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[Ozriel]

How is this not obvious that an "audience size" increases for something somebody doesn't have to actively go out and buy?

“Allowing more people to play the previous games has increased the audience for current and future titles”

That’s not that hard to parse. Like a Dragon certainly didn’t launch on Gamepass.

 

[DonJimbo]

Nah, he used to be cool....now he is woke and killed Kiryu

Look what they did to ma boy! Turned him into a K-Pop star, Retconned the whole damn series. Why? Cause Willy GATES, he is woke, thus XB is woke, thus Yakuza MUST be woke in order to please the Illuminati. It was all part of their agenda and the knee twas bent.


Turns out this is what he was going to look like before MS got involved and FORCED da WOKEZ!

I want to REAL Yakuza 8 that was cut, stripped from us to fit an agenda, how could he broz! /s




Semi on topic, I do believe Gamepass has many negatives, but many positives as well as lots that never played Persona or Yakuza can jump in and freely explore the IP that otherwise may have never cared. For Yakuza, I feel its more to do with Zero as its a great starting point and it made sense to do a remake of 1 to follow up to not have people feel left behind, so I feel with some beat em up, that starts with Zero and 1, that is more welcoming and fans feel like they are getting the story from the beginning. I feel most series when going to new platforms should do this, maybe not so much for COD or AC or FF, series that are known to not be in order or something.


DonJimbo Yakuza games are amazing. If you like Judgement, start with Yakuza Zero, then move to 1,2,3,4,5 etc

Stick with Judgement 1 and 2 though as it is a bit of a overlap, but nothing you really find out in those games will ruin anything in Yakuza, but if you like the beat em ups, those are the games to look out for. Nothing wrong with Yakuza Like A Dragon though, but if you like Judgement, I'd assume you'd also like that beat em up style from 1-6

Unless you absolutely love yakuza crime storie over lawyers stories, save the money.

I love the brand but if you don't like one, the chance of notcliking the others is extremely high.

If you have gamepass you can try yakuza 0, by far the best game in the saga and perfect starting point.

thanks guys I will download Yakuza 0 from GamePass and try it out

 

[Fabieter]

How are the Yakuza games ?
Never played them only a bit of Judgement are they comparable?
Should I try them out although i quit playing Judgement ?

It depends what you didnt like about judgement, but I would say either way play yakuza 0 as soon as possible.

 

[GymWolf]

thanks guys I will download Yakuza 0 from GamePass and try it out

Don't watch the intro dude, the music is absurdly good but it spoiler the entire game, remember this.

 

[Smoke6]

Oh shit, what do you know....this guy just signed up for the hit list.

God speed, fellow man.

Just like persona will see growth etc thanks to game pass. Plagues tale etc. Game pass has a lot of positives that people don't want to accept. Yes there are negatives that there are too many games, almost and you may have more players that drop a game if it doesn't grab them but that's the way it goes I suppose.

You can have these positives because they’re not paying full price for a title they’re unsure of to begin with!

With that said, are they willing to pay full price to what they did when it was on games pass when the day comes it’s no longer on the service for its next release?

You may get a few new customers, cool! But won’t sell nowhere near the amount they would on other platforms due to everyone wants everything on games pass

 

[Three]

“Allowing more people to play the previous games has increased the audience for current and future titles”

That’s not that hard to parse. Like a Dragon certainly didn’t launch on Gamepass.

Where is that quote from? Are you making stuff up? He just talks about the games on the services increasing the audience and doesn't mention future titles not on these services.

Like a Dragon Ishin isn't even for sale yet and Yukuza Like a dragon are on services like PS+ already
https://blog.playstation.com/2022/0...n-tony-hawks-pro-skater-12-little-nightmares/

When he is talking about an increased audience he is only mentioning an increased audience for the released games on these services. He made no mention of increased sales for games not on these services. That's not what he has said and it's yet to be shown. He is saying the audience has increased on these services and you're extrapolating something else from it.

 

[FF:Enhanced_Reality]

Of course it will. It's free if you gave GamePass. I can think of tonnes of games that I'd want to try if they were free. I might even end up enjoying them. But never wasting essential money that I need for other things. Seems like a common sense statement to me. Even when these titles went dirt cheap on offer on PlayStation, many would have waited until they were the plus titles to try them for free. It's like Soulstorm. Got it on plus. So happy I did, really didn't enjoy it. Would have been mad if I'd wasted money on it.

 

[Chukhopops]

It depends what you didnt like about judgement, but I would say either way play yakuza 0 as soon as possible.

Prepare to cry the manliest tears you’ll ever shed in your life. It’s really amazing from a story perspective.

Like a Dragon Ishin isn't even for sale yet and Yukuza Like a dragon are on services like PS+ already
https://blog.playstation.com/2022/0...n-tony-hawks-pro-skater-12-little-nightmares/

Yakuza 7 wasn’t on any sub service at launch and it still outperformed previous episodes’ sales.

It’s not only because of sub services for sure but I think they really helped the series internationally.

 

[Rac3r]

GAF trying to figure out how to turn this into a negative

Lol, says the guy with the Cudi avatar who was trying to spread FUD just a few hours ago.

Hop off Gaf and go listen to some Kid Cudi.

 

[Three]

Yakuza 7 wasn’t on any sub service at launch and it still outperformed previous episodes’ sales.

It was the first one to launch on multiple platforms simultaneously and internationally. Attributing sales to past versions being on services like PS+ and gamepass is a stretch though I think. The comment he has made isn't mentioning anything about it increasing sales. He is just saying it has increased the audience. Yukuza 7 released on PS+ too so it's not like its bigger audience doesn’t rely on them anymore.

 

[Pedro Motta]

http://[URL]https://twinfinite.net/2022/10/like-a-dragon-interview-producer/

[/URL]

Yeah? Now release them day one.

 

[Strider Highwind]

As someone who used to save up and import the old games when I was younger(Even played through the samurai spinoffs ol) I am extremely happy for the people making the Yakuza games and the new found success they've seen. This is great news and I hope their efforts continue to get more love

 

[DForce]

But if devs are happy, and gamers are happy, what exactly is the problem?

Again, devs are happy because they're getting paid. As Xbox fans on here wish MS acquires all major publishers, let's pretend that MS acquired Activation, EA, etc. What types of games do you think they're going to focus on to keep subscribers on the service? GaaS titles. 10 million might play a single-player game on Game Pass, but is it going to make them a lot of money? Likely not nearly as much as it would in retail for a triple A title. You might say this is a load of BS, so let me ask you this; Do you think if Sony had 25 million PS Now subscribers, do you think they will continue to release single-player games at the same rate as they have before or will they try to focus more on GaaS titles?

 

[SmokedMeat]

I would hope so. You’ve got some 25 million or whatever users that have automatic access to your games.

I hope that new audience turns into more sales.

 

[Bernd Lauert]

Again, devs are happy because they're getting paid. As Xbox fans on here wish MS acquires all major publishers, let's pretend that MS acquired Activation, EA, etc. What types of games do you think they're going to focus on to keep subscribers on the service? GaaS titles.

They're already focusing on GaaS titles. Nothing would change.

10 million might play a single-player game on Game Pass, but is it going to make them a lot of money? Likely not nearly as much as it would in retail for a triple A title. You might say this is a load of BS, so let me ask you this; Do you think if Sony had 25 million PS Now subscribers, do you think they will continue to release single-player games at the same rate as they have before or will they try to focus more on GaaS titles?

Isn't Sony working on 12 new GaaS titles?

 

[Chukhopops]

It was the first one to launch on multiple platforms simultaneously and internationally. Attributing sales to past versions being on services like PS+ and gamepass is a stretch though I think. The comment he has made isn't mentioning anything about it increasing sales. He is just saying it has increased the audience. Yukuza 7 released on PS+ too so it's not like its bigger audience doesn’t rely on them anymore.

I literally said it’s not the only reason, of course releasing internationally and on more platforms helped.

But how do you think the series became multiplat to begin with? It was ported to Xbox the same day it was added to GP so it isn’t a big stretch to think maaaaybe MS paid for the ports?

 

[Punished Miku]

So he just "believes" it huh? What about the profits? What about the hard data? No one just strolls around and says something positive about Game Pass PS+on my watch, sir - not without receipts.

 

[DForce]

They're already focusing on GaaS titles. Nothing would change.

Isn't Sony working on 12 new GaaS titles?

You simply don't get it. They purchased a lot of studios that make single-player titles. IF they CONTINUE to purchase publishers (which I clearly stated above) then they're going to put more of a focus on GaaS titles because they need to keep and increase subscribers.

Sony is in a different situation because they're not making GaaS for PS now. They purchased several studios that are working on GaaS titles and won't stop making single player titles because they're relying on retail sales for their success. Now for a game to be successful on game pass, it would go by a totally different metric.

 

[Bernd Lauert]

You simply don't get it. They purchased a lot of studios that make single-player titles. IF they CONTINUE to purchase publishers (which I clearly stated above) then they're going to put more of a focus on GaaS titles because they need to keep and increase subscribers.

The publishers they purchased are already big in the GaaS game (especially ABK). Literally nothing changes.

Sony is in a different situation because they're not making GaaS for PS now. They purchased several studios that are working on GaaS titles and won't stop making single player titles because they're relying on retail sales for their success.

And yet they're working on 12 GaaS titles. How many big single player titles are they working on? This is basically the scenario you're describing for Xbox.

Now for a game to be successful on game pass, it would go by a totally different metric.

The metric is sub count. Some subs want GaaS games. Other subs want single player games. Gamepass will keep delivering both.

 

[ChorizoPicozo]

Obvi. Next yakuza should sell like 10M Right?

 

[DForce]

The publishers they purchased are already big in the GaaS game (especially ABK). Literally nothing changes.

Saying "they already make GaaS games" isn't a counterargument. Bethesda makes a lot of single-player games.

And yet they're working on 12 GaaS titles. How many big single player titles are they working on? This is basically the scenario you're describing for Xbox.

You're not very good at paying attention. Sony doesn't have to worry about single players failing on a service because they're making money from retail, thus they will continue to make them.

The metric is sub count. Some subs want GaaS games. Other subs want single player games. Gamepass will keep delivering both.

GaaS titles keep active subscribers for months compared to single player games.



So does GaaS have a better chance of keeping active subscribers compared to single player titles?

 

[poodaddy]

How are the Yakuza games ?
Never played them only a bit of Judgement are they comparable?
Should I try them out although i quit playing Judgement ?

If you didn't like Judgement you won't like the others. Judgement is one of the best. If you're into turn based RPG's, maybe give Like a Dragon a shot, it's one of the best I've played despite not really being into turn based stuff.

 

[Thirty7ven]

The guy says a bunch of shit and all people get from it is gamepass lmao some of you really going crazy

 

[Bernd Lauert]

Saying "they already make GaaS games" isn't a counterargument. Bethesda makes a lot of single-player games.

And they are still making them and will be making them in the future.

You're not very good at paying attention. Sony doesn't have to worry about single players failing on a service because they're making money from retail, thus they will continue to make them.

There is no such thing as "failing on a service." As long as the single-player focused subs stay, all is fine.

GaaS titles keep active subscribers for months compared to single player games.

This doesn't mean that every game will be GaaS. It's a logical fallacy.

So does GaaS have a better chance of keeping active subscribers compared to single player titles?

Depends on the subscriber and what type of games he likes.

 

[Pasta la Vista]

You know what's pretty crazy, I've been seeing Persona 5 Royal posters in parts of LA recently. And you know what it says on the top of those posters? "On gamepass".
Stop teasing us already, Sega is ripe for the picking any Wednesday now.

 

[DForce]

And they are still making them and will be making them in the future.

They won't if they're not pushing and upping the sub count.

There is no such thing as "failing on a service." As long as the single-player focused subs stay, all is fine.

There is. If a game is not producing, then it's failing

This doesn't mean that every game will be GaaS. It's a logical fallacy.

I never said every game will, I said they will put more of a focus on GaaS titles.

epends on the subscriber and what type of games he likes.

That's not what I asked. I asked you if GaaS games have a better chance.

 

[DonJimbo]

It depends what you didnt like about judgement, but I would say either way play yakuza 0 as soon as possible.

Don't watch the intro dude, the music is absurdly good but it spoiler the entire game, remember this.

If you didn't like Judgement you won't like the others. Judgement is one of the best. If you're into turn based RPG's, maybe give Like a Dragon a shot, it's one of the best I've played despite not really being into turn based stuff.

Thanks Guys will give it a Try

 

[reksveks]

They won't if they're not pushing and upping the sub count.

Yes, you need games to attract users but different games attract different users so there is always to be a variety. If GP has too much focus on GAAS then users will leave and then MS will be forced to focus on SP. This doesn't really change with GP.

Smaller subscription services or platform maybe be fine with keeping within their niche.

 

[adamsapple]

 

[qthaumaturge]

The biggest negative is devaluing game prices, it will have consequences .

4 hour games sold at $40 (ehm. Scorn)?

 

[Bernd Lauert]

Yes, you need games to attract users but different games attract different users so there is always to be a variety. If GP has too much focus on GAAS then users will leave and then MS will be forced to focus on SP. This doesn't really change with GP.

Exactly. My favorite thing about Gamepass is that I get to play a bunch of smaller singleplayer or co-op games that I otherwise probably wouldn't've played. I don't need GaaS to keep me subbed, actually I actively avoid them because nobody got time for that.

 

[Ozriel]

Where is that quote from? Are you making stuff up? He just talks about the games on the services increasing the audience and doesn't mention future titles not on these services.

Like a Dragon Ishin isn't even for sale yet and Yukuza Like a dragon are on services like PS+ already
https://blog.playstation.com/2022/0...n-tony-hawks-pro-skater-12-little-nightmares/

When he is talking about an increased audience he is only mentioning an increased audience for the released games on these services. He made no mention of increased sales for games not on these services. That's not what he has said and it's yet to be shown. He is saying the audience has increased on these services and you're extrapolating something else from it.

He specifically mentions putting ‘previous games’ on Gamepass helping to increase the audience for the franchise, and not just the previous games alone.

You’re the one limiting this to previous titles.

 

[Punished Miku]

Exactly. My favorite thing about Gamepass is that I get to play a bunch of smaller singleplayer or co-op games that I otherwise probably wouldn't've played. I don't need GaaS to keep me subbed, actually I actively avoid them because nobody got time for that.

Pretty much. I pick just 1. It's usually Splatoon, Monster Hunter, or Soul Calibur. Everything else is going to be normal. 99% of the time on GP I'm just trying to play single player games before they leave because I don' thave time to play them all. Currently trying to run through Forgotten City and its fantastic.

 

[yurinka]

Well, I think it's obvious that releasing the game on new platforms like Xbox and PC expands the audience of the game, and to release it on subscriptions like GP or PS Plus too.

Obviously the audience is going to be higher than to release it on a single platform and not releasing it on subscriptions.

This applies for any game.

 

[adamsapple]

Gamepass has been available for more than 5 years now. Those negative consequences really are taking their sweet time aren’t they.

This has been the FUD talking point for the last 2~ years and will continue to be for the next couple of years. The reality is that more companies are adapting the subscription model.

Are they all adapting it to the same extent as MS and Xbox with day 1 content ? No, but that will happen soon enough as well.

Exactly. My favorite thing about Gamepass is that I get to play a bunch of smaller singleplayer or co-op games that I otherwise probably wouldn't've played. I don't need GaaS to keep me subbed, actually I actively avoid them because nobody got time for that.

Pretty much. I pick just 1. It's usually Splatoon, Monster Hunter, or Soul Calibur. Everything else is going to be normal. 99% of the time on GP I'm just trying to play single player games before they leave because I don' thave time to play them all. Currently trying to run through Forgotten City and its fantastic.

Spot on. Echoing what you guys said, I've not felt the need to play a single GaaS game on the service and only use it for single player content. It has allowed me to try and enjoy so many new experiences, including The Forgotten City, that I would have likely never played otherwise.

Well, I think it's obvious that releasing the game on new platforms like Xbox and PC expands the audience of the game, and to release it on subscriptions like GP or PS Plus too.

Exactly, he made a very basic statement. But folks gonna folks.

 

[DForce]

Yes, you need games to attract users but different games attract different users so there is always to be a variety. If GP has too much focus on GAAS then users will leave and then MS will be forced to focus on SP. This doesn't really change with GP.

Smaller subscription services or platform maybe be fine with keeping within their niche.

Attracting is one thing, but KEEPING gamers on the service is another.

This is proven by the most played games charts on all platforms. A successful single player game will remain in the top 50 for a few months and then drop out. However, a successful GaaS title will remain the top 50 for a year or longer.

Exactly. My favorite thing about Gamepass is that I get to play a bunch of smaller singleplayer or co-op games that I otherwise probably wouldn't've played. I don't need GaaS to keep me subbed, actually I actively avoid them because nobody got time for that.

Again, you're purposely ignoring the point. Read what I told reksveks above. It's not what YOU personally feel, it's about what attracts and keeps players on the service.

You guys love to look at the top 50 most played games list. MLB the show is STILL in the most top 50 games list on Xbox. It's actually on there twice for both Xbox consoles.

What happened to all the day one single player titles that were released on Game Pass? They dropped out.

If a person loves Starfield and MLB The show, but he put in 500 more hours into MLB the show than Starfield, then that means that person will stay subscribed to Game Pass longer because of MLB the show and NOT Starfield.

 

[reksveks]

Attracting is one thing, but KEEPING gamers on the service is another.

This is proven by the most played games charts on all platforms. A successful single player game will remain in the top 50 for a few months and then drop out. However, a successful GaaS title will remain the top 50 for a year or longer.

Two different metrics, you can be attracted/kept to a platform by one game and then spend most of your time in another especially. I wouldnt assume a causal relationship between the two things.

I would also argue that there is more of an issue with players sticking to a single GaaS game that obviously doesn't happen for single player games.

 

[DForce]

Two different metrics, you can be attracted to a platform by one game and then spend most of your time in another especially. I wouldnt assume a causal relationship between the two things.

It's not. You're going against all logic and data. The majority of the most played games on Game Pass are multiplayer games.

You're going to tell me that it's not the main driving force that keeps players on the service?

 

[Bernd Lauert]

Again, you're purposely ignoring the point. Read what I told reksveks above. It's not what YOU personally feel, it's about what attracts and keeps players on the service.

It is about what I personally feel, because I represent a certain part of the Gamepass audience.

You guys love to look at the top 50 most played games list. MLB the show is STILL in the most top 50 games list on Xbox. It's actually on there twice for both Xbox consoles.

What happened to all the day one single player titles that were released on Game Pass? They dropped out.

If a person loves Starfield and MLB The show, but he put in 500 more hours into MLB the show than Starfield, then that means that person will stay subscribed to Game Pass longer because of MLB the show and NOT Starfield.

You still don't get it. Singleplayer games are being constantly released on Gamepass. As long as they keep coming, singleplayer guys will stay subscribed.

 

[DForce]

It is about what I personally feel, because I represent a certain part of the Gamepass audience.

We didn't discuss this topic to see how you personally feel about Game Pass, this is about how the service will gain and maintain subs.

You still don't get it. Singleplayer games are being constantly released on Gamepass. As long as they keep coming, singleplayer guys will stay subscribed.

The subs reply on new content being provided on the service. Single player audiences will not stay longer than people who play multiplayer titles.

Why are the top most played games on Game Pass multiplayer titles?

 

[Punished Miku]

It's not. You're going against all logic and data. The majority of the most played games on Game Pass are multiplayer games.

You're going to tell me that it's not the main driving force that keeps players on the service?

I think you both are right. MS has released many statements saying they're happy with the data they get, seeing players move to new genres they haven't played before. They also seem to put in a fair bit of effort really purposefully pushing a diverse library (moreso than I've seen on PS+ so far which seems very core gamer focused). Really many unusual indies and genres, and even games squarely aimed at little children.

Any GAAS game will be near the top of the list because you play it for longer. If you play 10 smaller single player games then they wont rank as high, even if you only play 1 GAAS game, because it's spread out across 10 smaller games.

I think obviously everyone on GP is playing both. That's the main draw of the system. Personally for me though, I'm actually not playing any GAAS games on Xbox.

 

[Bernd Lauert]

We didn't discuss this topic to see how you personally feel about Game Pass, this is about how the service will gain and maintain subs.

And I'm a sub and represent a certain percentage of other subs.

The subs reply on new content being provided on the service. Single player audiences will not stay longer than people who play multiplayer titles.

Single player audiences will stay as long as single player games are being provided.

Why are the top most played games on Game Pass multiplayer titles?

Because they are played for much longer. GaaS boys play MLB for 6 months straight. Meanwhile I played at least a dozen of singleplayer games during the same time frame. We're both happy, we stay subscribed.

 

[reksveks]

It's not. You're going against all logic and data. The majority of the most played games on Game Pass are multiplayer games.

You're going to tell me that it's not the main driving force that keeps players on the service?

I am saying
1) single player games are inherently disadvantage because of those charts are tracking time
2) gamers play more than one kind of games
3) time played =/= attractiveness of a game

 

[reksveks]

even games squarely aimed at little children.

yeah, there is more than just one factor that goes into programming a service/library

 

[DForce]

And I'm a sub and represent a certain percentage of other subs.

Single player audiences will stay as long as single player games are being provided.

Because they are played for much longer. GaaS boys play MLB for 6 months straight. Meanwhile I played at least a dozen of singleplayer games during the same time frame. We're both happy, we stay subscribed.

You just proved my point.

If they're playing for longer then that means they're going to be subscribed for longer. If single player games drop off the chart after the first month, then that means they're moving on to something else. The likelihood of people staying subscribed goes to GaaS/Multiplayer games. This also includes the benefit of in-game content.

There's nothing else to be said. GaaS is the driving force when it comes to increasing and maintaining subscribers and that's what they're going to have to focus on.

 

[KingT731]

As expected since that's the reason you put games on these services. Now is this expanded audience going to buy the new games or wait for them to come onto the service again?

 

[DaGwaphics]

Attracting is one thing, but KEEPING gamers on the service is another.

This is proven by the most played games charts on all platforms. A successful single player game will remain in the top 50 for a few months and then drop out. However, a successful GaaS title will remain the top 50 for a year or longer.


Again, you're purposely ignoring the point. Read what I told reksveks above. It's not what YOU personally feel, it's about what attracts and keeps players on the service.

You guys love to look at the top 50 most played games list. MLB the show is STILL in the most top 50 games list on Xbox. It's actually on there twice for both Xbox consoles.

What happened to all the day one single player titles that were released on Game Pass? They dropped out.

If a person loves Starfield and MLB The show, but he put in 500 more hours into MLB the show than Starfield, then that means that person will stay subscribed to Game Pass longer because of MLB the show and NOT Starfield.

LOL, if Starfield is anything like Skyrim people will be putting a lot of hours into that one on average.

The mistake you are making is assuming that MS cares how a user spends their time with GP. Obviously most single player games are shorter in length, but a user could easily play multiple games in a months time. The user that spreads their time between different games is much more likely to stay subscribed than the user that spends all their time playing MLB (they can easily just buy MLB and not need the subscription). Single player content will always be the most important to these subscription services, its getting harder and harder to sell GAAS games without going FTP, which offers no value to a subscription at that point.

So yes, single player games will come and go from the most-played games list more quickly, but they still serve their purpose.

 

[Metnut]

I don’t have Gamepass but got hard copy Yakuza 0 for $10 on sale. It was the only game I played for 2.5 months. Plus, i still own Yakuza 0 and can lend it out.

 

[DForce]

LOL, if Starfield is anything like Skyrim people will be putting a lot of hours into that one on average.

The mistake you are making is assuming that MS cares how a user spends their time with GP. Obviously most single player games are shorter in length, but a user could easily play multiple games in a months time. The user that spreads their time between different games is much more likely to stay subscribed than the user that spends all their time playing MLB (they can easily just buy MLB and not need the subscription). Single player content will always be the most important to these subscription services, its getting harder and harder to sell GAAS games without going FTP, which offers no value to a subscription at that point.

The mistake you're making to assuming MS doesn't care where users spend their time. If players aren't playing a game, then they're not going to invest in another one. It's simple.

This is like the same people who say, "MS doesn't care about sales" stuff. lol. It's a business, they're not going to ignore data that says gamers are not playing their game and then try to make a sequel.

I don't need to discuss this any further. The proof is right there, yet people ignore it.

 

[Bumblebeetuna]

Gamepass has been available for more than 5 years now. Those negative consequences really are taking their sweet time aren’t they.

It’s typical doomsday conspiracy nonsense. No different than EA Play. I remember that it was supposed to lead to dark times where literally every publisher on the planet has their own sub service and the biggest best games will be locked behind the service. Eventually we’ll all need to subscribe to seventeen services just to play games!!!!!!111

Reality: Only a couple of publishers have a sub service, nothing is locked, big nothing burger.

It’s like this “new world order” shit people talk about nowadays like it’s new and edgy when in reality tin foil hat idiots have been spewing that since before the Great Depression.