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Forza Motorsport Monthly (May) | New tyre collisions, curbs, compounds, fuel etc

cormack12

Gold Member
Offical source livestream

Communtiy WrapUp


0:00 | Intro
1:44 | New Tire Collision Detection Model
3:06 | New Curbs
3:55 | New Tire Compounds and Fuel Strategy
5:10 | New Environment Factors
5:48 | Official Name Confirmed

Quick summary
  • Playtest beginning of May went better than expected, more playtest to come;
  • The playtest was centred around multiplayer and core mechanics;
  • The community have been opinionated on Chris tinkering with the tyre collision model (prior to FM);
  • The new range of changes are more signifcant between FM7 -> FM8 than between FM2 -> FM7;
  • Will be a true generational leap unlike anything we have ever seen before (in this series);
  • GT is not playing any more so they (Turn10) know they need to put their best effort into this game;
  • Biggest change is to tyre collision detection model - this is the part of the game that communciates how your car interacts with the track (wear, surface etc). Previously there was one point of contact that refreshed at 60Hz, new tyre model has 8 points of contact and refreshes at 360Hz;
  • New curbs - all of these improvements will be subtle but there will be a dramatic response in curb interaction. They used to be inconsistent but now more accurate;
  • Will finally support multiple tyre compounds, medium, hard and changeable during race;
  • All have different profiles on wear, traction etc. FM7 had different tyres but not compounds;
  • Will be able to refuel your car to arbitrary amounts. FM7 is all or nothing, will give more strategic racing options. Much closer to the GT experience;
  • More environmental factors affecting lap to lap gameplay. Tyre pressure, surface integrity, time of day and weather will all affect the racing dynamically;
  • Name confirmed as Forza Motorsport;
  • Next playtest in the summer, more to share after that;
 

CeeJay

Member
Dropping the numbered editions confirms that FM is going GAAS for me and we will only see the one entry this generation and beyond. Hopefully they don't lock the majority of the decent cars behind car passes forcing players into a quarterly car pass for the duration of the generation. The car pass is no doubt how they plan to monetise the game, I just hope they don't go too aggressive with it.
 
It's been really obvious for awhile now that Turn 10 have a hard on for GTSport. It's no secret that they intend to copy it as much as possible for their next game.

Shortly after GT Sport came out, Turn 10 flipped FM7 completely upside down and basically said that it would now be run as if it were GT Sport. Except they didn't have any of GT Sports skill based matchmaking system. So they simply banned everyone instead.
 

CeeJay

Member
Every Forza since 4 has claimed a new tire model. It's almost a running gag at this point.

Also, I would bet money on this being totally online-focused.
Personally I am fine with racing online all the time. I understand that it may not suit everyone but racing against AI is never as much fun or unpredictable. There's nothing quite like racing wheel to wheel in a tight pack with other races of a similar standard to your own when everyone in the pack is respectful of each others space. You do usually get one or two idiots in a lobby though who think it's demolition Derby but those times when you get a good lobby it's amazing. I hope they can get the matchmaking right so clean racers get to race with other clean racers all the time and the idiots can fight it out in their own bumper car lobbies.
 

ZywyPL

Banned
I'm sorry to say but all that focus on tire and suspension physics I've been reading for years and yet it's GT that has the best driving model out there. Take even the old GT5 from PS3 vs latest FM7 from PC, and there's just something missing in the connection between the car and the player, GT is simply the CoD of racing games, it feels so damn right, spot-on. So hepefully all the changes implemented in the upcoming FM will bring it closer to how cars drive in GT, because that's the only aspect I can complain about in Forza games.
 

LokusAbriss

Member
Biggest change is to tyre collision detection model - this is the part of the game that communciates how your car interacts with the track (wear, surface etc). Previously there was one point of contact that refreshed at 60Hz, new tyre model has 8 points of contact and refreshes at 360Hz;
That sounds really, really promising!

Let‘s hope they introduce some kind of driver rating, orherwise online multiplayer will be a mess like in current forza titles.

FM7 ist still a great game, but the improvements for the next title are substantial.
 

xrnzaaas

Gold Member
I don't think anyone is going to be surprised with only one Forza Motorsport this gen. They're already supporting FM7 for many years now and unfortunately Motorsport has become a much less popular series than Horizon. I'm okay with one game instead of buying several which don't add many new features and copy-paste the majority of the car & track lists.
 
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LokusAbriss

Member
Since FM3 they have been trying to please all players, from arcade gamer to sim racer. In that proccess, they lost a lot of the community. It was always too difficult and realistic for beginners and arcade players. And the sim racers got nothing interesting or important (qualifying,…).

Now with Horizon covering the part of just enjoying driving and a more arcade focus, I hope their goal ist to make FM a true sim racing title.
 

CeeJay

Member
I don't think anyone is going to be surprised with only one Forza Motorsport this gen. They're already supporting FM7 for many years now and unfortunately Motorsport has become a much less popular series than Horizon. I'm okay with one game instead of buying several which don't add many new features and copy-paste the majority of the car & track lists.
With one entry the whole gen we won't have to keep repeating the same boring career mode to unlock the same cars every two years which will certainly be very welcome for me. With only one entry it might well free up enough development resource for Turn10 to have a go at a different IP too at some point too, it would be interesting to see what happens when they try new things. As you say, motorsport seems to be getting less popular compared to horizon and they will eventually need another different game to move onto to stay relevant.
 
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Dropping the numbered editions confirms that FM is going GAAS for me and we will only see the one entry this generation and beyond. Hopefully they don't lock the majority of the decent cars behind car passes forcing players into a quarterly car pass for the duration of the generation. The car pass is no doubt how they plan to monetise the game, I just hope they don't go too aggressive with it.
For a game like this I'm ok with that if u actually see except the 4k on fm7 the difference between fm6 and fm7 was very small
In motorsport I want strict online racing , no ramming on the first corner and bullshit like that ,
 
For a game like this I'm ok with that if u actually see except the 4k on fm7 the difference between fm6 and fm7 was very small
In motorsport I want strict online racing , no ramming on the first corner and bullshit like that ,
There's not near as much ramming these days on Forza because Turn 10 made the idiotic decision to implement a report feature. The entire reporting system was handed over to community members to review reports and ban as needed. It might've went ok at first, but it didn't take long for them to get tired of the repetitive mundane task of reviewing report after report after report. At which point the procedure was for them to simply issue bans wholesale without even reading reports.

What really crippled it was that from the beginning, the ban system automatically detects previous offenses and bans in order to automatically escalate the punishment appropriately.
1st ban= 1 week.
2nd ban= 1 month.
3rd ban= 1 year.
If 3 people report you no matter the reason or if it even happened. No multiplayer for a year. When they put FM7 on Gamepass, there was an influx of new players. I've been in lobbies where one of those Gamepass users with a level of 1-5 would laughingly describe in game chat how they were just there to report everybody to get them banned. Within seconds everybody was disconnecting in the hope to avoid getting reported.

That's not even mentioning Turn 10's absolutely hypocritical ass censorship bs they implemented. Recreating the General Lee 68 charger is an auto ban. Any vinyl that includes a depiction of the Japanese rising sun is a ban as well. For months that include the rising sun that's on the logo for the Liberty Walk body kits. Which were created by Turn 10 themselves.

The last 2-3 years has displayed some of the most incompetent management I've ever been witness to. And I've been witness to some pitiful shit. It absolutely boggles the mind.
 

CeeJay

Member
There's not near as much ramming these days on Forza because Turn 10 made the idiotic decision to implement a report feature. The entire reporting system was handed over to community members to review reports and ban as needed. It might've went ok at first, but it didn't take long for them to get tired of the repetitive mundane task of reviewing report after report after report. At which point the procedure was for them to simply issue bans wholesale without even reading reports.

What really crippled it was that from the beginning, the ban system automatically detects previous offenses and bans in order to automatically escalate the punishment appropriately.
1st ban= 1 week.
2nd ban= 1 month.
3rd ban= 1 year.
If 3 people report you no matter the reason or if it even happened. No multiplayer for a year. When they put FM7 on Gamepass, there was an influx of new players. I've been in lobbies where one of those Gamepass users with a level of 1-5 would laughingly describe in game chat how they were just there to report everybody to get them banned. Within seconds everybody was disconnecting in the hope to avoid getting reported.

That's not even mentioning Turn 10's absolutely hypocritical ass censorship bs they implemented. Recreating the General Lee 68 charger is an auto ban. Any vinyl that includes a depiction of the Japanese rising sun is a ban as well. For months that include the rising sun that's on the logo for the Liberty Walk body kits. Which were created by Turn 10 themselves.

The last 2-3 years has displayed some of the most incompetent management I've ever been witness to. And I've been witness to some pitiful shit. It absolutely boggles the mind.
Damn, I didn't realise it got so bad. I've had a hiatus from FM for the last year so that I am fresh and ready to go heavy when the new one comes out. Hopefully they get their shit together and hit the ground running because crap like this can easily kill the launch of any game no matter how high profile.
 

cormack12

Gold Member
There's not near as much ramming these days on Forza because Turn 10 made the idiotic decision to implement a report feature. The entire reporting system was handed over to community members to review reports and ban as needed. It might've went ok at first, but it didn't take long for them to get tired of the repetitive mundane task of reviewing report after report after report. At which point the procedure was for them to simply issue bans wholesale without even reading reports.

What really crippled it was that from the beginning, the ban system automatically detects previous offenses and bans in order to automatically escalate the punishment appropriately.
1st ban= 1 week.
2nd ban= 1 month.
3rd ban= 1 year.
If 3 people report you no matter the reason or if it even happened. No multiplayer for a year. When they put FM7 on Gamepass, there was an influx of new players. I've been in lobbies where one of those Gamepass users with a level of 1-5 would laughingly describe in game chat how they were just there to report everybody to get them banned. Within seconds everybody was disconnecting in the hope to avoid getting reported.

That's not even mentioning Turn 10's absolutely hypocritical ass censorship bs they implemented. Recreating the General Lee 68 charger is an auto ban. Any vinyl that includes a depiction of the Japanese rising sun is a ban as well. For months that include the rising sun that's on the logo for the Liberty Walk body kits. Which were created by Turn 10 themselves.

The last 2-3 years has displayed some of the most incompetent management I've ever been witness to. And I've been witness to some pitiful shit. It absolutely boggles the mind.

That sounds terrible.
 
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Damn, I didn't realise it got so bad. I've had a hiatus from FM for the last year so that I am fresh and ready to go heavy when the new one comes out. Hopefully they get their shit together and hit the ground running because crap like this can easily kill the launch of any game no matter how high profile.

That sounds terrible.
I think what happened was when GT Sport released, it became really apparent just how neglected their multiplayer component was.

Instead of waiting for their next release to clean their multiplayer up and implement similar features as GT Sport. They did the whole putting a square peg into a round hole routine and did it post release on Forza 7. That was the entire reason they created that whole race regulation system with the track boundaries.

What they didn't have time to put in however was the skill based matchmaking like system that GT Sport has, where if you're constantly running into other players, you'll be placed with others who regularly do the same. So instead, they simply slapped on a reporting feature that isn't even in the game itself. You have to go to Forza.net and do it from there basically through an email system. Either because they didn't have the manpower, or simply because they didn't want the hassle of dealing with it. They compounded the problem by allowing the whole thing to be run unsupervised by community members. While I haven't seen it myself, I've heard stories of community managers wantonly banning people simply for beating them during a race.

When you allow any kind of system to be run by people who aren't really vetted as being responsible there's a potential for problems. When there's literally no oversight then you're really asking for trouble. I suspect that these Forza.net community members left in charge, for one reason or another became what places like that often do. An echo chamber, or a hive mind. Whatever you call it. I think that group jumped on the whole "woke" train, which ultimately lead to the banning of all sorts of vinyls and paintjobs. It would help explain the embarrassing act of them banning images that only months before, they had sold as dlc. Talk about facepalm.

I'm praying to the gaming gods that whole clusterfuck of an ordeal was just a temporary patch of sorts, and that with their next game doesn't involve any of that bs.
 
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JLB

Banned
There's not near as much ramming these days on Forza because Turn 10 made the idiotic decision to implement a report feature. The entire reporting system was handed over to community members to review reports and ban as needed. It might've went ok at first, but it didn't take long for them to get tired of the repetitive mundane task of reviewing report after report after report. At which point the procedure was for them to simply issue bans wholesale without even reading reports.

What really crippled it was that from the beginning, the ban system automatically detects previous offenses and bans in order to automatically escalate the punishment appropriately.
1st ban= 1 week.
2nd ban= 1 month.
3rd ban= 1 year.
If 3 people report you no matter the reason or if it even happened. No multiplayer for a year. When they put FM7 on Gamepass, there was an influx of new players. I've been in lobbies where one of those Gamepass users with a level of 1-5 would laughingly describe in game chat how they were just there to report everybody to get them banned. Within seconds everybody was disconnecting in the hope to avoid getting reported.

That's not even mentioning Turn 10's absolutely hypocritical ass censorship bs they implemented. Recreating the General Lee 68 charger is an auto ban. Any vinyl that includes a depiction of the Japanese rising sun is a ban as well. For months that include the rising sun that's on the logo for the Liberty Walk body kits. Which were created by Turn 10 themselves.

The last 2-3 years has displayed some of the most incompetent management I've ever been witness to. And I've been witness to some pitiful shit. It absolutely boggles the mind.

Its ok to not like forza. No need to send a dozen of hyperbole messages stating the same thing over and over again though.
 

Fox Mulder

Member
They’re smart to copy Gran Turismo Sports and do the GaaS thing. Forza also dropped the ball on esports they were doing before GTS came out. Stuff like tire compounds and fuel also just offers more strategy options and makes it a deeper game.
 
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elliot5

Member
I'm fine with it being a platform GAAS game. Like guild wars 2 and shit. You can pay upfront and then if you want to buy expansions or whatever over the years that seems better than buying a $60 game every two years for smaller upgrades. Make the evolution of the graphics and systems evolve through patches rather than new releases. Fits the game pass model that way, too, by having a unified player base on one available title rather than fragmented and moving on to the next release.

I just hope there's a good career mode like in Gran Turismo 3 :) maybe it's just my nostalgia. I haven't actually played a FM game, so idk what the career progression is like.
 

LokusAbriss

Member
I am really curious, if we will get Horizon or Motorsport end of this year.

It would be fine for me to get a Motorsport beta end of this year. Like AC Competizione. Developing the game while it is in the hands of the community and then working on it with the data and feedback.
 

Fox Mulder

Member
I am really curious, if we will get Horizon or Motorsport end of this year.

It would be fine for me to get a Motorsport beta end of this year. Like AC Competizione. Developing the game while it is in the hands of the community and then working on it with the data and feedback.

Feels like Motorsports is still a ways off. They’re building a whole new game and engine, don’t even think it’s been listed as running on last gen consoles.

Forza Horizon 5 will surely get announced at e3 and maybe even for release this year. They’re still supporting FH4 with new cars, but a new game on the current engine would make sense instead of waiting for after Motorsports. Save Japan for FH6 running on the new forzatech engine.
 

reksveks

Member
Feels like Motorsports is still a ways off. They’re building a whole new game and engine, don’t even think it’s been listed as running on last gen consoles.

Forza Horizon 5 will surely get announced at e3 and maybe even for release this year. They’re still supporting FH4 with new cars, but a new game on the current engine would make sense instead of waiting for after Motorsports. Save Japan for FH6 running on the new forzatech engine.
The thing is that Motorsport is the one with the alpha test going on so its running off some version of the new engine.
 
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CeeJay

Member
I just hope there's a good career mode like in Gran Turismo 3 :) maybe it's just my nostalgia. I haven't actually played a FM game, so idk what the career progression is like.
The "career" if you can call it that has been pretty weak. It's more like a collection of different series where you get half a dozen races in a particular vehicle class per series that tend to require more and more exotic cars as you progress. There are some one off exhibition type showcases on top that which range from great to the shitty car bowling. It's normally just a case of doing them to earn money to buy cars in whatever order you want. It's nothing like the licenses from the older GT games. It does give you the freedom to go for whichever cars you want in whatever order you want but really doesn't give that career progression feeling and you just go through the motions as a means to an end.
 

Turk1993

GAFs #1 source for car graphic comparisons
Its nice they confirm weather and tod, hopefully both dynamic at the same time since this is a current gen exclusive. Also nice that the physics get more depth in them but i just hope they fix the awful wheel support. The physics of FM7 are not bad at all but the wheel physics are trash, you got no feeling and the steering isn't even smooth. I still have a feeling that this wil release next year roughly same time period as GT7. So they had both 5 year and come out in the same year. First time in history for Turn 10 to make a Forza title in 5 years, they normaly take 2 years so i expect them to put lots of brand new content at there highest quality. 2022 gonna be a good year for fans thats for sure and can't wait to compare them when they are out.
 
Its nice they confirm weather and tod, hopefully both dynamic at the same time since this is a current gen exclusive. Also nice that the physics get more depth in them but i just hope they fix the awful wheel support. The physics of FM7 are not bad at all but the wheel physics are trash, you got no feeling and the steering isn't even smooth. I still have a feeling that this wil release next year roughly same time period as GT7. So they had both 5 year and come out in the same year. First time in history for Turn 10 to make a Forza title in 5 years, they normaly take 2 years so i expect them to put lots of brand new content at there highest quality. 2022 gonna be a good year for fans thats for sure and can't wait to compare them when they are out.
This right here, Turn 10 having this long a development period and going full next gen, this could be very special.
 

Tomeru

Member
This.
He said that in the video too:
- GT is not playing any more so they (Turn10) know they need to put their best effort into this game;
Ok, but what does it mean? Are they saying GT is no longer competing/trying to compete with us, so we are now in a position where we need to reinvent ourselves?
 

reksveks

Member
Ok, but what does it mean? Are they saying GT is no longer competing/trying to compete with us, so we are now in a position where we need to reinvent ourselves?
My understanding is it is the opposite, they aint playing the game for the sake of the game but competing to win.
 

CeeJay

Member
This right here, Turn 10 having this long a development period and going full next gen, this could be very special.
The one thing that stood out for me with the Horizon games over the Motorsport games was the dynamic weather and tod and how it changed the feel of the game moment to moment. On the previous motorsport games you would know at exactly which point the sun would lens flare your vision and exactly where and how much a puddle would affect your car. Horizon is not like this, it never fails to look and feel different in every race no matter how many times you have raced it before. Motorsport desperately needs that level of dynamic environments where the track has unpredictable lighting and conditions that can catch you out even if you've raced the track 100 times before.
 

Black_Stride

do not tempt fate do not contrain Wonder Woman's thighs do not do not
Ok, but what does it mean? Are they saying GT is no longer competing/trying to compete with us, so we are now in a position where we need to reinvent ourselves?
The exact opposite.
Hes saying GT are putting in work(The opposite of playing) so they(Turn 10) need to up their game to keep up with what GT is doing.
 

reksveks

Member
The one thing that stood out for me with the Horizon games over the Motorsport games was the dynamic weather and tod and how it changed the feel of the game moment to moment. On the previous motorsport games you would know at exactly which point the sun would lens flare your vision and exactly where and how much a puddle would affect your car. Horizon is not like this, it never fails to look and feel different in every race no matter how many times you have raced it before. Motorsport desperately needs that level of dynamic environments where the track has unpredictable lighting and conditions that can catch you out even if you've raced the track 100 times before.
Are you saying we need real and dynamic cloud technology? I do hope the asobo team shared some useful information on how to implement that.
 

CeeJay

Member
Are you saying we need real and dynamic cloud technology? I do hope the asobo team shared some useful information on how to implement that.
That would be great, maybe even the option for full realtime tod and weather like FS has. There is nothing technical stopping the devs from running global simulations in the cloud and pulling that data down to use in game. They could possibly even use the same one that FS uses, it's probably just an API that the game calls to grab data points.
 

reksveks

Member
That would be great, maybe even the option for full realtime tod and weather like FS has. There is nothing technical stopping the devs from running global simulations in the cloud and pulling that data down to use in game. They could possibly even use the same one that FS uses, it's probably just an API that the game calls to grab data points.
I love the fact that we saw storm chasers in fs2020, I would find it ultra cool if Forza could try and replicate real world track conditions on the same weekend as the major races. I do wonder what the licensing restrictions from the FIA would be though, it might kill it outside of the official games.
 

TBiddy

Member
Are you saying we need real and dynamic cloud technology? I do hope the asobo team shared some useful information on how to implement that.

I assume they've been unable to implement it because of the lack of resources on last gen consoles. If there's no dynamic weather in the new FM, it's a huge disappoinment to be honest!
 

CeeJay

Member
I love the fact that we saw storm chasers in fs2020, I would find it ultra cool if Forza could try and replicate real world track conditions on the same weekend as the major races. I do wonder what the licensing restrictions from the FIA would be though, it might kill it outside of the official games.
the FIA might be powerful but surely they can't license the weather can they??? haha

You are right, it would be awesome to watch a real race and then jump into Forza to relive it!
 

reksveks

Member
the FIA might be powerful but surely they can't license the weather can they??? haha

You are right, it would be awesome to watch a real race and then jump into Forza to relive it!
This would be my first Forza Motorsport but I just wondering if most of the proper tracks and events are already licensed out (hopefully not exclusively like Champions League/Euro's/World Cup) and so there wouldn't be the opportunity to see something a real race and then jump into Forza to relive it but yeah, fingers crossed.
 

CeeJay

Member
This would be my first Forza Motorsport but I just wondering if most of the proper tracks and events are already licensed out (hopefully not exclusively like Champions League/Euro's/World Cup) and so there wouldn't be the opportunity to see something a real race and then jump into Forza to relive it but yeah, fingers crossed.
There are loads of the best tracks already included in many of the top racers, its not something that tends to get licensed (thankfully!). In Forza there are great tracks like the Nürburgring (GP and the epic Nordschleife), Silverstone, Spa, LeMans, Indianapolis and Laguna Seca that also feature in plenty of other games. Each track has many multiple different configurations ranging from short right up to the full GP version. There aren't any official FIA races series in Forza though disappointingly. There is the F1 game that Codemasters have which has the licence for that and GT has some FIA affiliation as well although that is for online racing itself. In Forza there are many different styles of races and an extensive range of online hoppers to give you the feels of a specific series, 1970s GrandPrix being one of my favourites. I really hope that they do something more meaningful with the career and online championships as the whole game just feels like one single non-descript race after another with nothing of any substance holding them all together bar from some arbitrary leaderboards where you can see how your laptime compares to the rest of the world.
 

DuckZilla

Neo Member
I love what I'm hearing about this game. Hope it turnout next gen exclusive, full on sim racing.

FM6 and 7 were in a weird spot with the growing popularity of Horizon. They have to change the direction of Motorsports towards sim-like genre. With both series aiming at two different crowds I think it'll be the best decision they can make.

Motorsports for the serious track only / online championship / eSports / time trials sim gamers and horizon for casual pick up and play gamers. Im just a racing game fan in general so I would pick up both...
 

Slayer-33

Liverpool-2
This sounds DELICIOUS! If actual strategy will be involved with the core gameplay it sounds super juicy. A new tire model could add a massive layer of nuance to the actual racing. Super hyped!
 
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