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[TheGodfather07]

what about spider-man 2, naughty dog and sucker punch's next game? surly they'll be ps5 exclusive and not cross gen? surely not everything will be cross gen as we already have games that are exclusive to ps5. im sure theres more coming.

 

[Andodalf]

The pandemic was just an excuse? Do you know what's been going on in the world for the last year?

It’s very easy to tell many gaffers think that nothing has changed in the world because moms basement hasn’t changed one bit. GAF is very out of touch!

 

[Ass of Can Whooping]

It turns out that you can still have large open-worlds if you dial down other assets to compensate for lower spec hardware.....

Zelda would require different assets, not scaled up assets, to not look like a PS2 games

 

[FunkMiller]

It turns out that you can still have large open-worlds if you dial down other assets to compensate for lower spec hardware.....

Ah right... so it’s all about the ability to just scale things down to fit on a lesser machine. Every game can be put on everything, as long as its assets are scaled back.

Okay... why isn’t Ratchet on PS4? Why isn’t Demon’s Souls? Or Returnal? Why isn’t The Medium on Xbox One? Why aren’t all modern PC games able to run on ten + year old GPUs and CPUs?

 

[Birdo]

Why isn’t Demon’s Souls?

Demon's Souls ran on PS3.

 

[JoeBudden]

Once again... God Of War Ragnarok being on PS4 has nothing to do with the pandemic. It was in development long before it started.

And most people (Myself included) aren’t so much annoyed at Sony for doing cross gen, but for not being more up front about before the Ps5 launched. Some of us may have made a different purchasing choice has they been more transparent.

It doesn't matter if the game was in development before the pandemic. Every business in the world has lost money in this pandemic. Sony is clearly looking to make up for that. This is why only their top selling franchises are cross gen and games like Demon's Soul, Returnal and Ratchet are exclusive.

 

[Guilty_AI]

Ah right... so it’s all about the ability to just scale things down to fit on a lesser machine. Every game can be put on everything, as long as its assets are scaled back.

Okay... why isn’t Ratchet on PS4? Why isn’t Demon’s Souls? Or Returnal? Why isn’t The Medium on Xbox One? Why aren’t all modern PC games able to run on ten + year old GPUs and CPUs?

Publishers decisions obviously, they need to give people reasons to get a new hardware.
Demon Souls was DESIGNED to run on a ps3, theres absolutely 0 reason why the remake couldn't have been scaled down to a ps4.

 

[ecentre]

Thank god that the PS5 have new games released and soon to be so we can argue about how bad they are.
Some consoles dont even have that.

 

[Techno_Inked]

What's even more crazy is that MS is primed to be the one to release the first truly next-gen only games. Maybe it was smart of MS to skip out the first year?

What games are you talking about? Also, maybe it's smart for MS to skip out for this and the coming 5 years too

 

[FunkMiller]

Demon's Souls ran on PS3.

What about Ratchet? The Medium?

 

[jroc74]

Once again... God Of War Ragnarok being on PS4 has nothing to do with the pandemic. It was in development long before it started.

And most people (Myself included) aren’t so much annoyed at Sony for doing cross gen, but for not being more up front about before the Ps5 launched. Some of us may have made a different purchasing choice has they been more transparent.

The OP has a valid point, and I get this, because GT7 actually said PS5 exclusive. Ratchet n Clank is interesting because I have no idea if thats a strong IP. It might be according to Sony.

What some are upset about is this:

MS-no Series exclusives for the first 2 years.
Sony-we believe in generations.

MS flat out stated what was up, Sony basically said we will do like we have always done.


Here's my thing....if they woulda said we will have a mix of cross gen and exclusives....then the questions woulda been ok, which games? And to that, with GT7 now being listed as cross gen....would they have ever been able to say which games?

It becomes a never ending cycle of pr anwsers and questions.

Both MS and Sony know what position they are in as far as releasing games, so they both gave answers based on that.

We are debating about cross gen games.....and between 2020-2021 Sony has....... 11...fucking games total, (10 exclusive games....) released: (5 PS5 exclusive) EDIT: (added some cross games I forgot about)

TLoU 2
GoT
Dreams
Astro Playroom
Demon's Souls
Miles Morales
Sack Boy
The Show 21
Destruction All Starts
Returnal
Rift Apart


With HFW on track for this year.

So...again, OP has a valid point, but....how were they not up front? Because they didnt say specifically which games?

....They have never done that before....ever. They did like they have always done, release a mix of cross gen and next gen exclusives.

The problem is ppl mistakenly expected Sony to be the complete opposite of MS. Only thing they cant get a pass on is GT7 since that said PS5 exclusive.

 

[Birdo]

What about Ratchet? The Medium?

Both could be reworked for last-gen if Sony really wanted.

 

[FunkMiller]

Publishers decisions obviously, they need to give people reasons to get a new hardware.
Demon Souls was DESIGNED to run on a ps3, theres absolutely 0 reason why the remake couldn't have been scaled down to a ps4.

So why isn’t Ratchet on PS4? Clearly Sony have no issues with cross gen games. Hell, why isn’t Astro’s Playroom on PS4 too?

 

[FunkMiller]

Both could be reworked on last-gen if Sony really wanted.

So why haven’t they?

 

[Ass of Can Whooping]

The OP has a valid point, and I get this, because GT7 actually said PS5 exclusive.

What some are upset about is this:

MS-no Series exclusives for the first 2 years.
Sony-we believe in generations.

MS flat out stated what was up, Sony basically said we will do like we have always done.


Here's my thing....if they woulda said we will have a mix of cross gen and exclusives....then the questions woulda been ok, which games? And to that, with GT7 now being listed as cross gen....would they have ever been able to say which games?

It becomes a never ending cycle of pr anwsers and questions.

Both MS and Sony know what position they are in as far as releasing games, so they both gave answers based on that.

We are debating about cross gen games.....and between 2020-2021 Sony has....... 8....fucking exclusive games in total....released: (5 PS5 exclusive)

TLoU 2
GoT
Dreams
Astro Playroom
Demon's Souls
Destruction All Starts
Returnal
Rift Apart


With HFW on track for this year.

So...again, OP has a valid point, but....how were they not up front? Because they didnt say specifically which games?

....They have never done that before....ever. They did like they have always done, release a mix of cross gen and next gen exclusives.

The problem is ppl mistakenly expected Sony to be the complete opposite of MS. Only thing they cant get a pass on is GT7 since that said PS5 exclusive.

People need to stop bringing up MS

Sony lied about their next-gen exclusives

MS lied about having games

 

[N30RYU]

tbh i don't care about PS4 ports if the PS5 versions run at 60fps have better image qulity and fully use the dualsense

 

[Birdo]

So why haven’t they?

 

[Guilty_AI]

So why isn’t Ratchet on PS4? Clearly Sony have no issues with cross gen games. Hell, why isn’t Astro’s Playroom on PS4 too?

Cause their intention is more to advertise the PS5 than sell copies. In which case it wouldn't make sense if they also released them in their older hardware.

 

[FunkMiller]

It doesn't matter if the game was in development before the pandemic. Every business in the world has lost money in this pandemic. Sony is clearly looking to make up for that. This is why only their top selling franchises are cross gen and games like Demon's Soul, Returnal and Ratchet are exclusive.

So, God Of War Ragnarok is now on PS4 too because of the pandemic that started long after God Of War Ragnarok started development?

 

[FunkMiller]

Cause their intention is more to advertise the PS5 than sell copies. In which case it wouldn't make sense if they also released them in their older hardware.

So why are God Of War and Horizon on PS4. Why does it makes sense to release them on PS4 and nor Ratchet or Returnal?

Why did it not make sense to Microsoft to put The Medium out on Xbox One?

 

[FunkMiller]

The answer that your trying to avoid is: Ratchet and The Medium aren’t out on older consoles, because they couldn’t run them.

 

[JoeBudden]

So, God Of War Ragnarok is now on PS4 too because of the pandemic that started long after God Of War Ragnarok started development?

Maybe read my entire post.

 

[EDMIX]

Title - it is ridiculous that from onward into the nearest future we have only one Sony IP AAA game to be released with only PS5 in mind - Ratchet and Clank.

This is more sad when you think that to see truly next gen Gow/horizon (biggest Sony ip's) we will have to wait 4-5 years not to mention that another GT game might not come to this gen (polyphony is really taking their time). I wouldn't mind for GT7 to be whole-gen game with updates across the generation but with PS4 dragging it down it does not seems like a good idea. Imagine 5 years into the future Polyphony will have to Dlc on ps4 too.

Not to mention really disingenuous Sony marketing showing GT7 and other titles as PS5 exclusives and not mentioning PS4 versions while making fun of Xbox at the same time. Sony is becoming the Apple of gaming with its arrogance...

I disagree.

The teams you are talking about are not the only teams working on PS5.

You are crying over launch window games.

 

[Duchess]

Well, one way to look at it is that as the generation goes on, we'll only see the PS5 looking more and more powerful. Kinda like what tend to happen with these new machines, anyway.

 

[Krappadizzle]

Turns out, you're allowed to wait to buy a product until it gives you what you want. Whodathunk?

 

[jroc74]

People need to stop bringing up MS

Sony lied about their next-gen exclusives

MS lied about having games

lol, I edited that post, forgot about some cross gen games.

 

[Birdo]

The answer that your trying to avoid is: Ratchet and The Medium aren’t out on older consoles, because they couldn’t run them.

Or Sony wanted some exclusive games for their brand new console?

 

[FunkMiller]

Maybe read my entire post.

I did. You’re trying to say that God Of War Ragnarok is on PS4 because of the pandemic:

”Sony, like everyone else, was obviously impacted by the pandemic. That's why they're doing this.”

 

[Aion002]

You don't understand difference between graphic quality and game design. I never said that games will look bad on PS5 because of PS4. My main problem is that game design will be toned done to things possible on PS4. The experience will be hampered down by 10 years old hardware. Now imagine that PC games had to run on 10 years old GPU and CPU. Tell me what current games you can run on 10yo pc right now...

There is some kind of missconception about next Gen - many people only things that the image quality (graphics) is the only thing that next Gen brings to the table. But there is much more too it - with new hardware devs are free of limitation of old gen. You just don't seems to notice anything beside image quality. Things like animation and inverse kinematic, physics, AI etc. it's all part of the experience. Go play FF7R and see how many times you need to squeeze through some kind of spot - you thing devs add those kind of features because they are "fun"? No, it's a band aid to slow loadings.

GoW on ps4 is full of those solutions, elevators, portals, the tree rotating, slow lake swimming etc. Does it make game bad? No, GoW was brilliant. But could it be better? Ofc it could...

You think sliders are the solution to anything but that's not it. You can't slider down ammount of enemies or level size. Or I case of Spider Man - they said you could not swing faster and that they had to slow down Spiderman after free fall because PS4 hdd could not keep up with loading the city. Now go see Miles Morales - does he swinhs faster? No he does not. Why? Because chase sequences were design with PS4 travelsal speed. This is what I mean. Changing core gameplay to keep up with old hardware.

Maybe SantaMonica wanted to allow Kratos to fly with the Mjolnir just like Thor but guess what - this thing is out of the window right at the stage of pre production because devs are aware of Ps4 capabilities.

The whole game design is compromised to the old hardware. Why you never see AC kind of game where you could climb up everywhere on map on PS2? You think it's because noone ever thought about it? No, it's because the hardware was limited at that time...

Why we never had game like uncharted on PS1 but just in lower res and lower effects? Because PS1 could not handle słuch a big zones and complex animations. Your whole point is failing if you think the only thing where games are evolving is in image quality...

You really don't know what scalability is on games in the past gens...

You can increase enemy quantity, draw distance, effects and even features if needed. Heck Battlefield on ps360 had less players per match than on pc for example.


Another example is the Wii, that received many ps360 games with less features.

In this gen we already have games with less features on the ps4, like Miles Morales, that on the ps5 have many new stuff like RT, faster loads, improved graphics, 60 frames and more, another example is DMC5, on ps5 it has a shit ton of more enemies on screen and other improvements.

Anyway... Comparing the ps2 jump to the ps3 (it was way bigger) with this gen is silly... Things are way too different now.

Also, if Santa Monica wants to make Kratos flying around on the ps4... Well they can, it sure as hell won't be good as on the Ps5, but it is doable... Even if it has a shitty draw distance and plays at 15 frames... That never stopped Drakengard anyway.

 

[FunkMiller]

Or Sony wanted some exclusive games for their brand new consoles

Ah yes... Sony, who have clearly demonstrated that they want cross gen games because they make more money, decided to put out a Ratchet game just on Ps5, even though it could easily be adjusted to run on PS4.

And Microsoft, who have clearly demonstrated that they want cross gen games because they make more money, decided to put out The Medium just on Series X/S, even though it could easily be adjusted to run on Xbox One.

 

[EDMIX]

The pandemic and global chip shortage have absolutely nothing to do with why God Of War is on the Ps4. The game would have been in production long before the pandemic or shortage started.

I disagree.

The game being in full production doesn't mean the pandemic didn't get Sony to get them working on another version, doesn't mean the chip shortage didn't get them to focus on their larger install base thus having more versions be cross platform.

I'm sorry but....we all knew God Of War wasn't coming this fall, it was a trailer with a logo, how long it was in development is actually irrelevant. All that matters is the pandemic effected MANY THINGS for Sony to have some of their teams do cross plat titles.

"Sony, who have clearly demonstrated that they want cross gen games because they make more money, decided to put out a Ratchet game just on Ps5, even though it could easily be adjusted to run on PS4."

Maybe, maybe not. We are not Insomniac. We don't know JUST how much of that tech pretty much is the meat of the whole concept of Ratchet and Clank to really pretend it can easily work on PS4.

All this shows is that some games can work with it, some can't.

 

[meernakh]

While that might be true OP (eventho the cross gen games look fine) who’s to say next year you won’t get a new IP or Reboot that will instantly be great. Afterall, both gow reboot and horizon came out of nowhere (so to speak)

 

[NahaNago]

The pandemic was just an excuse? Do you know what's been going on in the world for the last year?

I'm well aware that there is a pandemic but don't you think it is the least bit possible that they made the financial decision to put the game on ps4 because of the large number of owners and used the pandemic as an excuse to push back the game so they could officially do so. These games were suppose to be released this year so debugging and optimization should have been predominantly done last year. You get the ps5 selling out and you get to sell games on the ps4 a win , win. I'm not faulting them for putting the game on ps4. It makes a lot of sense. They should have have been clear and announced that these games were coming to both platforms at the start. We would have a lot less drama if they had done so.

 

[FunkMiller]

I disagree.

The game being in full production doesn't mean the pandemic didn't get Sony to get them working on another version, doesn't mean the chip shortage didn't get them to focus on their larger install base thus having more versions be cross platform.

I'm sorry but....we all knew God Of War wasn't coming this fall, it was a trailer with a logo, how long it was in development is actually irrelevant. All that matters is the pandemic effected MANY THINGS for Sony to have some of their teams do cross plat titles.

Dude... the game would have started development in 2018. Sony first party had the dev kits for Ps5 at that stage. They made the decision to make the game for both Ps4 and Ps5 then.

The pandemic has fucked a lot of things up, but it’s not the reason God Of War is cross gen.

And again... it’s not the decision to make it cross gen that matters really: it’s the fact they werent transparent about it prior to the Ps5’s release.

 

[nbkicker]

I did. You’re trying to say that God Of War Ragnarok is on PS4 because of the pandemic:

”Sony, like everyone else, was obviously impacted by the pandemic. That's why they're doing this.”

The pandemic has nothing todo with this , from the start microsoft has stated they believe in software across there systems new and old, where sony came out and said the only place to play new outstanding games is the ps5, then since then all the games they showcased at there event have now a ps4 version apart from ratchet , all the games which have a ps4 version will have been made for that and then extra stuff added for ps5, but if the game is running on ps4, why did sony put there super fast ssd inside ps5 and make a big fuss over it, cause apart from ratchet it looks like bit of a waste of money apart from loading slightly faster then the ps4, its like there that many people in charge or having a say at sony they dont no what there doing , its like microsoft have got there shit together since the ps4/xbox launch and sacked people and sony have hired them

 

[SlimySnake]

If these games come out in 2022, the following would be true:

Horizon 2 would've taken 5 years to make.
Gow 4 years to make.
Gt7 4.5-5 years

We won't see next gen games from these studios until 2026-2027. 7 years into the gen. Let's hope they are two team studios and they have other stuff in the works simultaneously. But gt8, gow3 and horizon 3 def aren't coming out till 2027.

 

[ManaByte]

The answer that your trying to avoid is: Ratchet and The Medium aren’t out on older consoles, because they couldn’t run them.

Street Fighter Alpha 2 came out on the fucking SNES. Anything is possible if you want to sell your game to a huge installed base.

 

[EDMIX]

They made the decision to make the game for both Ps4 and Ps5 then.

None of us know that for a fact though.

They could have started development on PS4 knowing that PS5 was coming out and it stilled used x86 and then moved a lot over to PS5 when they got dev kits and then had to change stuff when they were told recently based on the pandemic and other changes that it would be cross gen.

Who knows.

So I don't think you can say it was made then anymore then I can say it was made NOW lol When ever that choice was made.....it was made. Clearly it was made on a game by game basis as several PS5 exclusives exist. This wouldn't even be the first time a game went to a lessor platform after announcement.

The Crew actually did to 360.

The Crew confirmed for Xbox 360

The next beta for The Crew coming to Xbox One and PS4.

www.gamereactor.eu

Its like saying they made their decision at the start of development or something. Maybe, maybe not. Keep in mind, they don't have systems to sell, they have no ode to lie about such a thing. It simply sounds like its on a game by game basis.

Which is why some games where announced cross plat from the start, some full exclusive from the start, some, later on announced cross plat etc Maybe its not a 100% we all knew day 1 type of deal as why even confirm those other cross plat games that launched? It tells me that its more likely the decision might have been made recently vs from the very start, as why even Ratchet or Demon Souls remake exclusive? It doesn't really support that whole "cross plat from the start for more moneys" narrative.

ManaByte "Street Fighter Alpha 2 came out on the fucking SNES. Anything is possible if you want to sell your game to a huge installed base." I don't know about all that.

What they are doing with Ratchet sounds hard enough and complex enough that its not a simply res or frame change or something. Insomniac is a extremely talented team with tech, if they were going to lie about cross gen to move units.

It would be with Spider man bud, not with Ratchet lol If Insomniac is saying it can't work that way, I'd trust what they are saying. They already did a cross gen game with Spiderman Mile Morales, so....its not like they can't if it was open to or it was feasible or something. It sounds like the concept they have going relies deeply on the SSD to do that world thing.

 

[skit_data]

The pandemic has nothing todo with this , from the start microsoft has stated they believe in software across there systems new and old, where sony came out and said the only place to play new outstanding games is the ps5, then since then all the games they showcased at there event have now a ps4 version apart from ratchet , all the games which have a ps4 version will have been made for that and then extra stuff added for ps5, but if the game is running on ps4, why did sony put there super fast ssd inside ps5 and make a big fuss over it, cause apart from ratchet it looks like bit of a waste of money apart from loading slightly faster then the ps4, its like there that many people in charge or having a say at sony they dont no what there doing , its like microsoft have got there shit together since the ps4/xbox launch and sacked people and sony have hired them

A big waste of money? Yeah, these 4-5 titles that we know of is all there is to it. Pack it up guys, Sony is not releasing any more games after these. No more PS5 exclusives after Ratchet & Clank Rift Apart. None. Everything will be on PS4 as well. We all know it to be true. Those 25 other games in development were a lie.

Seriously?

 

[namekuseijin]

I blame cryptocreeps.

how can Sony launch on pc when pc folks can't get fast GPUs?

 

[FatKingBallman]

What's even more crazy is that MS is primed to be the one to release the first truly next-gen only games. Maybe it was smart of MS to skip out the first year?

Dude, MS didn't even had a plan to release their games for Xseries only in first 1 year. Outside Halo Infinite ( maybe Forza will be announced ) any other game wasn't planned for 1st year at all. On the other hand, Sony had released 3 next-gen exclusives.

Probs Starfield, Avowed, Perfect Dark, Everwild, Fable, Forza Motorsport 8 and Hellblade 2. Should all be out within 2-3 years.

But original post was reffred to Xseries 1st year, not beyond. And these games you were mentioned wasn't planned at all for 1st year ( maybe Forza's date will be announced for this year )

Isn't Forza next-gen only? Damn near all Xbox Studios are working on nextgen only games that aren’t rushed for launch.

Rushed. LOL Wait, you think really that MS would release Fable, Perfect Dark, Starfield in Xseries first year??

 

[FatKingBallman]

Ratchet and Clank doesn't deliver big sales. Never has. Which is why they didn't give a shit about it not being on PS4 like their "strong" franchises such as Gran Turismo, GOW, and Horizon. Should we compare sales between those franchises and R&C?

Ratchet and Clank Reboot sold gangbusters.

 

[McCarth]

This thread is pretty great with Ratchet out in 7 days.

 

[FunkMiller]

If these games come out in 2022, the following would be true:

Horizon 2 would've taken 5 years to make.
Gow 4 years to make.
Gt7 4.5-5 years

We won't see next gen games from these studios until 2026-2027. 7 years into the gen. Let's hope they are two team studios and they have other stuff in the works simultaneously. But gt8, gow3 and horizon 3 def aren't coming out till 2027.

Yep. The dev times for games these days is absolutely ludicrous. I actually very much doubt we'll get a God Of War or GT exclusively for Ps5 at all. More likely is that we'll be in this same situation is seven or so years with games being cross gen between Ps5 and Ps6.

I really do think console generations are pretty much over as a thing, and that makes me sad, because it destroys a lot of the excitement and hype around the shift from one to the next.

 

[FatKingBallman]

Demon's Souls ran on PS3.

Yeah, but PS5 version is a next-gen title. And surely looks like that and it delivered

Both could be reworked for last-gen if Sony really wanted.

So, every damn developer in this world can do the same. :/

 

[Guilty_AI]

So why are God Of War and Horizon on PS4. Why does it makes sense to release them on PS4 and nor Ratchet or Returnal?

Why did it not make sense to Microsoft to put The Medium out on Xbox One?

Again, because games like Ratchet and Returnal are made to advertise the PS5. You can't advertise the PS5 and make all those slogans of "SSD PAWA!" if the game also comes out on the ps4.
God of war and Horizon are franchises they want to sell and reach as much people as possible, so all that PR can go out of the window for all they care.

 

[skit_data]

This thread is pretty great with Ratchet out in 7 days.

Tell me about it, I’m eagerly awaiting the next excuse from the ”But neither have released a next gen game”-crowd.

I’m already sensing some ”but it’s not one of their biggest IP”-arguments.

 

[VN1X]

The game was always going to look better on ps5 if it was a port from ps4. Plus the game was always going to be good for the most part if it came from Sony anyways.

FANBOY DETECTED

​

I knew it. Won't engage with fanboys. Good luck in your future endeavours.

 

[Banjo64]

But original post was reffred to Xseries 1st year, not beyond. And these games you were mentioned wasn't planned at all for 1st year ( maybe Forza's date will be announced for this year )

Think you’ve misunderstood the post, he’s saying that MS have skipped the first year (e.g barely any games) but it means their next gen only games should hit before Santa Monica’s, Polyphony’s and Guerrilla’s next gen only games.

What's even more crazy is that MS is primed to be the one to release the first truly next-gen only games. Maybe it was smart of MS to skip out the first year?

 

[FatKingBallman]

If these games come out in 2022, the following would be true:

Horizon 2 would've taken 5 years to make.
Gow 4 years to make.
Gt7 4.5-5 years

We won't see next gen games from these studios until 2026-2027. 7 years into the gen. Let's hope they are two team studios and they have other stuff in the works simultaneously. But gt8, gow3 and horizon 3 def aren't coming out till 2027.

So, just when PS6 will launch. Then maybe these titles will be a cross-gen PS5/PS6. And you surely would whine again. But, but, why these games aren't PS6 only titles. :/ What you said is nonsense. ND released 3 games last-gen. Suddenly we will MAYBE 1 title from them. Guerilla released 4 titles last-gen, now maybe it would be 2 this gen.