That is your opinion, it is very rare for someone to come in here and say that they even used the torches at all.
You seem to be an outlier.
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#DarkSoulsDowngrade and #YOULIED \\ a.k.a You got some splainin' to do, Namco
- Thread starter Havel
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That is your opinion, it is very rare for someone to come in here and say that they even used the torches at all.
You seem to be an outlier.
FairXchange
Member
I'm not going to get personal with you sir, I'm waiting to see if what I wrote elicits an actual response rather than continued hostility on your part.
Correct me if I'm wrong. But it looks like they substituted darkness with some kind of green puke fog?
Look at my image that I quoted two posts above. Would you say that the torch is irrelevant there?
Raven77
Member
Nope, when I buy a Big Mac, it comes with everything advertised.
When I buy Dark Souls 2, I don't get the Dragons advertised on the bridge scene, the missing environmental objects, etc.
No, that's an area where there is literally nothing outside so there is nothing to see - the fog isn't a darkness effect it's just nothingness for quite a distance.
legacyzero
Banned
Please tell me about mechanics that were publicized only to be taken away without any comment on the matter? The beta was a network test only a month ago. And there are people in here who've played the game, who contend the torches are severely muted in their use. This is about their dishonesty by actively hiding the truth, going so far as to show videos up to release with "pc" footage. Just want accountability, on top of making a good game.
I'm not pretending to be concerned about the console version. The PS3 version in special runs not so great, how would they improve the graphics?
You're mistaking everyone who's posting here for the thread creators. I'm not fighting the good fight, trying to represent mislead consumers, I'm just curious.
They aren't going to say anything. They have two versions of the game to sell, and know many PC buyers are double dipping. Why risk sales by showing off a vastly better version of the game? We already know it's going to be 60 fps vs. 30 fps.
So basically you're saying that developers can't change anything about the game during development? There were dragons when they filmed the trailer, but come release they had to cut it out and at that point there's no way to make a new trailer (which actually takes months, easily more time than it would have to make the decision to downgrade the game to make the release) and there's no real chance of losing a legal case for reasons those more educated in the matter can surely tell better.
EDIT:
There's also one real point against the misleading advertising: as long as the PC version delivers somewhat near the trailer quality they can defend by saying the trailer was cut from the PC version. It's pretty much common practice anyway, you take the version that looks best and touch it up to make the best trailer. Most trailers show player action or camera angles that cannot be reproduced in the game and that's usually fine so you can't even expect the trailer to be 100% representative of the actual game.
Fable
^^^ I think project Ego/Fable's massive downgrade was made public before launch, though i could be remembering wrong.
#GTAIVfingerlessGloves
Still a shitty practice that needs to die, whether "everybody do it" or not.
#GTAIVfingerlessGloves
Still a shitty practice that needs to die, whether "everybody do it" or not.
Molyneux came out multiple times and talked about tech restraints, FROM has said nothing.
Judging from the screenshots, I'd still say you don't need a torch, but they're definitely not useless, which pleases me a lot.
I'll carry them around all the time if I can just for that pretty lighting.
Well, normally I'd have no problem with that, but normally we would have an idea of how the PC version would look like judging from the videos, now we have 3 different builds and no idea of which one is closer to the PC version.
If they can't show it, at least confirm via twitter or whatever. Honestly, even if they say "it's like the retail version, shut up" it'd be enough already. At least I'd know and we could get over it sooner. Not knowing sucks.
skullwolfgp
Neo Member
Left is Network test --- Right is Retail
Thanks for the links, they look very similar, the biggest change is that the retail version is way brighter than the Network test.
Doesnt look as big of a change as the other areas.
Here's a good shot of the missing lighting effects between those two videos
Network Test:
Retail, missing shadows on the tree and bridge :
Raven77
Member
They showed the better looking version in February, last month. They also have made no comment or effort whatsoever to make the general public aware of the visual downgrade.
It's unethical...at best.
Spore
As in? It exists? And I didn't even buy that game because of how bad they gutted. That was highly publicized to be a bastardization of the original. Has Wright even done a game since?
FairXchange
Member
Halo 2 reveal vs. retail version.
You are the only one that will admit that.
What game mechanics were affected there?
For most areas they're useless(Which is to say, if you play the first 3 or so areas, you might not have any idea that torches are useful), if you don't use torches in certain areas, you're at a disadvantage. Not to mention that there are certain monsters that are scared off by torches that would otherwise swarm you and eat your ass.
He's not an outlier, he's just deeper in the game than a lot of the complainers.
EmCeeGramr
Member
Jarate, FairXchange, mmmmaybe don't draw comparisons to the most infamously disappointing and reputation tarnishing examples of all time if you're trying to defend Dark Souls.
weevles
Member
That it kinda is, but it's also the reality of it. A month isn't really enough time to make new marketing material and no developer is ever going to say that the game isn't going to be as good as they hoped or anything like that. Like it or not, there realities behind these decisions and sometimes (which is actually pretty common in the industry, FROM just had it really bad having to downgrade the game so little before the release and they'd demoed it extensively before).
Did they specifically say what platform the game was running on?
It's really not uncommon to show off the PC version of a game and not mention that fact unless specifically asked. ALL publishers have done this.
Relaxed Muscle
Member
Here's a good shot of the missing lighting effects between those two videos
Network Test:
Retail, missing shadows on the tree and bridge :
Finally we can put to rest the complainst it was just done for mechanics:
The whole lighting engine is considerably downgraded even from versions that ran on consoles.
Lighting is way more flat on retail and way less dynamic.
A story is not a mechanic, but pretty sure reviewers even talked about that. And they were rightly called out for it. But they also didn't flog that reveal as the game up until release like FROM did.
Raven77
Member
I see what you're saying.
But I guess the point i'm trying to make is that just because something is common, doesn't mean it's right.
Consumers should stand up against this kind of thing. That means voting with your wallets and not supporting unethical and deceitful companies.
PetriP-TNT
Member
avatar quote once again.
I thought you had left ... ?
This isn't about having them 'fix' the console versions. That's unlikely, at this point. It about voicing disappointment, and doing our best to make sure this doesn't happen again for future titles by voicing our discontent. Dark Souls II PC being one of those future titles.
Ocarina of Time was supposed to have footprints and such, but was downgraded (although a bit of a difference in these two)
Ask any game developer, like an actual game developer here if features get removed because they were bad, even ones that were advertised.
And once again, your point is completely invalid because the torches are INCREDIBLY HELPFUL AND PRETTY NECESSARY IN A CERTAIN PART OF THE GAME
you can ignore all of this of course, but the feature is still there.
Haha, I understand what you're saying, 100%, but if they said this it would be a monumental shit storm.
I'd also like to know how it looks, but honestly it won't affect my purchase at all. I decided a while back that the PC was going to be the way to go on this one, just because of the performance issues on the previous game. If it looks exactly the same and just runs better (which is realistically the worst case scenario) I'll be totally content.
Lol.
I'm among the many who avoided that game like the plague, despite being incredibly hyped for it after the reveal.
Not the best example.
PetriP-TNT
Member
Ocarina of Time has scenes that DON'T EXIST AT ALL on the back of the box. Da fuq Miyamoto.
-MD-
Member
You can't be serious.
Stone Ocean
Member
Irrelevant? No. Can I see perfectly fine without it and would rather have my shield out instead unless I crank down the game's brightness? Yes.
Show me one area where you can't go on without the torch.
EmCeeGramr
Member
I believe that PS3 kiosks with controllers and button prompts that were purported to be the PS3 version were shown at TGS last year looking very close to the reveal.
He told me to list examples of when this happened, and I did.
Relaxed Muscle
Member
Funny you mention OoT, because the retail game ended being much better looking:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=v9S-kUj5vcc
Dark Souls is really known for forcing the players into a very specific role. Also, since you have not played the game yet, that area is very much necessary to see things since there are pits everywhere. You could theoretically go through without a torch, but you could theoretically go through the dark caves in pokemon without flash.
Yes, I would. Sure, it looks lit up, but visibility-wise there's hardly a difference. Maybe you could post some more shots to make a better case.
Raven77
Member
Praise the sun! Looking forward to it.
I know and I absolutely agree, but the thing is that it also comes with game development and how you try to compete to stay afloat. As consumers we rarely see what goes on behind, but they are tough decisions forced by the market, by the budgets and extreme pressure and as long as other games are showing off well touched material and whatnot the pressure to match them is huge. These last minute changes are quite curveball and then things like these happen. It's always great to demand answers and more transparency, though.
-MD-
Member
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