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[Hawk269]

OK, here's a couple of comparison shots illustrating the issue I'm having. Note: these are not screenshots—these are manipulated images that directly reflect what I'm experiencing on my KS9000.

To reiterate, the TV is telling me it's receiving an HDR signal and I'm getting green ticks all the way in settings.

HDR Disabled

HDR Enabled

The above is exactly what the in-game settings screen looks like for me. As you can see, with HDR enabled the peak whites are still being 'hit'—however this appears to be at the cost of almost everything else in the image. The result is super bright rays of sun but dim, grey clouds, and a dark environment.

This appears to be occurring at an OS level, not just in this game. Everything on the dashboard is darker until switching to another app, when HDR is disabled and everything returns to normal.

This is most prominent in Game Mode, Natural Mode, and Movie Mode. It's a little less noticeable in Standard and Dynamic.

Oh, and just to make things even more bizarre, my in-game screenshots with HDR enabled look fine on both my TV and my computer. Nice and bright, unlike some I've seen. God knows what's happening here.

How can you be getting the option in the game for HDR brightness if HDR is disabled? When you disable HDR in the Xbox One S UI and then load the game, that menu will not show the ability to adjust the HDR brightness level in game, it will only show the standard brightness. So what it appears you are doing is leaving the Xbox One S with HDR on, loading the game and then manually turning off the HDR on your TV. I don't think it is a real reflection on how it will look unless you turn off HDR within the UI. Again, with HDR off you should not see the in game brightness menu giving you the HDR brightness option.

 

[Karak]

OK, here's a couple of comparison shots illustrating the issue I'm having. Note: these are not screenshots—these are manipulated images that directly reflect what I'm experiencing on my KS9000.

To reiterate, the TV is telling me it's receiving an HDR signal and I'm getting green ticks all the way in settings.

HDR Disabled

HDR Enabled

The above is exactly what the in-game settings screen looks like for me. As you can see, with HDR enabled the peak whites are still being 'hit'—however this appears to be at the cost of almost everything else in the image. The result is super bright rays of sun but dim, grey clouds, and a dark environment.

This appears to be occurring at an OS level, not just in this game. Everything on the dashboard is darker until switching to another app, when HDR is disabled and everything returns to normal.

This is most prominent in Game Mode, Natural Mode, and Movie Mode. It's a little less noticeable in Standard and Dynamic.

Oh, and just to make things even more bizarre, my in-game screenshots with HDR enabled look fine on both my TV and my computer. Nice and bright, unlike some I've seen. God knows what's happening here.

When you disable HDR in the Xbox One the option for HDR should not be coming up in your options at all. I have tested this a ton of times and if its off in the Xbox S it has not once showed up in the options.

 

[iMax]

How can you be getting the option in the game for HDR brightness if HDR is disabled? When you disable HDR in the Xbox One S UI and then load the game, that menu will not show the ability to adjust the HDR brightness level in game, it will only show the standard brightness. So what it appears you are doing is leaving the Xbox One S with HDR on, loading the game and then manually turning off the HDR on your TV. I don't think it is a real reflection on how it will look unless you turn off HDR within the UI. Again, with HDR off you should not see the in game brightness menu giving you the HDR brightness option.

When you disable HDR in the Xbox One the option for HDR should not be coming up in your options at all. I have tested this a ton of times and if its off in the Xbox S it has not once showed up in the options.

It doesn't, I'm phrasing it badly. I just trying to illustrate that when using HDR, that calibrator is white but everything else is dim and grey.

When booting up the demo, for example (which doesn't run in HDR) all those menu elements are that same bright white. But when booting up the full game (in HDR), all the menu elements except the calibrator are dim.

Again, those images are manipulated to illustrate the situation. They are not screenshots.

 

[iMax]

Just took two screenshots in-game using the 'take a screenshot' button in the OS—one with HDR enabled in System Settings, one disabled.

They both look exactly the same. Isn't this a red flag that something is wrong with the Xbox considering everyone else taking HDR screenshots at the moment are having severe image quality issues?

 

[BlindSwordsmanZ]

Just took two screenshots in-game using the 'take a screenshot' button in the OS—one with HDR enabled in System Settings, one disabled.

They both look exactly the same. Isn't this a red flag that something is wrong with the Xbox considering everyone else taking HDR screenshots at the moment are having severe image quality issues?

Sounds like a red flag to me. Can you share the shots?

 

[iMax]

Sounds like a red flag to me. Can you share the shots?

Sure thing!

HDR Disabled

HDR Enabled

You'll have to take my word for it that HDR was disabled in Settings for the first one, and enabled for the second. Verified in the in-game settings that the 'HDR Brightness' option was only available for the latter, as Karak says, and I force-quit the game for each scenario.

 

[Halabane]

Not sure taking screen grabs is going to do anything. Its not actually taking a picture of what you see...its just whatever format was done internally the game. probably some compressed jpg? why you are seeing different things could just be how it was rendered at that time but I don't know. Think you would need to take 'picture' of your TV screen with a very good camera to capture differences???

I just got an xbox s from target this weekend and I have an elite here. My quick test is that I was surprised that the s box was coming up as fast as the elite...so much for the hybrid drive. Right now out of the s box looks visually on the TV like my elite. But I'll look more later. I have an HDR 4k tv and the s box recognized it was hdr game ready on its own.

 

[iMax]

Not sure taking screen grabs is going to do anything. Its not actually taking a picture of what you see...its just whatever format was done internally the game. probably some compressed jpg? why you are seeing different things could just be how it was rendered at that time but I don't know. Think you would need to take 'picture' of your TV screen with a very good camera to capture differences???

I just got an xbox s from target this weekend and I have an elite here. My quick test is that I was surprised that the s box was coming up as fast as the elite...so much for the hybrid drive. Right now out of the s box looks visually on the TV like my elite. But I'll look more later. I have an HDR 4k tv and the s box recognized it was hdr game ready on its own.

Absolutely. But as mentioned in the post, it was to demonstrate that there may be an Xbox-level bug as my HDR screenshots aren't corrupt like everyone else's.

 

[Vuze]

Not sure taking screen grabs is going to do anything. Its not actually taking a picture of what you see...its just whatever format was done internally the game. probably some compressed jpg? why you are seeing different things could just be how it was rendered at that time but I don't know. Think you would need to take 'picture' of your TV screen with a very good camera to capture differences???

I just got an xbox s from target this weekend and I have an elite here. My quick test is that I was surprised that the s box was coming up as fast as the elite...so much for the hybrid drive. Right now out of the s box looks visually on the TV like my elite. But I'll look more later. I have an HDR 4k tv and the s box recognized it was hdr game ready on its own.

HDR screenshots are currently 'broken' and will show up as completely muted on SDR screens (see mine from a page or so ago). Both screenshots above look perfectly normal.
So it appears that in iMax's case the Xbox is sending an HDR signal and triggers the TV to go to HDR mode but the console is only providing SDR content for whatever reason. And as such breaks the whole image. If that makes any sense.

 

[ajmiles]

Absolutely. But as mentioned in the post, it was to demonstrate that there may be an Xbox-level bug as my HDR screenshots aren't corrupt like everyone else's.

I'll take this offline with iMax and see if we can figure out what's up (Xbox ATG engineer here).

 

[iMax]

I'll take this offline with iMax and see if we can figure out what's up (Xbox ATG engineer here).

That would be much appreciated, thank you. This is driving me crazy haha!

 

[iMax]

HDR screenshots are currently 'broken' and will show up as completely muted on SDR screens (see mine from a page or so ago). Both screenshots above look perfectly normal.
So it appears that in iMax's case the Xbox is sending an HDR signal and triggers the TV to go to HDR mode but the console is only providing SDR content for whatever reason. And as such breaks the whole image. If that makes any sense.

Yes, that must be what is happening. And if the signal is corrupt on arrival, that would explain my TV isn't displaying it correctly.

 

[Alpha Phoenix]

HDR screenshots are currently 'broken' and will show up as completely muted on SDR screens (see mine from a page or so ago). Both screenshots above look perfectly normal.
So it appears that in iMax's case the Xbox is sending an HDR signal and triggers the TV to go to HDR mode but the console is only providing SDR content for whatever reason. And as such breaks the whole image. If that makes any sense.

DF has said something along those lines IIRC. The best place to see HDR content is, well, an HDR screen.

 

[killroy87]

It doesn't, I'm phrasing it badly. I just trying to illustrate that when using HDR, that calibrator is white but everything else is dim and grey.

When booting up the demo, for example (which doesn't run in HDR) all those menu elements are that same bright white. But when booting up the full game (in HDR), all the menu elements except the calibrator are dim.

Again, those images are manipulated to illustrate the situation. They are not screenshots.

I know what you're talking about. I get the exact same effect, but I'm pretty sure it's only in-game. I don't think it does it for me in the dashboard (though I haven't paid a ton of attention)

 

[iMax]

I know what you're talking about. I get the exact same effect, but I'm pretty sure it's only in-game. I don't think it does it for me in the dashboard (though I haven't paid a ton of attention)

Have a look at your friends list when snapped whilst in-game, or when at the dashboard with the game in primary view.

Then snap your friends list again when you're in a normal, non-HDR game or app. Does the background look much brighter?

 

[Karak]

Sure thing!

HDR Disabled

HDR Enabled

You'll have to take my word for it that HDR was disabled in Settings for the first one, and enabled for the second. Verified in the in-game settings that the 'HDR Brightness' option was only available for the latter, as Karak says, and I force-quit the game for each scenario.

Yep you are 100% right. Something is indeed up from your description now. Thanks for clearing it up.

 

[MCD]

HDR is honestly game changer. Tried two switch back and forth between PC 4K and X1 and HDR only made X1 version so much worth it compared to the dull and washed out normal look.

No lies I truly believe HDR is gonna be the next big thing.

 

[vatstep]

Have a look at your friends list when snapped whilst in-game, or when at the dashboard with the game in primary view.

Then snap your friends list again when you're in a normal, non-HDR game or app. Does the background look much brighter?

I experience the same thing on my KS8000. It's not hugely noticeable, but there IS a difference. I didn't really think it was an indicator of something being terribly wrong, but it's there. HDR looks good on my set, though; I had to turn on Dynamic Contrast.

iMax, I'm sure you know this, but have you checked your picture settings (backlight, contrast, etc.) before and after entering HDR mode? It differs on some sets. On the KS8000, with Movie mode on, HDR sources trigger a "hidden" setting that bumps up some of the levels. You can make changes to it and they will be saved, though.

 

[iMax]

Yep you are 100% right. Something is indeed up from your description now. Thanks for clearing it up.

No probs mate!

 

[iMax]

I experience the same thing on my KS8000. It's not hugely noticeable, but there IS a difference. I didn't really think it was an indicator of something being terribly wrong, but it's there. HDR looks good on my set, though; I had to turn on Dynamic Contrast.

iMax, I'm sure you know this, but have you checked your picture settings (backlight, contrast, etc.) before and after entering HDR mode? It differs on some sets. On the KS8000, with Movie mode on, HDR sources trigger a "hidden" setting that bumps up some of the levels. You can make changes to it and they will be saved, though.

Yeah, I actually left the picture menu up to observe what changes when switching between 8-bit and 10-bit. With default settings it appears to be the Dynamic Contrast, Smart LED, and some changes in the colour space options.

 

[vatstep]

The other thing that I'm noticing (mentioned previously by iMax) is the difference between the brightness of white in the menus. I have my TV settings for HDR and non-HDR the same, but if I toggle HDR on the Xbox, there is a very noticeable difference in Forza – the white panels on the menu and the large in-game text are a very light gray with HDR on, but they're pure white with it off. In-game, though, the whites look consistent either way.

Can anyone else try and replicate it? That way we'd know if this is an issue with the game, the Xbox One S, or certain TVs. The fact that the brightness calibration box looks pure white regardless (HDR on/off) leads me to believe that this is a bug within the game.

I'll try to take some pics shortly.

 

[Karak]

The other thing that I'm noticing (mentioned previously by iMax) is the difference between the brightness of white in the menus. I have my TV settings for HDR and non-HDR the same, but if I toggle HDR on the Xbox, there is a very noticeable difference in Forza – the white panels on the menu and the large in-game text are a very light gray with HDR on, but they're pure white with it off. In-game, though, the whites look consistent either way.

Can anyone else try and replicate it? That way we'd know if this is an issue with the game, the Xbox One S, or certain TVs. The fact that the brightness calibration box looks pure white regardless (HDR on/off) leads me to believe that this is a bug within the game.

I'll try to take some pics shortly.

And you can't adjust them to get it right? You absolutely will have different TV settings for HDR on and off and they will make it look weird without adjustment.

 

[killroy87]

I really wish I could experience HDR on the sets of some of the people who are wowed by it here. I want to know if it's actually better on their TV than on mine, or if they simply like the effect it has more than I do. I have a pretty good set, so I assume it's the latter, becuase HDR or all 4K blurays I have works fine (in the case of Mad Max, it works too well, and blows out the colors too much)

 

[BlindSwordsmanZ]

I really wish I could experience HDR on the sets of some of the people who are wowed by it here. I want to know if it's actually better on their TV than on mine, or if they simply like the effect it has more than I do. I have a pretty good set, so I assume it's the latter, becuase HDR or all 4K blurays I have works fine (in the case of Mad Max, it works too well, and blows out the colors too much)

What make/model TV do you have?

 

[Karak]

I really wish I could experience HDR on the sets of some of the people who are wowed by it here. I want to know if it's actually better on their TV than on mine, or if they simply like the effect it has more than I do. I have a pretty good set, so I assume it's the latter, becuase HDR or all 4K blurays I have works fine (in the case of Mad Max, it works too well, and blows out the colors too much)

What tv? There are a number of differences in sets that can and will make HDR look a bit different on each, one of the factors of course being your home and your lighting.

 

[killroy87]

What make/model TV do you have?

What tv? There are a number of differences in sets that can and will make HDR look a bit different on each, one of the factors of course being your home and your lighting.

Sony XBR55X850D. It's not the absolute best on the market, but it does pretty well. 4K blus like Lego Movie and The Revenant fucking shine in HDR.

I think we are putting too much pressure on FH3 to get it perfect. It's basically the first game to support the feature, I'm sure as more games do the calibration will get better.

 

[Karak]

Sony XBR55X850D. It's not the absolute best on the market, but it does pretty well. 4K blus like Lego Movie and The Revenant fucking shine in HDR.

I think we are putting too much pressure on FH3 to get it perfect. It's basically the first game to support the feature, I'm sure as more games do the calibration will get better.

No local dimming, not super bright, blacks aren't very black. It has caveats in some of the major spaces that HDR shows its excellence.
That being said if your seeing it in movies than hold tight and games will do better later.

 

[Madness]

Dammit, is it worth it then? Will either buy the Sony 50w800c 1080p 120 hz last years model or the Xbrx800D which is 4k + Sony shitty hdr and 60 hz. Is at least some form of HDR worth it? When you play games. Does it increase the lag? I just know if I don't buy an HDR television for my room now I will regret it next year or year after as Scorpio and 4K and HDR gaming start to become commonplace.

 

[Karak]

Dammit, is it worth it then? Will either buy the Sony 50w800c 1080p 120 hz last years model or the Xbrx800D which is 4k + Sony shitty hdr and 60 hz. Is at least some form of HDR worth it? When you play games. Does it increase the lag? I just know if I don't buy an HDR television for my room now I will regret it next year or year after as Scorpio and 4K and HDR gaming start to become commonplace.

If you can wait, there is 0 real smart reasons to jump in now. The amount of available media + older tech still creeping into tv's. Man if you can wait its not like you are missing a ton.
And I love Forza with HDR its insane. But its just way too early with very little need.

 

[vatstep]

And you can't adjust them to get it right? You absolutely will have different TV settings for HDR on and off and they will make it look weird without adjustment.

Just out of curiosity I made my settings with HDR on and off exactly the same. While playing the game with HDR on, I can't find any setting that will make the whites in the menu look vibrant without some other tradeoff.

 

[Madness]

If you can wait, there is 0 real smart reasons to jump in now. The amount of available media + older tech still creeping into tv's. Man if you can wait its not like you are missing a ton.
And I love Forza with HDR its insane. But its just way too early with very little need.

I need a television though. So the question is to get a pretty nice 1080p set that is 120 hz and 3D or just do 4K with Sony X800D limited HDR right now so I am future proof. It is for the room and mostly for games and movies. I am definitely waiting to buy a television in the living room for next year and hoping the cost of OLED and Quantum Dot displays comes down.

 

[Karak]

I need a television though. So the question is to get a pretty nice 1080p set that is 120 hz and 3D or just do 4K with Sony X800D limited HDR right now so I am future proof. It is for the room and mostly for games and movies. I am definitely waiting to buy a television in the living room for next year and hoping the cost of OLED and Quantum Dot displays comes down.

My answer is already known. I am sure others can pipe in.

 

[StoOgE]

HDR on Netflix on my LG OLED (last years model) is really fucking great.

I am guessing the contrast ratio supported by OLED tech is really helpful, because I think my set technically doesn't actually meet the HDR spec, but only some of it.

 

[Ennosuke]

I need a television though. So the question is to get a pretty nice 1080p set that is 120 hz and 3D or just do 4K with Sony X800D limited HDR right now so I am future proof. It is for the room and mostly for games and movies. I am definitely waiting to buy a television in the living room for next year and hoping the cost of OLED and Quantum Dot displays comes down.

I had the same discussion with myself a couple of months ago. In the end I bought the w800 for an amazing pricing. The money I saved here will be invested in a couple of years when 4k and hdr are standard.
All the talk and epecially in this thread about hdr are of course very exciting, but I think I did the right thing. Amazing 1080p TV.

 

[Heidern98]

So I tried this yesterday with my LG 65UH9500. I started with the HDR mode set with all image processing turned off and adjusted the in-game settings as close as I could get them to being accurate. Everything appeared muted, like everyone else has mentioned.

I then took some of the suggestions and bumped the backlight to 100 and enabled dynamic contrast at maximum. It substantially improved the image appearance to me.

As for comparisons, I have the demo still and I have the new iphone, so I think if I took pictures of my TV I should get a better representation of the differences (someone else correct me if I'm wrong). I'll try to do this tonight after work.

 

[ghibli99]

So I tried this yesterday with my LG 65UH9500. I started with the HDR mode set with all image processing turned off and adjusted the in-game settings as close as I could get them to being accurate. Everything appeared muted, like everyone else has mentioned.

I then took some of the suggestions and bumped the backlight to 100 and enabled dynamic contrast at maximum. It substantially improved the image appearance to me.

As for comparisons, I have the demo still and I have the new iphone, so I think if I took pictures of my TV I should get a better representation of the differences (someone else correct me if I'm wrong). I'll try to do this tonight after work.

Will have to try this tonight to see if it makes any noticeable difference. So far, for FH3 specifically, HDR has not been impressive (whereas Deadpool 4K HDR blew me away).

 

[BlindSwordsmanZ]

I need a television though. So the question is to get a pretty nice 1080p set that is 120 hz and 3D or just do 4K with Sony X800D limited HDR right now so I am future proof. It is for the room and mostly for games and movies. I am definitely waiting to buy a television in the living room for next year and hoping the cost of OLED and Quantum Dot displays comes down.

Having made the decision to get the X800D i would highly recommend you do the same if you own or plan to own an X1S. The hdr in Horizon 3 is stunning and I'm sure that Gears will be the same. Add to that the fact that PS4 is going to have HDR content very soon and it was an easy decision to make. Of course if you don't plan on upgrading to a PS4 pro and don't have an X1S then it might not be worth it.

 

[Caayn]

Game doesn't look right in HDR mode. Colours are muted and the menu looks funny (white blueish), played around with the brightness / hdr sliders in the game. But can't get it to look good. Other HDR content such as movies instantly show an improvement.

Playing on an LG EG920v.

 

[iMax]

Game doesn't look right in HDR mode. Colours are muted and the menu looks funny (white blueish), played around with the brightness / hdr sliders in the game. But can't get it to look good. Other HDR content such as movies instantly show an improvement.

Playing on an LG EG920v.

Out of interest, could you take an in-game screenshot and post it here? Are the colours muted in that too?

 

[Caayn]

Out of interest, could you take an in-game screenshot and post it here? Are the colours muted in that too?

I don't fully understand why you want screenshots as the XB1s is designed to convert HDR into SDR when making a screenshot/video. Here are a couple of screens both with the default settings.

 

[BlindSwordsmanZ]

I don't fully understand why you want screenshots as the XB1s is designed to convert HDR into SDR when making a screenshot/video. Here are a couple of screens both with the default settings.

It's because now we can tell that HDR isn't working on your setup.

 

[Caayn]

It's because now we can tell that HDR isn't working on your setup.

And what can I do to get it working in FH3?

 

[BlindSwordsmanZ]

And what can I do to get it working in FH3?

It sounds like you and imax are having the same problem. I don't have an LG so I can't really say. I think an xbox engineer reached out to imax yesterday so hopefully there will be some new info for you guys.

 

[un1que]

Lg55oled E6

Colours are really washed it for me as well in HDR.
Really hope it's a glitch or something else HDR is really overhyped

 

[ghibli99]

Crazy that stuff looks washed out even on OLED displays. Makes you wonder if test teams were outfitted with proper displays and actually knew what to look out for...

 

[BlindSwordsmanZ]

Crazy that stuff looks washed out even on OLED displays. Makes you wonder if test teams were outfitted with proper displays and actually knew what to look out for...

I can't speak to the LG's but previously in this thread I said that game mode looked "terrible" on my Sony. That was 100% user error on my part so...

 

[iMax]

It's because now we can tell that HDR isn't working on your setup.

If you get a moment and can do the same as Caayn—screenshot of HDR on and off, so we can see the muted colours in a correctly engaged HDR setup, that'd be amazing. Trying to rule out everything I can!

 

[BlindSwordsmanZ]

If you get a moment and can do the same as Caayn—screenshot of HDR on and off, so we can see the muted colours in a correctly engaged HDR setup, that'd be amazing. Trying to rule out everything I can!

No problem I'll do that when I get home tonight.

 

[iMax]

No problem I'll do that when I get home tonight.

Awesome, appreciate that.

 

[guitarguy316]

Lg55oled E6

Colours are really washed it for me as well in HDR.
Really hope it's a glitch or something else HDR is really overhyped

Mine is fine. Post your settings