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[A-V-B]

Oh, for fuck sake. Posts like this are why people are calling you guys crazy. Justifiably so.

What? It has that same sort of flat lighting and sterility in a screen cap that I've seen in some game cube games, resolution and some assets not aside. It just looks bad. I didn't say I'd totally believe it if someone said it was a gamecube game. You trying to pick a fight or something?

I'm not even a Demons/Dark Souls fan. In fact the series kinda pisses me off -- I don't find it terribly entertaining, more of a chore than anything -- but there's no denying how absurd this downgrade is and I feel pretty bad for its fans.

 

[Poetic.Injustice]

The gaming press has repeatedly proved to be blind when it comes to graphical differences so no surprises here.

 

[Paracelsus]

I can't believe that people are really expecting the PC version to be a completely different build of the game. I don't think these downgrades happened at the last second like everyone thinks.

It will be, probably not the one going for sale in a month.

 

[bob_arctor]

So I've just started the game

Ok, I'm not going to deny it doesn't take a hit but I'm happy to say it looks much better than Dark Souls 1. I took a quick shot with my phone (I know, contard right?) of somewhere near the start and personally I think it looks stunning.

That's what most people are saying (those actually playing I mean), which makes me look forward to the PC version. Dark Souls Durante Edition looked incredible to me.

 

[Eusis]

I can't believe that people are really expecting the PC version to be a completely different build of the game. I don't think these downgrades happened at the last second like everyone thinks.

Yeah, your best hope is a repeat of Tomb Raider with a spruced up next-gen update. Though at this point it's arguable the game should've been a PS4/XB1 game in the first place, but those consoles weren't announced and it was even delayed from the end of 2013 to 2014. Hindsight's 20/20 and all that, though if everyone had that kind of sight into the future we'd have mindblowing launches.

 

[Persona7]

Gads, if the lighting and such is THAT horrible it will be a SEVERE downgrade from Dark Souls. Imagine the Tomb of the Giants if you could see everything??? ALL horror is subsequently lost. I really hope the PC version has pitch black segments where you need spells or special items to see with. Even Dragon's Dogma did night's darkness extremely well.

So far I don't see this in Dark Souls 2. It looks incredible.

 

[cascardian]

I don't believe it will change anything really either.

But I do think moaning endlessly about a game then throwing cash at it is hypocritical and dumb.

People still make this kind of faulty argument? I thought having to watch this video is basically a NeoGAF rite of passage ;-)

"Moaning endlessly" does get things done. Faster and better than any other way, actually. So what's that dumb about it? And for that matter, what's hypocritical? One can "endlessly moan" (which one single person isn't actually doing here, it's just your overall impression that is colouring this perception) about one aspect of a game but still immensely enjoy the rest.

I never said there's no difference, rather that people were acting crazy about it when they hadn't even played the game, which is par for the course on this forum. Since then I've been Twitter bombed and had my integrity and intelligence called into question multiple times. In my mind that just further proves my point.

At 15 hours into DS2, I can only think of one area that doesn't look as good as or better than everything I've seen in the previous games, and on top of that it's an exceptionally good game. If that's not enough for the people who are raging about the preview footage, it's their prerogative not to play it, but they're seriously missing out.

People seemingly acting crazy about it is, I'd say, just how human group psychology works and how one tends to categorise people as parts of a pattern/group instead of as individuals. There is, e.g., actually plenty of reasoned discussion and few if any trolling going on, so it's nothing really out of typical normative behaviour ('crazy')--even for mostly anonymous people. Non-normative writing, such as abuse of any kind, is usually punished quickly. As for the topic itself: False advertising practices will of course spark debate (as they did with Watch Dogs, Killzone etc.) and comparisons and whatnot, especially since this is an enthusiast forum.

That a lot of people hadn't or haven't yet played the game before starting the discussion is simply besides the point. Again, debating (even passionately hating) an aspect of a thing does not mean one does not like the thing as a whole or, in fact, needs to have experienced the thing in full to form a well-reasoned argument about it. This is one such topic where the evidence already weighs so heavily on one side that it's not needed. Thus, painting all participants of this topic with your overly broad crazy brush does a major disservice to the argumentative validity of your statement. I'm not saying you deserve the twitterbombing, though. That's just people on Twitter being people on Twitter--it's not exactly a great place for discussion. But hey, calling people crazy out of the blue and with no qualifier is not exactly a great discussion starter either, right?

 

[Floex]

That's what most people are saying (those actually playing I mean), which makes me look forward to the PC version. Dark Souls Durante Edition looked incredible to me.

I will say this, when it looks ugly, it looks ugly. I;ve just reached what I presumed is the beta 'level'. They've done a really stupid thing in this when it comes to the lighting. Just before I reached the first boss a cut scene plays showing the superior lighting, it's what the game should look like. Cut to actual gameplay and the downgrade rears it's ugly head and looks like DS1. Such a shame.

 

[bob_arctor]

I will say this, when it looks ugly, it looks ugly. I've just reached what I presumed is the beta 'level'. They've done a really stupid thing in this when it comes to the lighting. Just before I reached the first boss a cut scene plays showing the superior lighting, it's what the game should look like. Cut to actual gameplay and the downgrade rears it's ugly head and looks like DS1. Such a shame.

Does adjusting brightness at least fix the washed out look somewhat or does that just crush blacks on everything else?

 

[Metroid-Squadron]

That's what most people are saying (those actually playing I mean), which makes me look forward to the PC version. Dark Souls Durante Edition looked incredible to me.

Too bad the game only looks like that 1% of the time.

 

[swazzyswess]

I'm not even a Demons/Dark Souls fan. In fact the series kinda pisses me off -- I don't find it terribly entertaining, more of a chore than anything -- but there's no denying how absurd this downgrade is and I feel pretty bad for its fans.

Give your sympathy to people who need it. The game is unquestionably great.

 

[Sanctuary]

I don't know why people keep saying Dark Souls was ugly. It wasn't a graphical powerhouse at all, but it had amazing and cohesive aesthetics. All of the areas in the game felt like they belonged to the same world.

That screenshot from the phone is a terrible example. It just highlights how there are some really great looking areas in this game, but then they are joined with areas from "Shit Mountain". It makes it have a very schizophrenic look to it. And the removal of the lighting just makes all of the areas that were supposed to be dark, dull and boring. The kicker is that they left all of the sconces, but it's so bright you never need them most of the time.

 

[Arkanius]

I don't know why people keep saying Dark Souls was ugly. It wasn't a graphical powerhouse at all, but it had amazing and cohesive aesthetics. All of the areas in the game felt like they belonged to the same world.

So much this

 

[Branduil]

I will say this, when it looks ugly, it looks ugly. I;ve just reached what I presumed is the beta 'level'. They've done a really stupid thing in this when it comes to the lighting. Just before I reached the first boss a cut scene plays showing the superior lighting, it's what the game should look like. Cut to actual gameplay and the downgrade rears it's ugly head and looks like DS1. Such a shame.

Hmm, well if the cutscene(even if it's prerendered) still has the lighting, I have a little bit more hope for the PC version.

 

[Arkanius]

Remember this:

http://www.lazygamer.net/xbox-360/dark-souls-2-was-made-with-next-gen-in-mind/

“We always had in mind the next generation, such as DirectX11 and next generation hardware when creating our technology, and also challenged ourselves as programmers to simultaneously create for the new generation,” Ando said.

The thing we prioritized when re-creating our engine was, as a concept, taking the graphics to a more photo-realistic look, and in order to fulfil this, we had decided to discard our old engine and create a new one.

 

[A-V-B]

Give your sympathy to people who need it. The game is unquestionably great.

I don't agree? I just know people aren't getting the experiences they thought they paid for, and I know what that's like. You'll get my sympathy whether you like it or not, pal!

 

[CountAntonius]

Remember this:

http://www.lazygamer.net/xbox-360/dark-souls-2-was-made-with-next-gen-in-mind/

Then they realized it had to work on current gen consoles. If they were going to make a new engine of course it had to take next gen into account.

 

[Metalingus5150]

Then they realized it had to work on current gen consoles.

I've posted pictures in this thread of the 1080p 60 fps video which has to be on pc, it hardly looks next gen.

 

[RK9039]

Someone in this thread was claiming that the PC version has a 14gb install?
So then what's this?



Only two more gb than the consoles. Unless for whatever reason they don't include the "really, truly, seriously" recommended specs when factoring in HD texture packs?

I was 'claiming' it was 14GB because that's what it says on the Steam store.

 

[A-V-B]

Bet you a lot of the assets are still on the console versions, in the data, they just aren't being used.

 

[Metroid-Squadron]

Remember this:

http://www.lazygamer.net/xbox-360/dark-souls-2-was-made-with-next-gen-in-mind/

And that interview is only a couple of weeks old. WTF.

 

[Sanctuary]

And that interview is only a couple of weeks old. WTF.

I like the part where PS3 and 360 are current gen.

 

[Arkanius]

And that interview is only a couple of weeks old. WTF.

That's the point.
They lied and lied until the release.

 

[UrbanRats]

That's the point.
They lied and lied until the release.

Happens all the time, so it's ok.

 

[bob_arctor]

Too bad the game only looks like that 1% of the time.

The game only looks better than the original Dark Souls 1% of the time?

 

[futnownarcade]

We should have stopped trusting From Software after they lied about the Kinect actually working in Steel Battalion Heavy Armor.

 

[Metroid-Squadron]

The game only looks better than the original Dark Souls 1% of the time?

That depends on how much of your playtime is spent on Majula.

 

[EddCoates]

Here's the same image with some added contrast and brightness:

vs

Looks better than the original, so at least this would be plausible to add in to the PC version should it look the same, right?

 

[TheWriter]

Hey, I actually made a video comparing the original demo to the final game. Sort of shot for shot.

Dark Souls 2 - April 2013 Vs Retail Lighting and Graphics Comparison

Even though I was shocked from the first seconds onwards, I grew accustomed to the new look ... until 2:35, where he went down the dark corridor. The atmosphere is completely gone.

 

[CadetMahoney]

It is false advertisement because this was claimed to be running on PS3 just a month before release:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=A3MdOBH-jDc

That video looks amazing! Why?

It was quite disingenuous having that version out there in the press! This is going to get quite interesting before the end, I assure you.

What the actual fuck for footage from a couple fucking months ago? WHERE DID THIS VERSION OF THE GAME GO TO?!

PC version better be this.

I think things are only starting to get interesting tbh. ppl are hedging their bets on PC having the original improved geometry/lighting and so on. . . I have a feeling not even Durante will be able to help. We can only assemble our strike force to hit Bamco/FROM HQ if PC doesn't save us from false advertising since the gaming press are all too scared or paid off.

FROM kept showing the "old version" as the real thing to the public and they kept talking about their new engine till few months ago.

I don't believe for one bit that they didn't test the game or noticed bad performance months and months during the development. It's just very recent that people noticed huge downgrade.

The problem here is journalists and sites treat FROM like an innocent puppy since it's the "cool" FROM it's now " a normal thing happens all the time" like what that GB dude said.

pretty much.

 

[Floex]

Does adjusting brightness at least fix the washed out look somewhat or does that just crush blacks on everything else?

The initial brightness setting you do at the main screen doesn't help matters in the slightest. Everything is too flat. I'll have a look tomorrow to see if there is any way correcting the gamma.

Oddly it does say on the title screen just under the firmware version number, 'Calibrations' which is currently on 1.03 so perhaps they'll be looking to patch this at a later date.

 

[Easy_D]

Guys, sure we can be angry with the game, with the developers and their promises, but all this negativity has to end

Cheer up GAF! You know what they say...

 

[SargerusBR]

Guys, sure we can be angry with the game, with the developers and their promises, but all this negativity has to end

Cheer up GAF! You know what they say...

The bright side is that the game is so fucking good

 

[Albo]

Remember this:

http://www.lazygamer.net/xbox-360/dark-souls-2-was-made-with-next-gen-in-mind/

The game was built with next gen in mind only for it to turn out like this?

Just bring get working on those PS4/Bone ports already From. I'm reluctant to even buy the last gen version in this state as it sends the wrong message, but then again I know I'll enjoy it (just a little less) despite the downgrade.

 

[Grief.exe]

The game was built with next gen in mind only for it to turn out like this?

Just bring get working on those PS4/Bone ports already From. I'm reluctant to even buy the last gen version in this state as it sends the wrong message, but then again I know I'll enjoy it (just a little less) despite the downgrade.

The argument being, the PC is already well past the capabilities of the next-gen consoles.

Will that version be gimped as well out of the gate? If so, will the lighting changes in the inevitable next-gen versions be patched in?

 

[Relaxed Muscle]

The bright side is that the game is so fucking good

You could say is never dark in DS2!

 

[Horp]

Checked the Dark Souls Facebook page.
Kind of find this cover ironic, in the light (lol) of the situation.

EDIT:
Damnit, sorry for HUGE picture.

 

[Arkanius]

The argument being, the PC is already well past the capabilities of the next-gen consoles.

Will that version be gimped as well out of the gate? If so, will the lighting changes in the inevitable next-gen versions be patched in?

Remember the first Resident Evil 4 for the PC?
Absolutely horrible.

PC

 

[SonyToo!™]

My first reaction is fucking hell GAF you're taking this issue a bit far even if torches have been gimped.

On second thought I'm glad ppl are still raging, as it will put alot of pressure on FROM to do the right thing and set it all right in the PC port.

I really don't want FROM to use the lighting as a means to force ppl to double dip on a next gen port in 6 months time or whatever. Besides being manipulative as fuck it's also ruining the MP play by spitting the playerbase onto 5 separate systems.

I'd never buy a new FROM / Bamco title as new again if they did that. (I've triple dipped on DS1 new)

 

[Dwight Schrute]

Nevermind

 

[Vitor711]

Xbox @ 60fps:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wJ8erB6IeHU&t=1m49s

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cKdiiN62GzY&t=1m10s

Now, to be fair, NG was a GORGEOUS game on release and looked practically 'next-gen' at the time. Hell, NG:B on Xbox360 still puts some exclusive 360 games to shame.

Man I wish this was on PC. One of the best games of all time. OF ALL TIME. Shame about that God awful story though.

Loved having it on Vita, even if it was at 30FPS.

 

[Wadiwasi]

I really love the both of the previous Souls games, however, I don't like being misled. I was excited that this game was coming out and was very ready to purchase it, until all of this came to light. I'm a person that does a lot of things on principle and not buying this game is one of them, just like I won't be buying Watch_Dogs. The whole Xbox One debacle and backtrack by Microsoft proves that consumers within this industry have the power to get what they want changed but have to do so with their wallets.

I hope everyone here that is upset by the disparity in the game as shown vs retail doesn't purchase the game, it will be the only way things change.

Now this doesn't mean I'm boycotting From Software, if they release a PS4 version that looks as impressive as it did on the demos then I would buy it in a heartbeat. But I won't purchase an inferior product after being marketed as something I was expecting. Also, I'm sure I've bought games that have done this before but I wasn't aware of it. With GAF and all of the social media options out there that makes information readily available to consume for "hype", more and more people will be exposed to products before they launch. If the video game industry continues down this path there will be bad backlash especially in the U.S. market. People in the U.S. are finally starting to wake up and are tired of being lied to (slowly) (and spiders so I won't go farther than that)

 

[Techies]

Lets throw in a random Warmth type ENB mod for perspective.

This is similar to the type of lighting used in earlier videos.
Now from what I can tell is that exterior or natural lit areas in Dark Souls 2 look kinda alright.

The problem is interiors mostly where they removed all fire sources, and made the few existing ones more subtle, resulting in areas looking as if they are unlit.

You can enhance the contrast as much as you like, it won't make a dull unlit area look any better without a significant light source.

 

[Anung]

Cancelled my pre-order. I'll wait and see if the PC version of the game is in the same ballpark as the footage shown. I'm still cynical that this is just a cash grab. Make people buy an inferior version then give us a definitive edition down the line.

From Software have shot themselves in the foot in my opinion. I know that they obviously want to show their game in the best light and help secure sales. But for me it's done the opposite as this has went from a much hyped day one purchase into a "wait and see" game. I refuse to support bullshit practices.

Shocking, as I loved Demon's Souls and Dark Souls. Hopefully the PS4 Demon's Souls 2 that is supposedly being made is the real deal.

 

[Eusis]

I really love the both of the previous Souls games, however, I don't like being misled. I was excited that this game was coming out and was very ready to purchase it, until all of this came to light. I'm a person that does a lot of things on principle and not buying this game is one of them, just like I won't be buying Watch_Dogs. The whole Xbox One debacle and backtrack by Microsoft proves that consumers within this industry have the power to get what they want changed but have to do so with their wallets.

I hope everyone here that is upset by the disparity in the game as shown vs retail doesn't purchase the game, it will be the only way things change.

Now this doesn't mean I'm boycotting From Software, if they release a PS4 version that looks as impressive as it did on the demos then I would buy it in a heartbeat. But I won't purchase an inferior product after being marketed as something I was expecting. Also, I'm sure I've bought games that have done this before but I wasn't aware of it. With GAF and all of the social media options out there that makes information readily available to consume for "hype", more and more people will be exposed to products before they launch. If the video game industry continues down this path there will be bad backlash especially in the U.S. market. People in the U.S. are finally starting to wake up and are tired of being lied to (slowly) (and spiders so I won't go farther than that)

Well, there's something to be said for knowing when to pick your battles, and I'm more inclined to forgive footage from two years ago (though they should've known to quit showing only that) especially when the final game does have some areas that look better; take a look at the bridge in the fire lizard pit comparison pictures, I swear the final one looks more detailed. That hallway was definitely cut down though.

And I really do suspect it's a gameplay mechanic that wasn't really settling right. You had to give up a free hand, you were on a timer, you seemingly can not buy new torches... better to not make it THAT important because the supply was way too god damn tight for something that's supposed to be used throughout the whole game.

 

[jim2point0]

My first reaction is fucking hell GAF you're taking this issue a bit far even if torches have been gimped.

It's not just.... torches. People were really hyped based on the look of the game alone. They see the game looking like this and get really excited.

Then release day comes around and they see the game looking like this.

Call it what you will. Vertical slice bait and switch. False advertisement. It sucks.

 

[george_us]

I don't know why people keep saying Dark Souls was ugly. It wasn't a graphical powerhouse at all, but it had amazing and cohesive aesthetics. All of the areas in the game felt like they belonged to the same world.

Dark Souls is superior to DS2 in nearly every visual category. I'm loving DS2 but the game is ugly as sin pretty much every area I've been to.

 

[Garcia]

I don't know why people keep saying Dark Souls was ugly. It wasn't a graphical powerhouse at all, but it had amazing and cohesive aesthetics. All of the areas in the game felt like they belonged to the same world.

This is exactly what many people out there keep completely (and selectively) forgetting when they say Dark Souls 2 looks better than the first game.

Dark Souls 2 lacks cohesion, visual coherence and it has terrible art direction.

 

[Foffy]

That's the point.
They lied and lied until the release.

Well, they've also been very flip-floppery on the idea that the game will be ported to new systems...

I think this downgrade really gives ammo that they might pull a "Definitive Edition" card with the game, which will be shitty. Either that, or really what they scrapped on last gen will be fully utilized for the PS4 title in terms of engine scope.

 

[soontroll]

This is exactly what many people out there keep completely (and selectively) forgetting when they say Dark Souls 2 looks better than the first game.

Dark Souls 2 lacks cohesion, visual coherence and it has terrible art direction.

Well, that's not promising at all. Have you played the game?