runnin_blue
Banned
Oh, ok. So a mod did it? Lol.
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Speculation based on trademark minutia: Nintendo NX to use cartridges
- Thread starter Smellycat
- Start date
Vanillalite
Ask me about the GAF Notebook
512 gig HDDs in current consoles are already tiny. 64 gig internal NAND will last like a day in the current climate.
512 GB HDDs are tiny because of mandatory installs, otherwise they're perfectly fine, at least if you're not going full digital.
ViewtifulJC
Banned
cartridges
IN 2017
IN 2017
Okami Haundo
Member
I was just about to say this. If they're using a media format that doesn't need to be installed somewhere first, they can keep the internal storage to a minimum. The only thing you would need it for are the OS and some save data, neither of which should need anywhere remotely close to that much storage space.
Skittzo0413
Member
Of course they would love to charge more, that's not the issue. My main point is that nothing deterred publishers from charging $40 for 3DS ROM cards when manufacturing even 4GB cards must have cost a great deal more than Wii U discs to manufacture, which MSRP for $60.
The logical conclusion we can gather from this is that cost of manufacturing the medium is not a major factor in MSRP. I don't see how that can be argued.
ultrazilla
Member
TheSlySoul
Member
Still better than PS4/XBO system of have disc, game installs on your system, still need disc to play.
Vanillalite
Ask me about the GAF Notebook
Patches?
The Artisan
Member
well even if they have a blu ray player already it's just the convenience of having and using a machine that could include that feature as it's not too difficult too include. you have a point though i suppose it's not that essential.
Okami Haundo
Member
That's what an external drive on console or an SD card on a handheld would be for. Nothing says that patches and DLC need to exist on system memory, my Xbox One internal drive is empty aside from things I can't move to an external.
The average console attach ratio is around 8? How much space does the average patch take on PS4/XB1?
Enthusiasts can always spring for bigger drives/cards like with Wii U and 3DS.
Hispanic! At the Disco
Member
If I recall correctly, Dead Rising 3 once recieved a 16 GB patch. And i'm pretty sure Halo 5 has recieved around 40GB of updates.
Okami Haundo
Member
I can at least agree with you there! It makes too much sense as that would allow cross-buy/play for both physical and digital customers.
Cost is calculated on what the market will bear. The manufacturing costs eat into profits and other budgets. The effect is invisible but very significant. Schedules are also important. As are overages and waste
If a game fails those costs are precipitous. If it succeeds can demand be met rapidly? MSRP is a tiny aspect of the overall consideration and in some ways a fixed item.
Okami Haundo
Member
Neither of those were on Nintendo consoles though. Based on previous history, I can't see Nintendo allowing patches that large. Third parties wouldn't be happy with it at all, but Nintendo could want to keep things family friendly. Waiting hours upon hours for a 40GB day one patch is not family-friendly.
Hmmmm....
geordiemp
Member
Destiny 50 GB updates...and just not one...
Carts would work for Nintendo, cant see it for many third party games (which probably wont bother Nintendo anyway)
Patches nowadays are several GBs, so devs would have to order carts that are at least 8GB+ what they need for the game.
That's not even considering when devs just seem to submit the whole game again as a patch. So basically you are looking at a situation where developers would have to pay upfront for the possibility of patching things, and also where you limit a lot what they can do wrt those patches.
An internal HD has a lot of advantages in cost to make this idea unnecessary, even if they put in a slow 5200 rpm in. OFC Nintendo just refused to put a decently sized harddrive on the WiiU but that was probably the latest generation they can pull that off. Well, they can always support external harddrives from the initial launch and put a measly flash memory for the most immediate needs.
Pokemaniac
Member
Eh, Nintendo would probably only disallow it if the game was unplayable without the patch. There isn't really any evidence that they enforce any real size limits on patches besides inherent system limits.
Hispanic! At the Disco
Member
Oh of course and theyre not day 1 patches either. I was just commenting on xbox patches in general for the sake of harddrive size. I know Nintendo themselves keep patches and downloads failry small. Super Mario 3D World was under 2 GB for the full game download!
ShockingAlberto
Member
There was a 49GB AC Unity patch once, but that was because they made an error that forced the patch to redownload the entire game.
Those are two 1st party titles. What's a patch like for an average multiplatform game like COD or FIFA or Arkham or Just Dance, etc? Bonus what are patches like for those games on Steam/Origin/etc?
You just need to think for 10 second to undestand that what you said doesn't make any sense
capitalCORN
Member
Whether first party or third party, why would that affect patch size? And we even started the discussion on DLCs.
Okami Haundo
Member
Yeah, I'm really just speculating here. I can't see them allowing a patch that was larger than the on-board system memory at the very least. Full game downloads are a different story though.
Danny Dudekisser
I paid good money for this Dynex!
Carts, cards... whatever. I like them both more than discs. I'd be happy to see a return to them.
Neospartan
Neo Member
Taking the info from this site:
PS4 Update Sizes
And removing the games without an update, the average ends up being close to 3 GB.
So, 30 GB of actual storage space should be enough. Give the thing 64 GB to be sure and be done with it.
Avenger54321
Member
Cartridges huh? This will definitely be interesting to see. I doubt they will be as big as the old days maybe like the N64, but smaller.
There are some next-gen things that haven't happened yet. This console generation has just been about graphics.
In the past Nintendo introduces some cool standards, so I can see them doing this because of the benefits. Everything listed above is totally next gen. After the PSX gen, companies would boast about reducing load times and GCN was good at that. Then it disappeared and we have gone back to long load times.
For me, games need things like reduced load times and more interesting AI. With a cartridge, something akin to the Super FX can be implemented to future NX games, and Nintendo can even produce iterative hardware at a cheaper cost. The only thing about this is digital downloads. You can't download an additional chip.
If saves are written to the cart and there is a Nintendo cloud save system (or there isnt which is why they have carts) you can have your save anywhere and even recover it if you lose a cart.
I really want Nintendo to come back like Sony did from the PS3. It sucks what happened to Xbox, but now we see them competing more. But Nintendo is the right company to compete in interesting ways.
I think it'd be neat if it were to use cartridges. Especially if they release a portable system that'll run the games off the same cartridges.
While PS4 is pretty darn fast at getting the game going, having experienced the ps3 mandatory installs last gen and the xbox one this gen, it'd be nice to have a system that boots up right into the game with fast loading times without the need to install at all.
While PS4 is pretty darn fast at getting the game going, having experienced the ps3 mandatory installs last gen and the xbox one this gen, it'd be nice to have a system that boots up right into the game with fast loading times without the need to install at all.
Well, because you probably won't see Halo or Dead Rising 3 on NX. DR3 is around 30GB total on Steam with 3GB of dlc, why is a 16GB patch really even necessary?
ShockingAlberto
Member
I think cartridges makes a lot of sense if the NX is what we think it is.
If it's not, then cartridges are a baffling decision.
If it's not, then cartridges are a baffling decision.
Colonel Mustard
Banned
People keep saying third parties won't bother. If this does have some kind of handheld compenent and both devices play the same games, you can bet that most Japanese third parties will bother.
Vanillalite
Ask me about the GAF Notebook
Usually isn't 16 GB patch. It's more for evergreen titles that get updates overtime. Games like Destiny or now Overwatch will be constantly updated as it lives and breathes.
Plus all of the dlc.
It's more cumulative.
Okami Haundo
Member
If NX is just a box full of puppies and kittens (Nintendogs and Cats 2) then cartridges would make no sense at all. What would those adorable animals even do with cartridges?
Delusibeta
Banned
That's actually a fair point: carts would have a substantially higher transfer speed, and so would probably not require installing the game, unlike the PS4 and Xbone.
ShockingAlberto
Member
If they're anything like my friend's DS collection, including games they borrowed from me, probably chew them to the point of unsuitability.
Okami Haundo
Member
I definitely agree with you there. I feel like those people you're referring to are referring to Western third-party devs. Japanese third parties will be all over NX in that case.
Yeah because Nintendo has never developed hardware that flopped.
Astral Dog
Member
They are good fit for handhelds though.
What a timr to be alive
Astral Dog
Member
Thats a weird thing to respond, an hybrid would have some benefits but i think we can agree the minuses would overwhelm the pluses.
ShockingAlberto
Member
Hm, really, though? The number of Japanese third parties that supported the DS has shrunk significantly with the 3DS. A lot of that is because there's just fewer Japanese third parties now. Konami's out of the game, Square-Enix mostly moved to mobile (and basically gave all their western publishing responsibilities to Nintendo), Sega fell out of experimental quirky ideas and just kind of coughed up some phlegm on the 3DS, etc.
Really, the third party heroes of the 3DS are Atlus, Capcom, and Namco and, should graphics improve to the point where making games on a new system is any more difficult or expensive than it currently is, that might not keep going.
The 3DS is much more of a Nintendo system than people seem to think.
Evergreen titles also tend to get updated rereleases though. Even from Nintendo sometimes with NSMBU now coming with the dlc on disc at retail now for example. Nintendo won't limit things to what the storage devices ship with either, it will be expandable as needed.
SwiftDeath
Member
An amount that would be a non-issue if the price was right.
Expect 30-64 GB game cards.
Huelen, this picture is terribly misleading.
Best I can tell it is from those responsible for maintaining the storage format specifications itself, not any actual producers of Micro SD cards.
http://sdxcs.com/
The largest Micro SD card currently is the 256GB by Samsung which just released this month.
There are no rumors of a larger capacity currently that I'm aware of so that image is suggesting that storage capabilities of up to 2TB are possible now when that doesn't appear to be the case. Simply because the specification allows for it doesn't mean it can be functionally produced yet.
Would much rather have cards instead of disc installs
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