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[Ushiwaka]

Well, you made it seem like you knew that as a fact.

And I said it was a bad choice of words.

It all points to the contrary, actually.

This doesn't clarify anything either. Its still vague.

Maybe they are not allowed to talk about it yet and we will find out what really happened after the game's release. Or maybe we will never have an official, clear statement on the subject.

 

[ZSaberLink]

Hm, so is Disney Infinity 2.0 not releasing in Japan? I kind of wonder whether Namco might consider releasing it if the Kamen figure based game does well. Still, since the new one isn't on 3DS, it'd have to be the PS3/PS4/WiiU getting the title to sell.

Btw Hiska, is a game being sold out like Smash really that uncommon? Was Animal Crossing, Youkai Watch 2 and other titles not like this? Just curious whether it's a matter of not enough stock or just way more demand than Nintendo/retailers expected.

 

[uncredited male]

Given the depressed console sales in Japan it should be possible to get a pretty accurate number of consoles Bayo 2 may have moved.

 

[vicissitudes]

Any thoughts on Wii U 2014 versus PS4 2014?

Right now PS4 is ahead by about 300k. Let's assume they sell the same amount for the next 2 months. Last year Wii U sold ~300k in all of December. So it looks like Wii U won't be able to catch up to the PS4. But there's no telling how much of a bump it'll get due to Smash.

 

[Hero]

Weren't there rumors years ago that said Bayo 2 was mostly finished and then cancelled when Sega doubled down on their core IP?

It's kind of ridiculous that people still question the whole deal. Bayonetta 2 would not be releasing if it weren't for Nintendo.

 

[SwiftDeath]

Any thoughts on Wii U 2014 versus PS4 2014?

Right now PS4 is ahead by about 300k. Let's assume they sell the same amount for the next 2 months. Last year Wii U sold ~300k in all of December. So it looks like Wii U won't be able to catch up to the PS4. But there's no telling how much of a bump it'll get due to Smash.

What's even confirmed for PS4 for the rest of the year in Japan?

Dragon Quest Heroes is 2015, as is bloodbourne and Type 0 HD. I know there are some 2014 titles but I can't remember them

Is Lords of the Fallen getting a Japanese release? It's that Dark Souls clone being published by Bandai Namco. Has like zero marketing anywhere though but I'm curious if it's even getting released in Japan

It's kind of ridiculous that people still question the whole deal. Bayonetta 2 would not be releasing if it weren't for Nintendo.

Are you referring to this thread? Because I haven't seen a claim that Bayonetta 2 would have gotten made without Nintendo to the best of my knowledge

 

[ThoughtsOfSpeaking]

Weren't there rumors years ago that said Bayo 2 was mostly finished and then cancelled when Sega doubled down on their core IP?

It's kind of ridiculous that people still question the whole deal. Bayonetta 2 would not be releasing if it weren't for Nintendo.

Not questioning it, just wondering what Nintendo got out of it. It was never going to sell weĺl on the Wii U, even if its sales matched Wii Numbers.

Glad it got to be made but there is next to no chance of a Bayo 3. The best we can hope is sega still lets Bayo make guest appearences in their games.

Judging by how it ended up storywise, im pretty sure Platinum are ready to move on now anywho.

 

[Psycho_Mantis]

GTA V, COD, GG Xrd and LBP3 are all iirc. Don't know what happened to Minecraft.

 

[ZSaberLink]

Fatal Frame now at 35 at comgnet. Gained another preorder. 3 more days until it releases.

 

[Nyoro SF]

Weren't there rumors years ago that said Bayo 2 was mostly finished and then cancelled when Sega doubled down on their core IP?

It's kind of ridiculous that people still question the whole deal. Bayonetta 2 would not be releasing if it weren't for Nintendo.

I remember that rumor and the grief that followed. It wouldn't surprise me if Nintendo saved money by doing a partial salvage of the game.

 

[ZSaberLink]

Initial D Perfect Shift Online (F2P) for the 3DS has been downloaded 400,000 times in Japan
http://www.siliconera.com/2014/09/2...online-crosses-400000-downloads-nintendo-3ds/

 

[shinra-bansho]

Open question: what do people think from a commercial standpoint would have been more beneficial:

The current approach; ie Bayonetta 2, Devil's Third, Wonderful 101.

Or using the equivalent resources on securing continued ports of titles like FIFA and COD.

 

[SmokeMaxX]

Open question: what do people think from a commercial standpoint would have been more beneficial:

The current approach; ie Bayonetta 2, Devil's Third, Wonderful 101.

Or using the equivalent resources on securing continued ports of titles like FIFA and COD.

Not sure what would be more beneficial, but I imagine their current idea is better. Noone's going to buy a WiiU for FIFA/CoD whereas they could get SOME sales with their current offerings. It answers the question of "Why should I get a WiiU?" at least for some people.

 

[SwiftDeath]

GTA V, COD, GG Xrd and LBP3 are all iirc. Don't know what happened to Minecraft.

Thanks

A physical copy of Minecraft for PS4 hits in the US on October 7th so maybe October sometime in Japan?

Still curious if Lords of the Fallen is releasing in Japan though although I'm sure it will bomb most likely. I think Square Enix might be covering the Japan publishing for it instead of Bandai Namco who is covering the US

Open question: what do people think from a commercial standpoint would have been more beneficial:

The current approach; ie Bayonetta 2, Devil's Third, Wonderful 101.

Or using the equivalent resources on securing continued ports of titles like FIFA and COD.

So to answer this question properly I'll clarify I'm thinking in longer terms.

If Nintendo wants to improve their 3rd party support, especially their western 3rd party support they really need to make a concentrated consistent and long-lasting effort towards that end. Ensuring continued ports of those big 3rd party titles is important but I feel Nintendo has to do co-marketing with those games for several years to ensure the message gets out that Nintendo home consoles now have these games. It's pointless to get the ports if no one thinks to play them on your console

So I'd go with continued ports of 3rd party games as it can help you push in that direction. Commercially W101 seems like a failure and Bayonetta 2 looks to turn out the same. I'm not sure if it's assuming too much for Devil's third to likely be a failure as well but I can't see Nintendo doing anything but losing quite a bit of money on those titles

---------

I've been meaning to ask, since Sega owns the Bayonetta IP, will they be getting royalties off every sold copy of Bayonetta? If so does that mean, it will be harder for Nintendo to profit of the game?

 

[shinra-bansho]

The reality though is no one (not literally) is going to buy the Wii U for Bayonetta 2.

I guess the query could also be framed as: is the potential market that the Wii U is excluded from consideration due to the lack of these key titles more or less valuable tha the potential market for which these few exclusive titles make the system enter consideration.

 

[Mory Dunz]

Open question: what do people think from a commercial standpoint would have been more beneficial:

The current approach; ie Bayonetta 2, Devil's Third, Wonderful 101.

Or using the equivalent resources on securing continued ports of titles like FIFA and COD.

Hard to say "more beneficial". Seems like both decisions might have negative consequences. The Wii U ecosystem seems just that bad. Maybe they'd get FIFA and COD this year, but unlikely for the next 3 or whatever.

Can I just answer "no"?

Maybe pocketing whatever money spent would've been better haha. Maybe getting a western game or 2 exclusive to the 3DS...

 

[ThoughtsOfSpeaking]

Open question: what do people think from a commercial standpoint would have been more beneficial:

The current approach; ie Bayonetta 2, Devil's Third, Wonderful 101.

Or using the equivalent resources on securing continued ports of titles like FIFA and COD.

FIFA and COD rely too much on online userbases which are simply not there on WiiU

Something like Assassins creed or the new Batman? Yeah. That would of been more beneficial commerically.

 

[crinale]

Open question: what do people think from a commercial standpoint would have been more beneficial:

The current approach; ie Bayonetta 2, Devil's Third, Wonderful 101.

Or using the equivalent resources on securing continued ports of titles like FIFA and COD.

Multiplats did push XB1 and PS4 at their launch. Actually PS4's exclusive were rather lackluster and still multiplats did help propel PS4's sales.
However games you listed takes full advantages of XB1 and PS4's strength, as some ppl already stated, network infrastructure. So to make those game attractive on WiiU Nintendo should have provided some good "vision" to third parties of how to utilize secondary screen, the device that defines WiiU.

 

[Lumyst]

Open question: what do people think from a commercial standpoint would have been more beneficial:

The current approach; ie Bayonetta 2, Devil's Third, Wonderful 101.

Or using the equivalent resources on securing continued ports of titles like FIFA and COD.

Maybe EA is waiting for certain conditions to be met regarding online use? They did say that the WiiU is not a box that is compatible to their future, that it was "not connected." They're still eeking out Wii and 3DS legacy versions of their sports games, though, so they're keeping some sort of relationship going with Nintendo, perhaps until the time is right to go beyond the wait-and-see period in terms of online habits for their users. So what I think is that getting the sports games, the CODs, etc. would not matter until Nintendo gets their user base caught up with online use and purchasing.

And that will only happen with Nintendo's own games leading the way for the userbase. In that sense, it would be futile to spend money on those games, the CODs and Maddens, until the condition is met. So they make games such as Splatoon, Xenoblade X, Devil's Third, to hone their online multiplayer infrastructure and change the perception that Nintendo is uninterested in online play, they include DLC in Mario Kart, beginning to incorporate online purchasing into their major franchises. Though on the whole "brand perception" thing, I wonder if a game that doesn't sell much would still change perception, or if lacking COD/Madden harms perception more than showcasing online multiplayer in Devil's Third would add to it?

I also worry about the WiiU not being chosen as the "family value" option for gaming, the PS360 outsold it last year for many months, and maybe making games such as Lego City would have been better for their business than making Bayonetta 2. The WiiU's price is squeezed between the PS360 and the PS4/XB1, and it will be very awkward when the PS4/XB1 get to that "value option" pricing if Nintendo is unable to drop WiiU's price, will families then go for those systems due to their more flourishing ecosystem? But I don't think Nintendo anticipated they could lose their appeal to families, which is why they attempted to appeal to the core at launch.

 

[ZSaberLink]

Open question: what do people think from a commercial standpoint would have been more beneficial:

The current approach; ie Bayonetta 2, Devil's Third, Wonderful 101.

Or using the equivalent resources on securing continued ports of titles like FIFA and COD.

I think their current approach is better, despite how generally ineffective it's been so far. The latter might be the better longterm approach, but they actually need to finance a LOT of it.

In order for the latter to work, the Wii U should actually be getting decent ports. CoD level was fine. Nintendo would have also likely to front the money to keep the DLC going, advertising the game exists (Activision never even put the Wii U logo in most of their ads), and getting retailers to stock the games.
-- For example, most Target stores didn't stock any Mature third party title after Splinter Cell. Most people aren't even aware that CoD and AC were on Wii U. As such, it's a bigger waste of money than Bayo 2 & W101. I'm pretty sure Bayo 2 will outsell 1-2 AC titles as a whole on Wii U.

However, I actually think it'd be healthier for the industry if Nintendo could actually find success doing their own thing, as it'd mean there's an alternative to the "two very similar consoles with tons of multiplatform titles" environment we currently have. Clearly they have to get a much larger number of titles going, but if it results in them eventually investing in some studios of their own/second parties to create new titles, it could be interesting.

 

[theprodigy]

6.5 hours until it's up....oh yeah

 

[The Giant]

Looking forward to seeing Bayonett 2 sales.

 

[Hero of Legend]

Looks like Sega is doing a retail 3D Classics collection!

【12/18】[3DS] セガ「セガ 3D復刻アーカイブス」3,980円(税&#21029
■開発：エムツー
■3D復刻プロジェクトをまとめてパッケージ版発売決定
　収録作品「スペースハリアー」「ファンタジーゾーン オパオパブラザーズ」「アウトラン」「ベアナックル 怒りの鉄拳」
　　「ザ・スーパー忍II」「エコー・ザ・ドルフィン」「スペースハリアー 3D」「アウトラン 3D」

 

[zeromcd73]

Looking forward to seeing Bayonett 2 sales.

You're a monster!

 

[The Giant]

You're a monster!

Why? I'm hoping it sells very well.

 

[Deleted member 125677]

Are we expecting to see a hardware bump for the Wii U tomorrow? Seems like Bayo 2 is one of those titles that you might buy a console for and then sell it back when you've finished.

Nope. Not a chance.

Bayo 2 will have to get lucky to get twice of W101 opening (which it should do, since it's a relatively established franchise etc.). And it's been announced since forever as well, so I guess those most interested have already taken in into account.

Open question: what do people think from a commercial standpoint would have been more beneficial:

The current approach; ie Bayonetta 2, Devil's Third, Wonderful 101.

Or using the equivalent resources on securing continued ports of titles like FIFA and COD.

Strangely enough I think the former was the right choice. At least I understand the intention and ambition, and how they thought they could carve out a piece of the niche market. I think they know perfectly well that no one is interested in a Wii U to play FIFA and COD, really. And even though it has turned out that "no one" is interested in the other alternative either, it was at least worth a shot.

 

[Psycho_Mantis]

Why? I'm hoping it sells very well.

prepare to be disappointed

 

[theprodigy]

Nope. Not a chance.

Bayo 2 will have to get lucky to get twice of W101 opening (which it should do, since it's a relatively established franchise etc.). And it's been announced since forever as well, so I guess those most interested have already taken in into account.

The Wonderful 101 {2013.08.24} - 6,663 / 27,028

surely even Bayonetta 2 can manage more than 13326 sales its first week?

 

[Xater]

Well I guess this should settle things for the few people who thought the Xbox One wouldn't bomb.

Those people exist?

I wonder how much money MS loses every time they launch a console in Japan.

 

[airmangataosenai]

I feel like it we see Bayo do something in the 20k range we'll see a lot of "Better than expected!" posts.

 

[SwiftDeath]

I'm expecting like 25k for Bayonetta 2's opening. Which is awful but not surprising I guess. Hyrule Warriors opened to 70k and is a completely new IP although I suppose the genre is much stronger

Those people exist?

I wonder how much money MS loses every time they launch a console in Japan.

Their XB1 launch has been quite conservative by everything I've seen. I would think MS lost more money even on launching the OG Xbox if you adjusted for inflation and most certainly for 360 as they bought several exclusive titles and what not [i.e. tried to appeal to the market]

From that point of view, what would be "Better than expected!"?

I'd say 40k - 45k would be better than expected

 

[Atram]

I feel like it we see Bayo do something in the 20k range we'll see a lot of "Better than expected!" posts.

From that point of view, what would be "Better than expected!"?

 

[Psycho_Mantis]

I feel like it we see Bayo do something in the 20k range we'll see a lot of "Better than expected!" posts.

Bayonetta on the 360 which had an install base of 1.155 million at the time opened at 66k.

 

[Aostia]

The reality though is no one (not literally) is going to buy the Wii U for Bayonetta 2.

I guess the query could also be framed as: is the potential market that the Wii U is excluded from consideration due to the lack of these key titles more or less valuable tha the potential market for which these few exclusive titles make the system enter consideration.

no one would buy the Wii U for Fifa either. I think their approach is better, because seeing these "unprecedent" exclusives enlarge their portfolio making the actual Wii U owners happier, avoiding to "burn" also this small "fanbase" left.
Secure those multiplatform games would not benefit "new costumers" nor actual owners imho.
Their approach to third party would even worst if they invested the time and budget dedicated to exclusive games to some few additional multiplatform game. They should really revise completely their target (I totally agree with the "demographic" discussion we had few pages ago), if interested in bringin in more third parties, and benefit from that.

Btw, good to see FFV dominating the preorder charts! (half-jokin post)

 

[Deleted member 125677]

Yeah, 20K would not by any means be better than expected. 13K is more of worst-worst case scenario, 20K is still horrible.

~50K would be better than expected.

surely even Bayonetta 2 can manage more than 13326 sales its first week?

Yeah, you're right. I didn't remember W101 had a that awful first week.

 

[crinale]

Bayonetta on the 360 which had an install base of 1.155 million at the time opened at 66k.

This is where the demographic concept kicks in. If Bayo was family-friendly platformer it must do about the same, or even better than OG Bayo at Xbox360.

Yeah, 20K would not by any means be better than expected. 13K is more of worst-worst case scenario, 20K is still horrible.

~50K would be better than expected.

Yeah, you're right. I didn't remember W101 had a that awful first week.

I'm expecting like 20K-40K range. Not sure how ppl will consider that number.
Personally I would call it "better than expected".

 

[Aostia]

This is where the demographic concept kicks in. If Bayo was family-friendly platformer it must do about the same, or even better than OG Bayo at Xbox360.



I'm expecting like 20K-40K range. Not sure how ppl will consider that number.
Personally I would call it "better than expected".

I think that Bayo2 should reach 100k LTD to be considered somehow "decent". let's see: if it will open at 20k, it will be horrible, even considering possible "W101" legs (it tripled its debut in terms of LTD, if I remember correctly).

 

[hiska-kun]

I think that Bayo2 should reach 100k LTD to be considered somehow "decent". let's see: if it will open at 20k, it will be horrible, even considering possible "W101" legs (it tripled its debut in terms of LTD, if I remember correctly).

I wouldn't call this legs when the shipment was 30k and it's obvious it hitted the bomba bins.

 

[duckroll]

Yeah when something is obviously overshipped and demand isn't there, selling out the shipment eventually isn't "legs" so much as "clearance".

 

[Mpl90]

I wouldn't call this legs when the shipment was 30k and it's obvious it hitted the bomba bins.

Was going to say this. W101 indeed actually 4x the first week, but a huge role has been played by bomba bins.

Ah, right. hiska, there are download sales and charts in this week's Famitsu issue
Some of them from Hokanko

Minecraft PS3 - 41,000 (100%)
Kirby Fighters Z - 24,000 (72.7%)
Yokai Watch 2 - 19,000 (3.2%)
Ultra Street Fighter IV - 9,600 (12.2%)
Toukiden: Kiwami - 8,600 (7.9%)
Diablo III on both consoles - 20% of overall sales are digital; 14% for TLOUR and Bullet Girls; 15% for Neptunia U and 20% for Freedom Wars

Hopefully, I got everything correctly.

 

[javac]

Looking back at the reveal of Bayo 2 I think I got the impression that this was Nintendo making a statement as if to say that they're doubling down on more 'mature' games. Not only was Bayonetta a well known IP but it's from a dev who is equally known for its high octane gameplay. The statement had more weight behind it when we had no idea of the systems sales potential and the mere thought of the system launching was MH3U and DQ coming to the system was making people believe this system would sell well.

Coupled with the games like TTT2, Batman, NG3, Zombi U and CoD it seemed as if Nintendo were demonstration a shift in direction and image, putting the focus on the core user base.

Once sales and support waned it was irrelevant. A single game can do well, but Bayo 2 was a single part of a paradigm shift and without other titles to help push it, the title seems to be on its own. Nintendo tried to get the core audience on board at launch, but with that failing the game was left on a mismatched system.

 

[hiska-kun]

Was going to say this. W101 indeed actually 4x the first week, but a huge role has been played by bomba bins.

Ah, right. hiska, there are download sales and charts in this week's Famitsu issue
Some of them from Hokanko

Minecraft PS3 - 41,000 (100%)
Kirby Fighters Z - 24,000 (72.7%)
Yokai Watch 2 - 19,000 (3.2%)
Ultra Street Fighter IV - 9,600 (12.2%)
Toukiden: Kiwami - 8,600 (7.9%)
Diablo III on both consoles - 20% of overall sales are digital; 14% for TLOUR and Bullet Girls; 15% for Neptunia U and 20% for Freedom Wars

Hopefully, I got everything correctly.

Diablo for PS4 is 6,550

But wait, not Hyrule Warriors? XD

Anyway, in a few hours i'll get the top 10.

 

[Guymelef]

I think after future Devil's Third bomba Nintendo will not try any more.

And for Platinum Games, the only future I see for them is kickstarter.

 

[hiska-kun]

New 3DS Commercials in Japan

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iLETgzsBNv0

 

[Aostia]

I wouldn't call this legs when the shipment was 30k and it's obvious it hitted the bomba bins.

Yeah when something is obviously overshipped and demand isn't there, selling out the shipment eventually isn't "legs" so much as "clearance".

I wasn't implying any positive commercial judgement about W101

 

[Pennywise83]

Was going to say this. W101 indeed actually 4x the first week, but a huge role has been played by bomba bins.

Ah, right. hiska, there are download sales and charts in this week's Famitsu issue
Some of them from Hokanko

Minecraft PS3 - 41,000 (100%)
Kirby Fighters Z - 24,000 (72.7%)
Yokai Watch 2 - 19,000 (3.2%)
Ultra Street Fighter IV - 9,600 (12.2%)
Toukiden: Kiwami - 8,600 (7.9%)
Diablo III on both consoles - 20% of overall sales are digital; 14% for TLOUR and Bullet Girls; 15% for Neptunia U and 20% for Freedom Wars

Hopefully, I got everything correctly.

Initial D Perfect Shift Online (F2P) for the 3DS has been downloaded 400,000 times in Japan
http://www.siliconera.com/2014/09/2...online-crosses-400000-downloads-nintendo-3ds/

Looks like Sega is doing a retail 3D Classics collection!

All these news paint a very good and viable market on the 3DS eShop.

 

[Psycho_Mantis]

I think after future Devil's Third bomba Nintendo will not try any more.

And for Platinum Games, the only future I see for them is kickstarter.

They should continue making MGS Rising games.

 

[Aostia]

I think after future Devil's Third bomba Nintendo will not try any more.

And for Platinum Games, the only future I see for them is kickstarter.

Platinum games already has a contract with Microsoft for Scalebound, you know? that could see commercial success, but even if it will not: until their games will receive great metacritics scores and will be seen as great among the core, I think they'll find other publishers.
About Devil's third bomba, I think that we saw Nintendo funding games since the...forever? especially on second party or or third party with partnership, for "small" games (I mean no AAA western budget games), in order to enlarge their portfolio with games outside their usual IPs (such as Disaster before the acquisition of Monolith Soft, or Pandora's Tower on the Wii with Ganbarion and so on)
Maybe they could stop this for Wii U (after SMT x FE, I hope), because it will be late in any case...

 

[Pennywise83]

Platinum games already has a contract with Microsoft for Scalebound, you know? that could see commercial success, but even if it will not: until their games will receive great metacritics scores and will be seen as great among the core, I think they'll find other publishers.
About Devil's third bomba, I think that we saw Nintendo funding games since the...forever? especially on second party or or third party with partnership, for "small" games (I mean no AAA western budget games), in order to enlarge their portfolio with games outside their usual IPs (such as Disaster before the acquisition of Monolith Soft, or Pandora's Tower on the Wii with Ganbarion and so on)
Maybe they could stop this for Wii U (after SMT x FE, I hope), because it will be late in any case...

Who's left? Sony, maybe Square Enix, and then?

 

[mao2]

Who's left? Sony, maybe Square Enix, and then?

It'd be great if Capcom would give them a contract to make Devil May Cry 5 and Okami 3.