SonGoku
Member
Im talking of DLSS which is the post you quoted not rtxRaytracing isnt an easy feature when its engine assets dont take it into account.
Still, there have been big performance gains.
Im talking of DLSS which is the post you quoted not rtxRaytracing isnt an easy feature when its engine assets dont take it into account.
Still, there have been big performance gains.
Its literally a new feature. Its like saying pixel shader support sucked when Geforce 3 came out in 2001.Im talking of DLSS which is the post you quoted not rtx
Then you would know the difference.I've already read about sebbi's method, it's great.
I call early day code and the fact BFV is not the best example for RT a more likely candidate. I know its tempting to write off new tech when the support is still on-going, but if everyone held that thought, we would still be driving with T&L based games without shaders.I call going from 4k to 1080p, with less consistent framerate for some puddles, junk technology.
Sure, and for most situations it will suffice. But it will break realism under different conditions, plus you can't use real time window reflections so you can't tell who is shooting behind you.We've had planar reflections and clever tricks for reflections that look great for years.
How exactly is it brute force?This method seen in Battlefield is the brute force method and there's nothing clever about it.
I asked how exactly RT Cores, which accelerate a part of the process, are brute forcing the tech. If you mean brute forcing it in terms of pushing it into a game that clearly was not meant for it, then yeah, perhaps.Redneckerz I think I know the difference, again.
I am not denying that, i am just asking if you know what's going on.Sebbi's a clever programmer and Nvidia RT is a bloated waste.
Alright, so why don't more games use it instead of SSR?Planar reflections don't break. It's an older technique superior to SSR.
Guess what, they do! In a mixed fashion, but they do!Like I said bud, Universal, real ray tracing is a good step in real time rendering - when our hardware actually has the fucking resources for it!
What you want is an instant jump to full scene raytracing - Everyone knows progression comes in intermediate steps. Hybrid rendering is one such step.Even this piecemeal shit like in BF5 or metro where only one part of the rendering is ray traced... Is still cutting resolution and framerates to ribbons!
I am not your ''bud''.Stay with me bud. FOR NOW it is a waste, and we'd be much better served if devs would use the superior old techniques in clever and conservative ways. That's all I have to say.
"Im clueless but Im sure I'll get some atenttion with this"what a joke
targeting 1080p 60 with a 350 dollar card
But its supposed to be a simple to implement feature is it not? By your own admission RTX a more complex and harder to implement feature is seeing better support than dsllIts literally a new feature. Its like saying pixel shader support sucked when Geforce 3 came out in 2001.
Obviously it sucks. Games just dont automagically gain support for such a feature.
And i disagree, especially for the RTX 2060. Having 1080p on RTX on a midrange card and nearing 60 fps is quite impressive, especially when its early days. For the record: This card likely would have hit 30 fps or less with BFV RTX initial release, which should be telling as to how many strides there are undertaken.Redneckerz
Ok Sunshine -
What exactly is your point? My main point is this tech is simply not worth the current cost. That's it.
To your own accord its an older technique. So, what makes you think people went with SSR instead? Perhaps that was easier to set up in their renderers?There's a number of possible reasons why planar reflections may not be used, one its more expensive (however no where near as expensive as RT, so there's no "gotcha!" here) than SSR and 2. Devs might not necessarily know it. Believe it or not, not every dev has the time to look at every possible solution that ever existed since they're busy making games.
You have to start somewhere, which is the point. Your opinion is that this starting point should be discarded from the beginning.It's also a trend. Kinda like how chromatic aberration, eye adaptations, lens flare or anything else that's common in current games ; doesn't mean it's necessarily the best solution.
Those window reflections and door reflections look a lot more natural than what one could achieve with SSR, especially from an angle. Windows in particular.What I "want" is to not sacrifice resolution, textures or anything else for an extremely computationally expensive solution that doesn't necessarily look a while lot better than previously used techniques.
Such a useless accusation to make Chozo, especially when i cited most of your post.To repeat myself since you're on a warpath with selective reading,
Initial release i would have agreed. Now its actually a viable solution, at full HD which is what most gamers have. So its totally worthwhile. And again, BFV is not the best example of the tech.yes this hybrid solution may be an important first step but that doesn't mean it is a good or worthwhile solution at the moment.
DLSS requires adapting to an AI profile which requires user end data and game end data which may or may not be what every dev wants.But its supposed to be a simple to implement feature is it not? By your own admission RTX a more complex and harder to implement feature is seeing better support than dsll
eh.. in reality by numbers 4k is a meme almost just as much as rtx.Nope, not at 1080p it won't.
So this might slow down its adoption and might no be as widespread as some claim, more of a niche featureDLSS requires adapting to an AI profile which requires user end data and game end data which may or may not be what every dev wants.
Its a worthwhile addition though, considering the gains. Its in a way similar to the neural network HD texture packs that we have seen.
lol funniest post i read this week honesteh.. in reality by numbers 4k is a meme almost just as much as rtx.
I dunno. I mean, the performane gains are obvious, and if game devs love anything, its obvious performance gains, so it would be interesting if this keeps put out of the loop.So this might slow down its adoption and might no be as widespread as some claim, more of a niche feature
And i replied to that accordingly. Like you say, read better.Redneckerz I already said what it is I think stops PR from being in current games. Like I said - read better.
I agree. Except for the sunshine part which you are just doing to provoke. Childish, really.[
Luckily sunshine I don't feel this tech needs be discarded in the first place because it's relegated to the PC and those gamers are the beta testers. I consider the PC a testing platform anyway so I suppose all is right, really.
What i read is you dismissing the tech for a variety of reasons that may not hold true.[
I don't mean that condescendingly either, everyone knows that's how brand new tech works. I think it's stupid to buy, but you're not worse than me if you so choose.
That's why i said it gives me Pro CB vibes, a "simple" to implement feature with obvious performance and quality benefits goes ignored by most 3rd parties in favor of more rudimentary solutions.I dunno. I mean, the performane gains are obvious, and if game devs love anything, its obvious performance gains, so it would be interesting if this keeps put out of the loop.
Nvidia themselves could also point out the obvious advantages over this in perf gains vs the obvious perf disadvantages when doing RT. Fortunately DLSS migiates that so they should point that out more.
Checkerboarding is easy enough to implement, but there are various implementations with varied results. At times it can look worse than no upscaling at all.That's why i said it gives me Pro CB vibes, a "simple" to implement feature with obvious performance and quality benefits goes ignored by most 3rd parties in favor of more rudimentary solutions.
Yeah but CB, although it looks close enough to a 4K image, it isnt 4K. It also does not enhance perf that much.That's why i said it gives me Pro CB vibes, a "simple" to implement feature with obvious performance and quality benefits goes ignored by most 3rd parties in favor of more rudimentary solutions.
The PS4 Pro has a hardware based CB feature that goes ignored by most 3rd parties. Sony 1st party has the best image quality on that console and they use it most of the time games like Horizon and GoW showcase it.Checkerboarding is easy enough to implement, but there are various implementations with varied results. At times it can look worse than no upscaling at all.
Actually I would say at all times, but some methods are particularly bad like dragon quest or red dead.
Temporal injection is the gold standard of upscaling techniques and needs no special hardware. It's hilarious to see anyone touting dlss as something new/superior.
Oh no, im not saying they are the same tech wiseYeah but CB, although it looks close enough to a 4K image, it isnt 4K. It also does not enhance perf that much.
DLSS is closer to a native 4K (I think???) and enhances perf. Together with Variable Rate Shading so you have different parts of the screen in different rendering res, we could see a lot of gains.
Though i do think there is something to be said against AI profiles for games though. I am more into the neural network HD texture pack thing which uses similar tech.
Imagine that games could have something like DLSS but more on-the-fly and with shaders.
I think it's ignored because developers don't like the look of it and how it effects their lighting and particle systems.The PS4 Pro has a hardware based CB feature that goes ignored by most 3rd parties. Sony 1st party has the best image quality on that console and they use it most of the time games like Horizon and GoW showcase it.
Im just saying dlss sounds hell of a lot like Pro CB, great in paper but it barely receives support by anyone other than the hw manufacturer
Oh no, im not saying they are the same tech wise
Im just seeing similarities in support (or lack there off). Im sure DLSS is much better quality but also more complex to implement which makes it even less likely to receive widespread support
I mean, this much performance improvements is too much to just keep on getting ignored, no? Unless Nvidia has a whole list of restrictions before DLSS tech can be implemented, it seems like an obvious choice?Oh no, im not saying they are the same tech wise
Im just seeing similarities in support (or lack there off). Im sure DLSS is much better quality but also more complex to implement which makes it even less likely to receive widespread support
So how come sony 1st party image quality excels any 3rd party effort on the console?I think it's ignored because developers don't like the look of it and how it effects their lighting and particle systems.
But as we seen with Pro, theres always the cheap up-scaling route. idk Personally i hope dsll or a better version of it catches on in the futureI mean, this much performance improvements is too much to just keep on getting ignored, no? Unless Nvidia has a whole list of restrictions before DLSS tech can be implemented, it seems like an obvious choice?
So how come sony 1st party image quality excels any 3rd party effort on the console?
Perhaps we are back to the its more difficult and complex to implement properly dilemma?
RDR2 for example, i don't know what they used but it looks like ass worse than 1080p
I've been more impressed with those two games IQ than any other 3rd party on the console and thats in motion as wellI don't agree that horizon or god of war looks better than a straight up 1440p image
re2 demo is not a good example because its a demo6GB is more than enough for 2k, but not for 4K. Resident Evil 2 Remake demo on PC uses up to 12gb of VRAM at 4k/max settings.
mind you i never stated that what i use is the same.DP, but this post demonstrates exactly why render engines and game engines should not be compared, but also how silly it is to look down upon this from a game engine perspective.
Its very much raytracing, just a part of it. Hence why it is mixed rendering. All those render engines aren't laughing at RTX because they know its not in the same bracket. RTX, to them, is like their little cousin getting accustomed towalking/raytracing.
EDGY"Im clueless but Im sure I'll get some atenttion with this"
But what Nvidia isn't so much bullshit as it is just tracing a subset of the entire raytracing paradigm. And its doing that still without Metropolis Light Transport.mind you i never stated that what i use is the same.
just saying that
EDGY
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