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Is VR dead in the water? (Steam VR game sales / Data Leak)
- Thread starter DynamiteCop!
- Start date
1.21Gigawatts
Banned
I always thought it was still to early for VR. It needs a lot of hardware power and the resolutions framerates aren't where they should be, its also too expensive.
But I think it won't die. It will stay in the shadows until all these problems are eventually fixed.
Eye tracking and subsequently foveated rendering will realize its full potential and will allow 4k+ resolutions while pushing more advanced visuals than what we are used to on PC and consoles.
And then its just a matter of time until the price comes down enough.
But I think it won't die. It will stay in the shadows until all these problems are eventually fixed.
Eye tracking and subsequently foveated rendering will realize its full potential and will allow 4k+ resolutions while pushing more advanced visuals than what we are used to on PC and consoles.
And then its just a matter of time until the price comes down enough.
johntown
Banned
I don't think it is dead. It is just stalled ATM. I use VR on a high end PC (The Rift). I enjoy it for what it is worth but there are a few issues that need to be addressed before it takes off.
1. Comfort - this is the major issue with VR. The headsets are not comfortable to wear for really more than an hour. It can make you nauseous if not done properly at high resolutions and framerates (PSVR should have never been released in its form. It just is not powerful enough).
2. Portability and ease of use - being tied to a cord is not fun and the setup to get it working properly could be easier.
If I had a comfortable headset I could wear for hours and nothing keeping me in my chair I would play VR all day long.
1. Comfort - this is the major issue with VR. The headsets are not comfortable to wear for really more than an hour. It can make you nauseous if not done properly at high resolutions and framerates (PSVR should have never been released in its form. It just is not powerful enough).
2. Portability and ease of use - being tied to a cord is not fun and the setup to get it working properly could be easier.
If I had a comfortable headset I could wear for hours and nothing keeping me in my chair I would play VR all day long.
Solomeena
Banned
Surprise surprise surprise, gaf never changes with the VR IS DEAD bullshit threads. It is going to take years for VR to become mainstream, all the major players have said since day one that it could take years before VR truly takes off. VR is in it's infancy and it will take time to mature but you keep doing you GAF and slinging mud at something you don't want to succeed.
Solomeena
Banned
You have never owned a VR headset in your life, guaranteed. I would like to see your prove that you own a Rift. There is no way in hell that you purchased an expensive as fuck Rift or Vive without having a passion for VR and then just decide to hate it. I could understand that you decided that VR at this time is not for you because of the technology is still limited in what it can do but going from buying a super expensive headset to hating it is just pure BS.
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oxrock
Gravity is a myth, the Earth SUCKS!
Just because VR is not as successful as other more developed systems does not mean that it's dead. Considering the added cost of a VR device on top of a capable pc or console, I think it's amazing that it's doing as well as it is. It's a new medium that's behind a paywall much higher than most gamers are willing/able to scale. So of course the sales numbers are going to be lower. It's something that's going to need to slowly grow with time. The more quality titles that become available, the more value there is in having a VR device. The more the price point drops, the more people who will be willing to take the plunge into VR. Honestly, I don't see how VR will ever truly be dead. People want it, the question is whether or not they can afford it and if technology can live up to their expectations.
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bitbydeath
Member
That’s not true.
We were just told last December that it had sold 2M units in just over a year.
https://www.engadget.com/2017/12/07/sony-sold-2-million-psvr-units-in-over-one-year/
Also this snippet from the same link RE: Games
PSVR is going great.
I’ll hold out for at least PSVR2 though.
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diablos991
Can’t stump the diablos
I swear on my child’s life. Was super excited about VR. Tried my coworkers Kickstarter unit and was still excited thinking it was just that bad due to beta hardware.
Come release day and I try it out and get severe headaches that put me out for a day. Keep trying it after I recover from the sickness thinking I could push through. End up selling the damned thing 2 months post release locally for more than I paid for it.
I was an excited enthusiast and was let down by the terrible image quality and the headaches.
Each time I look into the market I see the developer neglect and the lack of progress on the hardware front. I’m not sad I shelved the idea until a few more generations.
Just because somebody spends a “lot of money” on a toy doesn’t mean they are guaranteed to like it. Hell, I’ve dropped tens of thousands on shit before, decided it wasn’t for me, and sold it. $600 is not much of a risk.
nemiroff
Gold Member
That sucks. It was the CV? I had a similar experience with the DK1 which put me out with sickness for 3-4 days(!). Thought VR was done for me forever after that.. The DK2 was better, but still a little bit uncomfortable at times. The CV1 and the Vive (yeah, I bought both) I can spend hours and hours in without any side effects except a slightly sore neck.
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diablos991
Can’t stump the diablos
Yeah. It was CV. It has happened to me with the Rift and a Vive I tried out. I haven’t even tried PSVR because I know image quality will be even worse and it doesn’t seem worth the effort to track somebody who owns one down.
I have never really been partial to motion sickness or headaches in my life so the VR shitty feeling is very jarring to me and not worth the muddy image.
abracadaver
Member
The leaked stats aren't reliable because they only track games where an achievement has been unlocked.
H3VR for example has sold over 100.000 copies and not 9700...
H3VR for example has sold over 100.000 copies and not 9700...
cryptoadam
Banned
Its like 3D. Expensive TV + buying glasses + buying Blu ray player.
VR now requires expensive PC (or console) + expensive head set.
VR won't take off until streaming gaming comes along and untethers the VR headset from the need to buy a console of PC.
The advantages of VR at its cost ($$$ and set up time) is just not worth it to the general consumer. Too much of an investment to game for little return. I am sure there are good VR games but nothing that makes you go I gotta play this. There is no GTA or PUBG or Fortnite for VR yet.
IMO for VR to take off its gotta be like RPO. A self contained headset that you just put on your head and start gaming.
VR now requires expensive PC (or console) + expensive head set.
VR won't take off until streaming gaming comes along and untethers the VR headset from the need to buy a console of PC.
The advantages of VR at its cost ($$$ and set up time) is just not worth it to the general consumer. Too much of an investment to game for little return. I am sure there are good VR games but nothing that makes you go I gotta play this. There is no GTA or PUBG or Fortnite for VR yet.
IMO for VR to take off its gotta be like RPO. A self contained headset that you just put on your head and start gaming.
frogger
Member
Add Kinect to the list.PSVR joins PS Vita, Wii U, Move, Jaguar, 32X, 3DO, Virtual Boy
It was not long for this world
ickythingz
Banned
It's a niche tech for now that is only growing. People need to to start understanding business. If you think a product only has a future if it sells billions upon billions of units a day I have some eye opening news for you. VR is fine. For those of us able to afford the experience we have a great time. For those of you unable jump in, yes, you are missing out, but you will soon know VR as well down the road. Let those of us who want to carry the industry do it. We will bring it to the masses eventually.
No reason for doom and gloom threads. Look at the tech with a wider scope and it will be clear to you VR is going nowhere but up.
No reason for doom and gloom threads. Look at the tech with a wider scope and it will be clear to you VR is going nowhere but up.
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theviolenthero
Member
The fact that PSVR (the best selling headset) only managed to get around 2 million of the 80 million PS4 owners to buy in after 18 months on the market is a huge red flag especially when you consider they've had official price drops down to $200 for it.
Those are way worse numbers than the Vita or Wii U. It's been a flat out flop and that's just the reality BUT i do not think it's "dead in the water".
Those are way worse numbers than the Vita or Wii U. It's been a flat out flop and that's just the reality BUT i do not think it's "dead in the water".
GTR R35_Supra RZ
Banned
Zero interest, not gonna happen. It just wouldn't stick for long...Only PC crowd gets in defensive mode, other than that it ain't going nowhere.
Kadayi
Banned
I think in large part a lot depends on how low they can push the price point, and how accessible they can make it to the average consumer. VR has much greater potential beyond the confines of games as a means to put you vicariously into another space real or otherwise. Whether that be in a virtual cinema, porn (which is already a thing) or base jumping off the Burj Khalifa etc.
Phoenix RISING
Banned
Perhaps generation 2, we will see prices in the $200-$300 range.
VindicatorZ
Member
It's not dead at all. Big games coming for Oculus and PSVR soon. People need to be patient and wait for the next gen. VR is just getting started and everyone knew it would take time.
RokkanStoned
Member
Definitely going to invest in VR, but been a bit busy at the moment and I always feel a bit of guilt splurging on myself and not saving money, so I've mostly avoided it, especially with my graphics card suddenly dying and me needing to buy a new one. If I get a really good deal on the Rift I might buy one this summer. I mean, porn and games, that itself should justify the purchase.
Do Make Say Think
Banned
It was a huge step forward in terms of tech so even if the adoption rate was low progress made was still significant. We aren't there yet but we got closer.
However I think we also need to consider that VR might not be as mass appeal as we first thought it might be.
However I think we also need to consider that VR might not be as mass appeal as we first thought it might be.
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DynamiteCop!
Banned
It's pretty simple really PSVR CUH-ZVR1 does not support HDR pass-through, CUH-ZVR2 does. The SKU is located directly on the bottom of the box right below the UPC barcode.
Lionel Richie
Member
It's too early, this will never be big until wearing it doesn't make you look like something our of Serial Experiments Lain.
Hotel Security
Member
Of course it's dead and for the same reason that any console dies...lack of quality games. This is the prevailing #1 selling point of any new console and, simply put, a large majority of VR games suck and feel like demos at best. Plus a ton of people just don't want to wear a fucking helmet to play games (folks didn't even want to wear 3D glasses) and, apparently the motion sickness effects a lot of people and limits playing time. And most parents may be wary about their kids using it so that severely cuts up your potential buyers since the 30+ crowd ain't carrying a console on their own. PSVR probably had the best chance of working since it's partly with the PS4 already and is the cheapest but even those games aren't worth it at all.
Combine that with the insane costs, the inconvenience of creating a "playing area" and the fact that most people are not PC-savvy enough to run them then, yes, this was inevitable. I don't know why every gaming publication was acting like this was the next big thing when it was very obvious that there wouldn't be any decent games for it.
Maybe in a few years when the consoles are cheaper and it's inexpensive enough to make entire games that match up to the regular ones...plus they'll have to find a way to do it without the cumbersome helmet...it'll never get big if that's a requirement. But until then, likely not.
Combine that with the insane costs, the inconvenience of creating a "playing area" and the fact that most people are not PC-savvy enough to run them then, yes, this was inevitable. I don't know why every gaming publication was acting like this was the next big thing when it was very obvious that there wouldn't be any decent games for it.
Maybe in a few years when the consoles are cheaper and it's inexpensive enough to make entire games that match up to the regular ones...plus they'll have to find a way to do it without the cumbersome helmet...it'll never get big if that's a requirement. But until then, likely not.
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Red Crayon Aristocrat
Member
It's not dead or going away, right now it's simply too expensive for most people (it's too expensive for me, that's for sure)
But as the technology gets better and cheaper it'll get more popular, smartphones took a while from the introduction of the iphone in 2007 to become ubiquitous like they are now.
I think the 2020s are going to be when VR really takes off.
But as the technology gets better and cheaper it'll get more popular, smartphones took a while from the introduction of the iphone in 2007 to become ubiquitous like they are now.
I think the 2020s are going to be when VR really takes off.
diablos991
Can’t stump the diablos
I believe the problem is the data is being misconstrued as sales data when in reality it is more accurate as gameplay data.
This is more about how many people played the games rather than how many bought them.
Wolfgang Jr
Banned
Well, fads usually don't last very long. Remember the tramp stamp?
Elenchus
Banned
Well since you typically can’t do one without the other it’s probably a pretty good indication.
In any event, VR is certainly not booming and I’ve yet to hear its defenders explain how or why they expect it to grow given its current state.
The promise of better VR hardware “someday” is supposed to convince publishers to invest millions today in AAA VR games to bring the audience VR has failed to build to date?
Good luck with that.
metareferential
Member
Another day another "vr is dead" thread.
Great games keep coming out, big franchises are getting their first VR game (even though it's just a "mod" for the time being), the hardware is still rather expensive, yet here we are discussing it's supposed death.
VR is here to stay. Because yes. You can hate on something else, or, for a change, learn that something you don't like might be enjoyed by others. The market is big enough for everyone.
I wonder how many of the drive by comments "it was always dead" and similar are by people who actually have tried VR. And maybe something a little more sophisticated than mobile VR.
Great games keep coming out, big franchises are getting their first VR game (even though it's just a "mod" for the time being), the hardware is still rather expensive, yet here we are discussing it's supposed death.
VR is here to stay. Because yes. You can hate on something else, or, for a change, learn that something you don't like might be enjoyed by others. The market is big enough for everyone.
I wonder how many of the drive by comments "it was always dead" and similar are by people who actually have tried VR. And maybe something a little more sophisticated than mobile VR.
Pretty much. Sour grapes.
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Fox Mulder
Member
The people that love it probably reeeaaly love it.
It's still too expensive, cumbersome, and junky ass games for everyone else. The technology will be there eventually.
It's still too expensive, cumbersome, and junky ass games for everyone else. The technology will be there eventually.
AndrewRyan
Member
Surprised this is from someone with a Vive. Motion gaming and room-scale are some of my favorite things about VR. If you could only play sitting down with a standard controller that would eliminate half the games and wouldn't be worth it IMO.
Price is the main problem. Only around 30% of Steam users even have a VR capable PC so it's a major ask to upgrade one that already works as well as a headset just to play VR.
Second is the hassle factor of getting in the game. Just getting a Vive headstrap with the built-in speakers helps immensely by eliminating the extra wires and speeding up the time to start a game. Especially if there's a setup issue like sound output.
No way VR is a fad or dies off anytime soon. It provides an amazing experience you can't get anywhere else and it's not like it prevents you from playing regular games.
DynamiteCop!
Banned
And what say you to someone who owns it and realizes exactly the precarious and disappointing position it currently sits in? Criticism isn't hate by the way, it's the observation and recognition of a problem.
Two Pikachus
Member
Work on your messaging, my dude. We're sick of hearing about how it's supposedly dead. We don't need you to muddy the water with sensationalist thread titles. Voice your criticisms, sure. I have a few myself. But this weak-ass shit is best left to people who get paid for clickbait, eh?
PerezDeCorcho
Member
It's bound to go mainstream at some point. I think it's a little foolish to say otherwise.
HagglesworthMD
Member
Welcome to Neogaf, home to such predictions as: the Wii will fail, Guitar Hero won’t sell more than a few thousand copies, Lawbreakers will be a smash hit & Hillary will win the Election.
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metareferential
Member
I wasn't specifically talking about you or your views. I referred to those drive-by comments "it's dead".
But since you ask: criticism is welcome, especially so if people expressing it actually know what they're talking about. I'd argue that PSVR isn't really the best way to experience VR, but it sure has games that should make abundantly clear why the tech is here to stay.
I mean, RE7 VR is one of the best games, and it doesn't even fully use the tech.
The problem with a lot of these doom and gloom threads is that everyone confuses VR for a single platform, like a console.
It is not. It's an open standard, it's a new tech (a new medium even?). It doesn't need a killer app, because VR is the killer app. It just needs time to get better and cheaper (no, those stand alone headsets aren't there yet).
Once we can get Vive-level of quality, wirelessly, for cheap, things will get interesting.
In the meantime, you can already play many remarkable games, that just don't (and can't) exist outside of VR.
Elenchus
Banned
Yea just like the Vita or the Kinect right? These things do not happen on their own. The stakeholders either bring the goods or they don’t. VR is not going anywhere without compelling software and we just went through another E3 with no significant announcements.
PSVR was supposed to lead the way but Sony barely promoted Farpoint and the game ended up selling poorly as a result. If Sony is not making real games or even paying to promote what’s coming I don’t see how PSVR pulls more people in and Oculus and Vive price too many people out.
Hell was there even a thread for Farpoint on GAF? I don’t recall much hype for that game and I don’t see many VR threads here. It’s not looking good. That assessment may anger some but it’s an honest outlook given the facts.
wondermega
Member
There was a decently-sized Farpoint GAF thread! Actually it convinced me to buy the game, and very glad I did. Boo on Sony for not releasing enough Aim stock at launch, but I guess they had their reasons (thought they were sending it to die maybe?) Actually I would be quite interested to know how their higher-ups feel about the PSVR investment, as a company, at this point. It had it's moment in the sun and is kind of quiet for a long time now, the whole thing feels more than a little bit like it is on life-support. I guess maybe they are waiting for it to burn itself out, otherwise just letting it sit out there as a curiosity to see where it will go (which doesn't sound like anything any decent-sized company would do in this day and age). We'll see.
I did check out the PSVR booth at E3 and was pleasantly surprised - maybe it was a fair amount "for show" but considering how quite things have been, I was expecting far less. So following this year (and last year's E3) I can't say it's a completely grim prognosis. Definitely stunted though.
As for VR in general, as someone who has been working in and around that splinter of the industry for some time now, I can say it is definitely stalled (at least) but not exactly sinking and certainly not about to die. I think the people who have arguments in that favor bring up very good points (price, putting something on your head, lack of software) and the overall interest and money is simply not there yet. But I can say that the match has been struck, it's just a slow burn. I am fine with this, what we have for now is definitely interesting (good - not GREAT - product comes out every year) and it's still finding it's footing. It will come, but it's far from being a (literal) game-changer in the fashion that many had hyped it to be. At least, not for a long while.
OldBoyGamer
Banned
As much as I love VR I just can't see where it can go from here.
Amazing tech that can do amazing things - things far beyond most people's imaginations. But it has a couple of serious shortfalls that stop it from making the leap into mainstream tech.
Wearable tech - headers are uncomfortable and clunky. Even Google's daydream became hot and uncomfortable after about 30 mins.
Motion Sickness. Until they fix this VR can only really be those little experiences like diving in a shark cage or standing on the spot and doing something.
Both of those things need development time so we'll see.
My personal take is that it will diss ape are for a few more years and return when those things have been solved.
Amazing tech that can do amazing things - things far beyond most people's imaginations. But it has a couple of serious shortfalls that stop it from making the leap into mainstream tech.
Wearable tech - headers are uncomfortable and clunky. Even Google's daydream became hot and uncomfortable after about 30 mins.
Motion Sickness. Until they fix this VR can only really be those little experiences like diving in a shark cage or standing on the spot and doing something.
Both of those things need development time so we'll see.
My personal take is that it will diss ape are for a few more years and return when those things have been solved.
Dontero
Banned
Do you see yourself playing few hours standing like a fool in small room, waggling controlers all the time ? Where is your stamina for that ?
Because that is the issue. It killed Wii motion gaming and VR by my experience is not in better situation.
magnumpy
Member
it's not dead, it's undead. it's long been that way, ever since the nintendo virtual boy and actually long before that.
it's been dying for many years and it will continue to die for years to come in the future. look at the pimax8k and the occulus rift half dome prototype. many years of virtual reality content is still to come
it's been dying for many years and it will continue to die for years to come in the future. look at the pimax8k and the occulus rift half dome prototype. many years of virtual reality content is still to come