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[Saruhashi]

I can't understand people that make sexuality the main aspect of their identity.
I really think your sexuality should be your own personal business.
But when people focus on only that aspect of themselves it starts to become a bit strange and obnoxious.

Having a video character whose identity is based around their sexuality is no different.
It is just so unimportant and can only be seen as a forced way to garner free publicity and support.
So it is no surprise people are rolling their eyes at these recent reveals. Generic video game soldier #12345 being gay or straight has literally no effect on the games whatsoever.

Most people do make it a big aspect of their identity though.

Just the fact that the vast majority of people are straight means it's just assumed for most people.

Look, imagine you start a new job and you are joining a team of, say, 10 people. I am gonna guess that by the end of the first week you will roughly know the relationship status of most of those people. Especially, if I may be so bold, the women.

Now, "my husband and I watched that Bird Box movie on Netflix last night" might not exactly be screaming "I AM STRAIGHT" but it's there.
"I have two kids, ages 3 and 5, and my wife stays at home to take care of them". Again, it's not overt but it IS there.

Dudes get asked ALL THE TIME "do you have a girlfriend".
Women get the same but it's "do you have a boyfriend".

Relationship status is a pretty bit aspect of MANY people's identities.
Some lads, all they ever go on about is their wife and kids.

The thing is that with most people being straight we don't see these open declarations of relationship status and, by extension, sexuality as all that remarkable.

So when a man replies "I don't have a girlfriend but I'm planning on marrying my boyfriend next year" he is completely bucking the trend by default.
So in that new job with that new group of 10 people the gay guy is almost already condemned to be defined by his sexuality.

In some ways it's not them making this a main aspect of their identity. It's us.
Yet when they embrace that and accept it we turn around and say "why is this the main aspect of your identity".

For a large chunk of the population, when asked to define themselves, relationship status, family status etc is basically their defining attribute. You participate in a "tell us a bit about yourself" in work and mostly all you'll hear about is husbands and wives and children.

So when someone is outside of that societal norm it's kind of obvious that this will be a main part of their identity.
If anything it's what makes them stand out from the majority.

And, dude, I bet you it's fucking DAUNTING to be sat in that circle when Mary the Manager says "I married my husband last year" and John the Project Leader says "I've been with the wife 10 years and we have 2 kids" and the other new start says "Hi I'm Karen and I'm single but looking for a nice man" and then it's your turn and you're wondering if you even should mention you are in a same sex marriage or relationship.

 

[DonF]

Prophet ...yeah...he gay.

 

[betrayal]

And, dude, I bet you it's fucking DAUNTING to be sat in that circle when Mary the Manager says "I married my husband last year" and John the Project Leader says "I've been with the wife 10 years and we have 2 kids" and the other new start says "Hi I'm Karen and I'm single but looking for a nice man" and then it's your turn and you're wondering if you even should mention you are in a same sex marriage or relationship.

Of course you should say that. If you want something to be normal, than don't act like you do something weird. By doing this you actively pushing gays into the "that's not normal and we're not like you" corner.

There is no advantage for not being honest in this situation. The only thing that keep people from coming out and saying the truth is that they're lacking the confidence to represent their own life. You did not draw the picture of a typical situation for gays. You have presented a situation for a guy who's lacking confidence.

 

[JareBear: Remastered]

Of course you should say that. If you want something to be normal, than don't act like you do something weird. By doing this you actively pushing gays into the "that's not normal and we're not like you" corner.

There is no advantage for not being honest in this situation. The only thing that keep people from coming out and saying the truth is that they're lacking the confidence to represent their own life. You did not draw the picture of a typical situation for gays. You have presented a situation for a guy who's lacking confidence.

How do you know what the “typical situation for gays” is?

What is “the typical situation for gays?” Can you enlighten us?

This is what I was talking about earlier, people their life experiences and world view on others as if everyone should feel the same way they do. That’s vain.

 

[ExpandKong]

It’s significant because the audience assumes heterosexuality because that is 99% of what is represented in games. It doesn’t have to be an intricate romance that is purely relevant to “gameplay loop” or storyline. He’s just gay, dude. What is so hard to understand about that? People assume that all characters are hetero because the vast majority of society believes that heterosexuality is the “default” sexuality, when it’s not for literally millions of people.

Something not being the norm for a comparatively small group of people doesn’t mean it’s not the norm. How do you think we all got here? Fell off the cabbage truck?

 

[JareBear: Remastered]

How do you think we all got here? Fell off the cabbage truck?

Mommy says I’m an alien.

Gotta love rhetorical questions

 

[ExpandKong]

Mommy says I’m an alien.

Gotta love rhetorical questions

Time to build that space wall

 

[Ogbert]

I'd respect these reveals far more if it was proper smut.

Two chaps absolutely bumming the hell out of each other.

 

[ROMhack]

Call me cynical but representation of LGBTQ+ characters seems like virtue signalling unless you're exploring themes that affect them in depth. The same goes for Overwatch.

It would be a completely different story if the next CoD actively explored the conflicts of gay soldiers in the military in a present or future warzone but it fucking won't obviously.

 

[Morinaga]

Wow a Gay character. Good for BLOPS. However I think the real issue has been overlooked and that's the writing in that comic strip, its fucking terrible. Its like fucking Twilight meets GIJoe.

 

[Saruhashi]

Call me cynical but representation of LGBTQ+ characters seems like virtue signalling unless you're exploring themes that affect them in depth. The same goes for Overwatch.

It would be a completely different story if the next CoD actively explored the conflicts of gay soldiers in the military in a present or future warzone but it fucking won't obviously.

Yeah, as much as I am fine with the representation and would like to see more of it I can't help but feel some of these companies are jumping on this now because it is trendy now.

It's all a bit shallow.

I'd be super interested to see how much money these kind of stunts make, or cost, them.

 

[Enjay]

If the industr makes this jump from letting terminally ill people play their games early before release (pun not intended) to retroactively making characters gay it will be amazing to watch. I am rooting for the following characters to be "outed:" Ryu, Ken, Raiden (Metal Gear), Clark Steel, Lara Croft, Bayonetta, Link, Sephiroth, Hwoarang. I am about 85% sure Ryo Hazuki will be revealed to be gay when ShenMue 3 is delayed again.

 

[AgentP]

This is getting ridiculous.

 

[Casanova]

Gay people are "othered" because they are the other in almost every human interaction.

Think of Japan for a moment, think about every piece of media you've ever seen on Japan and then think about how densely you basically only see Japanese people. If you were a non-Japanese in Japan you would basically fall into the same percentage of people who are homosexual in the world in relation to those who are not. Guess what? You really only see Japanese people in Japan. Your presence is that menial in relation to the whole so of course gay people are very "othered" in society.

Straight people don't go around telling people they're straight, straight people don't wear their sexual orientation on their sleeve in a lot of ways or hold parades, or change their voice, or their behavior, mannerisms, or clothing, or their style etc. Being straight isn't my identity, it's who I'm attracted to, pursue and have sex with and it doesn't go much beyond that. For homosexuals it seems to warp their very existence, it becomes who they are instead of their orientation, it becomes their identity and drives their life.

I’m curious: Have you ever actually met a real gay person before? I don’t fit in any of your wildly incorrect assumptions about gay people, and many many of us don’t. I’m 200 pounds, have a full beard, have almost no female characteristics, I played sports, etc. We are a heteronormative society, so of course you don’t have to wear heteronormativity on your sleeve… Everyone just assumes you’re straight by default. Also, I’ve heard this soapbox about “parades and celebrations” 1000 times. You seem to lack a basic understanding of the importance of these kinds of events and celebrations. I also imagine you don’t understand the significance of having, say, a black history month? The reason why these things are worthy of celebration is because, think for a moment, every day is straight pride day and every month is white history month. It’s okay to have a celebration of being gay every once in a while, the same as it’s okay to have a black history month without also having a designated “white history month”. It’s the same flaw in both arguments. Stop trying to undermine sexual minority celebrations because, for once, you don’t feel validated or represented.

 

[Dr. Claus]

I’m curious: Have you ever actually met a real gay person before? I don’t fit in any of your wildly incorrect assumptions about gay people, and many many of us don’t. I’m 200 pounds, have a full beard, have almost no female characteristics, I played sports, etc. We are a heteronormative society, so of course you don’t have to wear heteronormativity on your sleeve… Everyone just assumes you’re straight by default. Also, I’ve heard this soapbox about “parades and celebrations” 1000 times. You seem to lack a basic understanding of the importance of these kinds of events and celebrations. I also imagine you don’t understand the significance of having, say, a black history month? The reason why these things are worthy of celebration is because, think for a moment, every day is straight pride day and every month is white history month. It’s okay to have a celebration of being gay every once in a while, the same as it’s okay to have a black history month without also having a designated “white history month”. It’s the same flaw in both arguments. Stop trying to undermine sexual minority celebrations because, for once, you don’t feel validated or represented.

What are you smoking? Can I have some? Clearly it must be some good shit.

No. Every day is not "straight pride day" or "white history month". Where did you even come up with that bologna?

 

[Deleted member 713885]

Nevermind

 

[Casanova]

What are you smoking? Can I have some? Clearly it must be some good shit.

No. Every day is not "straight pride day" or "white history month". Where did you even come up with that bologna?

You realize the country and society you live in, correct? Hell, even your boy earlier said that being straight was “normal” because it’s the majority. You guys are really something else with all your hypocrisy “Why do gay people have to celebrate their gayness? Why can’t they just keep it to themselves?!” says the dude watching the 500th big screen movie this year featuring a straight white family...

 

[DeepEnigma]

You realize the country and society you live in, correct? Hell, even your boy earlier said that being straight was “normal” because it’s the majority. You guys are really something else with all your hypocrisy “Why do gay people have to celebrate their gayness? Why can’t they just keep it to themselves?!” says the dude watching the 500th big screen movie this year featuring a straight white family...

Stop painting everyone in here with broad. brush strokes for the words of a few. That's what bigots do.

 

[zeorhymer]

WTF!?!? Prophet is gay? I'm never playing CoD ever again!?! I want to play mah vid games!?!? RAAAAGGGEE
.
.
.
(I missed the train. Did I do it right?)

 

[iconmaster]

Wake me when Piranha Plant is revealed to be bicurious.

 

[888]

WTF!?!? Prophet is gay? I'm never playing CoD ever again!?! I want to play mah vid games!?!? RAAAAGGGEE
.
.
.
(I missed the train. Did I do it right?)

You may be riding that train alone. Choo choo.

 

[LucidFeuer]

I love the sudden rush of hypocrisy like "yeah I'm so tolerant so I'm just going to dismiss this as a bunch of pixel".

Nope, it's not the pixel that are gay, nor the characters having an actual sexuality, it's about force feeding a kind of toxic identity politic propaganda through an all-age entertainment and cultural format.

And yes, fuck that if there's no narrative point into throwing "here's a gay, here's a trans" at players face in completely unrelated and forced manners.

 

[zeorhymer]

You may be riding that train alone. Choo choo.

Oh damn. I bought the wrong ticket.

 

[Aurelian]

Call me cynical but representation of LGBTQ+ characters seems like virtue signalling unless you're exploring themes that affect them in depth. The same goes for Overwatch.

It would be a completely different story if the next CoD actively explored the conflicts of gay soldiers in the military in a present or future warzone but it fucking won't obviously.

This feels a bit like Activision and Blizzard are testing the waters for more substantial things... "do our sales fall off a cliff if we reveal that character X or Y is LGBT?" If the answer is "no," they can develop future games (not necessarily in those franchises) with LGBT characters' themes being discussed more substantially. I feel it's more worthwhile in Overwatch since the game does depend significantly on characterization.

Is that overly cynical? Maybe, but given what happened a few years ago it's not surprising that they'd be a bit reluctant to simply dive in head-first.

 

[Casanova]

Stop painting everyone in here with broad. brush strokes for the words of a few. That's what bigots do.

I’m not painting everyone here with broad brushstrokes. What are you even talking about? Hahaha.

 

[DeepEnigma]

I’m not painting everyone here with broad brushstrokes. What are you even talking about? Hahaha.

Statements like, "you guys", etc..

Or maybe I'm just over tired.

 

[Casanova]

If a person is straight, they’re just straight - no one thinks twice about it - but if they’re gay there MUST be a specific reason and an elaborate backstory to justify it?

 

[Casanova]

Statements like, "you guys", etc..

Or maybe I'm just over tired.

Referring to those who made the specifuc comments I was referencing. There’s a lot of people in here making similar comments, and they know if they are part of the group
of guys I was referring to. You’re only distracting from the actual conversation.

 

[DeepEnigma]

Referring to those who made the specifuc comments I was referencing. There’s a lot of people in here making similar comments, and they know if they are part of the group
of guys I was referring to. You’re only distracting from the actual conversation.

Yeah I get ya. It is a shit show on both sides with a select few.

 

[RedVIper]

You realize the country and society you live in, correct? Hell, even your boy earlier said that being straight was “normal” because it’s the majority. You guys are really something else with all your hypocrisy “Why do gay people have to celebrate their gayness? Why can’t they just keep it to themselves?!” says the dude watching the 500th big screen movie this year featuring a straight white family...

Yeah yeah white people are bad. No one goes to bollywood and complains about lack of representation of white people there. I've never watched a korean movie and said, Uh, I'd like it a lot more if the protagonist was white. Also you guys like to classify white as whatever suits you, there's plenty of racism between western europeans and eastern europeans, there's significant diferences between them even if they're "white". Are mexicans white? No? Well there's countries in Europe with nearly the same skin color as them, what gives. You say white as if some guy from Texas is the same as some dude from Romania.
You live in the most progressive societies in the world, stop pretending everyone is out to get you.

Being straight is normal because it's the biological norm, gay people aren't the norm, sorry if that offends you, there's nothing wrong with being gay, it just isn't the norm.

 

[Casanova]

Yeah yeah white people are bad. No one goes to bollywood and complains about lack of representation of white people there. I've never watched a korean movie and said, Uh, I'd like it a lot more if the protagonist was white. Also you guys like to classify white as whatever suits you, there's plenty of racism between western europeans and eastern europeans, there's significant diferences between them even if they're "white". Are mexicans white? No? Well there's countries in Europe with nearly the same skin color as them, what gives. You say white as if some guy from Texas is the same as some dude from Romania.
You live in the most progressive societies in the world, stop pretending everyone is out to get you.

Being straight is normal because it's the biological norm, gay people aren't the norm, sorry if that offends you, there's nothing wrong with being gay, it just isn't the norm.

Straight BEHAVIOR is normal because of reproduction, sure, but trying to say that straight sexuality (sexuality, not behavior) is the norm in just plain fucking wrong. There’s no “biological norm” of sexuality, so stop trying to sound smart. There’s a huge ever-changing continuum of sexuality. I love straight people, and most of my friends are straight, so I’m really not offended at all. You realize that pulling the “don’t get offended” card every chance you get is just a simple way of saying that you don’t really know what you’re talking about and you hope someone doesn’t call you on your bullshit.

When I was talking about gay parade’s and black history month I was referring to the United States - you know that. Stop trying to distract from the real conversation. You didn’t really address any point of mine.

All I hear is “lol who cares if he’s gay? It’s not important!”, yet at the same time “if it’s not significant and important to the gameplay then it shouldn’t be there! Include a full, detailed, backstory or it’s just media publicity!” That is textbook hypocrisy... lmao. Is it important or is it unimportant? Do y’all want the gay part to be completely left out or do you want a complete detailed justification as to the story, history, and background of how this video game character is gay? Make up your minds. It’s really laughable at this point.

 

[888]

Straight BEHAVIOR is normal because of reproduction, sure, but trying to say that straight sexuality (sexuality, not behavior) is the norm in just plain fucking wrong. There’s no “biological norm” of sexuality, so stop trying to sound smart. There’s a huge ever-changing continuum of sexuality. I love straight people, and most of my friends are straight, so I’m really not offended at all. You realize that pulling the “don’t get offended” card every chance you get is just a simple way of saying that you don’t really know what you’re talking about and you hope someone doesn’t call you on your bullshit.

When I was talking about gay parade’s and black history month I was referring to the United States - you know that. Stop trying to distract from the real conversation. You didn’t really address any point of mine.

All I hear is “lol who cares if he’s gay? It’s not important!”, yet at the same time “if it’s not significant and important to the gameplay then it shouldn’t be there! Include a full, detailed, backstory or it’s just media publicity!” That is textbook hypocrisy... lmao. Is it important or is it unimportant? Do y’all want the gay part to be completely left out or do you want a complete detailed justification as to the story, history, and background of how this video game character is gay? Make up your minds. It’s really laughable at this point.

When you say y’all. Are you saying there are some posters that say it should be left out and at the same time saying it needs to be justified? You say make up your minds like the group is a hive mind and that it’s laughable.

Maybe I’m reading it wrong?

 

[RedVIper]

Straight BEHAVIOR is normal because of reproduction, sure, but trying to say that straight sexuality (sexuality, not behavior) is the norm in just plain fucking wrong. There’s no “biological norm” of sexuality, so stop trying to sound smart. There’s a huge ever-changing continuum of sexuality. I love straight people, and most of my friends are straight, so I’m really not offended at all. You realize that pulling the “don’t get offended” card every chance you get is just a simple way of saying that you don’t really know what you’re talking about and you hope someone doesn’t call you on your bullshit.

When I was talking about gay parade’s and black history month I was referring to the United States - you know that. Stop trying to distract from the real conversation. You didn’t really address any point of mine.

All I hear is “lol who cares if he’s gay? It’s not important!”, yet at the same time “if it’s not significant and important to the gameplay then it shouldn’t be there! Include a full, detailed, backstory or it’s just media publicity!” That is textbook hypocrisy... lmao. Is it important or is it unimportant? Do y’all want the gay part to be completely left out or do you want a complete detailed justification as to the story, history, and background of how this video game character is gay? Make up your minds. It’s really laughable at this point.

You don't know what a norm means then:
a set standard of development or achievement usually derived from the average or median achievement of a large group
a pattern or trait taken to be typical in the behavior of a social group

Being straight is the norm because that's what norm means, heterosexuals are a vast majority of the world population, any deviation from that is, again, by definition not the norm.
I didn't mean to say "don't get offended", I mean I don't care if it offends you.

The "real" conversation, you must be really self centered to think America is the center of the world, you guys have existed for a few hundred years, you have nearly no history. Are we not allowed to talk about racism that goes somewhere else in the world? Why? Also parades also exist in the rest of the world, you didn't invent them.

How many characters do you have that come out yelling "I'm straight!!", none. Nobody cares if you're gay, nobody cares if the characters are gay, but when you and the media have to throw a virtual parade every time a character comes out as gay, and whine all the time because of "representation" then yeah people are going to be slightly annoyed. Also you're just dumb if you think companies are doing it for any other reason than publicity.

 

[Casanova]

You don't know what a norm means then:
a set standard of development or achievement usually derived from the average or median achievement of a large group
a pattern or trait taken to be typical in the behavior of a social group

Being straight is the norm because that's what norm means, heterosexuals are a vast majority of the world population, any deviation from that is, again, by definition not the norm.
I didn't mean to say "don't get offended", I mean I don't care if it offends you.

The "real" conversation, you must be really self centered to think America is the center of the world, you guys have existed for a few hundred years, you have nearly no history. Are we not allowed to talk about racism that goes somewhere else in the world? Why? Also parades also exist in the rest of the world, you didn't invent them.

How many characters do you have that come out yelling "I'm straight!!", none. Nobody cares if you're gay, nobody cares if the characters are gay, but when you and the media have to throw a virtual parade every time a character comes out as gay, and whine all the time because of "representation" then yeah people are going to be slightly annoyed. Also you're just dumb if you think companies are doing it for any other reason than publicity.

Again, they don’t have to come out and say it because everyone just automatically ASSUMES they are straight.

 

[ROMhack]

This feels a bit like Activision and Blizzard are testing the waters for more substantial things... "do our sales fall off a cliff if we reveal that character X or Y is LGBT?" If the answer is "no," they can develop future games (not necessarily in those franchises) with LGBT characters' themes being discussed more substantially. I feel it's more worthwhile in Overwatch since the game does depend significantly on characterization.

Is that overly cynical? Maybe, but given what happened a few years ago it's not surprising that they'd be a bit reluctant to simply dive in head-first.

Yeah that's probably a fair point.

 

[Dr. Claus]

You realize the country and society you live in, correct? Hell, even your boy earlier said that being straight was “normal” because it’s the majority. You guys are really something else with all your hypocrisy “Why do gay people have to celebrate their gayness? Why can’t they just keep it to themselves?!” says the dude watching the 500th big screen movie this year featuring a straight white family...

"my boy"? I have no relation with that user, so don't pull the disingenuous bullshit. I know you are just an ERA troll - but at least try to hide it better, mate. Yes, being straight is "normal". It is the majority of the world's population. A film involving white people isn't celebrating "whiteness" anymore than a film starring black folks is celebrating "blackness" - which is why I questioned your idiotic assumption.

If a person is straight, they’re just straight - no one thinks twice about it - but if they’re gay there MUST be a specific reason and an elaborate backstory to justify it?

Emil. Kaine. Bill. No one questioned why they are gay or intersex. They just were. That is good writing. It wasn't simply a token to appear friendly to the LGBT community.

 

[Casanova]

"my boy"? I have no relation with that user, so don't pull the disingenuous bullshit. I know you are just an ERA troll - but at least try to hide it better, mate. Yes, being straight is "normal". It is the majority of the world's population. A film involving white people isn't celebrating "whiteness" anymore than a film starring black folks is celebrating "blackness" - which is why I questioned your idiotic assumption.



Emil. Kaine. Bill. No one questioned why they are gay or intersex. They just were. That is good writing. It wasn't simply a token to appear friendly to the LGBT community.

The “majority” of a country (race or sexuality) doesn’t need to be celebrated because it is the majority every single day, and thus, celebrated just by being 100% present in almost every single form of media - that IS a celebration of majority...

 

[RedVIper]

The “majority” of a country (race or sexuality) doesn’t need to be celebrated because it is the majority every single day, and thus, celebrated just by being 100% present in almost every single form of media - that IS a celebration of majority...

Do you read the dumb stuff you write.

 

[Dr. Claus]

The “majority” of a country (race or sexuality) doesn’t need to be celebrated because it is the majority every single day, and thus, celebrated just by being 100% present in almost every single form of media - that IS a celebration of majority...

Read what you said back to yourself. That is not celebration.


celebration
►

• n.
  The formal performance of a solemn rite, such as Christian sacrament
• n.
  The observance of a holiday or feast day, as by solemnities
• n.
  The act, process of showing appreciation, gratitude and/or remembrance, notably as a social event.

What you stated isn't a celebration. Stop trying to twist words using your own meaning to push some asinine claim.

 

[EverydayBeast]

It took them until now for the great minds behind BO4 to reveal a characters backstory?