Support NeoGAF

[MightySquirrel]

Oh boy. I hope that really nobody expects for amd to suddenly release an APU that is as powerful as this power hungry vega refresh that is already on 7nm process.........

What this card clearly shows us that you can't expect next gen consoles [both ps5 and xbox] to be as powerful as a top card from 2017. I predicted 1080 performance for next gen - it seems that I might be totally on point.

 

[Leonidas]

We'll see. You're probably underestimating how much as an individual enthusiast consumer, that you're overpaying for PC parts.

This isnt NAVI like ps5 either.

I've never posted my specs and what I paid but here goes.
Ryzen 1700x - $150
RX 580(before selling it) - $180 with choice of 2 out of 3 games

Some people may be overpaying but I don't feel that I am. And you're right, Vega isn't Navi. Vega is high end. Navi is mid-range.

 

[CuNi]

I've never posted my specs and what I paid but here goes.
Ryzen 1700x - $150
RX 580(before selling it) - $180 with 3 free games

Some people may be overpaying but I don't feel that I am. And you're right, Vega isn't Navi. Vega is high end. Navi is mid-range.

From "Half-Whale" to "Half-Whale"..
I already gave up arguing and all I can do is to suggest you to do the same.

 

[JohnnyFootball]

Maybe for 4k and 1440p it can bottleneck, but i really doubt anything at 1080p can bottleneck a 8gb card

How many people are buying the expensive cards for 1080p gaming? It's kind of a moot point.

 

[MightySquirrel]

So, 9900К cost around 45К RUB here and I excpect Ryzen equivalent to cost between 38 to 40К (maybe slightly more). Now, even though 5-7К less (if well get extremely lucky) is kind of good and cheaper than 9900К, even at that price I just don't see myself buying ~40К CPU, I just freakin' can't. Furtermore, non X version of the same CPU for ~33-35К for example is also out of question cuz that means it is better to buy 8700K which'll be more that enough for gaming for at least 5 or even more years. Ugh, I know that it's kinda unrealistic to expect much more competative prices from AMD.... but damn, fuck no for 40K CPU.

I'm still waiting for 3700 and still wanna be optimistic. I mean Ryzen 7 2700 is fantastically priced!, so I really hope AMD cpu division won't go nuts as their gpu div.

 

[Imtjnotu]

So is this gpu Navi or Vega based?

 

[CuNi]

How many people are buying the expensive cards for 1080p gaming? It's kind of a moot point.

I would. I prefer FPS over resolution. No use in owning a 144Hz monitor if all I want is to have everything maxed out at only 80 to 100 fps.

 

[Caayn]

So is this gpu Navi or Vega based?

Vega20

 

[Chozofication_]

I've never posted my specs and what I paid but here goes.
Ryzen 1700x - $150
RX 580(before selling it) - $180 with 3 free games

Some people may be overpaying but I don't feel that I am. And you're right, Vega isn't Navi. Vega is high end. Navi is mid-range.

Oh I thought you said you valued RT and dlss, so I assumed you had a rt card.

Then no you didn't overpay, but that missed my point anyways. Every PC part you can buy is going to cost Sony a lot less than you paid because of bulk buying and contracts. Not to mention they're just buying a chip, not a shroud/card. You're charged a premium ; Sony and ms are not.

Navi has power consumption and architectural improvements that this RVII does not have because its essentially a die shrunk vega 64.

 

[Imtjnotu]

Vega20

Thanks. Was hoping to see some Navi tech today. Oh well. PS5 2020

 

[JohnnyFootball]

I would. I prefer FPS over resolution. No use in owning a 144Hz monitor if all I want is to have everything maxed out at only 80 to 100 fps.

The 2080 is for the most part performing even beyond the 144Hz at 1080p in competitive games. You could easily get a cheaper video card and perform well enough.

 

[CrustyBritches]

I thought Digital Foundry tested the PS4 and PS4 Pro with the same game(1080p and 4k, respectively) and found around 150W total system power consumption on each? The link lists this GPU at "300W?". Seems like a $700, 300W GPU would be out of the question for a $399 Next Xbox and PS5, or am I missing the joke?

 

[CuNi]

Oh I thought you said you valued RT and dlss, so I assumed you had a rt card.

Then no you didn't overpay, but that missed my point anyways. Every PC part you can buy is going to cost Sony a lot less than you paid because of bulk buying and contracts. Not to mention they're just buying a chip, not a shroud/card. You're charged a premium ; Sony and ms are not.

Navi has power consumption and architectural improvements that this RVII does not have because its essentially a die shrunk vega 64.

Saying "You're charged a premium" is so blatantly ignorant. How can you say we are charged a premium if that is the standard and the big companies only pay less because of the amount they buy and because of other deals. Paying a premium would be this gold covered RAM because it serves no real purpose than looks. That's what paying a premium is. Also, what you ignore completely is the fact that consoles have a way smaller form factor and have way more issues when it comes to handling the head with their cooling. Why do you think are the chips when compared to their PC brothers always underclocked?
Ofc they get more performance out of consoles when compared to PC, but that's because dev's can optimize the hell out of consoles since specs are locked, which isn't the case on PC. But still, PC will always be at least a mile ahead of consoles in every point in time.

The 2080 is for the most part performing even beyond the 144Hz at 1080p in competitive games. You could easily get a cheaper video card and perform well enough.

I prefer to get 1 card every 5-6 Years than go through the hassle of upgrading every 2-3 years. Last GPU I bought was the 970 and before that the 570. Hoped current cards wouldn't be so ridiculously expensive.

 

[Chozofication_]

Saying "You're charged a premium" is so blatantly ignorant. How can you say we are charged a premium if that is the standard and the big companies only pay less because of the amount they buy and because of other deals. Paying a premium would be this gold covered RAM because it serves no real purpose than looks. That's what paying a premium is. Also, what you ignore completely is the fact that consoles have a way smaller form factor and have way more issues when it comes to handling the head with their cooling. Why do you think are the chips when compared to their PC brothers always underclocked?
Ofc they get more performance out of consoles when compared to PC, but that's because dev's can optimize the hell out of consoles since specs are locked, which isn't the case on PC. But still, PC will always be at least a mile ahead of consoles in every point in time.



I prefer to get 1 card every 5-6 Years than go through the hassle of upgrading every 2-3 years. Last GPU I bought was the 970 and before that the 570. Hoped current cards wouldn't be so ridiculously expensive.

Why are you getting upset lol. Whether I say you're charged a premium vs. Sony or they get a discount... My point is the same!

I never said if you're a pc gamer, then you're dumb.

But I do think its stupid to happily buy these ever growing more expensive cards for less performance than you used to get.

 

[Makariel]

Waiting for benchmarks, I'm curious if the 16 GB make any difference or just a high cost element they could go without?

 

[Mr. Tobias Rieper]

good news

 

[Von Hugh]

good news

Not so good for PS5.

 

[SonGoku]

I was expecting better price/performance than 1080 Ti at launch.

Well this is just Vega no? Its their take of a familiar arch on a new process to get a grip on yields
This will go head to toe against the RTX 2080 in 4k games while being cheaper

Why are you so negative on amd gpus, im more of a Nvidia fan than amd yet i still root for amd because it will benefit us all

Not so good for PS5.

This is not the arch that will go on consoles
What exites me its 1TB/s HBM memory, if they could get that on consoles

 

[Airbus Jr]

Not so good for PS5.

Why not so good?

Assuming Navi is the console version of Radeon VII and deliver similar results this is more than double the Xbox One X perfomance and X is already doing great right now to deliver 4K entertainment

 

[SonGoku]

Maybe for 4k and 1440p it can bottleneck, but i really doubt anything at 1080p can bottleneck a 8gb card

Most people who buy a rtx 2080 will play at higher resolutions than 1080p

Why not so good?
Assuming Navi is the console version of Radeon VII and deliver similar results this is more than double the Xbox One X perfomance and X is already doing ok right now to deliver 4K entertainment

This level of performance would be phenomenal, only thing is it needs at least 24GB memory

 

[Airbus Jr]

Most people who buy a rtx 2080 will play at higher resolutions than 1080p

This level of performance would be phenomenal, only thing is it needs at least 24GB memory

True

Edit I was wrong about Radeon VII

This is still a Vega card, Navi is coming in July

 

[LOLCats]

gonna be rad once the prices drop and AIB cards available.

 

[Von Hugh]

Why not so good?

Assuming Navi is the console version of Radeon VII and deliver similar results this is more than double the Xbox One X perfomance and X is already doing great right now to deliver 4K entertainment

Did you miss the fact that this costs $699?

 

[Leonidas]

Well this is just Vega no? Its their take of a familiar arch on a new process to get a grip on yields
This will go head to toe against the RTX 2080 in 4k games while being cheap

Why are you so negative on amd gpus, im more of a Nvidia fan than amd yet i still root for amd because it will benefit us all

I'm not negative I just like good products. Ryzen good, Radeon bad, until they prove otherwise. I won't be waiting on Navi though, but I will be happy if they finally release a good GPU in late 2019/2020.

 

[SonGoku]

Edit I was wrong about Radeon VII

This is still a Vega card, Navi is coming in July

Which makes it all the more impressive

I'm not negative I just like good products. Ryzen good, Radeon bad, until they prove otherwise. I won't be waiting on Navi though, but I will be happy if they finally release a good GPU in late 2019/2020.

I agree thats why im choose nvidia even with its premium
But why have such a negative outlook? its almost as if you want them to do bad

Did you miss the fact that this costs $699?

Well this is still an old arch, plus profits plus early yields

 

[gspat]

My take on this is that they had some binned chips they couldn't use for their instinct cards, and they threw them in this to get rid of them.

This is still Vega. Even if they said it's for gaming, and it looks to be great for that, the target market is definitely scientific/content creation.

I can see the price dropping within 60-90 days

I'm hoping for Navi announcements around March/April.

I thought the new ryzen vs 9900 was a cool watch, wonder what the fully clocked chips can do?

 

[Leonidas]

I agree thats why im choose nvidia even with its premium
But why have such a negative outlook? its almost as if you want them to do bad

Want them to do great but disappointment after disappointment made me lose hope in them a while ago. If they put out a great GPU late this year or next year I'll be very happy. But we're back to waiting, again...
I just want a great GPU, that's why I'm glad Intel will be releasing a GPU in a year or two so there will be even more competition. I've given AMD a chance recently with RX 580 but was disappointed. I too will end up going with Nvidia this generation as they at least offer more performance at the same cost with 2060/2070.

 

[Chozofication_]

Want them to do great but disappointment after disappointment made me lose hope in them a while ago. If they put out a great GPU late this year or next year I'll be very happy. But we're back to waiting, again...
I just want a great GPU, that's why I'm glad Intel will be releasing a GPU in a year or two so there will be even more competition. I've given AMD a chance recently with RX 580 but was disappointed. I too will end up going with Nvidia this generation as they at least offer more performance at the same cost with 2060/2070.

Why were you disappointed in the 580? It's a great card for 1080p. Better than 1060 in a lot of titles.

 

[shark sandwich]

If you care about RTX features (raytracing, DLSS), 2080 is worth the $100 premium over Radeon VII.

If you don’t, 1080 TI gets you the same performance w/lower power consumption for roughly the same price as Radeon VII.

The only people who would want this card are maybe some “prosumers” who also do some gaming. Otherwise stick with RTX or wait for Navi.

 

[ethomaz]

It is a great launch if it was not 7nm.

Why? Well the chip is in 7nm and if it can only go that then AMD still have serious issues with their cards and they will pobably stay in the mid-range again.

With 7nm AMD should be delivering 2080 TI power with close the half of size (that affect price) and power drawn.

AMD launched a card that delivery in every sense what you expect from the actual 16/14/12nm.

Navi needs to have drastic changes.

 

[GermanZepp]

Is this good?

My man...

 

[SonGoku]

If you care about RTX features (raytracing, DLSS), 2080 is worth the $100 premium over Radeon VII.

If you don’t, 1080 TI gets you the same performance w/lower power consumption for roughly the same price as Radeon VII.

The only people who would want this card are maybe some “prosumers” who also do some gaming. Otherwise stick with RTX or wait for Navi.

If you want to play at higher than 1080p AMD has the better product

It is a great launch if it was not 7nm.

Why? Well the chip is in 7nm and if it can only go that then AMD still have serious issues with their cards and they will pobably stay in the mid-range again.

With 7nm AMD should be delivering 2080 TI power with close the half of size (that affect price) and power drawn.

AMD launched a card that delivery in every sense what you expect from the actual 16/14/12nm.

But this is an old arch with the same ole CU limit

 

[gspat]

It is a great launch if it was not 7nm.

Why? Well the chip is in 7nm and if it can only go that then AMD still have serious issues with their cards and they will pobably stay in the mid-range again.

With 7nm AMD should be delivering 2080 TI power with close the half of size (that affect price) and power drawn.

AMD launched a card that delivery in every sense what you expect from the actual 16/14/12nm.

Why would you expect that?

 

[ethomaz]

Why would you expect that?

Why should I not expect 7nm to delivery 7nm? If 7nm delivery what you have with 16nm then why 7nm?

Like I said for the consumer it will be a great launch.

But technically it is subpar.

 

[JohnnyFootball]

The number one is issue with AMD is hope and expectations. People have high hopes for AMD products and those hopes become expectations and AMD is absolutely abysmal and terrible at managing them. You see these leaks that get reported on major sites and everyone makes them their expectations. Once those expectations aren't meet, people feel jaded even if they deliver something that isn't too bad. Take Ryzen from two years ago, the Ryzen was an excellent value and performer just not as good as Intel at that time, when developers were still focusing on 4 cores/8 threads. Some people (due to fake leaks) had the expectation that Ryzen was going to come in a demolish Intel and when it didn't happen, despite being very good, people were disappointed. I expected a Vega 2 card, but did not expect $699.

Now that has changed for Ryzen and people feel its a great CPU now that software developers are starting to utilize more cores.

Where AMD really and I mean really blew it is that they didn't get out and squash the performance and price rumors. They ignored them while others sites reported them and people (unfairly or not) began to believe there was some validity to them

 

[gspat]

If you care about RTX features (raytracing, DLSS), 2080 is worth the $100 premium over Radeon VII.

If you don’t, 1080 TI gets you the same performance w/lower power consumption for roughly the same price as Radeon VII.

The only people who would want this card are maybe some “prosumers” who also do some gaming. Otherwise stick with RTX or wait for Navi.

Your perspective is interesting...

I'm not sure I get why everyone is referencing the 1080ti?

It seems it's bad for AMD to make a card that's 1080ti level 2 years later, but it's OK for Nvidia to do the exact same thing but charge an extra 100 bucks MSRP?

Where's the hate for that?

 

[Leonidas]

Why were you disappointed in the 580? It's a great card for 1080p. Better than 1060 in a lot of titles.

I had a 1060 previously that had similar performance but was much quieter and had overclocking headroom. RX 580 was very loud even after undervolt.

RX 580 also triggered OCP in my PSU. My PSU was faulty but I never would have known it if I stuck with GTX 1060 so I guess I should thank AMD for using more power which lead me to troubleshoot that issue I guess. That's the only good thing that came out of me owning RX 580(that and the 2 free games).

 

[gspat]

Why should I not expect 7nm to delivery 7nm? If 7nm delivery what you have with 16nm then why 7nm?

Like I said for the consumer it will be a great launch.

But technically it is subpar.

No, I do expect 7nm to deliver 7nm, but why do you expect that much from it? Most people expect ~15% improvements tops. You seem to be expecting much much more than that.

 

[JohnnyFootball]

If you care about RTX features (raytracing, DLSS), 2080 is worth the $100 premium over Radeon VII.

If you don’t, 1080 TI gets you the same performance w/lower power consumption for roughly the same price as Radeon VII.

The only people who would want this card are maybe some “prosumers” who also do some gaming. Otherwise stick with RTX or wait for Navi.

You're talking like it's two months ago when 1080 Tis were still readily available and had their best prices at around $500 - $600. But those have LONG since sold out and you will not find one for a reasonable price anymore. Same with the regular 1080s. They are long gone. If you want 1080 Ti performance the 2080 is your only option.

The 1080 Ti is not really a valid option for most people unless you can get a good second hand one.

 

[ethomaz]

No, I do expect 7nm to deliver 7nm, but why do you expect that much from it? Most people expect ~15% improvements tops. You seem to be expecting much much more than that.

Probably because AMD said their 7nm was expected to double the density and 40% more performance vs 14nm.

 

[shark sandwich]

Your perspective is interesting...

I'm not sure I get why everyone is referencing the 1080ti?

It seems it's bad for AMD to make a card that's 1080ti level 2 years later, but it's OK for Nvidia to do the exact same thing but charge an extra 100 bucks MSRP?

Where's the hate for that?

? Nvidia got TONS of hate for their RTX pricing. And Radeon VII is just as bad or arguably worse value-wise.

 

[Chozofication_]

I had a 1060 previously that had similar performance but was much quieter and had overclocking headroom. RX 580 was very loud even after undervolt.

RX 580 also triggered OCP in my PSU. My PSU was faulty but I never would have known it if I stuck with GTX 1060 so I guess I should thank AMD for using more power which lead me to troubleshoot that issue I guess. That's the only good thing that came out of me owning RX 580(that and the 2 free games).

Hmm yeah power consumption is an issue with AMD for sure, maybe navi changes this.

That is one thing I give Nvidia credit for.

 

[TyphoonStruggle]

Price is too high.

2080 can already be had for about $650

 

[gspat]

? Nvidia got TONS of hate for their RTX pricing. And Radeon VII is just as bad or arguably worse value-wise.

Not nearly the same level as AMD is getting, and people are still choosing to buy the 2080.

 

[gspat]

Price is too high.

2080 can already be had for about $650

Only the cheaper chips that can't OC as well.

 

[SonGoku]

Probably because AMD said their 7nm was expected to double the density and 40% more performance vs 14nm.

But this is old arch wit cu limit, infact it has fewer cu than vega

 

[gspat]

Probably because AMD said their 7nm was expected to double the density and 40% more performance vs 14nm.

Was that before or after they dialed it back a couple months ago?

 

[ethomaz]

But this is old arch wit cu limit, infact it has fewer cu than vega

Arch should not be affected by die shrink.

We are talking about improvements only in the shrink process not new arch.

New arch add more improvements over what you get with a new process.

 

[Shin]

I wonder if they went with 700 because of the naming scheme...
The 25% is normal for the shift to 7nm, that's around the figure TSMC and GloFo put out when they were still in risk production.

 

[bitbydeath]

Did you miss the fact that this costs $699?

By the time the new Xbox is released 2020/2021 it should be much cheaper.
Plus MS can subsidise the cost by purchasing in bulk.
New consoles will be in the 7nm range so this meets the bill.
Not to mention MS are talking about their partnership with AMD the same time this was announced.

https://twinfinite.net/2019/01/xbox...ut-partnership-with-amd-for-future-platforms/

They'll likely modify it a bit more for better/worse. (Hopefully better)