Sapiens
Member
NoJ called all the shots for NoA.
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Yoshi's Island explains the differences in Mario and Luigi's personalities
- Thread starter The Adder
- Start date
NoJ called all the shots for NoA.
EmCeeGramr
Member
I am.
Okay, so here is my first question:
Did you honestly ever think that the Wiki would become so... detailed? I don't mean that in a backhanded way, I mean just looking at something like the Super Mario Facts twitter where so many of these things taken out of context just look crazy.
JSoup
Banned
At the start, no. I thought it would end up being detailed, but not to the degree it is today. As the ball really started rolling, I realized a few things that other fans had already figured out:
-That it's a fanwiki, not Wikipedia. We could add and extrapolate on just about any Mario themed subject under the sun and people would read so long as the writing was good.
-That the fans are a creative bunch and will easily come up with new things to cover when all the basics are done.
-That there really wasn't many already established Mario databases (there are other, older sites that are still around, but none of them cover as much as us), and the ones that did exist didn't cover everything. We had the opportunity to become THE one-stop shop for the Marioverse.
EmCeeGramr
Member
Were there any debates over how extensive the scope would be? i.e, were there any fights over stuff like Donkey Kong Country games or Smash Bros. characters being included, because it "wasn't Mario enough"?
JSoup
Banned
Oh, yeah.
Initially nothing other than a basic Donkey Kong and Smash Bros. article was allowed.
Then there was a plan to create a Donkey Kong Wiki to house that information, which fell through, partly due to a lack of there being enough information (debatable) and lack of community interest. (There is a DK Wiki now, though (http://www.dkwiki.com/) and is one of our sister wiki's through NIWA.) All the information was moved back in and the concept of an extended universe were added in so we can cover general Nintendo/Mario minutia. We've found a happy medium between covering extended universe subjects while also not going overboard. The next big fight after that was over including Banjo and Conker, due to the inclusion of Diddy Kong Racing. They were in, then removed, then argued about again and again and again and again until we finally have to make a "shut up about it" rule. We eventually caved an there are articles up for both of them currently, but they are focused on wiki covered games only.
EmCeeGramr
Member
Are there any other big fights over stuff like that you can remember?
DrDrizzay101
Member
I approve of this wacky theory OP. Well done sir.
JSoup
Banned
Three biggest fights, off the top of my head:
-Canonicity. What was what storyline, who did what with who, oh god it just wouldn't stop. The administrative team ended up having several discussion about this and went back and forth. Finally narrowed down what worked (http://www.mariowiki.com/MarioWiki:Canonicity and the two other articles that are linked out from there).
-There isn't really a title for this one, but it was an issue we were having with several of our editors inferring too much information from a single source and then trying to pass it off as fact. What really sparked it was the supposed relationship between Baby Daisy and Baby Wario (I think it was Wario). They were both together on a statue in one of the racing games, so people started adding information to articles about how they were the best of friends or other....things. When it became clear that this wasn't going to solve itself via the natural editorial process, we had to move in, lock the article and eventually ban unconfirmed information from being added.
-Bob freaking Hoskins. Look up the page and read the quote. It's a great quote and says a lot about the Mario movie and Hoskins outlook on it. But people kept having issues with it. "We should remove that quote, the children will see it!" and other stuffs. We're an encyclopedia, we don't censor. It was actually just recently that the administrative team put it's collective foot down about the whole thing and said "it's staying, enough".
EmCeeGramr
Member
This is all amazing. Thank you so much (I mean that sincerely). I can't really think of any other questions right now, but thanks again.
JSoup
Banned
No problem~
Feel free to PM me if you think of anything else. Or even join our community over on MarioWiki.
foxuzamaki
Doesn't read OPs, especially not his own
I feel so informed from the conversation that just happened.
Lupin the Third
Member
Couldn't have they just spoiler-tagged/flagged it with a not-work-safe warning? It's not exactly censorship, but gives sufficient warning for kids/adults who would not care to see it. But yes, it's a very telling and informative quote worth keeping on the books.
In any case, love me some Mario, but it's like Lupin the Third: there is no real and definitive canon, end of story.
JSoup
Banned
It was suggested and it got shot down. Not because it's a bad idea or anything, I think the userbase was just sick to death of arguing about it at that point. Don't know why it didn't get brought up at the administrative level, now I think about it, but I'd imagine the response would have been the same. At the time, this was a major stresser for everyone involved.
Edit: And looking back at the initial proposal, the box was hilariously too big and was designed to make a big damn deal over the word 'fuck' being there. Didn't get reworked after that.
Noooo
I like to believe Lupin is canon. The Fujiko Mine series is canonically first of course, then green jacket series and then red jacket and last the movies, except that green vs red one.
Valjean Lafitte
Banned
Came expecting completely original and always hilarious "Mario lore is so deep" comments, was sadly not disappointed.
God forbid the OP's theory, which actually fits perfectly, was actually intentional in a game Miyamoto was closely involved with, a game that made a point of establishing itself as Mario's first adventure.
I probably should avoid these threads from now on, because my reaction to these comments is always the same: disgust that people find it so absurd to actually dig just past surface of the Mario stories. Yes, stories.
I love Mario stories and sometimes I like to joke. I also love Zelda stories and lore and often talk about those in great detail and I joke about Zelda's timeline as well.
Fake edit: I also use Mario Wiki as a place of resource on every single detail, and yes there's quite a lot of absurdity in Mario in general that I like to joke about. OP's theory is pretty good.
Wait I thought Luigi didn't find Yoshi till he was an adult?? This is some deep lore....
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aRkJGY1bzVY
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aRkJGY1bzVY
ChosenPredator
Banned
give me a origin story of the super mario bros in new york getting taken into the mushroom kingdom
Valjean Lafitte
Banned
Sorry for getting riled up then. Yeah, there are some absurd and inconsistent things in the Mario series, and those have partly crept in as a result of Nintendo handing Mario off to so many different developers, but also because no one takes Nintendo to task when it comes to Mario; even when a company like Alpha Dream, which does take the Mario universe more seriously than others, makes a game featuring Mario and Luigi as babies, but never connects it to Yoshi's Island in any way. Seriously, I have no doubt that if someone from the gaming press had asked one of the devs "I see this game has baby Mario in it. He was last seen in Yoshi's Island. Will this game reference that game in any way?", that they would have considered it a necessity.
At some point in the distant past Miyamoto cared more about the Mario series having a more cohesive universe and cast of characters, but now when someone tries to inject a little bit of easily overlookable depth (e.g, Rosalina being Peach's ancestor and a previous princess of the Mushroom Kingdom herself, according to Galaxy's story) into one of the mainline games, Miyamoto pulls in the reigns and makes sure it doesn't happen again.
Lupin the Third
Member
Noooo
I like to believe Lupin is canon. The Fujiko Mine series is canonically first of course, then green jacket series and then red jacket and last the movies, except that green vs red one.
You can't say that both the First TV Series and Episode 0: First Contact coexist and have both stories be 100% accurate. There are a couple of other issues, but if you have to arbitrarily pick out official productions you like or ones you don't like then it's not exactly a canon-friendly franchise. Lupin would be especially problematic if you tried to put the stories in any kind of chronological order....yeesh. Monkey Punch clearly wasn't concerned with continuity, so I don't see why anyone else would be.
As for Mario, I once looked into writing a Mario origin story that was extremely faithful to the original SMB's storyline but I never got around to finishing it.
Outtrigger888
Member
NSLU DLC only gives you 100 seconds per stage, and is much more difficult than NSMBU.
That's my cue to step away, as it's gotten too confusing.
Ein Bear
Member
This has just blown my mind. Had never thought about it before, but technically Conker's Bad Fur Day takes place in the same universe as the Mario games.
That is a really great theory that I enjoyed reading very much. And the best? It even makes sense
Broken Joystick
At least you can talk. Who are you?
JSoup
Banned
Like in some hood on the far south end of the Mushroom Kingdom.
"Ah, a Toad, that's nice.. Let me tell you, son, you just came into the wrong neighborhood, motherfucker."
Ein Bear
Member
Princess Peach is a Princess, yet there's no mention of a King or Queen.
Conker's Bad Fur Day ends with Conker becoming 'King of all the land.'
Conker is the King of the Mushroom Kingdom.
ArchedThunder
Banned
_-_Donkey_Kong_Country_Tropical_Freeze.png/300px-Donkey_Kong_Artwork_(alt)_-_Donkey_Kong_Country_Tropical_Freeze.png)
We should get Dan Ryckert to ask some good questions on lore. He always enjoys asking those out of nowhere character questions like he did in one Miyamoto interview he did at Game Informer if Mario was a real licensed doctor.
Also, I see Yoshi's Island being the new origin retconning the old Brooklyn story. I also had the same theory on Rosalina being an ancestor to Peach. There's a lot of legitimate stuff to look through, it's just more unseen than most others like something like Zelda, Metroid or Mega Man where you have an actual timeline of events.
thesurfshop19
Member
I have little to add except that I love the theory in the OP and am glad we are exploring this topic.
JSoup
Banned
BRB, proposing inclusion to admin team.
No problem~
Feel free to PM me if you think of anything else. Or even join our community over on MarioWiki.
Must say that I love what you do with the Wiki. I've added some things in my bored spare time (Like the worlds for the educational games, Info on obscure arcade titles) and I absolutely love how thorough the whole damn thing is. It's especially better than the "official" wikia for the series I saw one time.
This'll probably sound a touch bizarre, but if it was just you guys for info, MFGG for sprites/sounds, and Supper Mario Broth for the fandom (I.e., Like if you guys were the only two fan run sites left for the series (TMK shuts down, SMBHQ's webmaster quits for the 5th time, etc...)) I wouldn't mind in the slightest.
Dr. Buni
Member
This is good.I think this is a bigger one, but it's a little hard to tell on a phone:
tkscz
Member
I think this is a bigger one, but it's a little hard to tell on a phone:
Why are there two yoshi's island?
JSoup
Banned
Glade you enjoy! It's always a pleasure to hear people love our collective works.
Oh, those jokers. Yeah, they were some guys who didn't agree with how we were running the wiki in the early days and tried to compete with us, or some such. Wikia loyalists are the nuttiest people. Not that there is anything particularly wrong with wikia. It has it's problems as a provider, but it's a great place for budding wiki's to start. Many members of NIWA started there before joining the garden.
Firstly, thanks for the compliment, it means a lot to us (the rest of the administrative team are aware of this thread, so they'll also see your kind words). Secondly, I encourage you (or anyone interested in the fandom, for that matter) to try all the major fansites. Not just to find the right community for you, but to see what everyone has to offer. While previous encounters with the TMK community had soured me on them a bit, there is no denying that the site is an excellent resource (I've always felt that their merchandise lists were particularly well done). MarioWiki has problems too, just like any other site/community. Variety is the spice of life and all that.
That's probably the kindest thing I've ever heard about the wiki. Thank you!
I'm still kinda bitter someone over there ctrl+c, ctrl+ved the Mario Takes America page I wrote without any form of attribution.
did you know Rhythm Heaven take place in the same universe as WarioWare and thus, by extension, is part of the Mario universe? It's true.
Starwolf_UK
Member
Was Luigi's Mansion the first game play of coward Luigi?
I remember years ago there was an interview with questions submitted by fans and one of them was along the lines of "if Mario runs about a lot and does all these sports, why is he so fat?", Miyamoto found the question amusing, I don't remember the exact response sadly.
Always an excuse to post this.
always.
it's uncommon to see something scaring and amazing at the same time as this gif
Bomber Bob
Banned
BishopLamont
Banned
Yoshi's Island is one of the greatest Mario games ever, it's always funny when people exclude the game.
D.Lo
Member
Japanese title is Super Mario: Yoshi Island.
Japanese title of the GBA version is Super Mario Advance 3: Yoshi Island
I mean, you're already on the internet, it's not that hard to check that it's an official mainline Super Mario game in Japan too...