Stuart360
Member
A problem?, a 1080p version of Series X that will probably be $299 or near, and as you lot always like to say, price is paramount.
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12.15 - 10.28= 1.87 Teraflops difference between the XSX and PS5 (52 CU's vs. 36 CU's)
- Thread starter MiyazakiHatesKojima
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MiyazakiHatesKojima
Banned
You're taking a single sentence he said and speculating something that has severe implications on the potential power of the hardware.
I watched the panel and read the article. The way I see it, he's giving developers flexibility with the RT features.
Deeper Underground
Member
lol My guy. Stop. You just said on this same page that basically Cerny and Sony are lying and that they are going to be running a majority of their games at 9TF. We have the lead architect just tell us from his mouth the PS5 will run a majority of the time at 2.23Ghz and only downclock when a truly console breaking game is put against it. You think he just made that shit up because he was worried about Xbox fanboys?
I mean, if it makes you feel better, then sure, Cerny is a big, fat liar and the PS5 is shit. At the same time, go and read up on AMD’s Smartshift technology that allows the RDNA2 to shift power back and forth between the CPU and GPU which allows the GPU to stay boosted to 2.23Ghz. Or you can always rewatch the entire section about the GPU so wewouldn’t have to have this conversation in the first place lol.
siekro1983
Banned
The slide literally says "FULL RAY TRACING". Let me show you.
DF mentioned that some Key features in x series were not mentioned in the ps5 ray tracing presentation.
Roxkis_ii
Member
They talked about their solution in the road to Ps5 video. You should watch it. Mark talked about this at 35:35.
I'm starting to think the people commenting here aren't doing so in Good faith with people bring up issue that aren't issue for the ps5
Pallas
Gold Member
Wouldn’t more CU’s enabled provide for better ray tracing though?
Stuart360
Member
When the console launches, and all the tech heads and tech sites start doing their tests, i wont be surprised if PS5 is operating around the 9.5tf mark with heavy graphical games, especially the longer you play.
siekro1983
Banned
I have never heard a not a well optimized game forces downclocks, it actually. Never heard that feature in any current gen consoles or the X series.
MiyazakiHatesKojima
Banned
Frankly, RT is a bit overrated and very power hungry in any PC.
Semi-RT or RT that's effectively used and balanced is more preferable, which Cerny meant whne he said devs can switch RT off.
Shifty1897
Member
From what I understand, the 10.28 is more of a theoretical max, you'd have to hit just the right mix boost clocks on both CPU and GPU in order to achieve that. Most use cases will cause it to hover around the 9's.
Of course, TFLOPs won't be an accurate depiction of graphical fidelity next generation anyway.
Of course, TFLOPs won't be an accurate depiction of graphical fidelity next generation anyway.
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Stuart360
Member
They were the most important thing in the first 4 years of this gen.uuuuugh, muh terraflaps
Psykodad
Banned
The problem for MS will be this:
Series S 6Tf
PS5 9-10Tf
XSX 12Tf
PS5 will be a safe middleground between both Xbox version and likely to be priced in between as well.
So while everybody is either cheering or booing atm, the situation of 2 Xbox units will be a worst-case scenario for Xbox.
Because when prices will be €300, €400 and €500 respectively, along with Sony's 1st party output, the 9Tf PS5 is no joke.
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SenjutsuSage
Banned
Believe what you want, and I know what I said, but nice try attempting to turn it into a food fight for console wars. Time to move on won't waste time on the forum abiout that stuff anymore. We know what the specs are now. Next is to see what the games are like and how the SSDs change things and what they can do with the I/O improvements they've made.
lepermessiah
Member
Blah blah blah, a million bucks on Sony being able to get more with less/faster ssd because of ingenuity over brute forcing. Cerny is a gentle lover but lover none the less. 
Pallas
Gold Member
It is pretty power hungry but it doesn’t change why the series X probably has a lot of CU’s compared to PS5. I take it as Microsoft being more serious about ray tracing. PS5 is no slouch but I think it might have been a victim of unforeseen circumstances(if you recall the suppose rumor about shortages and Sony originally aiming for a 2019 release)
Stuart360
Member
Well i dont have stocks in either Microsoft or Sony, so it means little to me.
TLZ
Banned
A whole PS4 of a difference!
Cerny confirmed to Richard from DF that it's always at 10.28tf.10.28 tf max while overclocking
Otherwise single digits
siekro1983
Banned
Exactly.
Psykodad
Banned
Duhhh nobody does, but we discuss these things all the same.
XSX being more powerful means little to me. There's no harm in talking about things.
I am sure PS5 will be an amazing upgrade to PS4/Pro. Saying that, I cannot reconcile the time and effort spent by Sony/AMD to retain the hardware back compatibility with PS4 in order to get 100 working ps4 games out of the gate? Thus limiting the GPU options.
It just doesn't make any sense.
The only logical conclusion is that they were aiming at $399 price point all along.
It just doesn't make any sense.
The only logical conclusion is that they were aiming at $399 price point all along.
The Pleasure
Member
Thisnis giving me dreamcast vibes. Remember when the dreamcast did 3 mil polygons while ps2 did 75 mil? The difference is the xbox won't dominate sales wise so unless that power is easy to use without much if any effort will people bother to use it? And cerny is boring as fuck. He is Krazy Ken minus the Krazy and minus the entertainment.
Stuart360
Member
Your hundreds of posts in the next gen thread speculation over which is more powerful, says otherwise.
Psykodad
Banned
I never said anything other than what I'm saying now.
Rightisright
Banned
Simulating Gonzalo (Rumoured NextGen/PS5 leak)
Welp, isnt 200w where unbearably loud PS4 Pro is? If so, no, thanks. Betwen 5700 and XT looks like the most realistic bet. Heck, which is quite a bump vs earlier hopes of betveen vega56 and 64. And of course there is the spec arms race, so, perhaps, closer to XT. And Im not buying the...
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Gamernyc78
Banned
Tht wasnt the context of tht comment. It was clearly referring to over heating
let's stop the fuckery.
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lepermessiah
Member
Cerny got dat nasal seccs though.
Gamernyc78
Banned
Jigsaah
Gold Member
I don't know. I think options are a good thing. But I could definitely see as well how things could get a bit dicey for Microsoft. Mind you we have no precedent for this kind of move so it's hard to say how the majority of people would react. I think the biggest factor are the 3 prices.
For example let's say PS5 is priced withing 50 bucks of the Series X. I think the idea of PS5 middle ground would be significantly diminished. We have heard that Sony is struggling with the price so this may be possible. When I say 50 dollar difference this could be 499 to 449 or 549 to 499. There marketing psychology that goes into pricing, hence the whole "x99" thing. So I'm considering that as well. With that being said, in a situation like this, The Series S at $299 would shine and both the PS5 and Series X would be seen as premium offers.
With a neat 100 dollar gap between the 3, I would agree, Series X could be in trouble.
Stuart360
Member
Some tech people have speculated the PS5 SSD, as it is, would probably cost about $300 to us, now obviously it wouldnt cost Sony $300, but how much cheaper could they get it than us?, $200?, $150?, would £100 even be realistic for Sony?Tht wasst the context of tht comment. It was clearly referring to over heating
I do think XSX will be more expensive but i think it will be $50 tops. Thats why neither want to give pricing yet, but someones going to have to at some point.
Bryank75
Banned
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TLZ
Banned
So what does mostly mean? 90-99% of the time? Compared to how everyone here is trying to say it's a 9.2tf gpu most of the time?
Psykodad
Banned
Completely agree. Even with 2 Xbox units, there is nothing set in stone.
But people do overlook certain things.
Like how Sony seems to be struggling with the price, but we have no idea what's happening on Xbox' side.
Like I said, there's the Series S rumor. Because XSX pricing also needs to take a Series S into consideration if it exists.
Stuart360
Member
Yes corporate stooges, in a promotion reveal, have never been known to bend the truth a little, or even flat out lie.You know better than Cerny
Pallas
Gold Member
I see it only a problem if Series S and PS5 are priced too close together. Series S(If it even exists) really needs to be priced competitively and even at a lost if needed, if they can make it $150 or even $200(doubtful but hey) cheaper than the PS5 then that would do wonders.
octiny
Banned
Elaborate more, Mr. Cowell.
I want to see how Cerny and his team did not foresee these issues and not create custom based architecture to mitigate these. Tell me, Mr. Cowell
Honest to God, did some of you even watch the entire 52 minute panel?
There's nothing to elaborate on. We'll have similar based GPUs from AMD before the consoles even launch. You're stretching the word "custom" to laughable proportions. Binning starts from the top & litters down to the bottom (resulting in what I said, again, re-read my post). It's common sense. 52 CU to get to 10TF will always be more efficient (vs 36 CU's @ 10TF). In similar fashion as a 9900K would use/need less voltage (=less power/heat) when disabling Hyperthreading vs a 9700K (which has no HT to begin with) at the same speeds to be stable. It's how binning works, consoles are no different.
SImply put, it's not that Sony didn't mitigate for it, they were simply caught off guard with rumored Xbox numbers. The same core chip has stayed the same, 36 cu's. They simply upped the clocks. No one in their right mind would clock it so high (in a console) from the start. It was too late for them to change course. They were put in a similar position as Xbox One (when they upped both the GPU & CPU clocks prior to launch, albeit slightly).
Rumour: Sony Paying More for Top Quality Cooling System in PS5
No more fan noise?
www.pushsquare.com
I'm 100% positive Sony would've opted for a higher CU count w/ lower clock speeds had they known Series X was going to be the beast it currently is, for the simple reason w/ how much money they are putting towards the cooling in it (again, re-reread my first post). It's counterproductive any way you look at it. Which is what this thread is about, correct?
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Old Retro
Member
Friend, the console wars were decided decades ago. All this benchmark weeb bullshit means nothing.
siekro1983
Banned
You know better than Cerny
cerny said it himself the clock speed will adjust when things get hot.
TLZ
Banned
So Cerny says it's mostly at 10.3, and you say it's generally lower.
Who should I believe?
Besides, why won't you give PS5 the 10.3? What difference does it make? You have your 12.1 don't you? Isn't that all you should care about? Isn't 1.8tf enough of a difference? Does pushing that extra 0.5tf win matter that much?
At the end of the day XSX has the power crown now. Just sit back relax and enjoy every gigaflop of it. Let the others enjoy their 10.3!
Jigsaah
Gold Member
It's not even a confirmed thing that Sony is struggling with it. I think that came outta Forbes, so I take it with a grain of salt.
Psykodad
Banned
Seems reasonable.
That's why I think the "war" has only just begun.
And it's gonna be more interesting as well. Current-gen was a bit boring as far as competition's concerned.
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MaulerX
Member
Tht wasst the context of tht comment. It was clearly referring to over heating
The fuckery is you misinterpreting the context of the comment. High clocks like that need more expensive cooling to avoid what you inferred and thus jives with the possibility that the PS5 might cost the same as Xbox while being less powerful. Or do you honestly think that the possibility of this happening is not there?
Deeper Underground
Member
lol man stop. You (and your several alts) got banned from ResetEra for doing this same mess before. I’m just going to end the conversation here because you are truly in the Sunken Place of Video Games Lol.
Jtibh
Banned
This console was designed WITH and FOR kojima.
3d audio , haptik controls, insane ultra fast ssd......
Walking through the mountains in death stranding i will finally hear norman fart tornados from his unhealthy diet of energy drinks and whatever the shit he is picking up from the ground. All this like i am truly there to the point i am opening windows as i am convinced it was me.
3d audio , haptik controls, insane ultra fast ssd......
Walking through the mountains in death stranding i will finally hear norman fart tornados from his unhealthy diet of energy drinks and whatever the shit he is picking up from the ground. All this like i am truly there to the point i am opening windows as i am convinced it was me.
Pallas
Gold Member
Ahhh man I wish these wars would just end lol
It’s just with the general consumer, they aren’t really focused on the general specs(though tflops may matter to them now, idk) like we are. Price is probably the most important detail for them, well that and if it can play their games smoothly.
Jtibh
Banned
Whatcha doing here from resetera? You lost?
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