The Technomancer
card-carrying scientician
Flashback effects are always playable. Split cards are usually playable. Flashback split cards were definitely going to be playable
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Magic: the Gathering |OT11| Amonkhet - Have you ever had decks with a Pharaoh?
- Thread starter SigmasonicX
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Went 3-2 at the GPT and didn't make Top 8.
2-2 at the Standard Showdown, playing against aggro every single time with Marvel. I feel like I need to put some Radiant Flames in there. Won a pack anyway. Had an Avacyn's Judgment, a Demon of Dark Schemes, and two Amonkhet full-art lands, one of them being foil. Could be better, could be worse.
2-2 at the Standard Showdown, playing against aggro every single time with Marvel. I feel like I need to put some Radiant Flames in there. Won a pack anyway. Had an Avacyn's Judgment, a Demon of Dark Schemes, and two Amonkhet full-art lands, one of them being foil. Could be better, could be worse.
There's a big Pauper tournament going on, if anyone wants to watch something different:
https://www.twitch.tv/cardkingdom
https://www.twitch.tv/cardkingdom
So gearhulk was the card dominating standard. Not Gideon who has been in every pro tour final since his release. Nor the 13 power minslaver or the artifact that lets you play it turn 4. Or the vehicle that was in every deck. Or the insta win combo.
charlequin
Banned
Me too! I even posted about this exact factor early on: the fact that both parts are typically overcosted, and the flashback part majorly so, tricks people into evaluating them as if they were standalone spells of those costs. The reality is that for anything where the front half is vaguely playable, the effect the back half gives of strengthening the front, or creating inevitability, or providing instant-speed card advantage, or whatever is just enormous in many cases. I wasn't surprised at all to see four or five of them getting tried out in fairly solid early Standard lists.
Familienoberhauptvogel
Banned
I asked this before did anyone in this thread actually underrate aftermath? All I remember is complaining about the design.
divisionbyzorro
Member
I think there was mostly bitching about the layout, and a lot of people cautioning against underrating them.
charlequin
Banned
I don't actually think anyone in here really did, I was more thinking of the broader community (and especially a notably bad post by SaffronOlive.)
Giant Panda
Member
I complained about some of the aftermath cards, especially the W/G one, but Dusk // Dawn and Cut // Ribbons always looked pretty good to me.
There's also a truly terrible article about Cut // Ribbons by Frank Lepore where he calls the card so bad that's insulting.
https://www.channelfireball.com/articles/cut-ribbons-and-gideon-of-the-trials/
Aftermath as an effect will always be strong. I just thought that some of the cards were underwhelming.
What are the Condemns for? Bouncing back another creature in hopes of killing a Shadow? We'll have to wait until the end of the month though before we'll have a good look at the meta when the next Modern GP's are hosted.
What are the Condemns for? Bouncing back another creature in hopes of killing a Shadow? We'll have to wait until the end of the month though before we'll have a good look at the meta when the next Modern GP's are hosted.
charlequin
Banned
One of the weird common threads of this and the SaffronOlive article is offense that these cards are rare, which I suspect is another factor driving people to subconsciously underrate them.
divisionbyzorro
Member
Cut to Ribbons is an insultingly good Limited card.
The latest LR cast was actually really negative about this limited format, which surprised me. Usually the guys are more forgiving up front, but neither of them seem to like it very much at the moment.
The latest LR cast was actually really negative about this limited format, which surprised me. Usually the guys are more forgiving up front, but neither of them seem to like it very much at the moment.
Cut/Ribbons at uncommon would NOT BE OK.
Frank Lepore doesn't impress me with his insight. I don't like that he replaced Cheon on magic tv.
Imperfected
Member
I mean, I'm pretty sure I only really spoke about them in a Limited sense, as did a lot of people, for which it's hard not to rate them well.
There may have been a person or two saying, "They aren't really Modern playable" at some point, but it's not like that's a scathing criticism. Most cards aren't Modern playable.
But he wears a suit when he plays Magic! A suit!
I feel like this is a loophole that should be closed. Memory is a sorcery, that's some bs
Infinite Stars
Member
Believe! Good luck getting that 1 last win!
This format is so bomb heavy compared to the last few formats. Rhonas and Glorybringer are everywhere. So hard to compete with the top tier bombs.
I've never seen Lepore in a suit, even when he plays here in store. Sure you aren't thinking of Todd Stevens?
I like a lot of the specific Amonkhet mechanics but I totally agree with their point about cycling being too prominent. (Rendering situational answers low to no opportunity cost) I also, as you might be able to tell from the above, hate how "princely" the rares are, as they mentioned as well. Way too swingey.
I've never seen Lepore in a suit, even when he plays here in store. Sure you aren't thinking of Todd Stevens?
I like a lot of the specific Amonkhet mechanics but I totally agree with their point about cycling being too prominent. (Rendering situational answers low to no opportunity cost) I also, as you might be able to tell from the above, hate how "princely" the rares are, as they mentioned as well. Way too swingey.
Imperfected
Member
That moment when you forget to mute Grand Prix coverage.
"I'd rather have Trial of Zeal than Rhonas."
Hey, I love losing games, too!
"I'd rather have Trial of Zeal than Rhonas."
Hey, I love losing games, too!
Had a pretty decent time at GO Richmond yesterday.
Played in the Sealed pool in the morning, did really shitty. Played in two Modern Showdowns and went 2-2 both times.
Traded in a bunch of cards and got a Mox Ruby and some deck boxes along with some stuff to work on foiling out Affinity and some cards to build Elves.
Wish I could have stayed the weekend like I intended to last month, but my dad decided he wanted to come visit.
And good luck Ashodin.
Played in the Sealed pool in the morning, did really shitty. Played in two Modern Showdowns and went 2-2 both times.
Traded in a bunch of cards and got a Mox Ruby and some deck boxes along with some stuff to work on foiling out Affinity and some cards to build Elves.
Wish I could have stayed the weekend like I intended to last month, but my dad decided he wanted to come visit.
And good luck Ashodin.
Also, while we're on the subject, why aren't grand prixs and limited PTQ events draft instead of sealed? Watching people that ripped sick pools annihilate everyone else isn't exactly great. While great players will invariably perform better than others over time, sealed is also inarguably a less skill testing/balanced format to qualify with. Have they ever given a reason for keeping draft events solely at the PT level? (Where they obviously recognize its merits as the superior format....)
Familienoberhauptvogel
Banned
Probably it's logistics. Sealed is easy to set up and maintain. Imagine having to organise ~150 drafting pods and a play area for them
I saw Lepore on Magic TV the other night but I assumed he was just subbing in because Cheon wasn't avalible that night (which he sometimes isn't). Is Cheon no longer a Magic TV host? I haven't been watching regularly for a while due to being busy but I didn't hear about this host swap if that happened recently. Bummer
Familienoberhauptvogel
Banned
My EDH decks have been so spikey recently that I'm doing a heel turn and brewing a solo Thrasios Moonfolk Landfall deck.
The deck has been on my radar for some time but I've struggled to marry the concept in my head to a partner combination and including all the usual suspects and playing Neheb made realize I like 2 colour deck for the restrictions it puts on you.
I could add Kydele but she doesn't really fit the Landfall theme.
The deck has been on my radar for some time but I've struggled to marry the concept in my head to a partner combination and including all the usual suspects and playing Neheb made realize I like 2 colour deck for the restrictions it puts on you.
I could add Kydele but she doesn't really fit the Landfall theme.
Wait what?
The meta already adjusted. We have the most diverse tier 1 in modern than we have had in ages. There is control (UW control), combo (dredge, storm), midrange (shadow decks) ramp (valakut, 50 shades of tron), aggro (burn, affinity). Why would you want a ban based on how healthy this is....
I'm trying to get a full set of power. That puts me at 4 moxes. Just had a bunch of random cards that I'm not playing or doing anything with and just was able to find someone that would take them all and with trade in bonus got me there.
Part of me wishes i would have had Dan Frazier sign it, but don't have all five and hope to be able to get them all signed at once.
And all the nissas are garbage but one.
Where have I heard this before?
charlequin
Banned
Yeah, it seemed trivially obvious to me why some of these had to be rares and whether or not the "individual effects" "count as rare" that doesn't change their overall power level.
Not sure what you're trying to snark about here. Modern has been a good, diverse format at multiple points in its history.
Infinite Stars
Member
Modern is pretty great at the moment, though I'd Wish they'd act on their teasing about fixing the current imbalance where White and Blue are meme-tier compared to Mono Colorless decks.
Basically, Azorius is the Priest of Modern right now: it's not the absolute worst (that's Mono White) but it's still way below the other 3 colors(and colorless)
The fact that you listed 1 Control deck that's still somewhat fringe and are saying it somehow balances out the overexcess of Ramp/Aggro/Midrange is bonkers. We have 1 Control Deck floating around tier 1 (that according to basically all info I can find is 4-5% of the field, aka the same amount as Non-Eldrazi Tron) vs all the Combo(Ad Nasaeum/Dredge/Storm), Ramp(Valakut/Tron), Midrange(Eldrazi/Death's Shadow), and Aggro(Burn/Affinity).
I don't even like Control that much, but it says something that Blue and White get continuously fucked over in Modern(What's the most recent cards in these colors to see play in the vein of Fatal Push/Swiftspear/The Eldrazi that wasn't banned in under 6 Months?) In fact, of the unbans we've had both the ones aimed at helping UW landed with a wet fart while the Green one has to be rebanned.
Basically, Azorius is the Priest of Modern right now: it's not the absolute worst (that's Mono White) but it's still way below the other 3 colors(and colorless)
That's not diverse though.
The fact that you listed 1 Control deck that's still somewhat fringe and are saying it somehow balances out the overexcess of Ramp/Aggro/Midrange is bonkers. We have 1 Control Deck floating around tier 1 (that according to basically all info I can find is 4-5% of the field, aka the same amount as Non-Eldrazi Tron) vs all the Combo(Ad Nasaeum/Dredge/Storm), Ramp(Valakut/Tron), Midrange(Eldrazi/Death's Shadow), and Aggro(Burn/Affinity).
I don't even like Control that much, but it says something that Blue and White get continuously fucked over in Modern(What's the most recent cards in these colors to see play in the vein of Fatal Push/Swiftspear/The Eldrazi that wasn't banned in under 6 Months?) In fact, of the unbans we've had both the ones aimed at helping UW landed with a wet fart while the Green one has to be rebanned.
Based on this post I can tell that you haven't played competitive magic that frequently. At the highest level there is normall LESS than this that's viable. For the past few years the format has had like 3-5 decks that are tier 1 with NO control deck being tier one for a consistent basis. (Grixis isn't consistent) This is as good as it gets since wizards doesn't print powerful answers often anymore. No use in complaining about it when that's how they print cards these days. Plus there is nothing that's on the ban list that helps. Jace homogenizes fair decks, stoneforge slides into abzan and makes it better, and preordain makes storm better. The only argument for a card to help blue is dig through time and that card carries more baggage than Jace does. The format is fine how it is right now and bans to death shadow just make the format worse. If shadow is banned then all the tron decks/unfair decks get way better and push the other fair decks minus abzan out. UW control is there to prey on shadow. Also what are you talking about? UW is tier 1 because of ancestral being legal. Hell there are two builds floating around right now: the as foretold build and the Gideon of the trails build. The powerful control decks are good in different metas. Jeskai is good when small creatures are good, UW is good when ramp/big creatures/midrange is good and grixis is good when control needs a slightly faster way to close out. The format is fine just not for you.
Modern is pretty diverse. Certainly much closer to the positive end of the spectrum than the negative. Yes, control and reactive strategies need a boost, but I don't think bannings or unbannings will help that- they need printings. New cards in the format to help address how slow reactive strategies are compared to the proactive ones. Taking out one strategy- be it death's shadow or anything else- isn't going to help control in the face of all the other incredibly fast strategies. Unbanning Jace or any other option won't help either- those only solidify control's grip on the game where it's strongest already; there are no unban options that will help control's early game.
That said, UW's success IS promising, even if it's only one archetype doing well atm.
That said, UW's success IS promising, even if it's only one archetype doing well atm.
My thoughts exactly. This is as good as it gets with the current pool of cards. Be happy that there is a tier 1 control deck since there isn't most of the time.
Yeah, I think modern is in a good place for brewers and those who thrive on getting edges through careful deck choice and sideboard selection. I do think the actual play of the format is pretty weak- with lots of strategies playing their own game of solitaire, shutting out certain decks with a single card, (blood moon, chalice on 1, rest in peace, stony silence, etc.) natural tron just ending games, etc. I find even standard to be a more interesting and skill testing from a play perspective.
I don't know how they address that problem, though, and at least the format does offer something different with its diversity so players that enjoy the deck choosing or building aspect of the game more than the minutia of navigating careful battlefield oriented games have a good option in the game.
Of course, the natural solution for everyone is just to play legacy, which has the best balance of both deck diversity and skill testing gameplay.
Congratulations! Now, take it all the way tomorrow and get that PT invite! (I think 12-3-0 can top 8? Although you may need to have taken your losses later on for better breakers.... fight the good fight, in any case)
I don't know how they address that problem, though, and at least the format does offer something different with its diversity so players that enjoy the deck choosing or building aspect of the game more than the minutia of navigating careful battlefield oriented games have a good option in the game.
Of course, the natural solution for everyone is just to play legacy, which has the best balance of both deck diversity and skill testing gameplay.
Congratulations! Now, take it all the way tomorrow and get that PT invite! (I think 12-3-0 can top 8? Although you may need to have taken your losses later on for better breakers.... fight the good fight, in any case)
Congrats! Hope you get Top 8, or at least top 64 and get some money!
Congrats, dude!
Wulfric
Member
Awesome, P9 always looks beautiful in the display cases, but I could never justify it myself. How much was the Ruby btw? I imagine your trade in stack must have been pretty tall by the end of the deal. xD
Nice work, get some rest tonight buddy.
Infinite Stars
Member
Again, I'm not saying Modern is horrible right now, it's just a bit lacking for Blue/White mages because Red gets Bolt(Legacy Playable), Black gets Thoughtseize(Legacy Playable), Green gets Goyf(Legacy Playable). Meanwhile, White gets Path and Blue gets Serum Visions/Mana Leak, both of which are good cards but not anywhere near on par with the 3 aforementioned cards.
Ancestral Control isn't played in any of the blue White Lists I've seen, because it's too slow of a card half the time. It's great against Death Shadow.. but that's basically it, and you still need to live the 5 turns to make up for it. And Lol at Saying As Foretold is good, it reeks of "Trap" card in the same way that Ajani Unyielding is for Standard: it comes down at a point where you'd be better served with some other card.
I'm still on the Unban Mystic Train because Batterskull+Death's Shadow can't be run in the same deck without somehow warping the deck due to their conflicting natures.
The issue with hoping for Standard cards to help is that Wizards still believes that 4 Mana Board Wipes are too good for Standard while pushing creatures to breaking points(Spell Queller has no reason to be able to hit 4 CMC beyond pushing it. Same goes for Reality Smasher being the way it is)
I think that you can make that case about Solitaire as true which is mainly my biggest complaint with Modern. I don't mind Blood Moon/Rest in Peace/Stony Silence because they can mostly be played around(There's footage from GP Pittsburg of Wescoe losing to Affinity after he resolved Stony, Tron can generally power through a Blood Moon if there's no pressure, RIP can't beat Dredge alone because they'll Mull to an answer, etc), but As Nauseum/Tron getting to go off on Turn 3/Turn 4 when the best answers are either a 3 Mana Enchantment/Quarter or Discard(which is Mono Black Woooo)
Woo! Time to for you to win it, right?
The format still only has 1-4 decks at tier 1(Death's Shadow, Eldrazi Tron, and Tron, with Burn/Affinity floating around at the bottom). I play plenty of Competitive Modern, trust me, and when every spiky player at my LGS is on either Tron or Eldrazi that's not healthy to me. This is putting Tier 1 as 5% or above according to MTGTop8 because Salvation's current tiers are off and Nexus doesn't update at a reasonable pace and even then Eldrazi+Death's Shadow are at 23-24% of the meta.
Ancestral Control isn't played in any of the blue White Lists I've seen, because it's too slow of a card half the time. It's great against Death Shadow.. but that's basically it, and you still need to live the 5 turns to make up for it. And Lol at Saying As Foretold is good, it reeks of "Trap" card in the same way that Ajani Unyielding is for Standard: it comes down at a point where you'd be better served with some other card.
I'm still on the Unban Mystic Train because Batterskull+Death's Shadow can't be run in the same deck without somehow warping the deck due to their conflicting natures.
I'm not on the "Ban Death Shadow Train" by any means. I'd rather we kill Eldrazi Tron for violating the color pie by being able to run no colors and still be 11% of the meta then kill a deck that is actually pretty sweet.
The issue with hoping for Standard cards to help is that Wizards still believes that 4 Mana Board Wipes are too good for Standard while pushing creatures to breaking points(Spell Queller has no reason to be able to hit 4 CMC beyond pushing it. Same goes for Reality Smasher being the way it is)
Yeah, I think modern is in a good place for brewers and those who thrive on getting edges through careful deck choice and sideboard selection. I do think the actual play of the format is pretty weak- with lots of strategies playing their own game of solitaire, shutting out certain decks with a single card, (blood moon, chalice on 1, rest in peace, stony silence, etc.) natural tron just ending games, etc. I find even standard to be a more interesting and skill testing from a play perspective.
I don't know how they address that problem, though, and at least the format does offer something different with its diversity so players that enjoy the deck choosing or building aspect of the game more than the minutia of navigating careful battlefield oriented games have a good option in the game.
Of course, the natural solution for everyone is just to play legacy, which has the best balance of both deck diversity and skill testing gameplay.
I think that you can make that case about Solitaire as true which is mainly my biggest complaint with Modern. I don't mind Blood Moon/Rest in Peace/Stony Silence because they can mostly be played around(There's footage from GP Pittsburg of Wescoe losing to Affinity after he resolved Stony, Tron can generally power through a Blood Moon if there's no pressure, RIP can't beat Dredge alone because they'll Mull to an answer, etc), but As Nauseum/Tron getting to go off on Turn 3/Turn 4 when the best answers are either a 3 Mana Enchantment/Quarter or Discard(which is Mono Black Woooo)
Woo! Time to for you to win it, right?
Nice one, congrats. Your pool was killer.
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