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Next-Gen PS5 & XSX |OT| Console tEch threaD

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Entroyp

Member

Apologies if it’s frowned upon to link to other forums, but this post is an excellent description of what fixed power draw and variable clocks actually means to real world compute.

The zone in pink is all that matters. Not a theoretical number.

Useful work done = power draw, not frequency.

Uh.. well now I know how that part of the system works.
 

SSfox

Member
So regarding the Bloodborne rumours,

From one unsubstantiated rumour to another.



Not gonna be disappointed if the 60 bucks BB upscale is fake, but i absolutely hope the DmS remake is a real thing.

Not feeling that one, I think there have been far better.

Would look better like this bit in those white colours.

ps5-devkit-render.jpg


Or more like this...

frd8FnHRG5JCYpT8MjL6y7-1200-80.jpg


Or this one is great and has just looks like it'll be super fast...

ps5_dv5.png

Last one looks like some super sexy sport car design. I really love it.

Funny how quickly people forgot which company supported cross-play with PC the most for many years and which flip-flopped with the help of media propaganda for maximum impact. The shit-show is there alright, you just refuse to see the extent of it.

Microsoft started supporting Crossplay in this gen only because they were in bad position and had bad reputation to save their ass and look good among gamers, people forgot how they were against it during PS360 era. (I even believe in old interviews the SE guy said FF14 didn't come on Xbox because MS didn't want crossplay with PS...)
 
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Tiago07

Member
Excuse me Sir but that asset duplication goes for both MS and Sony. This has to do with the SSD Tech itself. It is NOT something that Sony invented/introduced.

As long as you are using SSD instead of an HDD you won't need this duplicated data...

Thanks for the replying. Ok I can agree with you in a time that BCPack can be efficiently to place the textures first and extra load times for the other things. But I haven't seen yet, this discussion of Duplicated Data with the XSX, only with PS5, so if you're right, this is my fault.


I have seen some people talked about my thread, and I think I gave the wrong Idea what I wanted to say and I see some people disappointed with me.

Guys what I really wanted to say is, we have already see a test speed in XSX and with the real game size, the XSX possibility load it instantly but don't. It was a Bottleneck case ?, have MS removed all Bottlenecks ?, Or a current-gen game cannot use Velocity Architecture advantages ?

I'm not saying the real I/O speed of XSX, will be less than 1gb/s, but based in this test COULD be. Sony already did a custom Flash chip and a custom I/O with all the technologies to make the real 100x speed advantage over the PS4, and we only know about Microsoft Decompression Block.

Sorry if some understand this like, PS5 is RDNA1 or PS5 doesn't have HW Ray Tracing (Same Vibes).

My personal predictions / opnion ?

I think MS is making a hard job to develop the BCpack, so I belive the textures streaming will use all of 4.8gb/s speed. So if SeX have some bottlenecks the extra load time will be for everything else in the data, and we will obviously sense the real NextGen advantage for games, even if PS5 can do more things (but for this we will need to wait the tests and FirstParty games).

I think PS5 Architecture is a real crazy thing, and everyone is amazed with what is possible now, so we downplay the XSX more than we thought. Let's wait and see. Sorry for you guys if I gave the other idea.
 
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Neo Blaster

Member

Apologies if it’s frowned upon to link to other forums, but this post is an excellent description of what fixed power draw and variable clocks actually means to real world compute.

The zone in pink is all that matters. Not a theoretical number.

Useful work done = power draw, not frequency.
Wonderful explanation!!
 
Since Sony had to postpone the PS5 event will we know have the Xbox event also later, or will they know basically fall in the same week. Would be a great week actually.
Was not until July .... man why so many time hahaha
Wouldn't surprise me if this was his plan to reach a wider audience.
Well I prefer this kind of strategies than which many pc gaming channels follows ..... which is think than the
PCs are build using technologies only available for aliens or something which make it invencible.
Guess what, they say exactly the same about the PS community. Who would've thought that? Whenever you have a preference the other side always looks crazy
The PlayStation VP are not quoting fanboys like the Xbox do so if you think that is normal sure and the xbox fans say of the ps fans only talk of exclusives .... I know
is crazy one side use as main argument the quality of the games (very similar to Nintendo fans) instead to just say but Microsoft has more money and VP of Xbox
say the TF are the most important.
You guys seen the RTX 3080? It has leaked. The design is pretty nice!
That was a blower design please tell me not.
 

MoreJRPG

Suffers from extreme PDS
See generations before, where devs squeezed so much out of systems, even with weaker specs. FFVIIR and TLOU2 are incredible lookers, as well as God of War, which run on Jaguar and small GPUs.

At 30fps you can make a lot of great looking games. A lot goes into the engine as well. Decima is incredible with how good Death Stranding looks. I can't wait to play it on PC at it's maximum potential.
 
Was not until July .... man why so many time hahaha

Well I prefer this kind of strategies than which many pc gaming channels follows ..... which is think than the
PCs are build using technologies only available for aliens or something which make it invencible.

The PlayStation VP are not quoting fanboys like the Xbox do so if you think that is normal sure and the xbox fans say of the ps fans only talk of exclusives .... I know
is crazy one side use as main argument the quality of the games (very similar to Nintendo fans) instead to just say but Microsoft has more money and VP of Xbox
say the TF are the most important.

That was a blower design please tell me not.
Not a blower. Double fans, one on each side of the GPU.
 

Mars2003

Neo Member
This won't age well.
I'm not so sure, I've had a look through his tweets and there does at least seem to be a well thought line of thinking, all based on small snippets of tangible evidence.
He may well be wrong, but saying he's wrong based on blind faith/wishful thinking is a bit silly. Bring a better arguement to the table or be quiet until the metrics exist to build the better arguement.
Always remember that absence of evidence is not evidence of absence, however I do wonder why Sony is staying quiet on so many aspects of PS5.
 

Bo_Hazem

Banned
I'm not so sure, I've had a look through his tweets and there does at least seem to be a well thought line of thinking, all based on small snippets of tangible evidence.
He may well be wrong, but saying he's wrong based on blind faith/wishful thinking is a bit silly. Bring a better arguement to the table or be quiet until the metrics exist to build the better arguement.
Always remember that absence of evidence is not evidence of absence, however I do wonder why Sony is staying quiet on so many aspects of PS5.

Maybe you can read the thread thoroughly before throwing words like blind faith/wishful thinking. We've raped the topic several times and it's gaping wide open at this point.

You've been absent.
 

juaco1993

Neo Member
Hey guys, I'm curious, I wonder what speed engineers managed to get out of PS5 exactly, anyone willing to ask on twitter for me? I'm legit afraid saying things in such a wrong way that I might get smitten down by one of Tim's TRUTHFACT thunderbolts. :messenger_anxious:
Hello there, what speed do you want to know? Exact technical details about how Unreal Engine 5 works are still under NDA. The speeds we do know are transfer speed of the ps5 ssd which are 5,5GB/s of uncompressed data and 8-9GB/s of compressed data.
Cheers!
 
I am trying to understand how much risk Sony accepted earlier on to push for the much higher clock speeds. It seems like Sony was willing to accept the risk of having a 9TF console if AMD couldn't deliver. Were there any hints early on that RDNA2 was capable of much higher clocks? In all of predictions, I don't remember anyone betting on clock speeds that high.

Do you think Sony was aiming for a higher clockspeed than where they ended up? Did MS go wide and slow to guarantee they hit 12+ with less risk?
 

Bo_Hazem

Banned
I am trying to understand how much risk Sony accepted earlier on to push for the much higher clock speeds. It seems like Sony was willing to accept the risk of having a 9TF console if AMD couldn't deliver. Were there any hints early on that RDNA2 was capable of much higher clocks? In all of predictions, I don't remember anyone betting on clock speeds that high.

Do you think Sony was aiming for a higher clockspeed than where they ended up? Did MS go wide and slow to guarantee they hit 12+ with less risk?

I think they're putting into account a chiplet, 3D stacked apu like last time for a PS5 Pro 3-4 years later. AMD itself is going for only 36-40CU stackable going forward for better yields.
 
I am trying to understand how much risk Sony accepted earlier on to push for the much higher clock speeds. It seems like Sony was willing to accept the risk of having a 9TF console if AMD couldn't deliver. Were there any hints early on that RDNA2 was capable of much higher clocks? In all of predictions, I don't remember anyone betting on clock speeds that high.

Do you think Sony was aiming for a higher clockspeed than where they ended up? Did MS go wide and slow to guarantee they hit 12+ with less risk?

it sounds like a fairly calculated target. My main question in all of this is how does the size of the APU in PS5 compare to that of XSX

Die size is the truly limiting factor in all of this and it’s not practical to go too much beyond a given size.

we know that Sony’s IO solution has a ton of fixed hardware, the audio engine is also fairly robust. It’s quite likely that this takes up a hefty amount of real estate.

if XSX is about the same size as PS5 that will give us a good idea why. If XSX is significantly bigger, then I suspect cost was the main concern.
 
it sounds like a fairly calculated target. My main question in all of this is how does the size of the APU in PS5 compare to that of XSX

Die size is the truly limiting factor in all of this and it’s not practical to go too much beyond a given size.

we know that Sony’s IO solution has a ton of fixed hardware, the audio engine is also fairly robust. It’s quite likely that this takes up a hefty amount of real estate.

if XSX is about the same size as PS5 that will give us a good idea why. If XSX is significantly bigger, then I suspect cost was the main concern.
That is a very good point, clearly they prioritized I/O and 3D Audio; which forced them to look for ways to hit their targets with less CUs. Still curious why the higher clock speeds caught everyone by surprise; it seems like it was kept pretty quiet by AMD and Sony.
When all of the GitHub stuff came out, many people seemed incredulous even at 2ghz
 

Lunatic_Gamer

Gold Member
AMD’s SmartShift tech for faster frame-rates won’t be in any more laptops until 2021 (but will boost PS5)

AMD’s SmartShift tech, which boosts performance in laptops with AMD processors and GPUs, might be in the recently released Dell G5 15 SE gaming portable, but it won’t be in any other notebooks this year.

One interesting twist, however, is that both of the next-gen consoles from Microsoft and Sony pair AMD CPUs and GPUs, and Sony has already confirmed that the PS5 will use SmartShift to help get the most from its components.

So we will see another SmartShift-toting machine this year, but it won’t be a laptop, it’ll be the PS5 – and possibly also the Xbox Series X. As we discussed when AMD first revealed this technology back at CES, SmartShift could be a key part of how next-gen consoles realize their full performance potential.

For now though, the gaming laptop world will have to wait to see how this technology will more broadly impact on performance levels, and perhaps just as crucially, battery life – which has always been a thorny area for gaming portables.

 

ToadMan

Member
AMD’s SmartShift tech for faster frame-rates won’t be in any more laptops until 2021 (but will boost PS5)

AMD’s SmartShift tech, which boosts performance in laptops with AMD processors and GPUs, might be in the recently released Dell G5 15 SE gaming portable, but it won’t be in any other notebooks this year.

One interesting twist, however, is that both of the next-gen consoles from Microsoft and Sony pair AMD CPUs and GPUs, and Sony has already confirmed that the PS5 will use SmartShift to help get the most from its components.

So we will see another SmartShift-toting machine this year, but it won’t be a laptop, it’ll be the PS5 – and possibly also the Xbox Series X. As we discussed when AMD first revealed this technology back at CES, SmartShift could be a key part of how next-gen consoles realize their full performance potential.

For now though, the gaming laptop world will have to wait to see how this technology will more broadly impact on performance levels, and perhaps just as crucially, battery life – which has always been a thorny area for gaming portables.


To be honest I can’t see why MS wouldn’t use it if the technology is available to them.

I suppose there could be architectural, PSU or customer hardware reasons what they aren’t implementing it but if there no reason not to, mate as well flick it on.
 

Neo Blaster

Member
I am trying to understand how much risk Sony accepted earlier on to push for the much higher clock speeds. It seems like Sony was willing to accept the risk of having a 9TF console if AMD couldn't deliver. Were there any hints early on that RDNA2 was capable of much higher clocks? In all of predictions, I don't remember anyone betting on clock speeds that high.

Do you think Sony was aiming for a higher clockspeed than where they ended up? Did MS go wide and slow to guarantee they hit 12+ with less risk?
Cerny made it pretty clear in the deep dive he always preferred higher clocks than more CUs.
 

Radical_3d

Member
I'm surprised that there are no leaks from Sony event, not even one leak
With this economy everyone must be very afraid about their jobs but I’m also a little surprised. Even I, and I’m not an insider, have info about next gen (don’t ask please, I can’t tell). I’d thought that this would leak more with everyone at their homes and the fact that by this time of the year in previous generations we had all the info. I guess that ninjas are more terrifying now.
 
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Neo Blaster

Member
With this economy everyone must be very afraid about their jobs but I’m also a little surprised. Even I, and I’m not an insider, have info about next gen (don’t ask please, I can’t tell). I’d thought that this would leak more with everyone at their homes and the fact that by this time of the year in previous generations we had all the info. I guess that ninjas are more terrifying now.
images
 

SlimySnake

Flashless at the Golden Globes
If this BloodBorne remaster rumor is true and Sony actually charge existing users for it, then I'm going to give them a lot of shit. And it has nothing to do with so that, 'Studio who put the work in get paid'. Well, that's Sonys' prerogative, pay them a huge stack of cash or cut them a certain %. It's their headache. MS have a dedicated BC team whose sole purpose is to enhance the existing games for future consoles, I'm sure they are being paid well.

There are folks who paid full price for this game, some picked it up for cheap, and held onto it in hope Sony would bother with a Pro patch. Which never arrived, now once they are actually putting the effort in, which is only accessible via gateway hardware i.e. (PS5, you'd still need to buy it) and then ask existing users to pay for it? What a huge slap in the face. Ideally, they'd just put out a new SKU for fresh users who are jumping into the eco-system and offer the upgrade free of cost for existing users (cause they'd still have to buy your PS5 to play in first instance). But, current strategy seems to be of, charge existing users for upgrade, charge new users the same, and oh, if there are people who don't want to pick up the hardware, well we're putting out a PC SKU as well. It just reeks of maximizing profits, and while from business standpoint it makes a lot of sense, in the end they're shafting the long term users, which is what SlimySnake SlimySnake alluded to in his posts.

I really hope they don't hang us existing users out to dry by charging for remasters, it's a tired philosophy and I gave them a pass for it due to BC issues from PS3 -> PS4. But, for next-gen there is zero excuses to do so, especially when their biggest competitor is going all-out when it comes to Enhanced BC.
Yep. This doesn't make much sense. They gave me Journey and Flower for free on PS4, so it's possible this might be a free upgrade to PS4 owners of bloodborne.

However, this would effectively take away marketing cycles and hype away from their full demon souls remake. it makes zero sense to launch the ps5 with both bloodborne and demon souls.

i have no idea whats going on over at sony. if only they would just do their conference so at least we know which direction they are headed in. right now, its just one bad news and more fud after another.

EDIT: i just realized something. i heard a rumor that sony was trying to make up for the delay. what if they are gonna be giving away the BB remaster as part of their PS+ lineup for launch.
 
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