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Ace Attorney [Mafia] |OT| Turnabout Scum

Zubz

Banned
I guess Squidy's explanation of having 2 contradictory explanations does make the whole thing a bit peculiar. I mean, I'm not sold, but that nudge puts Zeke an inch ahead in terms of suspicion... Which is better than anything else I've got. Plus, after my last game, I trust Squidy's deductions even if I did the opposite at the time.

Besides, I really need to get to bed. Sorry if you're innocent, Zeke.

Vote: EzekelRAGE

And even if I'd argue I'd be somewhat active, Scrafty, I can relate on being busy this weekend/past couple of days...
 

squidyj

Member
how can it be a gambit if it's an ordinary and normal town reaction to an event as opposed to being constructed outside of the norm so as to generate a response? Tell me how you intended to catch people in this so-called gambit.
 
how can it be a gambit if it's an ordinary and normal town reaction to an event as opposed to being constructed outside of the norm so as to generate a response? Tell me how you intended to catch people in this so-called gambit.

What you described fits CB's gambit perfectly. Yet you made no hostile remarks toward him? You've made fun of my gambit 3+ times already.

The normal/town response's I expected were "Meh, little defensive but nothing to write home about" which what it seems most were seeing it as.

CB on the other hand acted like he caught me red handed spelling out "Hey guys, I'm scum please lynch me now." The bulk of the argument is how defensive he read my post. Making a mountain out of a molehill, which was the purpose of my gambit. Who would desperately try to make something out of nothing.
 

Sorian

Banned
Current Vote Count:

EzekelRAGE (3)
Cornburrito
squidyj
Zubz

QuantumBro (2)
Xamtheking
Matt Attack

Kalor (1)
Hipster Cthulhu
Roytheone

Stanleypalmtree (1)
EzekelRAGE

TheWorthyEdge (1)
Barrylocke

Matt Attack (1)
CrimsonFist

Barrylocke (0)
RobotNinjaHornets
Cornburrito

Xamtheking (0)
squidyj
CrimsonFist

Hipster Cthulhu (0)
Kalor

Zubz (0)
CrimsonFist

RobotNinjaHornets (0)
CrimsonFist

Roytheone (0)
squidyj

11 votes are needed for majority.

Day 1 ends in:
blu_1455746400.png
 
how can it be a gambit if it's an ordinary and normal town reaction to an event as opposed to being constructed outside of the norm so as to generate a response? Tell me how you intended to catch people in this so-called gambit.

The same argument you are trying to use to discredit my gambit is basically the same post I made in regards to CB's gambit.

I could argue my gambit was better than CB's since anyone would want to know why someone would place a random vote. With my post, I figure most would read it for what it is. But someone, desperate to find anything to prove to be useful would try to make it a full blown ordeal.

Why weren't you as critical of CB's gambit as you are mine?
 
Vote: EzekelRAGE

Sorry RAGE, not to dogpile but you are acting the most suspicious and I believe your elimination will give us a good direction to go with once we see everyone react.
 
Vote: EzekelRAGE

Sorry RAGE, not to dogpile but you are acting the most suspicious and I believe your elimination will give us a good direction to go with once we see everyone react.

What is suspicious exactly? You have been MIA in this thread for most of this day. Other than a filler post and a post where you claim vocal ppl are suspicious (while hardly posting yourself).

You ignored Squidy's question about posting your thoughts on me and qb to post filler about you not being able to spell well.

You say I'm suspicious, but dont say why. You just may a driveby post and peace out.
 
im going to keep this short and sweet, since im dead tired and all the coffee in the world cant change that right now.
i really doubt i will be on again before the day ends, so here it is:

Vote: EzekelRAGE

the claim that your defensiveness was a gambit just doesn't read right at all, and makes almost no sense with how you acted both immediately after it, and in your justifications afterwards. ( being found out via contradictions, very ace attorney wouldn't you say?)
And since CB took you to court on the matter your attempts at self defense have been flaccid and petty, arguing over semantics and trying to shift the blame to others.

im not certain you are scum, but you certainly seem more like it than anyone else at this point,
and even if we spared you, i really doubt that your presence in the following days will be anything other than a distraction to the many here that dont trust you (myself included).

as too the rest of you, ill see you in the mourning morning.
 
CB tries a gambit earlier, fails..

Actually no, it didn't. I was able to gather some info on StarSketch. I was fine with only one person.

As for me not responding to your "what if this is a cover from CB?" I didn't respond because there's nothing really to respond to. If you think me trying to scum hunt is scummy, then vote for me.
 
CB on the other hand acted like he caught me red handed spelling out "Hey guys, I'm scum please lynch me now." The bulk of the argument is how defensive he read my post. Making a mountain out of a molehill, which was the purpose of my gambit. Who would desperately try to make something out of nothing.

On the off chance you are town and that was an actual gambit attempt, I'm going to suggest not doing those sorts of things on D1 if you aren't prepared for the consequences. Making mountains out of molehills is the only thing we can really do on D1. Before doing your gambit did you somehow miss the fact that people were considering voting for Stanley because he used "mourning everyone" in his post? That's D1.
 
The same argument you are trying to use to discredit my gambit is basically the same post I made in regards to CB's gambit.



Why weren't you as critical of CB's gambit as you are mine?

Final post before I head off to work. There actually had been a random RNG vote before I made my seemingly random vote. An RNG vote people didn't respond to.

Notice how I found it odd StarSketch responded to my random vote, but not somebody else's.
 
Idk about this one.

The whole contradictory stuff doesn't exactly do anything for me that screams scum. I think the whole QBro "epicmafia" stuff is pretty stupid, and I think Crimson and Barrylocke are interesting to look @.

I mean, as of now I guess Zeke is our best option for Day 1, BUT if you know me in these games I vote for who "I" think we should vote. I know Zeke will be the victim today, but I don't necessarily agree with it, so I'm going to vote for

Vote: QuantumBro
 

roytheone

Member
The three people I am willing to vote on today are:

Kalor: He is very quiet, talked mostly about mechanics in the beginning. Had a weird first vote which he later said was to see responses, only he "forgot"about it. He did gave his opinion on a couple of things, but only after people directly asked him a question, he does't give his opinions by himself, he needs to be prodded first.

EzekelRage:I could understand his RNG vote. I could understand his reaction to suspicion, I could even understand the idea of doing a gambit with it. I can't understand the way he did the gambit however. He basically gave it up after only getting one reaction from CornBro, and then continues to attack CornBro. And I agree with Squidyj that him saying that it wasn't a very aggressive reaction and also saying that it was a gamble is a weird combination.

QuantumBro:Immediately starts the day with "I am probably going to follow Scrafty her lead", which doesn't help discussion and would make his vote useless to analyse. When confronted with that, he reacts by saying that people going to bandwagon on Scrafty her vote doesn't mean that those people should stop talking, calling out suspicions etc. Only after those three posts detailing him bandwagoning Scrafty, HE SAID NOTHING AT ALL. Where the hell did you go Quantum??

VOTE: QuantumBro
 
He basically gave it up after only getting one reaction from CornBro, and then continues to attack CornBro.
I've addressed that I responded too early. CB is attacking me so why wouldn't I attack him?

I agree with Squidyj that him saying that it wasn't a very aggressive reaction and also saying that it was a gamble is a weird combination.
This is "a very defensive" reaction:
WTF? It was just a random vote! Why the hell you questioning me and not anyone else?
Its a 3 day game and the vote isn't set in stone. Only thing guaranteed is that there will be a lynch today. Did I miss some development that is leading to someone being scum? Sorry I'm not reading between the lines of the posts some other ppl are seeing. It's not like I came in here at the last minute with a vote.
If I read the example, now I would read that as being extremely defensive. My post isn't that at all. I mention that there is a lot of time, we already said there will be a lynch today. Mention I'm not seeing what everyone else is seeing and I didn't try to hammer a vote or something at the last minute.

. Making mountains out of molehills is the only thing we can really do on D1.

In this instance, only you have been the one to do that.

Actually no, it didn't. I was able to gather some info on StarSketch. I was fine with only one person.
Actually you caught two, Zubs questioned you on why you voted Barrylocke as well. His post was directly after Star's post I think.

Zubs even wondered why you focused on Sketch:
Although, wait. If CornB's plan was to attempt a "Gotcha!" on people asking about a vote he casted without a given reason, why is he singling out Sketch? I was confused by the choice, too!

It looks like you ignored that post. Both Zubs and Star questioned you on the Barrylock vote. Both missed/didn't mention the Kalor vote on Hipster, but you only used that evidence to zero in on Star.
 

roytheone

Member
I've addressed that I responded too early. CB is attacking me so why wouldn't I attack him?


This is "a very defensive" reaction:
WTF? It was just a random vote! Why the hell you questioning me and not anyone else?

.

So your gambit was to react with a non-aggressive, normal reaction, to see how people would react? Wouldn't it make more sense if the gambit was to have an on purpose overblown reaction, and see who would then jump onto you and try to make you the easy prime lynch candidate? Honestly, If your reaction was way more aggressive I would have probably been more inclined to believe that it was indeed intended as a gambit.

(And I actually agree that CornBro his "I think I found scum" reaction on your slightly but not that aggressive response was a bit weird, but in turn the way you reacted on CornBro with your "it was a gambit" was even weirder).
 
CB's Gambit - 30 minutes pass between his vote and his "it was a gambit" post
Vote: Barrylocke

? What for?

Any particular reason for that vote, CornBurrito?

To see who would respond to it. ;)

Squidy's first/playful reply
and what does that tell you?

CB focuses on Star w/o mentioning Zubs.
I know StarSketch seemed fairly concerned/perplexed by the vote. Granted, a town player could have as well. But should either Barry or Star turn out to be scum I know where I'd turn my sights next.

You put up that vote with out any reasoning at all. Of course I'm concerned. Random votes generally don't make any sense to me.

The only other person to vote for Barry was RNH, and RNH was joking.

CB questions Star on why they didn't quesiton Kalor's vote: (Which Zubs didnt either)

I'm going to say "I missed that one" and no one will believe me.

Squidy "supports" CB in a way by wondering why Star didn't say nething about Kalor.
It's like you read my mind :p

Here squidy covers for CB. Only calls CB's gambit a little weird. Nothing else really major.
I think CornB's little 'gotcha' Barrylocke vote, if that's really what it is is a little weird, especially when he gives away the ending so early on, CornBurrito you really could have let that sit for a while and seen if it grew into something.

Otherwise though I'm reading him as town as he seems to be interested in hunting scum,

Inserting this because I think roy's read of CB may be spot on. And it seems Squid didn't read CB as any of that.
CornBro: he has a lot of role speculation, which honestly is pretty useless at this stage of the game IMO. It's all just guesswork which will tell us nothing, and a pretty easy way for a scum to appear active while actually contributing nothing. He does also seem to hunt for scum though, even though I think his quick calling out of ri'on, his argument against stanley his first post, and his Barrylocke vote gamble aren't the strongest arguments.


Zubs wonders why CB is just focusing on sketch.
Although, wait. If CornB's plan was to attempt a "Gotcha!" on people asking about a vote he casted without a given reason, why is he singling out Sketch? I was confused by the choice, too!

He doesn't bother to answer. It's pretty much dead after that.
=============================================================
My gambit - 1 hour passes between my post and "it's a gambit" post
Its a 3 day game and the vote isn't set in stone. Only thing guaranteed is that there will be a lynch today. Did I miss some development that is leading to someone being scum? Sorry I'm not reading between the lines of the posts some other ppl are seeing. It's not like I came in here at the last minute with a vote.

So....

One way to read this post is a very offended/defensive town player being mad that they were thought of as scum for doing something that isn't inherently scummy.

But this to me reads more like scum getting mad that they were thought to be scum for something that wasn't inherently scummy.

Or........

A post made to be purposely defensive to see who would try to jump on it to try to claim it seemed scummy.

Squid's first post is immediately hostile.
is there someone here who is supposed to believe that?

Then drops another post to bash the gambit.
Worst trap since Seath's Conway Stern 'fake claim'

CB votes for me.
VOTE: EzekelRAGE

Guess we'll see.

CB does his little court thing. What's odd his the excuse he thought I shouldve gave, "I'm town, and people think I'm scum. That pissed me off.". I read that as way more defensive than my "damning, very defensive" post
COURT IS IN SESSION
I hereby call EzekielRAGE to the stand.

CrimsonFist called Ezekiel out on his vote. http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showpost.php?p=195399179&postcount=388
Ezekiel responded in an extremely defensive way. http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showpost.php?p=195418808&postcount=395
I believe that this sort of defensive response is more indicative of scum than of town. I said as much. Ezekiel responded like this:
Now quite frankly, I think that's an entire load of bullshit. I don't buy it.
But this is the sort of lie scum would do in my opinion.
If you were town, you could easily explain away your defensive nature. "I'm town, and people think I'm scum. That pissed me off." The problem is that the truth in this case is admitting to anti-town behavior. And pulling a "I'm town, trust me bro" line. The truth looks damning. Scum never wants to look bad. Ezekiel I think understood that. So he scrambled and looked for a lie. And that lie is what he came up with. A way to try to spin his defensiveness as some sort of pro-town gambit.
I'm personally feeling confident that Ezekiel may be scum. I'd like everyone, if possible, to weigh in on this. Because if he is scum, the opinions we get from everyone could be very valuable evidence in future cases.

OBJECTION!
So if you disagreed that you were overly defensive, why did you not argue that? Instead you basically responded "maybe I was being overly defensive on purpose."

I obviously disagree about the degree of defensiveness. Your making it seem like I cursed, called Crimson out his name or something. Making a mountain out of a molehill.

After the two above msgs, I and others go back and forth basically about how defensive I was trying to be.

full
more gambit bashing
this is an argument I could have believed but instead you started with "it was a gambit guys, lol" which has seriously damaged your credibility.

I read sarcasm in his "Did I miss something?" post. That, and in general being very defensive when people call you out on a vote isn't exactly pro-town.
Yet his reply "I'm town, and people think I'm scum. That pissed me off." is more defensive than mine.

full
more gambit bashing
Also, the idea of that being a gambit is just sort of ridiculous.

full
more gambit bashing
how can it be a gambit if it's an ordinary and normal town reaction to an event as opposed to being constructed outside of the norm so as to generate a response? Tell me how you intended to catch people in this so-called gambit.
 
Understood. I've always had an issue with letting things play out before I'm able to comfortably comment on things (unless it immediately sets off red flags of course) but I understand the problem with that and I'll try to fix it.

For some reason, I had a feeling that when I came back your only new comment would be a reply to me.

Well, you posted that correction too, but that's not really much.
 
So your gambit was to react with a non-aggressive, normal reaction, to see how people would react?
So at least you agree that it wasnt as aggressive/defensive as CB is making it out to be.

Wouldn't it make more sense if the gambit was to have an on purpose overblown reaction, and see who would then jump onto you and try to make you the easy prime lynch candidate?
I figured if it was too overblown, anyone would try and get me lynched behind it.

Honestly, If your reaction was way more aggressive I would have probably been more inclined to believe that it was indeed intended as a gambit.
As my msg above, then I wouldve had anyone questioning me. The purpose was to see who would take something so small and make it a shitstorm. And it seems to be CB and Squidy.
 
Which is an unfortunate excuse and is making it easy for him to fly under the radar.
Did someone say under the radar?


READS LIST READS LIST GET YOUR READS LIST HERE

Confirmed Town:
ScraftyDevil

Leaning Town:
roytheone - Good prodder and discussion starter
CrimsonFist - Ditto

Very slightly town:
squidyj - Hasn't really done anything to garner suspicion
Ri'Orious - Asked some general questions

Pure neutral read / not enough to really go on IMHO:
Bowlie
Barrylocke
CornBurrito
EzekelRAGE
StankeyPalmtree
Matt Attack
RedFalco (He might just be a figment of our imagination, thou)
RobotNinjaHornets
TheWorthyEdge
TheGoddamn
Zubz

Very slightly scummy:
Hipster Cthulhu - I find the interaction between him and Kalor to be something to look into later on, if need be
Kalor - As above
StarSketch - Tried to make herself fit in with town, maybe?

Scumtown Central:
QuantumBro - I still can't understand why you would do that
 

Sorian

Banned
Effective immediately, QuantumBro will be dropping out due to not having enough time to play. I will be contacting someone from the replacement list and will keep you all updated
 
Just sent Sorian a PM, but I might as well post in here too; I've requested a replacement since I don't think I'm going to have enough time to keep up with the game.

Sorry about doing this so close to the voting deadline. Good luck to y'all.

Just beat me, haha.
 
Effective immediately, QuantumBro will be dropping out due to not having enough time to play. I will be contacting someone from the replacement list and will keep you all updated
How does QB dropping out affect the votes we have on him currently, if there isn't a replacement by the end of the day?
 

Sorian

Banned
How does QB dropping out affect the votes we have on him currently, if there isn't a replacement by the end of the day?

The votes remain (and for my own bookkeeping they will just be filed under QB's name until a replacement is found). Votes may still move to and away from his as needed.
 

roytheone

Member
Don't think it is smart to keep our votes on someone that can no longer play and is getting replaced soon, since that is a very good way to accidentally lynch a PR. Even if Sorian finds a replacement before day's end, I doubt he/she will be able to read up on the thread before the deadline.

VOTE: Kalor

Ezekel is very suspicious, but at least he is actively playing the game and creating discussions. Kalor on the other hand seems to be content to just sit back and watch, and only spring into action when he is asked a direct question. There seem to be more of those type of players in this game, but a lot of them are first timers so that is a bit better understandable (but still dangerous). Also, Kalor had that weird vote gambit he "forgot" about, and had to be reminded of by Starsketch. I don't understand how you manage to forget about your own gambit.
 

Bowlie

Banned
As before, I've been reading what you all have been saying and trying to understand the game.

So far, I have some doubts against:

StarSketch (openly declared herself as town)

StanleyPalmtree ("mourning" joke)

Kalor (stayed pianissimo after his vote without reason, and forgot about commenting after his target reacted to it)

QuantumBro (I had doubts against him too, but he's out now)

of those three, I think the most disturbing one is Kalor.

VOTE: Kalor

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

I did not like Ezekel before, but after his long post (feat. Khaled) I think his defense against CB's behavior during the first day (which I also did not like) is interesting.

To clarify, I did not like CB's behavior because almost no one was following his arguments with rebuttals, and even though I think it's good for someone to create discussion and information, it was almost feeling like it was one-sided.

I want to see more of them, and I'll try to be more active from now on too.
 
miapearl-ohmy(a).gif


Hmm, I was strongly in favour of voting for Ezekiel until he made that impassioned plea, which actually makes me hesitant to send him off today despite the strong points some others have made about him.

On the other hand, I'm not convinced of Corn either and I'd rather not vote off QB's replacement either in case we make a grave error while they're not even around to defend themselves, so I think I'll opt for my third pick instead.

VOTE: Kalor

I'm still suspicious of Ezekiel and Cthulhu (although the latter could just be newbie jitters) and I'll certainly be keeping a closer eye on them in the near future. Until then, I believe it'd be pertinent for everyone to try and come up with a list of their top 3 most and least-trusted individuals, so that even if you get killed we'll have something to work with.

miapearl-strict(b).gif


Most Trusted:

roytheone - Observant, engaging and not quick to jump to conclusions. I feel very good about roy.

CrimsonFist - Good at following discussions and bringing up subjects that others might have passed over.

CornBurrito - Very involved if perhaps slightly overzealous. I wouldn't trust him with my life but I do think he's worth keeping around for now.

Least Trusted:

Kalor - Content to fade into the background and say/do nothing at all.

QuantumBro - Perhaps announcing your intention to be a follower from the start of the proceedings wasn't the best move, mmm? Nevertheless, I don't feel comfortable voting out someone who can't defend himself so I'll simply be scrutinizing his replacement.

RedFalco - Similar to Kalor, and just as unimpressionable. I'd really like to hear more from you tomorrow.
 

Kalor

Member
Well, I half expected people to turn on me but I wasn't expecting it to be today. I've been sick since the game started so that's why I've been quiet and only really keeping up to date with it. Not really an excuse for forgetting but it played into it so may as well mention it.

I fail to see what makes me more suspicious than other people. All I did was forget to explain my vote. Sure it might be suspicious but it doesn't seem like something that scum would do. What would I have to gain as scum by not mentioning my reasoning for voting Hipster?
 
Ok: I didn't find CB's gambit especially weird, because I've been doing similar with some of my voting, although not calling them gambits. Reading back through that whole exchange, the whole thing feels like insincere fluff, Squidy's contributions included. Not sure what to think about that right now though.

As for tunneling on Ezekel, claiming that reaction as a gambit was weird and still feels weird, and I think it was a legitimate thing to react to. However your contributions today have been much better, and are giving me much better vibes. Still not enough to make me completely forgive that "gambit" though.
 
Am I the only one suspicious of Matt Attack?

Can a few other people give thoughts on him?

SP - offered nothing new really wiht his vote for me and just regurgitated what CB/SJ said.

Matt - Added nothing to discussion. Saw the wind blowing my way and said he would vote for me.

Hipster - Votes for me, says im very suspicous, but doesnt bother saying why.
What is suspicious exactly? You have been MIA in this thread for most of this day. Other than a filler post and a post where you claim vocal ppl are suspicious (while hardly posting yourself).
Both Hipster and Matt both said the most would be learned from lynching me, but didnt go into detail about it.

You ignored Squidy's question about posting your thoughts on me and qb to post filler about you not being able to spell well.

You say I'm suspicious, but dont say why. You just may a driveby post and peace out.

Both Hipster and Matt both said the most would be learned from lynching me, but didnt go into detail about it. Just dog piled on.

Vote: Kalor QB thing seems to not being going anywhere due to the replacement angle. I'm not gonna vote for my self in this situation.
 
So Ezekiel said he was attacking me because I attacked him. That shit play, sorry. I attack you because I think you are scum. If you think I am scum for legit reasons then do it. Don't try to OMGUS me.
 
SP - offered nothing new really wiht his vote for me and just regurgitated what CB/SJ said.

Matt - Added nothing to discussion. Saw the wind blowing my way and said he would vote for me.

Hipster - Votes for me, says im very suspicous, but doesnt bother saying why.


Both Hipster and Matt both said the most would be learned from lynching me, but didnt go into detail about it. Just dog piled on.

Vote: Kalor QB thing seems to not being going anywhere due to the replacement angle. I'm not gonna vote for my self in this situation.
Votes need to be on a separate line of text, sarge
 
Kalor will flip town, Ezekiel is actually scum. Calling this now and prepared to eat crow later if wrong.

Well done Ezekiel. Convincing town to give you another day may let you live at least a few more days.
 

Kalor

Member
A lot of people jumping on my Kalor vote, interesting. I didn't even post any reasoning with it.

The votes have been piling on quite quickly.

So, at this point I doubt that I'll be able to get out of this situation without claiming. I won't reveal my exact role at this moment but I will say that I am Gregory Edgeworth, the classiest defense attorney around.
 
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