shark sandwich
tenuously links anime, pedophile and incels
EA especially used it as a marketing tool. During the uproar over Mass Effect 3’s ending they bombarded the media with stories about how progressive they are.
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Two Apex Legends characters are LGBTQ, say EA and Respawn
- Thread starter Shin
- Start date
Dr. Claus
Vincit qui se vincit
You said it better than I could. Excellent post, Sqorin.
MacReady13
Member
Correct. So why mention it in a 1st person shooter with no story whatsoever?
lukilladog
Member
An ideology that can be used as a moral weapon to dictate and enforce the traits of fictional characters is pathetic.
It´s implied if you are telling people that they are not being represented unless certain fictional character has certain color, or small tits, or whatever. Guess what, the same way I can identify myself with black characters because of athleticism or rationality (I´m a fan of Neil Degrasse btw) or the tenacity of some caucasic woman like Sgt Ripley, black people or gays can identify themselves with whatever traits they want... but nevertheless, changes are needed because of "our own good".
autoduelist
Member
In those quite times between picking my nose and drinking cappuccino, I often wonder which pixels on my tablet are gay.
Shmunter
Member
Gay people are more fashion oriented. Makes sense to sell outfits. Now where are my ass-less chaps for $18.
Nah seriously, love all people. Gay, trans, black or white. It’s the authoritarian left that is the problem and it’s difficult to divorce even the smallest things from the bigger agenda by those evil fuckers.
Nah seriously, love all people. Gay, trans, black or white. It’s the authoritarian left that is the problem and it’s difficult to divorce even the smallest things from the bigger agenda by those evil fuckers.
Lionel Richie
Member
Some of you are missing the point so fucking hard it could circle the earth and come around to hit you in the back of your head. People enjoy playing as characters they share any common trend with. Not because we can only play as characters we're similar to, but it's a nice bonus when it happens and any game that features a fuckton of avatars theoretically should have no issue including a very diverse cast. Is this a marketing strategy? Fuck yes it is, but it's a harmless one that might actually provide some enjoyment to people. Stop chasing ghosts and fighting an irrational war.
Redneckerz
Those long posts don't cover that red neck boy
What part of this brings enjoyment in your eyes?
SvRomanov87
Neo Member
You can't do that. It's PERSONcotting now.
josherjohn
Banned
"People enjoy playing as characters they share any common trend with."
Fucking read
Krappadizzle
Gold Member
I really don't care. They can make them all gay or whatever, as long as the game is fun I don't care. I don't play these types of shooters in a way such that I am roleplaying.
Ivellios
Member
There is a vast difference between including diversity right and forced diversity down people throats.
Just one example of a minority character done right on a game is an adventure called Technobabylon: There is a trans character in this game that you only discover in a casual dialogue that actually makes sense that she is a trans person and it was a nice addition to the story. There are more exemples but this is the first game that came to my mind.
When i mention forced diversity its addind character for sole purpose of filling a "diversity checkbox" that results in poorly written characters or BFV 5 situations where they promised historical fidelity and then for the sake of diversity they done the opposite.
Now in Apex they are just using diversity as a market tool. Redneck explained far better than me on one of his posts the issue with this game.
I think you are the one who is missing the point, no one is fighting an irrational war here (aside from people who want the game to bomb maybe). We are just talking about how weird is the situation that devs are marketing things like "look at my game, we have minority people and plenty of diversity here!".
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Mobile Suit Gooch
Grundle: The Awakening
That's one reason why I love Japanese devs. They don't make a big deal out of stuff like this.
Sqorin Hammerfarf
Banned
So, given that the majority of their audience is not non-binary, gay, or black women, this means that in the desire to provide characters that are like their players, they've made white male hetrosexual characters (representing the vast, vast, so vast it is not even funny majority of their players, customers, and influencers) easily accessible so that they may too enjoy the pleasure of such a bonus, right?
The fact that they made the only white male character literally toxic and behind a paywall basically removes all rational defense of the representation argument. Either they were trying to be representative and failed spectacularly to represent their ACTUAL audience, or they are being purposefully antagonistic against their audience using representation as a weapon against them.
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Vtecomega
Banned
Still plenty of sjw soy boys here. This thread is proof.
lukilladog
Member
But there is damage done here, there is not an extremely sexy woman, nor an alpha male. It´s dumb that you can find them in any street, but not in a game that claims to be inclusive. If there was no artificial interference, you bet they would be here, in whatever color the artist conceived them.
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Helios
Member
Why are you saying this like it's some revolutionary thing? This has happened before in gaming and was done way better and no-one called them out. Two weeks ago I played a game that had a trans character in the game and the character was not only really well written overall but the reveal was also relevant to the story.
Also is the W in LGBTW a mispelling or the new term now? It' legitimately hard to keep up with this.
Sqorin Hammerfarf
Banned
Not only that, but LGBT has always had a presence in game development. One of the absolute most famous early video game designers is Dan/Danielle Bunten (of M.U.L.E. fame) and literally nobody had a problem with this. And there are literally hundreds of LGBT characters throughout video gaming. Nobody is arguing that Ultima 7 was a terrible game because the Avatar could bang prostitutes of either gender. There was no uproar with the explicitly homosexual undertones in Phantasmagoria. These things happened and nobody really cared, because there wasn't some new wave of political correctness forcing people to obsess over these things (or the lack thereof).
Gaming has ALWAYS been inclusive because it was made up of social outcasts who were joined together by a shared love of something most people just didn't get. But somewhere along the line, a bunch of mean girls came in and decided that we are all -isms and need to be schooled in true acceptance... by not accepting any of us, our hobby, and certainly not our history together.
Redneckerz
Those long posts don't cover that red neck boy
First post, 4 year old account and i need to fucking read? Mind your tone plz.
So the enjoyment part is purely because the discussion is a common trend. Now why is it a trend? Surely its not because of marketing devices like these...
Mista
Banned
The Skull
Member
A single line in a bio and one mention about the "non-binary" character in another interview article is diversity forced down peoples throats? Come on, that's reaching. If there was a huge EA press release with this at the forefront, then maybe I'd agree but there isn't. A large percentage of players aren't gonna read the bio or interview and, as far as I know, there isn't anything when you boot up the game that goes "Btw this character is gay and this character is non-binary" is there?
Redneckerz
Those long posts don't cover that red neck boy
You would be surprised how our sister site thinks about it.
Spoiler: They still aren't satisfied since now the characters are bland.
Ivellios
Member
Yeah i guess i exaggerated a bit there, sorry not my intention
Just used it as an example in general though
angelic
Banned
True, but they dont get a free pass by virtue signalling. Points are debated, which is as it should be. Usually with complete destruction of the SJW stance.
cormack12
Gold Member
This is an excellent post. Glad to see it getting likes. However,
Lionel Richie
does make a good point (not just abut Endless Love) but also about players wanting to play as something they can identify with. I think the balance and marketing is completely wrong around these two clashing issues. and it's ultimately causing friction. However, I identify as much with Marcus Fenix as some random Asian guy, despite being white. And that;s the fallacy of the argument. I don't identify with Marcus, Geralt, Nate etc. They don't 'represent' me just because they are white. That's a racist assumption in itself. Are you telling me I can't identify with Max in LiS as a coming of age story and high school drama? Don't be stupid.I want to go back to two characters in Tomb Raider first. In the reboot, Jonah and Reyes:
Both these characters are at first glance in that 'diversity' demographic. They were not highly touted, they were released as part of the game without fanfare or anyone trying to score points for including a black female and New Zealander-cum-Hawaiian islander. The backlash was immense on both these 'stereotypical' characters. They were as fleshed out as any other character and also had collectibles explaining the back story. But they were reduced down to what people saw. Because they didn't have a blurb and didn't pass the purity test. They were just called out as being poorly written, cardboard characters - the de facto statements when no real arguments can be made.
Next, I want to move onto the Apex characters. So now we know one is gay and one is non binary. However, what is coming out the woodwork - that the names are racist, that it's a good start, there's debate about oriental asian and oriental black. The purity council has convened. The reason why characters above from TR are dismissed is because there wasn't a fanfare about them, so the community sneer at the effort because they don't feel like they have influence. All the while those who do release stuff and make the effort are greeted with:
Meanwhile the marketing arms of these companies in order to stifle the online purity council release promotional material to satiate the thirst of these people. The problem is that it's starting to piss off the core audiences who care more about the game is good and actual gameplay elements and dynamics are improved and evidenced. It used to be a zero cost strategy for companies but now 'go woke, get broke' is being used more for a reason. It's just turning people away, because passively aggressively it's saying this is our target audience first and foremost, not the folks that have been playing and supporting for years who don't really care.
guggnichso
Banned
ITT: eight fucking pages of people who „do not care“.
AnotherOne
Member
Is this really necessary, seems like a cheap appeal to everyone tactic. What's next?
Shangounchained
Banned
I simply don't play most modern games because of this LGBT stuff n I don't watch any series only anime don't watch most new films I sometimes just google old 90s n 80s films n don't even know when or how people wanted this LGBT trend and as a black man I never asked to be represented if you don't want to represent me then don't art shouldn't beg for representations n I've never asked to be James Bond even if Tarzan is a white dude talking to animals in the Congo, what's happening here isn't about black rights or gay rights since ever it's always been about European n American culture, basically it's the whole freedom democracy Freemasons founding fathers ideology of a utopia where everybody can be what he wants an ideology of a common pop culture villain ironic, now they're having dogs getting sexual rearrangement surgeries, humans, while combating female genital mutilation, or calling prostitution illegal and following pornstars on Twitter n call those young teenagers getting abused on set actors, it's always the same thing Europeans have always thought themselves as superior and right it goes way back before hitler and nazi eugenics and they won't stop would use everything in their power whether it's games films or anything and I'm afraid there's no way to fix Europeans and there's no way to fix Africans we'll always be black savages to which I know people think of me that way but it is what it is there's nothing to do its out of control now they got kids playing propaganda already
Shmunter
Member
From the comments, I’m seeing a clear pattern that people are against the concept of the weaponisation of identiy politics, e.g. the well intentioned #meetoo gone sour, the constant virtue signalling like some kind of mea culpa prair, on and on, and the absolute hate mobbing, cause for firing or deplatforming by the extreme progressives.
Yes it’s rightfully deplorable to any level headed individual
There is no Ill will to sexual identities, or genders, or other.
Yes it’s rightfully deplorable to any level headed individual
There is no Ill will to sexual identities, or genders, or other.
Lionel Richie
Member
You clearly know more about this game than I do lol but yeah, if the only white man is like you described I could see how that wouldn't be ideal and needlessly antagonistic. I was mainly referring to the non-issue of having LGBT characters.
You're asking for the cast diversity to be set accordingly to your preferences while criticizing the game for having the cast diversity set accordingly to someone else's preference.
mckmas8808
Mckmaster uses MasterCard to buy Slave drives
Makes you realize how much "certain" people actually do care.
Shangounchained
Banned
It's the same old story, we've always been told about Europeans growing up and as kids we never believed what we heard but soon as we got older we started understanding what our parents told us n it's not a false stereotype Europeans are simply weird people n as for me I've seen enough nothing surprises me anymore, it's always the same they just can't leave shit and they think they know it all all the while putting the world in danger every fucking century.
JareBear: Remastered
Banned
Vast majority of those posts read like:
“Man I don’t care, let me now explain why I care.”
No Word Count
Member
Indeed.
This is exactly why they do it. It's free advertising, whilst also breeding fanaticism for a brand, which is exactly how you convince people to spend more money on your product.
I made a comment earlier in the thread asking people why they care so much. Nobody seems to have provided an answer.
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Shangounchained
Banned
N what were generally against is politics we just want to take a controller and play a game same as a movie If I go to watch face off its face off if I'm ordering chips it's chips don't give me rainbow chips I don't need your politics if u feel like choping ur dick off go do it if u feel like sitting on a dildo go do it but no you won't Europeans don't like being crazy alone they want everybody else to do it from America to Somalia just for the sake of saying I'm right n they do this time n time again whether it's liberals or conservatives
JareBear: Remastered
Banned
A line on a bio page sure is aggressive marketing
No Word Count
Member
...wut?
They're a multi billion dollar business. Every single move they make is marketing.
If it suddenly became fashionable to wear black and walk around graveyards and cut your wrists tomorrow, 90% of characters would be designed that way. I know. I lived through that fad.
Cheap advertising is the holy grail for businesses. The nature of the internet means that yes, even a single line of text becomes news story nowadays. They are fully aware of this fact.
All the arguing from both sides does nothing but increase the veracity of the potential fans that do become interesting, increasing their loyalty of the brand due to a perceived belief that they have to "defend" it from the "haters". You just have to look at Overwatch for the perfect example of this.
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JareBear: Remastered
Banned
Stay mad.
Sqorin Hammerfarf
Banned
None of the posts are criticizing the character’s sexuality itself - nobody is arguing that Gibraltar shouldn’t be gay, we don’t care about that - but are criticizing how hamfisted and ideological the weaponized identity politics is.
You are intentionally conflating two separate issues in a straw man attempt to dismiss the actual problem by pretending it is instead a different, more easily dismissed problem. Either this is intentional, which makes you disingenuous and kind of a dick, or it is your mistake, which means you have the reading comprehension of a third grader and should probably stay out of the big boy conversations.