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Next-gen Racing Graphics Face-off | (Next-gen means current-gen)

Yeah definitely an improvement. In earlier GT games you could definitely push cars but you could never apply any rotational force to them, i.e. attempting a PIT maneuver would just push them to the side instead of spinning them.

I last played 5 and didn't notice much of anything like in those gifs, especially when hitting walls etc so it's a good step

Its one I said I was fine with to play the game cause I like the driving model, but it was an obvbious issue, especially when playing fun arcade games like motorstorm where physics were crazy and fun.
 

rodrigolfp

Haptic Gamepads 4 Life
Final game:

It does have tire flex. I'm not sure where that comes, there's no proof of the contrary and is visible in other cars when you're play and in the dynamic way the tires react.

Cars react like they are 10 tons weight. Plus almost no damage like your gifs show.

There are only visual animations for tire deformation (even Forza 4 has this and yet not even Forza 7 has tire flex physics). There are no physical feedback to the driver. Watch the Inside Sim Racing review.
 

Darkdeus

Member
Edit: Gifs I made are not working. I'll have to post them later.

Here's some screens in the mean time.



36423078842_f16811ea3c_h.jpg


37709431586_5148b3d03e_h.jpg


36527113666_1a114c3a3c_b.jpg
 
There are only visual animations for tire deformation (even Forza 4 has this and yet not even Forza 7 has tire flex physics). There are no physical feedback to the driver. Watch the Inside Sim Racing review.

Forza has had tire flex physics since Forza 4. It's not just a graphical effect.
 

Darkdeus

Member
Pcars 2 definitely has better collisions than the first game. It's no BeamNG but they look much better and the damage is okay at times.

giphy.gif


giphy.gif


giphy.gif


It's scary to crash and flip multiple times in VR!
 

rodrigolfp

Haptic Gamepads 4 Life
Come on, there's no need for the passive aggression. I don't like GT's collision physics either but as with anything there's probably a good reason for it.

I bet there is a good reason and is that they don't have enough competence to create a better damage model like the PC2 one.

I literally showed you a video of GT 5 and it's damage model and I'm sure you know it was patched out.

And I literally showed you that even Grand Prix 2 from 1995 could do more damage than GT5. There is no excuse to keep the game with almost no damage. I am sure they patch is out from GT5 to help with performance issues.
 

Tomeru

Member
I dob't know, damage is the last thing I think about in sims. I try to focus on not damaging the cars, and if I crash I'm bummed that my time suffered or I lost a place. I realky don't care about how my car looks.

I do like it in burnout or nfs though, because it's not impacting performance so much.
 

pixelbox

Member
I bet there is a good reason and is that they don't have enough competence to create a better damage model like the PC2 one.



And I literally showed you that even Grand Prix 2 from 1995 could do more damage than GT5. There is no excuse to keep the game with almost no damage. I am sure they patch is out from GT5 to help with performance issues.

Luxury Vehicle manufacturers do not want their cars to depict damage. For that reason, PD has not invested in extensive damage models until 5. And even then, consumers complained about different models having different levels of damage thus they patched it out.

PD could give a fuck about performance back then. PD chose to uniformity apply the same level of damage for all cars as a means to tighten quality.

If you can't use critical thinking regarding why sims don't depict damage then this conversation is over between you and i.
 

Jamesways

Member
I dob't know, damage is the last thing I think about in sims. I try to focus on not damaging the cars, and if I crash I'm bummed that my time suffered or I lost a place. I realky don't care about how my car looks.

I do like it in burnout or nfs though, because it's not impacting performance so much.
For this ridiculous thread, like tire walls and trees off in the distance, it's super important...
 

rodrigolfp

Haptic Gamepads 4 Life
Luxury Vehicle manufacturers do not want their cars to depict damage. For that reason, PD has not invested in extensive damage models until 5. And even then, consumers complained about different models having different levels of damage thus they patched it out.

PD could give a fuck about performance back then. PD chose to uniformity apply the same level of damage for all cars as a means to tighten quality.

If you can't use critical thinking regarding why sims don't depict damage then this conversation is over between you and i.

Oh sure manufacturers do not want their cars to depict damage yet PC1 and 2, AC, R3E all have damage. Even Forza 7 has some parts flying off. Took out of your ass that sims doesn't decipt damage? Its only PD that doesn't "want" damage.

Quality on a sim = doing a better simulation, and taking off damage = making a worse simulation.

I am loving your, literaly, damage control. And please, show us some non luxury cars on GTS having better damage than on PC2.

I dob't know, damage is the last thing I think about in sims. I try to focus on not damaging the cars, and if I crash I'm bummed that my time suffered or I lost a place. I realky don't care about how my car looks.

I do like it in burnout or nfs though, because it's not impacting performance so much.

I think nobody wants to crash their cars but, you know, shit happens and when it happens, it's nice and imersive seeing some damage.

For this ridiculous thread, like tire walls and trees off in the distance, it's super important...

This is a graphics comparation thread. Visual damage, tire walls, trees = graphic features.
 

pixelbox

Member
Oh sure manufacturers do not want their cars to depict damage yet PC1 and 2, AC, R3E all have damage. Even Forza 7 has some parts flying off. Took out of your ass that sims doesn't decipt damage? Its only PD that doesn't "want" damage.

Quality on a sim = doing a better simulation, and taking off damage = making a worse simulation.

I am loving your, literaly, damage control. And please, show us some non luxury cars on GTS having better damage than on PC2.

Yet most of your videos are non luxury vehicles. You continue to miss the point of PD had it in the past, go5 bitched at and removed extensive damage to certain models all together.

You seemingly do not know what "keeping a unified damage model" means, so please, keep posting F1 cars and very specific manufacturer vehicles.

https://youtu.be/VtkBkfTot_I
 

rodrigolfp

Haptic Gamepads 4 Life
Yet most of your videos are non luxury vehicles. You continue to miss the point of PD had it in the past, go5 bitched at and removed extensive damage to certain models all together.

You seemingly do not know what "keeping a unified damage model" means, so please, keep posting F1 cars and very specific manufacturer vehicles.

Ferrari 458 is non luxury? Audi R8? lol. PD removed damage to keep quality? PC, AC, R3E devs added more and improved the damage to keep quality.

i don't know? No, i don't CARE about keeping unified damage if this means keeping almost or entirely non existing. I care about better damage models.

Keep posting damage control as you can't post real damage on any car on GTS.
 

cooldawn

Member
Oh sure manufacturers do not want their cars to depict damage yet PC1 and 2, AC, R3E all have damage. Even Forza 7 has some parts flying off. Took out of your ass that sims doesn't decipt damage? Its only PD that doesn't "want" damage.

Quality on a sim = doing a better simulation, and taking off damage = making a worse simulation.

I am loving your, literaly, damage control. And please, show us some non luxury cars on GTS having better damage than on PC2.

I think nobody wants to crash their cars but, you know, shit happens and when it happens, it's nice and imersive seeing some damage.

This is a graphics comparation thread. Visual damage, tire walls, trees = graphic features.
I've read your posts on damage and you haven't got a clue what you are talking about. The only thing you point out that's closely resembles anything meaningful is that Gran Turismo and Forza Motorsport are currently way behind other simulators when it comes to presenting damage. The rest though...dribble.

According to you Polyphony Digital doesn't want damage in the Gran Turismo franchise. Now, rewind to 2010, Gran Turismo 5 had a dynamic procedural damage system which was way beyond anything in any other racing game in the sub-genre i.e. simulators. Mechanically it still is way beyond current damage systems. It got removed.

Why did it get removed? As far as I am aware it wasn't because of manufacturers. Although deformation depending on impact and panel fall-off, it did not include any infringement to the driver cabin or a shattered windscreen i.e. still a safe place to be.

However, there was a vocal amount of players not keen on seeing something radical and, mechanically, unrepresentative of crumpling metal or glass. The system was new so it had technical issues and physics calculations that needed to be resolved but players had no patience. It was removed.

I firmly believe players are responsible for it's removal and most probably for the idea to be rested. I can't imagine how good a system like that would look now if Polyphony Digital stopped pandering to the crybabies and just continued to refine it.

Amar, SolidSnake etc...might be able to shed more light on the matter or correct me if I am wrong.

Right now I've not seen a racing game come close to that system yet today most people are pleased with Project CARS 2's implementation, even Forza Motorsport 7's (yes, which is better than Gran Turismo Sport's) when Gran Turismo 5's was in a different league.
 

rodrigolfp

Haptic Gamepads 4 Life
I've read your posts on damage and you haven't got a clue what you are talking about. The only thing you point out that's closely resembles anything meaningful is that Gran Turismo and Forza Motorsport are currently way behind other simulators when it comes to presenting damage. The rest though...dribble.

According to you Polyphony Digital doesn't want damage in the Gran Turismo franchise. Now, rewind to 2010, Gran Turismo 5 had a dynamic procedural damage system which was way beyond anything in any other racing game in the sub-genre i.e. simulators. Mechanically it still is way beyond current damage systems. It got removed.

Why did it get removed? As far as I am aware it wasn't because of manufacturers. Although deformation depending on impact and panel fall-off, it did not include any infringement to the driver cabin or a shattered windscreen i.e. still a safe place to be.

However, there was a vocal amount of players not keen on seeing something radical and, mechanically, unrepresentative of crumpling metal or glass. The system was new so it had technical issues and physics calculations that needed to be resolved but players had no patience. It was removed.

I firmly believe players are responsible for it's removal and most probably for the idea to be rested. I can't imagine how good a system like that would look now if Polyphony Digital stopped pandering to the crybabies and just continued to refine it.

Amar, SolidSnake etc...might be able to shed more light on the matter or correct me if I am wrong.

Right now I've not seen a racing game come close to that system yet today most people are pleased with Project CARS 2's implementation, even Forza Motorsport 7's (yes, which is better than Gran Turismo Sport's) when Gran Turismo 5's was in a different league.

I said they don't want damage in GTS, not the franchise. Learn to read.

Oh and GT5 damage pre patch has still the best damage in sims? So ,post some flying wheels/partys like GP2 or the PC2 Audi R8.

Meanwhile i will post some pre GT5 damage model. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eVHe2hzclB8
 

pixelbox

Member
I've read your posts on damage and you haven't got a clue what you are talking about. The only thing you point out that's closely resembles anything meaningful is that Gran Turismo and Forza Motorsport are currently way behind other simulators when it comes to presenting damage. The rest though...dribble.

According to you Polyphony Digital doesn't want damage in the Gran Turismo franchise. Now, rewind to 2010, Gran Turismo 5 had a dynamic procedural damage system which was way beyond anything in any other racing game in the sub-genre i.e. simulators. Mechanically it still is way beyond current damage systems. It got removed.

Why did it get removed? As far as I am aware it wasn't because of manufacturers. Although deformation depending on impact and panel fall-off, it did not include any infringement to the driver cabin or a shattered windscreen i.e. still a safe place to be.

However, there was a vocal amount of players not keen on seeing something radical and, mechanically, unrepresentative of crumpling metal or glass. The system was new so it had technical issues and physics calculations that needed to be resolved but players had no patience. It was removed.

I firmly believe players are responsible for it's removal and most probably for the idea to be rested. I can't imagine how good a system like that would look now if Polyphony Digital stopped pandering to the crybabies and just continued to refine it.

Amar, SolidSnake etc...might be able to shed more light on the matter or correct me if I am wrong.

Right now I've not seen a racing game come close to that system yet today most people are pleased with Project CARS 2's implementation, even Forza Motorsport 7's (yes, which is better than Gran Turismo Sport's) when Gran Turismo 5's was in a different league.

Appreciate that man, it's been a long time since that debacle. Memory is fuzzy. Hopefully sport will be the turning point of PD following their own path.
 

Apex

Member
Oh sure manufacturers do not want their cars to depict damage yet PC1 and 2, AC, R3E all have damage. Even Forza 7 has some parts flying off. Took out of your ass that sims doesn't decipt damage? Its only PD that doesn't "want" damage.

Quality on a sim = doing a better simulation, and taking off damage = making a worse simulation.

I am loving your, literaly, damage control. And please, show us some non luxury cars on GTS having better damage than on PC2.
http://forum.projectcarsgame.com/sh...ics-question&p=1006929&viewfull=1#post1006929
http://forum.projectcarsgame.com/sh...ics-question&p=1007705&viewfull=1#post1007705
http://forum.projectcarsgame.com/showthread.php?22702-Car-damages&p=889724&viewfull=1#post889724
http://forum.projectcarsgame.com/showthread.php?22702-Car-damages&p=896561&viewfull=1#post896561
http://forum.projectcarsgame.com/showthread.php?22702-Car-damages&p=943696&viewfull=1#post943696
http://forum.projectcarsgame.com/sh...bout-damages&p=1056261&viewfull=1#post1056261
http://forum.projectcarsgame.com/sh...bout-damages&p=1079104&viewfull=1#post1079104
 

Neo 007

Member
@Rodrigolfg Seems to me dude,you need to stay well away from Granturismo.
Whatever you see or experience in game is just going to ruin your day.

Obviously got a "Bug-Bear" with it ...(And thats ok)
So yeah..do yourself a favour and play something you enjoy.

Make sure the door doesn't hit you up-side the head on the way out.
Have a nice day :)
 

pixelbox

Member
@Rodrigolfg Seems to me dude,you need to stay well away from Granturismo.
Whatever you see or experience in game is just going to ruin your day.

Obviously got a "Bug-Bear" with it ...(And thats ok)
So yeah..do yourself a favour and play something you enjoy.

Make sure the door doesn't hit you up-side the head on the way out.
Have a nice day :)

lol


What's your point?
 

Bliman

Banned
Yep, simply the best looking sim out there...

To be honest it isn't a sim.
That's why what Project Cars2 is doing is pretty impressive (especially on PC graphics wise).
If you see what it is doing under the hood is very impressive and ahead of GTS in pretty much any area, simulation related.
Project Cars 2 blowed me away and is I find one of the best racing games I played ever (certainly if you love more the simulation spectrum side).
It still has bugs but it drives so nice with the controller (better then any Forza I have driven) and feels so realistic and is miles apart from Project Cars in that regard. To me it is a must if you love racing and love the sport.
 

pixelbox

Member
To be honest it isn't a sim.
That's why what Project Cars2 is doing is pretty impressive (especially on PC graphics wise).
If you see what it is doing under the hood is very impressive and ahead of GTS in pretty much any area, simulation related.
Project Cars 2 blowed me away and is I find one of the best racing games I played ever (certainly if you love more the simulation spectrum side).
It still has bugs but it drives so nice with the controller (better then any Forza I have driven) and feels so realistic and is miles apart from Project Cars in that regard. To me it is a must if you love racing and love the sport.

Could you explain the differences or is this a gut feeling?
 
There are so many things.
Maybe start here.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hUyqY3WM4Hw

The same guy - who is only one opinion btw and you know what people say about opinions - says in his PC2 first impressions that the two games, PC2 and GTS, are "very very close" when it comes to physics.

FxMafEI.png


Luckily, nobody has to pick between them, especially if you're at this level of analysis you are spending 10x the money on a wheel so can buy all the driving games you like.
 

pixelbox

Member
The same guy - who is only one opinion btw and you know what people say about opinions - says in his PC2 first impressions that the two games, PC2 and GTS, are "very very close" when it comes to physics.

FxMafEI.png


Luckily, nobody has to pick between them, especially if you're at this level of analysis you are spending 10x the money on a wheel so can buy all the driving games you like.

interesting...
 

Darkdeus

Member
Nice shots!! Lighting looks great.

I've almost never heard of anyone who plays the PC sims and the console racing games actually thinking they're on the same level physics wise. Most people play GT and forza for casual fun and they're great for that. None of the pro race drivers actually train on them. You do see pro race teams using rfactor, and other PC race sims to train though.

Anyone who plays something like Automobilista and then plays GT or Forza can instantly tell they're worlds apart in terms of physics fidelity.

That being said GT Academy is probably a good test in regards to finding people with good reactions and hand eye coordination.
 

pixelbox

Member
Nice shots!! Lighting looks great.

I've almost never heard of anyone who plays the PC sims and the console racing games actually thinking they're on the same level physics wise. Most people play GT and forza for casual fun and they're great for that. None of the pro race drivers actually train on them. You do see pro race teams using rfactor, and other PC race sims to train though.

Anyone who plays something like Automobilista and then plays GT or Forza can instantly tell they're worlds apart in terms of physics fidelity.


That being said GT Academy is probably a good test in regards to finding people with good reactions and hand eye coordination.

Idk...racers said theyve used gt.
 

Sebmugi

Member
great job Stillmatic ad guildo, we knew that GT sport would be untouchable on the quality of the modeling and on the natural phtorealistic rendering light, we can say that it is confirmed now :)
 
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