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Halo |OT8| A Salt on the Control Room

This is random, but I've found myself playing more Halo: Anniversary while I wait for Halo 4 (and Borderlands 2). The more I play it, the more I love it, and the more I recognize that it has a magic that none of the other Halo games have captured.

For one it's hard. If you don't heed your surroundings you can die very quickly from a few needler shots, but nothing feels as cheap as deaths in Reach. Jackals don't have an easy button and require decent timing, flank attacks or grenades. Hunters are pretty easy, but Covenant tanks and Banshees will eat you for breakfast if you're not on your game. There is more strafing and dancing around cover, more close quarters full-tilt in-the-zone madness, far more utilization of the environment and more goodies to find (power-ups) to tilt the scales in your favor by upping the intensity of the firefights.

Every weapon is useful, sounds great and packs a hefty whallop. Dat shotgun. Dat pistol. Dat assault rifle. :)

Sure the levels have a lot of repetition and back tracking, but they're filled to the brim with tons of enemies to fight, so I can't say I'm not having a great time with every room, bridge, or snowy expanse. Keep the bad guys comin', I'm just fine with that.

So yeah, basically, I'm damn glad we got to see a re-release of this great game. Its not just nostalgia talking, as I've gone back to play some Halo 2, 3, and Reach, and the others don't have the moment to moment satisfaction that I get from CEA.
 

feel

Member
Well, unfortunately, your gunna be looked at through walls regardless.

So might aswell balance it appropriately.
True. I quite like the radar wave, not only does it warn people about the PV user, it actually draws more attention to him than a simple red dot would and will expose his position if he does it while crouching around a corner. So if two guys are in a CQC standoff crouching behind cover, one doesn't get the upper hand if he uses PV because he will show up on the other guy's radar, so he can't abuse it that way.
 
But if Halsey survived, then he must be alive.
If I remember correctly she had an unnamed spartan body guard in one of the books that was killed protecting her after the events of the mission The Package, that spartan could have been him.

If not he could have easily just died at anytime post Halo Reach.
 

Brolic Gaoler

formerly Alienshogun
I think the likelyhood of recruit being the default armor is high, especially now that we see there is a recruit pose. Not to mention the fact we can't get a direct answer from Ellis/Frank on the subject when they have talked about the other armors not being default.

Looks like the LE was misleading from the get go, it probably is just a skin which makes the LE no better than a preorder and season pass.
 

RdN

Member
If I remember correctly she had an unnamed spartan body guard in one of the books that was killed protecting her after the events of the mission The Package, that spartan could have been him.

If not he could have easily just died at anytime post Halo Reach.

IIRC, they added a passage in the revised version of First Strike, where it said that a Spartam was guarding Halsey and was killed by an Elite (possibly the Arbiter, but not sure).
 
I think the likelyhood of recruit being the default armor is high, especially now that we see there is a recruit pose. Not to mention the fact we can't get a direct answer from Ellis/Frank on the subject when they have talked about the other armors not being default.

Looks like the LE was misleading from the get go, it probably is just a skin which makes the LE no better than a preorder and season pass.

True word, I'm about one step away from downgrading my order.
 
I think the likelyhood of recruit being the default armor is high, especially now that we see there is a recruit pose. Not to mention the fact we can't get a direct answer from Ellis/Frank on the subject when they have talked about the other armors not being default.

Looks like the LE was misleading from the get go, it probably is just a skin which makes the LE no better than a preorder and season pass.

It is incredibly annoying that the Limited Edition console gets an exclusive set of armor but the Limited Edition of the game does not. It should have been the other way around.

At least the console armor looks terrible...
 
I think the likelyhood of recruit being the default armor is high, especially now that we see there is a recruit pose. Not to mention the fact we can't get a direct answer from Ellis/Frank on the subject when they have talked about the other armors not being default.

Looks like the LE was misleading from the get go, it probably is just a skin which makes the LE no better than a preorder and season pass.

Shogun

http://www.littleenglishhaloblog.com/2012/08/more-new-images-of-halo-4-limited_22.html
 

Domino Theory

Crystal Dynamics
So is there any reason not to use the DMR? It seems so absurdly powerful in Halo 4, I don't see why anyone would ever choose a different starting weapon. It's powerful, really accurate, and has a decent-sized clip. Even at mid-range, it seems as though it performs better than the BR.

I really hope it doesn't become the go-to weapon after release. I'd love to see some variety.

BR 4 lyfe.
 

Risen

Member
True. I quite like the radar wave, not only does it warn people about the PV user, it actually draws more attention to him than a simple red dot would and will expose his position if he does it while crouching around a corner. So if two guys are in a CQC standoff crouching behind cover, one doesn't get the upper hand if he uses PV because he will show up on the other guy's radar, so he can't abuse it that way.


LOL I don't understand the change at all. I don't like PV and think it's a terrible idea in Halo, but if indeed that pulse on the radar is advising you of someone using PV, it renders PV pointless... you might as well remove it entirely.

Now I know that he knows exactly where I am and what I'm doing... which will actually give ME the upper hand when he uses his PV.

Well done 343...

It's like they were watching The Princess Bride while working on balancing PV.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=E2y40U2LvKY
 
Steeeely. Good write-up.

I'm still kind of confused by the bloom on the DMR. So is it like its counterpart on the DMR in Reach or is it more like the sniper's in Reach in that it tells you when you can fire again?
Feels like telling you when you can fire again, with the exception of EXTREME ranges. In almost all combat with it, bloom is not a factor at all.
Normally I'd agree but I think having more ammo will matter more in Halo 4 because they'll be far more starting weapons--other people on the field might not have Carbines, for example.
True, I did run out of ammo with my starting weapons a few times because there is less of the same weapons lying on the map.
We need to leave MLG settings out of this. I mean just removing the radar for a hardcore playlist. I would want the full AA, armor mod and weapon list to be available for every gametype. However, I'm just questioning what would break if radar was removed, and only radar. We actually talked about this in the last podcast with Bravo. We just don't know what will happen.

Again, not talking about potential MLG settings.
You'd have to take out the armor mods that enhance radar and keep radar when you are scoped, and probably take out promethean vision. Other than that you'd be good to go.
To anyone that played at PAX.

How is not getting knocked out of scope when being shot? I still find this very strange. It's been one of the most consistent things throughout the Halo series multiplayer.
I really liked how it felt. No more youarealreadydead.gif when someone gets the jump on you in an open area, you can actually fight back. Mid-long range combat was more enjoyable without getting knocked out of scope.
Didn't use that perk because I got pro real fast at strafing and dodging bullets.
I went from scrub baby to MLG amateur in like 5 minutes, sorry I couldn't help you answer your question.
To be clear, Heckfu is a dirty liar with this statement. :p

The perk you are referring to just reduced kick/flinch when taking damage scoped in. You don't get knocked out of scope with or without that perk.
 

DeadNames

Banned
LOL I don't understand the change at all. I don't like PV and think it's a terrible idea in Halo, but if indeed that pulse on the radar is advising you of someone using PV, it renders PV pointless... you might as well remove it entirely.

Now I know that he knows exactly where I am and what I'm doing... which will actually give ME the upper hand when he uses his PV.

Well done 343...

It's like they were watching The Princess Bride while working on balancing PV.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=E2y40U2LvKY

It's a wall hack. It should be near useless.

Besides, an experienced player wouldn't even need PV.
 

Plywood

NeoGAF's smiling token!
But if Halsey survived, then he must be alive.
I'd bet he is.
If I remember correctly she had an unnamed spartan body guard in one of the books that was killed protecting her after the events of the mission The Package, that spartan could have been him.

If not he could have easily just died at anytime post Halo Reach.
IIRC, they added a passage in the revised version of First Strike, where it said that a Spartam was guarding Halsey and was killed by an Elite (possibly the Arbiter, but not sure).
Jun may very well be alive.
The Spartan that died protecting Halsey isn't Jun.
Correct it was Sheila.

http://www.halopedia.org/Sheila-065

Also important to remember is a quote by Frankie in this video @ 6:30.

"We didn't see all of their fates one of them could have at least survived"
 

Brolic Gaoler

formerly Alienshogun
It's a wall hack. It should be near useless.

Besides, an experienced player wouldn't even look at the radar.

He's also discarding that he can see the disposition of the player he sees in PV, where they are facing etc. The radar does not allow that. The counter is pinging the radar to let someone know that another player can see them, that's all it does.
 

nillapuddin

Member
343 wont even have to NDA me, ill fake my own death, set up automatic withdraw to pay my rent, tell my mom I love her, drop my courses on campus, buy like 300 bucks worth of non perishables (read: puddin packs).

go dark, forge every day.

whatever remakes you want, I got you 343.
 

GhaleonEB

Member
Last bucket of thoughts on PAX stuff.

CTF Settings

I got to play CTF a couple times, but as I mentioned, they were all on Exile and I spent my time respawning thanks to the Gauss Hog and Scorpion. So I can't speak to the flag carrier traits and how it affects the game directly. So what follows is really based on what everyone else has: video and extrapolation based on what''s been announced.

On the one hand, the instant pick up solves a problem with objective games since Halo 1: there's a pile of weapons on the flag - or a Warthog lovingly parked there - and you can't pick it up on first go. I often cycle through AR's and Plasma Pistols before grabbing the flag, and that eats into critical time as the defending team converges. It'll be nice just to pick up the damn flag and go a move on.

So that's one situation where auto pick up will help. But there will be situations where you're fighting against defenders in the flag room, and strafe into the flag by accident - and are doomed for doing so. Or you're fighting alongside the carrier, and he dies, and we scoop up the flag instantly, without wanting to. And are, again, doomed. I hope the flag pick up zone is about the size of the flag pole to minimize these kinds of accidents.

Which leaves the decision to eliminate dropping the flag (giving players a magnum is probably closely related to this one). There will surely be situations where you grab the flag and round a corner to find three guys there, and you'd really like to drop it. Or you have the flag but want to drop it for a piece of heavy ordnance nearby, and so on. It also eliminates play such as tossing the flag to a lower level and covering your teammate from your position.

I've heard three reasons for the decision. The first is to eliminate flag juggling, which seems drastic considering the other options available (as with Reach's cool down). Another is that is speeds up gameplay, which could probably be accomplished through other means as well. The last is that it pushes players into dedicated roles: you're the flag carrier, and you'll behave differently once you are. This one seems the most compelling to me, an I'm interested to play it and see how it alters the game.

I wish I had a chance to play CTF more and get a feel for how it worked out. On paper, I can't say I like these changes, but I'll refrain from judging it to see how it plays out. On balance, the changes will make for a somewhat simpler game, and it eliminates a suite of coordinated flag movement options (juggling, tossing) that will make the mode more newcomer friendly. Which, combined with the added clarity to the HUD and announcer lines, is probably part of the goal. To the extent that it helps make CTF games more popular and thus voted in more often, I applaud the effort.​


Ordnance Drops

On one of those games on Exile where I was getting camped, I spawned and then had a piece of ordnance drop next to me. I grabbed it, scoped, and toasted the marauding Warthog with whatever Forerunner death ray I scooped up. Fun outcome. But it's a moment that's troubled me ever since, because I keep thinking about the implications.

The last time I played Halo 3 matchmaking was last fall, with a bunch of GAFers. We had an amazing game of Slayer on Avalanche. Our team fell behind as the other guys accumulated an advantage, toasting a few of our vehicles and pinning us down. We were behind by over a dozen kills. A plan formed, targeting specific vehicles. Rockets and power drains were acquired, players were positioned, and we executed a plan that eliminated their vehicles and we began to fight back. We ended up winning by seven kills.

This kind of comeback was made possible because of the fixed weapon placements and spawns. We knew where the tools were, and about when they would appear.

In Halo 4, we likely would have lost that game, because we could not have anticipated what ordnance would drop, or where. If we got lucky, it might have been anti-vehicle weapons, and if we were really lucky, they might have dropped near us. But the ability to put together a plan to combat a team that has a tactical advantage - be it map control or vehicle control or both - is dependent on knowing what tools you have available at your disposal. The ordnance system in Halo 4 injects a heavy dose of luck into the equation, and I predict the result is fewer come from behind victories.

I see Steely has noted the same issues in his post, so I'm not alone in this observation.

The flip side is, now and then a player will get some goodies land next to them, and they'll feel like they won the jackpot. Against a superior team with solid map control, the other team will still be able to have some goodies delivered to them by sheer luck, as the opposing team can't predict where stuff lands. As with the CTF updates, this sounds like something to make the game more accessible; randoms getting mauled by a team will still get thrown a bone from time to time, probably not turning the tide of the game but letting them get a few kills they otherwise would not. (And the reverse: a team with excellent map control and coordination will still get toasted by ordnance they can't control.)

The ordnance system in War Games, as I understand it, sounds like a very bad idea. It removes a lot of the strategy from multiplayer games, and injects a healthy dose of random luck, which runs counter to the competitive nature of the game. As I said, I think there will be fewer come from behind victories as a result, which is unfortunate.​


Music in War Games

Just a quick note here. There's music in most (all?) modes now, usually coming in at the end to ratchet up the tension. I liked it; it felt like a natural evolution from the music in Invasion and Firefight. My only worry is that it will start playing say, at the end of a CTF match. And then the game will go on for a very long time - what happens to the music then? Are we stuck with it?

At any rate, this is another departure to the series that I find quite welcome. It worked.​


Closing Thoughts

Games like Halo take time to judge properly, and it's doubly hard at public events like PAX to do so. But the game made a strong first impression on me, and I don't think that is likely to turn around after it ships. My immediate reaction to Reach was pretty negative, and looking back, it was for all the same reasons it remains so.

Halo 4 plays like Halo, with changes around the edges but not to the core of combat (which is what Reach did). The gunplay is extremely strong, and there's an emphasis on it that prevents the game from degenerating into a melee and grenade spam fest. I'm very worried about a number of elements - map set ups, ordnance, armor mods, cluttered UI and sound design - but even with all these things in the mix, the game was simply fun to play, and it played, for the most part, like Halo should; in the end, that's what really matters.

Much appreciation to the 343 folks, who put on a great show at PAX and who were great to talk with. Their passion for the game was on full display, and I think they've got a game to be proud of.​
 

Tashi

343i Lead Esports Producer
That was a good read Ghal. I also realized while reading it that you're a much better writer than I am lol. I need to be more clear in the things I write and even in the podcast. Good stuff.
 

Slaker117

Member
They have addressed questions about other armor being default, just not this one.



You're mistaking mad with a customer seeking clarification on a product before purchase, one that isn't being addressed.

From simply its name to it being the first helmet in the list and the icon for the armory in general at PAX, I'm definitely getting the impression the Recruit is the default armor.
 
Silly.Mikey thinks the Thruster Pack seems useless. I think he refers to the HaloGAF vs. 343i match. Let me clarify: It is not. Thruster Pack is the best addition in Halo 4. I love it. I miss it already. The Thruster Pack is definitely the new evade, just better and more balanced. It covers only 1/3 of the distance. What should you do with it? I am thinking TP is the perfect and best way to get out of Grenade's detonation zone. I used it for that purpose the most times. If you know the map, you can use to get into cover. At the beginning, I got stuck in geometry or the cover was to far away for the TP. But after I knew the map, I saved my ass many many times.

Bút now back to the HaloGAF vs. 343i match, you should ask Sai-Kun what I did with the TP in the match. His mind freaked out and his mouth went down just because of the magic tricks I managed to perform.
 

Vire

Member
Today I learned Shadowrun was an RPG and the 2007 game was just a spinoff.

Well Shadowrun itself stretches further back than that. It's a Dungeons and Dragons spinoff that originated in 1989 that spawned numerous video games. (SNES, Genesis, 360).

It's an interesting universe, shame the recent 360 game was so blah.
 
Well Shadowrun itself stretches further back than that. It's a Dungeons and Dragons spinoff that originated in 1989 that spawned numerous video games. (NES, SNES, Genesis).

It's an interesting universe, shame the recent 360 game was so blah.
nope, the recent game is great. I have no idea how it held up to its universe, but the gameplay was excellent
 

GhaleonEB

Member
Silly.Mikey thinks the Thruster Pack seems useless. I think he refers to the HaloGAF vs. 343i match. Let me clarify: It is not. Thruster Pack is the best addition in Halo 4. I love it. I miss it already. The Thruster Pack is definitely the new evade, just better and more balanced. It covers only 1/3 of the distance. What should you do with it? I am thinking TP is the perfect and best way to get out of Grenade's detonation zone. I used it for that purpose the most times. If you know the map, you can use to get into cover. At the beginning, I got stuck in geometry or the cover was to far away for the TP. But after I knew the map, I saved my ass many many times.

Bút now back to the HaloGAF vs. 343i match, you should ask Sai-Kun what I did with the TP in the match. His mind freaked out and his mouth went down just because of the magic tricks I managed to perform.

My favorite use of the Thruster Pack was while jumping. It just feels awesome to jump forward, then blast over the gap and land safely. The limited range will limit this use, but it was fun and kept maps flowing well.
 
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