? NOA was too lazy to bring over 100% developed and translated games to support their own console (the Wii). If NOA doesn't support their own console(s) with 100% developed titles, why should third parties?
Edit: And you're acting like because there was no translation costs that it was a winning cause? Do you think it automatically becomes profitable because it's already translated? They can still lose money on the project, I'm not sure why you're acting like they can't.
THAT'S THE POINT.Originally Posted by Dragonzord
Chill out, dude. It's just a video game company.
It's a video game company. You're an admitted basher of a video game company? Yeah, that sounds really childish. It's videogames.
The only way I could see justification for that is if you had some sort of personal ISSUE with the company. Like a really bad customer service experience or something like that. That's different. And understandable.
Always entertaining to see companies leaving money on the table.Originally Posted by CoffeeGames
Disaster: Day of Crisis, 100% developed and translated. Released in Japan, Europe, and Australia by Nintendo in those regions.
Pandora's Tower, 100% developed and translated. Released in Japan, Europe, AND Australia by Nintendo in those regions.
The Last Story, 100% developed and translated. Released in Japan, Europe, AND Australia by Nintendo in those regions.
I wonder what his thoughts on the Japanese operation bringing in perennial sales failure Platinum studios. I feel they did the right thing to boost the games portfolio of the WiiU but going by his statements he might not agree considering.
Refreshingly honest!
Reggie doesn't care what NCL does. He isn't in charge there and doesn't have to answer for that.Originally Posted by reptilescorpio
Always entertaining to see companies leaving money on the table.
I wonder what his thoughts on the Japanese operation bringing in perennial sales failure Platinum studios. I feel they did the right thing to boost the games portfolio of the WiiU but going by his statements he might not agree considering.
I would happily get behind something like this if it was for localising already existing Japanese titles that otherwise wouldn't make it to western shores. I wouldn't be so keen if it was for new, unproven games though as I think that money would be better spent on smaller, indie projects that interest me ie. guys who really need to money.Originally Posted by bengraven
Big companies need to do some kind of Kickstarter thing.
Like Sega or Nintendo.
"If we presell _____ # of copies, we will develop Shenmue 3" for example. Go just a bit higher than you need to so you can get SOME profit, but then after those copies that were presold are released, everything else is pure profit PLUS imagine what it does for your fanbase, something that is so much more important these days than sales sometimes.
Honest though not sure this is a good PR move.
The games came out anyway so they might as well have attributed it to the fans to create some goodwill and good feels all around, like what Sony did with the NoDRM thing.
The games came out anyway so they might as well have attributed it to the fans to create some goodwill and good feels all around, like what Sony did with the NoDRM thing.
This was pretty stupid of Reggie to say. He was better off lying. Nintendo is hurting on America. Apparently there are layoffs in IT, more reliance on contracting, piss poor morale etc. The last thing you want to say to your audience is that they have no voice. I took a bunch of business courses before graduating, you as a consumer have a ton of power. These companies fear you if they have don't have shit for brain management. Word of mouth hurts them and helps them just as much as sales.
lol at reggie wanting to bring xeno to american shores
Nintendo has become very short sighted and does not realized that outside casual gamers and Nintendo diehards they alienated themselves from a big portion of that dedicated gaming market. "If a game is worth the cost they will bring it, if not tough luck".
That does not bode well with the hardcore audience Reggie. That's doesn't sound like a commitment Reggie and you need a commitment because you lost the hardcore dedicated gamers.
What on earth is Nintendo expecting to accomplish by bringing isolated titles from established franchises ? Mass Effect 3 on its own, Yakuza HD on its own, Bayonetta 2 on its own. Bayonetta 2 will be a nicely polished piece of furniture on the titanic that's the WiiU.
That does not bode well with the hardcore audience Reggie. That's doesn't sound like a commitment Reggie and you need a commitment because you lost the hardcore dedicated gamers.
What on earth is Nintendo expecting to accomplish by bringing isolated titles from established franchises ? Mass Effect 3 on its own, Yakuza HD on its own, Bayonetta 2 on its own. Bayonetta 2 will be a nicely polished piece of furniture on the titanic that's the WiiU.
I like it when Reggie takes off his weird PR puppet hat and talks like a real human being.
Doesn't happen nearly enough, unfortunately.
Doesn't happen nearly enough, unfortunately.
If anyone doubted the value of the surveys you take for club
Nintendo, they don't care what you think.
So happy to be done with Nintendo and their backwards approach to everything
Nintendo, they don't care what you think.
So happy to be done with Nintendo and their backwards approach to everything
It was released with basically the most reluctance ever. The fact that there was some heated debate it just silly.He did see it, though, as Xenoblade was released.
I just... I don't get this topic. I just don't...
Are people being dense for no other reason than to be dense?
This wasn't a fan movement to make Mother 4. It was to release a game that had already been localised and translated into English. I can't believe that the cost would have been big at all.
It's clear that over the last 3-4 years Nintendo's rusted on fan base has dwindled. A small financial risk to help rebuild/placate that fanbase would be a good decision. T
And all this is ignoring the fact that the Wii was crying out for software in 2010/2011 as it sat there dying a horrible death.
Especially when your userbase in the region was upwards of 40 million. That kind of headroom should allow for large risks...localizing a game that's already done (when you had virtually nothing else on your plate) didn't even fall into that category.Originally Posted by Leondexter
Considering what it costs to develop a game, and the small fraction of that cost that it takes to localize a game, I always find it very hard to believe that bringing a game to the US could ever not be cost effective. All the hard work is done. All the large costs are sunk.
Just fucking do it, NoA, you cheap bastards.
Ok, this is like your fifth post in this thread saying the exact same thing.This was pretty stupid of Reggie to say. He was better off lying. Nintendo is hurting on America. Apparently there are layoffs in IT, more reliance on contracting, piss poor morale etc. The last thing you want to say to your audience is that they have no voice. I took a bunch of business courses before graduating, you as a consumer have a ton of power. These companies fear you if they have don't have shit for brain management. Word of mouth hurts them and helps them just as much as sales.
And no offense, but your couple years of courses pales in comparison to the decades that Reggie has spent running highly successful companies.
Lying wouldn't do anything but make people angrier when they ask for stuff and it never comes. That's just dumb business.
Outside of maybe Bayonetta (which still might be happening) Nintendo had no control over those other franchises. Sega and EA were the ones that fucked up, not Nintendo.Originally Posted by DigitalDevilSummoner
Nintendo has become very short sighted and does not realized that outside casual gamers and Nintendo diehards they alienated themselves from a big portion of that dedicated gaming market. "If a game is worth the cost they will bring it, if not tough luck".
That does not bode well with the hardcore audience Reggie. That's doesn't sound like a commitment Reggie and you need a commitment because you lost the hardcore dedicated gamers.
What on earth is Nintendo expecting to accomplish by bringing isolated titles from established franchises ? Mass Effect 3 on its own, Yakuza HD on its own, Bayonetta 2 on its own. Bayonetta 2 will be a nicely polished piece of furniture on the titanic that's the WiiU.
And every business says "If it doesn't bring us money, tough luck." Every. Single. One.
Just as a side note here to this discussion.....
To give a bit of context here, this "interview" posted by Siliconera was not some kind of exclusive interview. I'm given to understand that it simply came from a bunch of people talking to Reggie at the #ImwithReggie event yesterday. Given that this was a fan event, and that other fans were involved in the conversation, we should probably take that into account when considering Reggie's responses here.
To give a bit of context here, this "interview" posted by Siliconera was not some kind of exclusive interview. I'm given to understand that it simply came from a bunch of people talking to Reggie at the #ImwithReggie event yesterday. Given that this was a fan event, and that other fans were involved in the conversation, we should probably take that into account when considering Reggie's responses here.
Good to know. Thanks manOriginally Posted by Bulbagarden
Just as a side note here to this discussion.....
To give a bit of context here, this "interview" posted by Siliconera was not some kind of exclusive interview. I'm given to understand that it simply came from a bunch of people talking to Reggie at the #ImwithReggie event yesterday. Given that this was a fan event, and that other fans were involved in the conversation, we should probably take that into account when considering Reggie's responses here.
100k ? No. But 1million signatures? It'll definitely get their attention.
Still would have been nice to take care of that region lock thing.
And it's why I won't buy a Wii U Reggie. It took you how long to get those games to the US? Why should I have any confidence in you to deliver X to the US on a reasonable schedule? What happen if similar games are released near the end of U's life-cycle in Japan? It's not just a matter of direct sales, sometimes the loss in consumer confidence is worth taking what amounts to a very minor hit to their bottom line.
Last edited by JCizzle; Today at 12:50 AM.
.Originally Posted by megalowho
I can respect his honesty when it would be very easy to placate fans with little white lies about the extent of their involvement in the greenlighting process at NOA. We get far too much PR spin out of corporate heads in this industry as it is.
Transparency > Obscurity...
Nintendo does look at them, or we wouldn't have gotten Paper Mario: Sticker Star as it is.Originally Posted by vagabondarts
If anyone doubted the value of the surveys you take for club
Nintendo, they don't care what you think.
So happy to be done with Nintendo and their backwards approach to everything
Of course he would say that. They don't want NoA's mailbox to be swamped by
fan petitions any more than it already is.
It would be pretty idiotic for them not to take fan feedback into account
in their decision making.
fan petitions any more than it already is.
It would be pretty idiotic for them not to take fan feedback into account
in their decision making.
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